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The article about subarctic climate says 90 days frost freee periode at most and no more than 3 months of summer (mean 24-hr average at least 10°C). However, this article says that an area with summer lasting less than four months (and winter colder than -3) has a subarctic climate. A substantial area in Scandinavia, Russia and Canada have summers lasting more than 3 months and less than 4 months. Lillehammer, Norway, has a summer lasting on average 108 days, frost free periode is a bit longer, while winter (average below freezing) lasts 5 months, with January average -9 C. So is this a humid continental (Dfb) climate or subarctic (Dfc) climate? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Orcaborealis ( talk • contribs) 09:05, 22 October 2006 (UTC)
Can anyone prove that Charleston and Roanoke is is in the Humid Continental climate zone? Those cities do have mountains, but they are not high enough to make a huge difference. The coldest areas of West Virginia and Virginia are in the Allegheny Mountain range. Neither city is located in that area. The Punk 08:50, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
In the Köppen article, the Dfa /Dwa/Dsa subtype is referred to as having a hot summer, while the Dfb subtype (hemiboreal) is referred to as having a warm summer. Orcaborealis 09:07, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
No -- Dfb suggests a long (three months or so, which is enough for some agriculture), but not 'hot' summer, one with four or more months of average temperatures above 10°C, but none at or above 22°C. Such allows a significant frost-free season suitable for such crops as potatoes and the hardier varieties of wheat. Dfa indicates a month with an average temperature at or above 22°C... and implies a long summer because the transition from a snowy 0°C month takes time through some 'cool' months that may be considered 'spring' or 'fall'(typically May and September -- which implies a five-month summer by climatic, if not cultural, standards). Such crops as maize and tomatoes possible in a Dfa climate with its long summer are impossible in a Dfb climate that has the possibility of a killing frost during much of the year. Dfc climates, in contrast to Dfb climates, have short summers unsuited to effective agriculture. Short summers might allow some spikes of temperature (a 37°C record in Fort Yukon, Alaska north of the Arctic Circle) -- but those temperatures are short-lived. More characteristic is the possibility of a severe frost even in July.
As a rule, summers become warmer and longer as one goes southward through the layers of D climates. Dfa climates are subject to harsh summer heat waves -- but unlike the neighboring Cfa climates to their south they can have weeks of snow cover that allow more intense and more sustained chill than is characteristic of Cfa climates to the south.
Winters that might be long and severe toward the tundra/boreal forest divide near the Dfc/ET divide become shorter and less distinct until the Cfa/Dfa divide near Philadelphia or St. Louis, where snow is possible only as a short-term phenomenon. To be sure, a place like Memphis, Tennessee or Richmond, Virginia clearly to the south of the Dfa/Cfa divide has a well-marked winter unsuited to rapid crop growth in the short, chilly winter. Hard frosts are possible -- and so is snow -- in the more poleward areas of Cfa climate. But we should be discussing that in a Cfa classification. Around the Dfa/Cfa divide one might find that a climatic summer begins in April and ends in October.
The issue is not what is culturally understood as "summer" or "winter"; the words apply to essentially the same months in New Orleans and San Francisco -- and even Honolulu! -- as they do in Edmonton because of shared language and culture, even if "summer" and "winter" have different local meanings in climate; the Köppen classification allows the physical distinctions between groups of climates. -- Paul from Michigan 14:51, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
To me it seems inaccurate that Tokyo, Japan be labelled as a Humid Continental Climate. If you look at the climate chart both for summer temperatures and winter temperatures (as well as absolute minimum lows), this clearly falls into the Humid Subtropical Category and not the Humid Continental Category. Deneb1978 06:04, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
The map attached to this article is confusing. It has no legend and seems to have little relation to the two subtypes described in the article text. BobDively 18:59, 2 March 2007 (UTC)
More of Maryland should be shaded, and no part of Oklahoma or Arkansas should be blue, let alone dark blue. According to this map, Tulsa has a humid continental climate, although its average temperature in January is 36 [4]. 72.81.251.212 (JScott06) 21:09, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
this map is completly wrong some of the largest cities included in the area on this map so not meet the requierments set to be considered humid continental-- Dzd ( talk) 02:19, 6 December 2008 (UTC)
The article says: "Average annual temperature below 8°C". Where does this definition come from? And, the article says that annual amplitude (monthly averages) is no more than 22°C . This is wrong. The amplitude can be significantly greater. Here is data for Moscow, with an amplitude of nearly 29°C. Orcaborealis 17:51, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
Here's another incorrect claim: Nashville and Louisville in the transition zone. Both cities have coldest month averages above 0°C, so they are are in the subtropical zone. [9] [10] Faz90 ( talk) 05:37, 31 January 2008 (UTC)
The mean temperature in Boston in January, the coldest month isn't bellow -3°C. It's only -2.6°C. So, Boston can't be considered as an exact Dfa climate, but as a Cfa climate in which the mean temperature is between the freezing point (0°C) and -3ºC, just like New York. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 189.20.72.66 ( talk) 22:24, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
You're right. Actually, the coldest month is -1.5C. Philadelphia is a true subtropical, proven here: http://www.idcide.com/weather/pa/philadelphia.htm. Oh, and by the way, we should call all parts of New Jersey (besides the northwestern part), Boston, NYC, and extreme southeastern New York humid subtropical. If Cape Cod's climate is like the west coast, then it's marine west coast. How come nobody seems to get that? Koppen's boundaries shouldn't change because something on the east coast would then be called "Marine 'West' Coast." Press olive, win oil ( talk) 20:44, 4 April 2008 (UTC)
D climates are rare in the Southern Hemisphere for the simple reason that all landmasses south of between 30°S and 60°S are exposed to the moderating effects of open ocean or are dry enough ( Patagonia) due to rain-shadow effects that if they have a chilly month to have BSk (cool steppe) or BSk (cool desert) climates. Temperature ranges are generally slight between the zones of subtropical desert and the Antarctic icecap. Thus the transition in the southern hemisphere between the warm temperate zone and the subantarctic regions is ordinarily Cfa→Cfb→Cfc→ET from north to south, Cfc climates appearing where summers are short but no month has an average temperature below 0°C.
Rare, of course, does not mean non-existent. Some highland areas in New Zealand have one month below 0°C... it's in fact an area with ski resorts. It covers little area, but it exists. It has a Dfb or Dfc climate. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Paul from Michigan ( talk • contribs) 22:22, 22 January 2008 (UTC)
Topeka is in the transition zone, proven here: http://www.idcide.com/weather/ks/topeka.htm. I would consider it humid subtropical because Koppen did. Press olive, win oil ( talk) 21:35, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
Is Juneau's climate subarctic or humid continental? According to http://www.idcide.com/weather/ak/juneau.htm, Juneau has 3 months that average above 10C/50F and 8 months below this line. However, 1 month is on that borderline. I read that Juneau was the size of Rhode Island on the internet, so the subarctic-continental border would be located in Juneau. However, every map that I've come across says that Juneau is subarctic. Then again, many also use 0C as the subtropical-continental dividing line instead of -3C. NYC is considered humid subtropical by Koppen standards. Press olive, win oil ( talk) 22:32, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
Interestingly, Trondheim, Norway, at more than 63 degrees North latitude, has a climate very similar to Juneau (although Trondheim gets less precipitation), and is on the border of four climate zones: Cfb-Dfb-Dfc-Cfc border, so it is hard to classify! As seen in table below (1961-90 base period):
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Orcaborealis ( talk) 16:34, 27 May 2011 (UTC)
Cape Cod and nearby islands get me sick climate wise. Climate wise means I would love to go to Cape Cod in summer but Cape Cod is the reason why some people draw the borderline at 0C. If Cape Cod's climate is like the west coast, call it Marine West Coast. Are San Francisco and Los Angeles on the Mediterranean? I don't think so. However, these places in California have a Mediterranean climate. Also, how about global warming? At the start of the industrial revolution, temperatures were a bit cooler. NYC was between 0C and -3C even then, but climate does change. If global warming continued until it was 20C higher, Maine would have a humid subtropical climate, and NYC would have a tropical rain forest climate. There'd be major differences. Press olive, win oil ( talk) 13:29, 18 April 2008 (UTC)
"Dfa: Hot (or very warm) summer subtype"
Is this a user made list or is based on real statistic? If the former, could we include Southern Quebec? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Deus911 ( talk • contribs) 01:59, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
The Köppen climate classification of Dfa appears in the first section heading, with no explanation of what these letters mean. Only by scrolling down to the bottom of the article can the reader discover that these letters are part of a classification system. This article and the others which describe various classifications should each mention the Köppen climate classification system and the particular code in the lede. This is a bigger job than I have the energy to do. -- DThomsen8 ( talk) 13:04, 14 June 2009 (UTC)
Many of the cities in Europe listed as Dfb climate are actually Cfb due to winters being too warm to fit the Dfb criteria. These cities must be removed, or another section added, where the cities having winters warmer than -3 C and colder than 0 Celsius are listed, as is done for North America. Examples: Bratislava has a coldest month of -1.3 Celsius link Bratislava climate. Budapest has a coldest month of 0.2 Celsius, even above freezing and is not Dfb whether the Koppen definition is used or the American, link Budapest climate. Vienna has a coldest month of -1.4 Vienna climate Why so many mistakes? Orcaborealis ( talk) 19:30, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
The altitude actually is not the determinat factor to the occurence of Continental Climate (Df) in the Alps. While some cities and towns at a few Hundred meters above the sea level, such as Klagenfurt and most of Carinthia, have a typical Dfb climate, others at much higher altitude (such as Napf, Grachen -about 1500meters above the sea level - Switzerland) do not. The position inside the mountain range is actually the main factor. I think it would be more corect to divide in 'Inner Alps' and 'External Alps'. The first one would reffer to Carinthia, Tyrol, western Styria and Southern Salzburger in Austria, South Tyrol, Sondrio's province, Comelico and Aosta's Valley in Italy, Vallais and Grauben in Switzerland, and I wouldn't know where else, probably High Savoy and some other places in French Alps. In the Inner Alps Dfb climate indeed occur, sometimes at really low altitudes, while in external side of Alps, usually, in high altitudes, summers shorten enough to became a Cfc climate much before the coldest winter month reaching -3oC, such as in Napf. Only at really high altitudes or due to particular microclimates, Df climates are found in the External Alps, and usually as Dfc climate, once it occurs just some hundred meters above the Cfc climate area.
Should I change the article? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.18.157.167 ( talk) 19:34, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
Is there an explanation of why this article is rated as mid-importance?? South Bay ( talk) 03:05, 9 January 2010 (UTC)
As someone how has spent summers in Central Europe and Southern Illinois I definitely would not call Central Europe's climate Humid Continental. I don't know if the map is based on any research, but the climates might as well be on two different planets. -- 67.142.130.20 ( talk) 06:35, 3 March 2010 (UTC)
I initially chose:
When editing the data for Pyongyang (primarily to improve precision), I also added a graph at the same time. I do not think it should be included as an example over other Asian cities because it has the same classification as Beijing does, and is thus a repeat. it only differs in the maritime influence, as August, not July, appears to be the warmest month. What we probably should add is a European Dfa example, a European borderline case, an Asian borderline case, an Asian Dwb, Dfb, and Dfa. --- 华钢琴49 ( TALK) 22:05, 5 May 2010 (UTC)
I propose that the article continental climate be merged into this article, as the information there is to be found almost in its entirety on this page, plus a great, great deal more.
If the aim of the continental climate page was to provide a description of climactic regions that display continentality without following the strict and arbitrary definitions of what is a (humid) continental climate according to the Koppen climate classification system, this aim has most certainly not been met. 1brettsnyder ( talk) 08:51, 1 August 2010 (UTC)
I propose a complete re-write of this mess of an article. the humid subtropical article is much better written due primarily to this. --- 何献龙4993 ( talk) 01:07, 5 September 2010 (UTC)
I'm curious as to why the sections of this article are split up into 'North America'(not even labelled so, just assumed, as though if it isn't made explicit that somewhere else is being referred to, then naturally the subject is the US) and then 'Places outside the US'. This seems to me to be a somewhat parochial way of organizing things. Grcaldwell ( talk) 10:58, 28 November 2010 (UTC)
Not so quick with the charts, Thegreatdr. This article does not have the continental/regional divisions that the humid subtropical article does, which assists the selection of cities for charts. Could hardly call one city for each type representative of the world at-large. More on this later... --HXL's Roundtable and Record 15:00, 3 April 2011 (UTC)
The largest number of the English-language users of Wikipedia are Americans. Climate is a very provincial subject. People know the quirks of some local microclimates where some physical feature (mountains, water exposure) make the difference within a few kilometers, as in coastal California, greater New York City, Salt Lake City, Phoenix, Denver, and southeastern Massachusetts. Such is especially true of places on climatic borderlines (like San Diego and Salt Lake City). I have seen the climate of Salt Lake City described as Csa, Dsa,and BSk with some nearby locations (the Great Salt Lake Desert and the Wasatch Range) described as BWk and Dfb. The C/D line depends upon the -3C/0C divide for the coldest month, and the BSk/Cs or Ds divide depending on whether one considers a couple of very dry months as part of the summer. The 'low' areas of the area are just too dry to qualify for the Cfa or Dfa categories.
New York City offers one 'problem' -- of where one draws the C/D line. The -3C isotherm passes through northern part of the northern and western suburbs, and the 0C January isotherm is very close to JFK Airport. Poughkeepsie and Morristown are clearly Dfa. Coney Island is Cfa. Midtown Manhattan? Which line do you use?
...Maybe margin examples would be appropriate -- Cfa/Dfa (St. Louis?), Dfa/Dfb (Minneapolis?) and Dfa/BSk (somewhere in Ukraine?) if shown as such. Climatic boundaries except in mountainous areas are usually areas of transition. I suggest that the margins be within the zone in question and not be places of a variety of microclimates. Pbrower2a ( talk) 17:05, 8 October 2011 (UTC)
Morristown is actually Cfa. Also, the map shows continental climates as too extensive.
They should not include Boston, most of New Jersey, and much of the Polish Baltic coast (e.g. Gdansk, and for instance Warsaw is barely continental). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 168.229.107.122 ( talk) 13:43, 18 May 2012 (UTC)
The article currently doesn't explain the specific meaning of the "Dsa" climate. Please add. -- 92.226.27.226 ( talk) 14:11, 13 July 2012 (UTC)
I understand that this article has Toronto, Ontario and its surrounding vicinity as a Dfb climate zone. With the hot and dry summer that we've been having this year, maybe it should be reclassified as a Dsa climate zone. If this dry climate persists into 2013, the climate experts may have no choice but to reclassify Southern Ontario's climate zone. GVnayR ( talk) 17:03, 25 July 2012 (UTC)
I check pages listed in Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for orphaned references in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of Humid continental climate's orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for this article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.
Reference named "CMA":
I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not. AnomieBOT ⚡ 17:27, 20 September 2013 (UTC)
Why are these classified as humid continental on this article? They're continental but not humid - they have dry summers. Jim Michael ( talk) 14:16, 30 November 2014 (UTC)
I chose Pyongyang, North Korea, as a representative example of a site with a Dwa (hot, rainy summer and cold, dry winter).
The wet winter Dfa (as in Chicago) was shown with no contrast for a dry winter. One might wish to change the alignment, as it doesn;t satisfy me. Pbrower2a ( talk) 01:56, 11 December 2014 (UTC)
I checked in on this article for the first time in a while and was astounded. The gallery was back (see Wikipedia is not an art gallery) and the format was in ruins. I was bold and temporarily fixed it (mainly format-wise) to increase the chances someone might be able to use it. I added some referenced content, and shifted the unreferenced article template at the top of the article to unreferenced sections within the sections which continue to have no referencing. I'm tempted to remove the remainder of the unreferenced content , which is well within the rules. If any information is added without referencing in the future, it will be removed per wikipedia rules. :/ Thegreatdr ( talk) 01:30, 23 February 2015 (UTC)
Toronto is only partially in dfa along the lake. Most of the city limits lie in dfb. It is incorrect to list that city as a dfa when it borders both dfa/dfb. 50.101.55.5 ( talk) 02:04, 1 December 2019 (UTC)
Was very confused by Spokane Wa and Kelowna BC being considered Humid continental because those are two very non humid areas of the world. Dry summer Humid continental is an oxymoron. They are considered continental climates because they have a high range of temperatures and are too wet to be semi arid. But a dry summer means that there is not a lot of humidity. I think because DSA and DSB are pretty small areas without major cities they just kinda got put into the wrong category because nobody cared. I think that DSA/DSB shouldn't be considered humid but I guess thats a problem for the KOPEN climate people. Always beleive in hope ( talk) 22:41, 8 August 2022 (UTC)
There were 7 charts in this article. I removed the one for Erzurum because the source was not quite reliable.
But now, A new one for Winnipeg is added. I like the charts to be honest, but isn’t 7 charts too much(3 from Canada only)?
PAper GOL (
talk) 14:03, 16 August 2023 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Humid continental climate article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
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Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
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![]() | Text and/or other creative content from Humid continental climate was copied or moved into Temperate continental climate with this edit on July 1, 2022. The former page's history now serves to provide attribution for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists. |
The article about subarctic climate says 90 days frost freee periode at most and no more than 3 months of summer (mean 24-hr average at least 10°C). However, this article says that an area with summer lasting less than four months (and winter colder than -3) has a subarctic climate. A substantial area in Scandinavia, Russia and Canada have summers lasting more than 3 months and less than 4 months. Lillehammer, Norway, has a summer lasting on average 108 days, frost free periode is a bit longer, while winter (average below freezing) lasts 5 months, with January average -9 C. So is this a humid continental (Dfb) climate or subarctic (Dfc) climate? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Orcaborealis ( talk • contribs) 09:05, 22 October 2006 (UTC)
Can anyone prove that Charleston and Roanoke is is in the Humid Continental climate zone? Those cities do have mountains, but they are not high enough to make a huge difference. The coldest areas of West Virginia and Virginia are in the Allegheny Mountain range. Neither city is located in that area. The Punk 08:50, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
In the Köppen article, the Dfa /Dwa/Dsa subtype is referred to as having a hot summer, while the Dfb subtype (hemiboreal) is referred to as having a warm summer. Orcaborealis 09:07, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
No -- Dfb suggests a long (three months or so, which is enough for some agriculture), but not 'hot' summer, one with four or more months of average temperatures above 10°C, but none at or above 22°C. Such allows a significant frost-free season suitable for such crops as potatoes and the hardier varieties of wheat. Dfa indicates a month with an average temperature at or above 22°C... and implies a long summer because the transition from a snowy 0°C month takes time through some 'cool' months that may be considered 'spring' or 'fall'(typically May and September -- which implies a five-month summer by climatic, if not cultural, standards). Such crops as maize and tomatoes possible in a Dfa climate with its long summer are impossible in a Dfb climate that has the possibility of a killing frost during much of the year. Dfc climates, in contrast to Dfb climates, have short summers unsuited to effective agriculture. Short summers might allow some spikes of temperature (a 37°C record in Fort Yukon, Alaska north of the Arctic Circle) -- but those temperatures are short-lived. More characteristic is the possibility of a severe frost even in July.
As a rule, summers become warmer and longer as one goes southward through the layers of D climates. Dfa climates are subject to harsh summer heat waves -- but unlike the neighboring Cfa climates to their south they can have weeks of snow cover that allow more intense and more sustained chill than is characteristic of Cfa climates to the south.
Winters that might be long and severe toward the tundra/boreal forest divide near the Dfc/ET divide become shorter and less distinct until the Cfa/Dfa divide near Philadelphia or St. Louis, where snow is possible only as a short-term phenomenon. To be sure, a place like Memphis, Tennessee or Richmond, Virginia clearly to the south of the Dfa/Cfa divide has a well-marked winter unsuited to rapid crop growth in the short, chilly winter. Hard frosts are possible -- and so is snow -- in the more poleward areas of Cfa climate. But we should be discussing that in a Cfa classification. Around the Dfa/Cfa divide one might find that a climatic summer begins in April and ends in October.
The issue is not what is culturally understood as "summer" or "winter"; the words apply to essentially the same months in New Orleans and San Francisco -- and even Honolulu! -- as they do in Edmonton because of shared language and culture, even if "summer" and "winter" have different local meanings in climate; the Köppen classification allows the physical distinctions between groups of climates. -- Paul from Michigan 14:51, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
To me it seems inaccurate that Tokyo, Japan be labelled as a Humid Continental Climate. If you look at the climate chart both for summer temperatures and winter temperatures (as well as absolute minimum lows), this clearly falls into the Humid Subtropical Category and not the Humid Continental Category. Deneb1978 06:04, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
The map attached to this article is confusing. It has no legend and seems to have little relation to the two subtypes described in the article text. BobDively 18:59, 2 March 2007 (UTC)
More of Maryland should be shaded, and no part of Oklahoma or Arkansas should be blue, let alone dark blue. According to this map, Tulsa has a humid continental climate, although its average temperature in January is 36 [4]. 72.81.251.212 (JScott06) 21:09, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
this map is completly wrong some of the largest cities included in the area on this map so not meet the requierments set to be considered humid continental-- Dzd ( talk) 02:19, 6 December 2008 (UTC)
The article says: "Average annual temperature below 8°C". Where does this definition come from? And, the article says that annual amplitude (monthly averages) is no more than 22°C . This is wrong. The amplitude can be significantly greater. Here is data for Moscow, with an amplitude of nearly 29°C. Orcaborealis 17:51, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
Here's another incorrect claim: Nashville and Louisville in the transition zone. Both cities have coldest month averages above 0°C, so they are are in the subtropical zone. [9] [10] Faz90 ( talk) 05:37, 31 January 2008 (UTC)
The mean temperature in Boston in January, the coldest month isn't bellow -3°C. It's only -2.6°C. So, Boston can't be considered as an exact Dfa climate, but as a Cfa climate in which the mean temperature is between the freezing point (0°C) and -3ºC, just like New York. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 189.20.72.66 ( talk) 22:24, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
You're right. Actually, the coldest month is -1.5C. Philadelphia is a true subtropical, proven here: http://www.idcide.com/weather/pa/philadelphia.htm. Oh, and by the way, we should call all parts of New Jersey (besides the northwestern part), Boston, NYC, and extreme southeastern New York humid subtropical. If Cape Cod's climate is like the west coast, then it's marine west coast. How come nobody seems to get that? Koppen's boundaries shouldn't change because something on the east coast would then be called "Marine 'West' Coast." Press olive, win oil ( talk) 20:44, 4 April 2008 (UTC)
D climates are rare in the Southern Hemisphere for the simple reason that all landmasses south of between 30°S and 60°S are exposed to the moderating effects of open ocean or are dry enough ( Patagonia) due to rain-shadow effects that if they have a chilly month to have BSk (cool steppe) or BSk (cool desert) climates. Temperature ranges are generally slight between the zones of subtropical desert and the Antarctic icecap. Thus the transition in the southern hemisphere between the warm temperate zone and the subantarctic regions is ordinarily Cfa→Cfb→Cfc→ET from north to south, Cfc climates appearing where summers are short but no month has an average temperature below 0°C.
Rare, of course, does not mean non-existent. Some highland areas in New Zealand have one month below 0°C... it's in fact an area with ski resorts. It covers little area, but it exists. It has a Dfb or Dfc climate. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Paul from Michigan ( talk • contribs) 22:22, 22 January 2008 (UTC)
Topeka is in the transition zone, proven here: http://www.idcide.com/weather/ks/topeka.htm. I would consider it humid subtropical because Koppen did. Press olive, win oil ( talk) 21:35, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
Is Juneau's climate subarctic or humid continental? According to http://www.idcide.com/weather/ak/juneau.htm, Juneau has 3 months that average above 10C/50F and 8 months below this line. However, 1 month is on that borderline. I read that Juneau was the size of Rhode Island on the internet, so the subarctic-continental border would be located in Juneau. However, every map that I've come across says that Juneau is subarctic. Then again, many also use 0C as the subtropical-continental dividing line instead of -3C. NYC is considered humid subtropical by Koppen standards. Press olive, win oil ( talk) 22:32, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
Interestingly, Trondheim, Norway, at more than 63 degrees North latitude, has a climate very similar to Juneau (although Trondheim gets less precipitation), and is on the border of four climate zones: Cfb-Dfb-Dfc-Cfc border, so it is hard to classify! As seen in table below (1961-90 base period):
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Orcaborealis ( talk) 16:34, 27 May 2011 (UTC)
Cape Cod and nearby islands get me sick climate wise. Climate wise means I would love to go to Cape Cod in summer but Cape Cod is the reason why some people draw the borderline at 0C. If Cape Cod's climate is like the west coast, call it Marine West Coast. Are San Francisco and Los Angeles on the Mediterranean? I don't think so. However, these places in California have a Mediterranean climate. Also, how about global warming? At the start of the industrial revolution, temperatures were a bit cooler. NYC was between 0C and -3C even then, but climate does change. If global warming continued until it was 20C higher, Maine would have a humid subtropical climate, and NYC would have a tropical rain forest climate. There'd be major differences. Press olive, win oil ( talk) 13:29, 18 April 2008 (UTC)
"Dfa: Hot (or very warm) summer subtype"
Is this a user made list or is based on real statistic? If the former, could we include Southern Quebec? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Deus911 ( talk • contribs) 01:59, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
The Köppen climate classification of Dfa appears in the first section heading, with no explanation of what these letters mean. Only by scrolling down to the bottom of the article can the reader discover that these letters are part of a classification system. This article and the others which describe various classifications should each mention the Köppen climate classification system and the particular code in the lede. This is a bigger job than I have the energy to do. -- DThomsen8 ( talk) 13:04, 14 June 2009 (UTC)
Many of the cities in Europe listed as Dfb climate are actually Cfb due to winters being too warm to fit the Dfb criteria. These cities must be removed, or another section added, where the cities having winters warmer than -3 C and colder than 0 Celsius are listed, as is done for North America. Examples: Bratislava has a coldest month of -1.3 Celsius link Bratislava climate. Budapest has a coldest month of 0.2 Celsius, even above freezing and is not Dfb whether the Koppen definition is used or the American, link Budapest climate. Vienna has a coldest month of -1.4 Vienna climate Why so many mistakes? Orcaborealis ( talk) 19:30, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
The altitude actually is not the determinat factor to the occurence of Continental Climate (Df) in the Alps. While some cities and towns at a few Hundred meters above the sea level, such as Klagenfurt and most of Carinthia, have a typical Dfb climate, others at much higher altitude (such as Napf, Grachen -about 1500meters above the sea level - Switzerland) do not. The position inside the mountain range is actually the main factor. I think it would be more corect to divide in 'Inner Alps' and 'External Alps'. The first one would reffer to Carinthia, Tyrol, western Styria and Southern Salzburger in Austria, South Tyrol, Sondrio's province, Comelico and Aosta's Valley in Italy, Vallais and Grauben in Switzerland, and I wouldn't know where else, probably High Savoy and some other places in French Alps. In the Inner Alps Dfb climate indeed occur, sometimes at really low altitudes, while in external side of Alps, usually, in high altitudes, summers shorten enough to became a Cfc climate much before the coldest winter month reaching -3oC, such as in Napf. Only at really high altitudes or due to particular microclimates, Df climates are found in the External Alps, and usually as Dfc climate, once it occurs just some hundred meters above the Cfc climate area.
Should I change the article? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.18.157.167 ( talk) 19:34, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
Is there an explanation of why this article is rated as mid-importance?? South Bay ( talk) 03:05, 9 January 2010 (UTC)
As someone how has spent summers in Central Europe and Southern Illinois I definitely would not call Central Europe's climate Humid Continental. I don't know if the map is based on any research, but the climates might as well be on two different planets. -- 67.142.130.20 ( talk) 06:35, 3 March 2010 (UTC)
I initially chose:
When editing the data for Pyongyang (primarily to improve precision), I also added a graph at the same time. I do not think it should be included as an example over other Asian cities because it has the same classification as Beijing does, and is thus a repeat. it only differs in the maritime influence, as August, not July, appears to be the warmest month. What we probably should add is a European Dfa example, a European borderline case, an Asian borderline case, an Asian Dwb, Dfb, and Dfa. --- 华钢琴49 ( TALK) 22:05, 5 May 2010 (UTC)
I propose that the article continental climate be merged into this article, as the information there is to be found almost in its entirety on this page, plus a great, great deal more.
If the aim of the continental climate page was to provide a description of climactic regions that display continentality without following the strict and arbitrary definitions of what is a (humid) continental climate according to the Koppen climate classification system, this aim has most certainly not been met. 1brettsnyder ( talk) 08:51, 1 August 2010 (UTC)
I propose a complete re-write of this mess of an article. the humid subtropical article is much better written due primarily to this. --- 何献龙4993 ( talk) 01:07, 5 September 2010 (UTC)
I'm curious as to why the sections of this article are split up into 'North America'(not even labelled so, just assumed, as though if it isn't made explicit that somewhere else is being referred to, then naturally the subject is the US) and then 'Places outside the US'. This seems to me to be a somewhat parochial way of organizing things. Grcaldwell ( talk) 10:58, 28 November 2010 (UTC)
Not so quick with the charts, Thegreatdr. This article does not have the continental/regional divisions that the humid subtropical article does, which assists the selection of cities for charts. Could hardly call one city for each type representative of the world at-large. More on this later... --HXL's Roundtable and Record 15:00, 3 April 2011 (UTC)
The largest number of the English-language users of Wikipedia are Americans. Climate is a very provincial subject. People know the quirks of some local microclimates where some physical feature (mountains, water exposure) make the difference within a few kilometers, as in coastal California, greater New York City, Salt Lake City, Phoenix, Denver, and southeastern Massachusetts. Such is especially true of places on climatic borderlines (like San Diego and Salt Lake City). I have seen the climate of Salt Lake City described as Csa, Dsa,and BSk with some nearby locations (the Great Salt Lake Desert and the Wasatch Range) described as BWk and Dfb. The C/D line depends upon the -3C/0C divide for the coldest month, and the BSk/Cs or Ds divide depending on whether one considers a couple of very dry months as part of the summer. The 'low' areas of the area are just too dry to qualify for the Cfa or Dfa categories.
New York City offers one 'problem' -- of where one draws the C/D line. The -3C isotherm passes through northern part of the northern and western suburbs, and the 0C January isotherm is very close to JFK Airport. Poughkeepsie and Morristown are clearly Dfa. Coney Island is Cfa. Midtown Manhattan? Which line do you use?
...Maybe margin examples would be appropriate -- Cfa/Dfa (St. Louis?), Dfa/Dfb (Minneapolis?) and Dfa/BSk (somewhere in Ukraine?) if shown as such. Climatic boundaries except in mountainous areas are usually areas of transition. I suggest that the margins be within the zone in question and not be places of a variety of microclimates. Pbrower2a ( talk) 17:05, 8 October 2011 (UTC)
Morristown is actually Cfa. Also, the map shows continental climates as too extensive.
They should not include Boston, most of New Jersey, and much of the Polish Baltic coast (e.g. Gdansk, and for instance Warsaw is barely continental). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 168.229.107.122 ( talk) 13:43, 18 May 2012 (UTC)
The article currently doesn't explain the specific meaning of the "Dsa" climate. Please add. -- 92.226.27.226 ( talk) 14:11, 13 July 2012 (UTC)
I understand that this article has Toronto, Ontario and its surrounding vicinity as a Dfb climate zone. With the hot and dry summer that we've been having this year, maybe it should be reclassified as a Dsa climate zone. If this dry climate persists into 2013, the climate experts may have no choice but to reclassify Southern Ontario's climate zone. GVnayR ( talk) 17:03, 25 July 2012 (UTC)
I check pages listed in Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for orphaned references in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of Humid continental climate's orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for this article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.
Reference named "CMA":
I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not. AnomieBOT ⚡ 17:27, 20 September 2013 (UTC)
Why are these classified as humid continental on this article? They're continental but not humid - they have dry summers. Jim Michael ( talk) 14:16, 30 November 2014 (UTC)
I chose Pyongyang, North Korea, as a representative example of a site with a Dwa (hot, rainy summer and cold, dry winter).
The wet winter Dfa (as in Chicago) was shown with no contrast for a dry winter. One might wish to change the alignment, as it doesn;t satisfy me. Pbrower2a ( talk) 01:56, 11 December 2014 (UTC)
I checked in on this article for the first time in a while and was astounded. The gallery was back (see Wikipedia is not an art gallery) and the format was in ruins. I was bold and temporarily fixed it (mainly format-wise) to increase the chances someone might be able to use it. I added some referenced content, and shifted the unreferenced article template at the top of the article to unreferenced sections within the sections which continue to have no referencing. I'm tempted to remove the remainder of the unreferenced content , which is well within the rules. If any information is added without referencing in the future, it will be removed per wikipedia rules. :/ Thegreatdr ( talk) 01:30, 23 February 2015 (UTC)
Toronto is only partially in dfa along the lake. Most of the city limits lie in dfb. It is incorrect to list that city as a dfa when it borders both dfa/dfb. 50.101.55.5 ( talk) 02:04, 1 December 2019 (UTC)
Was very confused by Spokane Wa and Kelowna BC being considered Humid continental because those are two very non humid areas of the world. Dry summer Humid continental is an oxymoron. They are considered continental climates because they have a high range of temperatures and are too wet to be semi arid. But a dry summer means that there is not a lot of humidity. I think because DSA and DSB are pretty small areas without major cities they just kinda got put into the wrong category because nobody cared. I think that DSA/DSB shouldn't be considered humid but I guess thats a problem for the KOPEN climate people. Always beleive in hope ( talk) 22:41, 8 August 2022 (UTC)
There were 7 charts in this article. I removed the one for Erzurum because the source was not quite reliable.
But now, A new one for Winnipeg is added. I like the charts to be honest, but isn’t 7 charts too much(3 from Canada only)?
PAper GOL (
talk) 14:03, 16 August 2023 (UTC)