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Hughes de Payens was pupil of Schlomo ben Yitzchak. A link between Knights Templar, Gnosticism, Kabbalah and Baphomet... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 01:08, September 17, 2005 ( talk • contribs) 84.61.10.86
According to a second version, Hughes de Payens was born in the city of Forenza in Basilicata, (ancient Lucania), Italy and bore his father's surname, "Paganos",or "Pagan" who was a norman ruler and his wife Emma. That changes perspective of the whole genesis of the "Pauperes Commilitiones Christi Templique Salomonici", or Knights Templar Order, and moves it to middle ages Italy, to a region that was enriched by different cultural influences up to that period,(Pagan,Greek,Lungobardian and Normanic cultures)... After founding the order, they joined the Crusades lead by French royalty, and departed to the Holy Land. December 11th, 2008, Roxane Larocca. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.4.55.32 ( talk) 16:37, 11 December 2008 (UTC)
Dude this is rediculous and you cite no sources. Edgemaniac ( talk) 03:01, 2 March 2010 (UTC)
I reverted an edit to the page that tried to change the name from "Hugues" to "Hughes". This is an occasional misspelling. The correct name is either the French spelling, "Hugues de Payens", or the English version, "Hugh of Payens". The "Hughes" spelling is just a confused version of the two. Currently the article title is at Hugues de Payens because I feel that's the most commonly-seen version of the name, but if anyone really wants to move the page to Hugh of Payens, we can definitely talk about it. -- El on ka 16:22, 8 August 2007 (UTC)
Added "In Popular Culture" section to insert the claim that Hugues de Payen married Catherine St Clair, since this is really only part of the recent romantic histories of Rosslyn Chapel. The historical record states that his wife was really Elizabeth de Chappes, and this is what is found on the French Wikipedia version of the article: http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hugues_de_Payns Wfgh66 ( talk) 00:44, 14 March 2008 (UTC)
Hello,
I would like to know why are you desagree, for a external links~ about Hugues de Payns Museum. When I go in the external links about museum (in the article), the links give "bad" informations (open/close of museum....).
In the description, when can see in the notes, the book of M. Thierry Leroy,and the origine of existence of museum is T. Leroy and friends of him. the "webmestre" of external links I purpose, is T. Leroy
Sorry, but you can see, I'm not english....that's why my english isn't good....
Thanks.
Cordially —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.192.144.210 ( talk) 13:18, 10 August 2008 (UTC)
Someone can add this book : Hugues de Payns, la naissance des Templier, de PF Thierry Leroy, ThebookEdition, March 2011,
Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.34.111.166 ( talk) 08:47, 15 July 2011 (UTC)
If I've understood correctly, this is the same fellow as Hugues de Payens: the dispute is over his place of birth. It appears the Italian wiki briefly had both articles but has merged them under the French name, it:Hugues de Payns. There is much discussion on the Italian talk page, which I admit I haven't yet read.
The Catalan wiki describes him as (of course) Catalan. See ca:Hug de Pinós. That's not much help, except to suggest that no one has the faintest idea where he came from. And rew D alby 13:26, 11 May 2012 (UTC)
OK, thanks to all. Since there was no objection I have made the merge. I could save an external link from the page "Ugo de'Pagani", and I retrieved a book citation from that link. I would have loved to save something more, because the existing Hugues de Payens is weak, to say the least, but I honestly couldn't. It was completely unsourced. All the material about the First Crusade and the founding of the Order at that time was fiction. There is no evidence known to me, or cited on Wikipedia, that Hugues/Ugo was in Palestine at that period. And rew D alby 13:31, 24 May 2012 (UTC)
Dear friends, I read your thesis... I am Italian, but I swear this does not influence my research. The data about the Italian origin of Ugo de' Pagani are many, but I have not had time to translate all my research, you can find it in Italian on
Ugo de' Pagani.
In Italy the topic Ugo de' Pagani has become a taboo, because despite historians and heraldists of every age and nationality have always supported his Italian origin, from 1800 on, some novelists have begun to support his French origin.
Thanks.
-
Major
Marco Antonio Sorrentino
Only there??? Read: http://www.facebook.com/Hugo.de.Paganis http://hugodepaganis.blogspot.com/ http://docs.google.com/document/pub?id=1JN_2XJklenCBzacfbEzDjW_w2dSgKytEvE0nLSCC_lI http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utente:Mario_Moiraghi/Sandbox http://www.tonyassante.com/renzoallegri/templari/indice.htm http://www.osmtj.com/date.htm http://www.templars.it/ugodepaganiL.html http://faculty.ed.umuc.edu/~jmatthew/naples/templar.htm http://www.storiainrete.com/619/medio-evo/i-templari-sono-%C2%ABmade-in-italy%C2%BB%E2%80%A6-altro-che-francesi/ http://www.templarisanbernardo.org/A%20Ferrara%20la%20tomba%20di%20Uo%20dei%20Pagani%20primo%20magister%20templare.htm http://forum.nexusedizioni.it/litaliano_che_fondo_i_templari-t4143.0.html http://apocalisselaica.net/varie/miti-misteri-e-poteri-occulti/l-italiano-che-fondo-i-templari http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=59414627202&v=info — Preceding unsigned comment added by Marco Antonio Sorrentino ( talk • contribs) 14:08, 15 May 2012 (UTC)
The following paragraph is unencyclopedic. I have moved it to here. Something similar can be put back in the article if (1) it uses encyclopedic language ("cheats" is out, for starters), (2) it can by reliably sourced, and (3) it goes into the article proper, not the lead.
Under the gallicised version of his name, Hugues de Payens, recently some French cheats adopted him as their fellow countryman, saying that he was born in Payns, in the Champagne region, but:
Scolaire ( talk) 08:14, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
I am currently adding material about alternative views of Hugues de Payens' origin. This results from the merge of the page "Ugo de'Pagani", which existed to highlight an Italian claim to him. And rew D alby 13:35, 24 May 2012 (UTC)
![]() | This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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Hughes de Payens was pupil of Schlomo ben Yitzchak. A link between Knights Templar, Gnosticism, Kabbalah and Baphomet... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 01:08, September 17, 2005 ( talk • contribs) 84.61.10.86
According to a second version, Hughes de Payens was born in the city of Forenza in Basilicata, (ancient Lucania), Italy and bore his father's surname, "Paganos",or "Pagan" who was a norman ruler and his wife Emma. That changes perspective of the whole genesis of the "Pauperes Commilitiones Christi Templique Salomonici", or Knights Templar Order, and moves it to middle ages Italy, to a region that was enriched by different cultural influences up to that period,(Pagan,Greek,Lungobardian and Normanic cultures)... After founding the order, they joined the Crusades lead by French royalty, and departed to the Holy Land. December 11th, 2008, Roxane Larocca. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.4.55.32 ( talk) 16:37, 11 December 2008 (UTC)
Dude this is rediculous and you cite no sources. Edgemaniac ( talk) 03:01, 2 March 2010 (UTC)
I reverted an edit to the page that tried to change the name from "Hugues" to "Hughes". This is an occasional misspelling. The correct name is either the French spelling, "Hugues de Payens", or the English version, "Hugh of Payens". The "Hughes" spelling is just a confused version of the two. Currently the article title is at Hugues de Payens because I feel that's the most commonly-seen version of the name, but if anyone really wants to move the page to Hugh of Payens, we can definitely talk about it. -- El on ka 16:22, 8 August 2007 (UTC)
Added "In Popular Culture" section to insert the claim that Hugues de Payen married Catherine St Clair, since this is really only part of the recent romantic histories of Rosslyn Chapel. The historical record states that his wife was really Elizabeth de Chappes, and this is what is found on the French Wikipedia version of the article: http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hugues_de_Payns Wfgh66 ( talk) 00:44, 14 March 2008 (UTC)
Hello,
I would like to know why are you desagree, for a external links~ about Hugues de Payns Museum. When I go in the external links about museum (in the article), the links give "bad" informations (open/close of museum....).
In the description, when can see in the notes, the book of M. Thierry Leroy,and the origine of existence of museum is T. Leroy and friends of him. the "webmestre" of external links I purpose, is T. Leroy
Sorry, but you can see, I'm not english....that's why my english isn't good....
Thanks.
Cordially —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.192.144.210 ( talk) 13:18, 10 August 2008 (UTC)
Someone can add this book : Hugues de Payns, la naissance des Templier, de PF Thierry Leroy, ThebookEdition, March 2011,
Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.34.111.166 ( talk) 08:47, 15 July 2011 (UTC)
If I've understood correctly, this is the same fellow as Hugues de Payens: the dispute is over his place of birth. It appears the Italian wiki briefly had both articles but has merged them under the French name, it:Hugues de Payns. There is much discussion on the Italian talk page, which I admit I haven't yet read.
The Catalan wiki describes him as (of course) Catalan. See ca:Hug de Pinós. That's not much help, except to suggest that no one has the faintest idea where he came from. And rew D alby 13:26, 11 May 2012 (UTC)
OK, thanks to all. Since there was no objection I have made the merge. I could save an external link from the page "Ugo de'Pagani", and I retrieved a book citation from that link. I would have loved to save something more, because the existing Hugues de Payens is weak, to say the least, but I honestly couldn't. It was completely unsourced. All the material about the First Crusade and the founding of the Order at that time was fiction. There is no evidence known to me, or cited on Wikipedia, that Hugues/Ugo was in Palestine at that period. And rew D alby 13:31, 24 May 2012 (UTC)
Dear friends, I read your thesis... I am Italian, but I swear this does not influence my research. The data about the Italian origin of Ugo de' Pagani are many, but I have not had time to translate all my research, you can find it in Italian on
Ugo de' Pagani.
In Italy the topic Ugo de' Pagani has become a taboo, because despite historians and heraldists of every age and nationality have always supported his Italian origin, from 1800 on, some novelists have begun to support his French origin.
Thanks.
-
Major
Marco Antonio Sorrentino
Only there??? Read: http://www.facebook.com/Hugo.de.Paganis http://hugodepaganis.blogspot.com/ http://docs.google.com/document/pub?id=1JN_2XJklenCBzacfbEzDjW_w2dSgKytEvE0nLSCC_lI http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utente:Mario_Moiraghi/Sandbox http://www.tonyassante.com/renzoallegri/templari/indice.htm http://www.osmtj.com/date.htm http://www.templars.it/ugodepaganiL.html http://faculty.ed.umuc.edu/~jmatthew/naples/templar.htm http://www.storiainrete.com/619/medio-evo/i-templari-sono-%C2%ABmade-in-italy%C2%BB%E2%80%A6-altro-che-francesi/ http://www.templarisanbernardo.org/A%20Ferrara%20la%20tomba%20di%20Uo%20dei%20Pagani%20primo%20magister%20templare.htm http://forum.nexusedizioni.it/litaliano_che_fondo_i_templari-t4143.0.html http://apocalisselaica.net/varie/miti-misteri-e-poteri-occulti/l-italiano-che-fondo-i-templari http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=59414627202&v=info — Preceding unsigned comment added by Marco Antonio Sorrentino ( talk • contribs) 14:08, 15 May 2012 (UTC)
The following paragraph is unencyclopedic. I have moved it to here. Something similar can be put back in the article if (1) it uses encyclopedic language ("cheats" is out, for starters), (2) it can by reliably sourced, and (3) it goes into the article proper, not the lead.
Under the gallicised version of his name, Hugues de Payens, recently some French cheats adopted him as their fellow countryman, saying that he was born in Payns, in the Champagne region, but:
Scolaire ( talk) 08:14, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
I am currently adding material about alternative views of Hugues de Payens' origin. This results from the merge of the page "Ugo de'Pagani", which existed to highlight an Italian claim to him. And rew D alby 13:35, 24 May 2012 (UTC)