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Depending on the definition. A router is also a host. A (level 7) gateway is also a host. As is a printer with a NIC.
I would suggest that a host is a node that has a level 3 address. In *nix, anything that can be added to the hosts file. (This is one of the few instances where I believe even the CCNA material is wrong.)
Is there any RFC on this? Or any academically researched book? -- itpastorn ( talk) 09:35, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
Actually, the whole article stinks. Here's the text as it stands at present, with my comments interspersed throughout and enclosed in braces:
Host (network)
A host is a node on a network that is a computer.[1][2] Every host is a node but every node is not a host.
{I've already discussed the first sentence; the second is simply wrong. It says "every node is not a host," but the beginning of the sentence says "every host is a node"! Obviously, the intent is to say that "not every node is a host," which is entirely different. Moreover, it goes without saying. Furthermore, it follows the statement that "A host is a node," making "Every host is a node" utterly redundant.}
Definition
In general terms, a host is a computer on a computer network. {Is there any good reason for the disclaimer, "in general terms"? Definitions ought to be definite. We already know from the opening sentence that a host is a computer, and that it's a node. The whole sentence, like the one before it, contributes nothing.} A host is at a specific location {Why "specific"? Are there locations other than specific ones?} on the network; {Doesn't that, too, go without saying? Perhaps there are computers which have no location. Are there?} this holds true {"This holds true" is bad style.} for the nodes which make up the network as well. {"As well" as what? We know that a host is a computer which acts as a node on a network. What is now being said of nodes?} The location is called an address; {So the location isn't called a location; why call it a location in the first place?} in the Internet protocol suite, the address is an IP address. {If the address is an IP address, why not introduce it as an "IP address" in the first place? And how does it help to know that? Does "host" mean something in other contexts which differ from its meaning in the Internet protocol suite, and if so, why isn't that explained explicitly? Also, what is it that a "host" hosts? According to the first reference at the bottom, which, incidentally, is gone, but archived by the Wayback Machine, it hosts information. Is that true? Is that why it's called a host? The second reference is a lot more confusing; it only says what "a host used to be."}
The term host should not be confused with host computer, which is a computer server on a computer network. {This really throws a monkey wrench into the whole concept. None of these things are surrounded with quotation marks to distinguish them as precise terms. Is "host computer" not a host? Is it not a computer? What is it? What about "computer host"? Does that mean anything? Is a "computer server" a computer? Does it serve computers? Is a computer network a network made up of computers? Why not say so? The sentence seems to imply, assuming that a "host computer" is a computer, and assuming that "computer server on a computer network" means that the "host computer" is "on" a network in some way, that it's something other than a node. What else is there on networks besides nodes? Doesn't that require explanation in order to understand what a host is?}
History {The information here is of historical interest, but it's peripheral to a discussion of hosts.}
A hosts file originally defined in RFC 627 to define locations of hosts on the ARPANET.
{That isn't a sentence. Also, RFC 627 doesn't define or mention "hosts file." Nor does it define "locations" or "locations of hosts." It is about a file, but the name of the file is "HOSTS.TXT," not "hosts."}
This is why the file was named hosts, literally a file with a list of hosts.[3]
{"This" is vague; what does it refer to? "Literally" goes without saying; we know the article isn't worded figuratively. "HOSTS.TXT," apparently, wasn't "with" a list of hosts, it actually was one, but RFC 627 isn't very helpful in explaining what a host is; its purpose, evidently, was to document and publicize the existence and location of the file.}
References {All these references are very poor. I discuss them with respect to the information they present under the word "host." The inclusion of an RFC among the references is encouraging, though. There must be a few gems among them.}
1. ^ Glossary of Distance Learning Terms, University of New Orleans, Accessed: June 27, 2007.
{That has been taken down, was poorly worded, and was not in the least authoritative. Judging by "Distance Learning," it was intended only as a brief introduction to a few essential ideas students might need to know.}
2. ^ Advertising Glossary Index smartbizconnection.com, Accessed: June 27, 2007.
{This reference is even less clear than the first, is less authoritative, discusses the subject only tangentially, and is profit-motivated. It discusses hosts in a way suggesting its intended readers are already familiar with the term. It actually says only what "host" was, not what it is.}
3. ^ ASCII TEXT FILE OF HOSTNAMES, RFC 627, Mike Kudlick - Jake Feinler, March 25, 1974
{This is ancient and primitive. It's interesting to see how "hostname" was used in 1974, but it isn't really about hosts, only about a file which acted as an index.}
Unfree ( talk) 03:34, 8 March 2008 (UTC)
I am looking for definitions of terms in RFCs. It seems "host" is a bit vague, depending on the circumstances. We have got:
Etc
Two factors seem consistent: Naming and addressability. Generally RFC 1122 seems to be the best source for how the term host is used today. Anyway, the article needs a rewrite.-- itpastorn ( talk) 20:52, 11 March 2008 (UTC)
Lgnlint added a {{ cleanup rewrite}} tag with edit comment: Added cleanup rewrite tag due to article quality and how long it's been in poor shape. I finished a review of all text in this article in 2018 and didn't see such a general issue so have removed the tag. We're going to minimally need a more specific description of what is wrong here before restring it. ~ Kvng ( talk) 13:10, 28 April 2019 (UTC)
I have a number of comments:
* I applaud the effort to define hosts -- it is a term that has confused me for a long time, but this article hasn't really helped, or not very much.
* Back in the day (ca. 1985), the word "host" was (among people I worked with) used to describe almost any standalone computer (e.g., a PDP 11/750). I had one (high ranking in our company) colleague who objected to the term as a devout Catholic.
* Often on mailing lists that I peruse, I see people using the word as a synonym for computer, connected to anything or not (but these days it may be hard to find a computer that is not connected to some network type thing (continuously or intermittently).
* Also, often on mailing lists that I peruse, I see people using the word as a synonym for server.
There is enough confusion (in my mind ;-) that my intent in writing anything will be to avoid the use of the word "host".
In reading what others have written, I will probably continue to have trouble understanding what they mean as I often see it used as a synonym for server and often used as a synonym for any computer on a network, and sometimes even just as a synonym for any computer.
Rhkramer ( talk) 15:53, 28 May 2022 (UTC)
UPDATE : I often also see the word used as a synonym for server, yet per most of the definitions here, a host could be a client or a server. Rhkramer ( talk) 10:41, 9 June 2022 (UTC)
ANOTHER UPDATE: Deleted my comments about the last two paragraphs, added a comment about my intended avoidance of the word "hosts". Rhkramer ( talk) 10:56, 9 June 2022 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Host (network) article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives:
1Auto-archiving period: 365 days
![]() |
![]() | This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||
|
Depending on the definition. A router is also a host. A (level 7) gateway is also a host. As is a printer with a NIC.
I would suggest that a host is a node that has a level 3 address. In *nix, anything that can be added to the hosts file. (This is one of the few instances where I believe even the CCNA material is wrong.)
Is there any RFC on this? Or any academically researched book? -- itpastorn ( talk) 09:35, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
Actually, the whole article stinks. Here's the text as it stands at present, with my comments interspersed throughout and enclosed in braces:
Host (network)
A host is a node on a network that is a computer.[1][2] Every host is a node but every node is not a host.
{I've already discussed the first sentence; the second is simply wrong. It says "every node is not a host," but the beginning of the sentence says "every host is a node"! Obviously, the intent is to say that "not every node is a host," which is entirely different. Moreover, it goes without saying. Furthermore, it follows the statement that "A host is a node," making "Every host is a node" utterly redundant.}
Definition
In general terms, a host is a computer on a computer network. {Is there any good reason for the disclaimer, "in general terms"? Definitions ought to be definite. We already know from the opening sentence that a host is a computer, and that it's a node. The whole sentence, like the one before it, contributes nothing.} A host is at a specific location {Why "specific"? Are there locations other than specific ones?} on the network; {Doesn't that, too, go without saying? Perhaps there are computers which have no location. Are there?} this holds true {"This holds true" is bad style.} for the nodes which make up the network as well. {"As well" as what? We know that a host is a computer which acts as a node on a network. What is now being said of nodes?} The location is called an address; {So the location isn't called a location; why call it a location in the first place?} in the Internet protocol suite, the address is an IP address. {If the address is an IP address, why not introduce it as an "IP address" in the first place? And how does it help to know that? Does "host" mean something in other contexts which differ from its meaning in the Internet protocol suite, and if so, why isn't that explained explicitly? Also, what is it that a "host" hosts? According to the first reference at the bottom, which, incidentally, is gone, but archived by the Wayback Machine, it hosts information. Is that true? Is that why it's called a host? The second reference is a lot more confusing; it only says what "a host used to be."}
The term host should not be confused with host computer, which is a computer server on a computer network. {This really throws a monkey wrench into the whole concept. None of these things are surrounded with quotation marks to distinguish them as precise terms. Is "host computer" not a host? Is it not a computer? What is it? What about "computer host"? Does that mean anything? Is a "computer server" a computer? Does it serve computers? Is a computer network a network made up of computers? Why not say so? The sentence seems to imply, assuming that a "host computer" is a computer, and assuming that "computer server on a computer network" means that the "host computer" is "on" a network in some way, that it's something other than a node. What else is there on networks besides nodes? Doesn't that require explanation in order to understand what a host is?}
History {The information here is of historical interest, but it's peripheral to a discussion of hosts.}
A hosts file originally defined in RFC 627 to define locations of hosts on the ARPANET.
{That isn't a sentence. Also, RFC 627 doesn't define or mention "hosts file." Nor does it define "locations" or "locations of hosts." It is about a file, but the name of the file is "HOSTS.TXT," not "hosts."}
This is why the file was named hosts, literally a file with a list of hosts.[3]
{"This" is vague; what does it refer to? "Literally" goes without saying; we know the article isn't worded figuratively. "HOSTS.TXT," apparently, wasn't "with" a list of hosts, it actually was one, but RFC 627 isn't very helpful in explaining what a host is; its purpose, evidently, was to document and publicize the existence and location of the file.}
References {All these references are very poor. I discuss them with respect to the information they present under the word "host." The inclusion of an RFC among the references is encouraging, though. There must be a few gems among them.}
1. ^ Glossary of Distance Learning Terms, University of New Orleans, Accessed: June 27, 2007.
{That has been taken down, was poorly worded, and was not in the least authoritative. Judging by "Distance Learning," it was intended only as a brief introduction to a few essential ideas students might need to know.}
2. ^ Advertising Glossary Index smartbizconnection.com, Accessed: June 27, 2007.
{This reference is even less clear than the first, is less authoritative, discusses the subject only tangentially, and is profit-motivated. It discusses hosts in a way suggesting its intended readers are already familiar with the term. It actually says only what "host" was, not what it is.}
3. ^ ASCII TEXT FILE OF HOSTNAMES, RFC 627, Mike Kudlick - Jake Feinler, March 25, 1974
{This is ancient and primitive. It's interesting to see how "hostname" was used in 1974, but it isn't really about hosts, only about a file which acted as an index.}
Unfree ( talk) 03:34, 8 March 2008 (UTC)
I am looking for definitions of terms in RFCs. It seems "host" is a bit vague, depending on the circumstances. We have got:
Etc
Two factors seem consistent: Naming and addressability. Generally RFC 1122 seems to be the best source for how the term host is used today. Anyway, the article needs a rewrite.-- itpastorn ( talk) 20:52, 11 March 2008 (UTC)
Lgnlint added a {{ cleanup rewrite}} tag with edit comment: Added cleanup rewrite tag due to article quality and how long it's been in poor shape. I finished a review of all text in this article in 2018 and didn't see such a general issue so have removed the tag. We're going to minimally need a more specific description of what is wrong here before restring it. ~ Kvng ( talk) 13:10, 28 April 2019 (UTC)
I have a number of comments:
* I applaud the effort to define hosts -- it is a term that has confused me for a long time, but this article hasn't really helped, or not very much.
* Back in the day (ca. 1985), the word "host" was (among people I worked with) used to describe almost any standalone computer (e.g., a PDP 11/750). I had one (high ranking in our company) colleague who objected to the term as a devout Catholic.
* Often on mailing lists that I peruse, I see people using the word as a synonym for computer, connected to anything or not (but these days it may be hard to find a computer that is not connected to some network type thing (continuously or intermittently).
* Also, often on mailing lists that I peruse, I see people using the word as a synonym for server.
There is enough confusion (in my mind ;-) that my intent in writing anything will be to avoid the use of the word "host".
In reading what others have written, I will probably continue to have trouble understanding what they mean as I often see it used as a synonym for server and often used as a synonym for any computer on a network, and sometimes even just as a synonym for any computer.
Rhkramer ( talk) 15:53, 28 May 2022 (UTC)
UPDATE : I often also see the word used as a synonym for server, yet per most of the definitions here, a host could be a client or a server. Rhkramer ( talk) 10:41, 9 June 2022 (UTC)
ANOTHER UPDATE: Deleted my comments about the last two paragraphs, added a comment about my intended avoidance of the word "hosts". Rhkramer ( talk) 10:56, 9 June 2022 (UTC)