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In the table on the right side of the article, some users put "Central" for the capital of Hong Kong, and "Sha Tin" for the largest city. I wonder if this is correct. As I know, a lot of texts would rather put Hong Kong itself as a city, those entities like Central and Sha Tin as areas within a city. In Wikipedia, I found a sentence in the article List of current and former capitals of subnational entities of China that reads like this: "Excluded from the list: First-level units that are cities, such as the municipalities or the two special administrative regions of Hong Kong and Macau." In that way, it seems that Hong Kong is "a first-level administrative region that is a city." By definition, the capital city of a city is the city itself. A good example is Singapore, which is a city-state. Its capital city is Singapore, its only city. Using this logic, should the capital city of the Hong Kong Special Administrative Region be "Hong Kong"? Or, should we put "Not applicable" in the blank for "capital"? Meanwhile, in the blank for "capital", I have put Central as the de facto capital of Hong Kong, and mentioned that it is the location of the Government headquarters. Similarly, in the "administrative divisions" section, some users added that "There are several cities and towns within Hong Kong, the largest of which include Kowloon." I wonder if the wording should be changed. - 70.231.51.124 08:07, 31 March 2006 (UTC)
What does the English word city means can be viewed from different perspectives, e.g., geographical, ceremonial, and administrative. Geographically there're several urbanised areas within the territory of Hong Kong, that are geographically qualified to be considered cities or towns. Administratively, Hong Kong is unitary and there's no sub entity designated as city (or town). The extents of the City of Victoria, Kowloon and New Kowloon, are respectively demarcated by law. So far I have not found any information showing if Victoria City (or any other part of Hong Kong) has received a charter from the Queen/King or not.
Victoria City, legally speaking, still exists, and many government offices, including the headquarters of almost all departments are within Victoria City. But in modern conversations few people actually use this name. They call the names of the areas instead. It's also interesting to note that the boundary of the City of Victoria does not follow those of the modern districts.
If you're taken a geographical perspective, Kowloon (including New Kowloon) would be the urbanised area with the largest population, wheareas the City of Victoria would be the legal entity where the government headquarters are located. — Insta ntnood 21:12, 31 March 2006 (UTC)
It seems that the currect info box is not really suitable for the article about Hong Kong. Because it is the standard country info box. Although some users have been repeatedly arguing that Hong Kong is a country on its own, Hong Kong is not quite the same kind of entity as those common examples of countries that we can come up with, like the United States, the Russian Federation, the Republic of Korea, the People's Republic of China (PRC) etc. The fundamental policy of the Hong Kong Special Administrative Region (HKSAR) is "One Country, Two System", which means practicing two political systems (the one within the HKSAR and the one in the rest of the PRC) in one country (the PRC). Therefore, it would be more correct to say that the HKSAR + the rest of the PRC = the entirety of the PRC = one country, rather than the HKSAR = one country. But when Hong Kong was a British colony before 1997, Hong Kong is not an integral part of Britain. Due to this historical, and pragmatical reason, Hong Kong has usually been put in a separate entry in a list of countries. However, Hong Kong is now a special administrative region (SAR), and does not have all the characteristics possessed by those common countries like the United States, the Russian Federation. An SAR is a very special kind of political entity / administrative division of the PRC. It would be useful to design a unique info box specifically for an SAR. If we insist to use the standard country info box, we really don't know what to put for "capital city". It seems silly and providing no useful information to say that the capital city of Hong Kong is Hong Kong. I would prefer, as some users suggested above, changing the "capital city" to "seat of the Government headquarter", and the "largest city" to "largest district". This would make the info box tailor-made for the special situation of Hong Kong. - Alan 00:05, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
Let's take a look at the article " Political divisions of China", the subsection about "Special Administrative Regions" is listed under the section "Province level". In the "Summary" section, "special administrative regions" is again placed in the box for "Province level". Apart from this, in both the articles " List of China administrative divisions by population" and " List of China administrative divisions by population density", the first sentence is "This is a list of the first-level administrative divisions of People's Republic of China." Meanwhile, the two special administrative regions - Hong Kong and Macau - are included in the lists. These clearly shows that special administrative regions are province-level, i.e. first-level, administrative regions of the PR China. That is, Hong Kong and Macau are part of the hierachy of the administrative regions of the PR China. I feel that some Hong Kong Wikipedians have been trying to deny this fact for many times, but no matter what, that is the fact. As a first-level administrative region of the PR China, it makes sense for the "Hong Kong" article to use the kind of info box that has been used in the articles for other first-level administrative regions, such as Shanghai, Guangdong, Guangxi, Beijing etc. But this could have a certain extent of flexibility.
Although a lot of people like to compare Hong Kong with Singapore, their status in the hierachy of administrative divisions should not be equated. Singapore is an independent state, or a city-state. Hong Kong is a special administrative region of the PR China, and coincidently a city. Regardless of whether a special administrative region is automatically a city, it is a first-level administrative region. - Alan 03:01, 10 April 2006 (UTC)
Hong Kong simply doesn't have a capital,
according to an government official. Thus IMO it is ridiculous to put Central / Victority City as the "capital" of Hong Kong. You can call Central as the administrative center but not "capital". --
Lorenzarius
09:04, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
If anybody cares about Instantnood's current revert war on this article: [1] [2] [3] SchmuckyTheCat 19:30, 22 April 2006 (UTC)
Hi, we need Chinese language help at Chinese wine. There's a wine which isn't yet discussed that is sold as "hung-lu" wine. It is reddish in color, with a sharp smell and is sold by the Oriental Mascot brand (which also makes mijiu and formerly also made Shaoxing jiu). The largest photo of this wine is here, but the characters aren't easily readable. I think "hung-lu" isn't Hanyu pinyin. Can someone provide information about this wine, the characters, etc.? Thank you! http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/images/B0000DJZ0F/ref=dp_primary-product-display_0/102-4042702-9901704?%5Fencoding=UTF8&n=3370831&s=gourmet-food Badagnani 22:34, 22 April 2006 (UTC)
I made a major change to the infobox so we no longer use the country template to rid us of the problems associated with it. I've adopted an infobox a few other Chinese cities use (not a template) and made it very HK specific. Discuss if there is something missing or problematic. SchmuckyTheCat 03:58, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
The 'new' infobox is not easy on the eyes. It is more difficult to read. What were the problems associated with the Template:Infobox Country?— MJCdetroit 16:19, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
This will need consensus, here and at Wikipedia:WikiProject Countries, to be implemented. I oppose. Entities with sufficient autonomy (i.e., those given separate entries at the World Factbook) have the WikiProject Countries applied to them. For example, Puerto Rico has the country template, not the US state template.-- Jiang 19:42, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
Amidst the revert wars, I can't believed nobody noticed 17 footnotes missing from the article due to the missing <references/> tag. I have inserted it. Also, reworded the caption in the Victoria Harbour by night photo. Kimchi. sg 15:23, 3 May 2006 (UTC)
Footnotes not in any proper citation format. Skinnyweed 14:42, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
I see this at the Chinese page: [9] no idea what it is, but it looks very cool. Consider copying it to Commons, using it here and nominating as featured picture? Stevage 20:00, 15 May 2006 (UTC)
This article says only 25% of the land in Hong Kong is developed. When I looked at the google satellite photo of Hong Kong, I doubt if the 25% is accurate because only a small portion of the land looked "gray" (urban) and most of Hong Kong is covered by vegetations. I remembered reading a tourist brochure from Hong Kong which said Hong Kong is one of the greeniest cities in Asia despite its high population because its population density is vertically stacked. Kowloonese 01:15, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
According to surveys, Hong Kong is 94% urbanised, so it can't be a greeniest city... Also, according to Guiness Record, "Ap Lei Chau" which is an Island in Hong Kong, is the most densely populated Island in the world. Cherubfish 11:04, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
But I agree with you. There are pretty much outlying islands in Hong Kong that have no settlements on. My flat used to face the sea and there was a lot of these islands. Cherubfish 16:45, 17 May 2006 (UTC)
I'm not sure if anyone has had a smell of the fragrant harbour, the sight of stuff floating in the surrounding waters or the brown haze in sky around HK. Maybe it is green in the NT, but not in Kowloon of Hong Kong Island. Recycling is a joke in HK, there is too much packaging. Autos, lorries and buses still emit dirty emissions that coat the buildings in the urban areas of HK. HK is still auto dependent and throw away society. Don't blame China for the pollution, HK contributes its part to the South China area. User:fat_pig73 17:03, 13 June 2006 (EST)
The symbol in the top right corner covers the original small star for featured article. -- Samwingkit 13:27, 17 May 2006 (UTC)
Just look the summer of 2006. The pollution levels have been unacceptable. The city is covered in heavy smog most of the time, and the air is hardly breathable. Calling Hong Kong green is like calling a toxic waste dump refreshingly natural.
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | Archive 2 | Archive 3 | Archive 4 | Archive 5 | Archive 6 | → | Archive 10 |
In the table on the right side of the article, some users put "Central" for the capital of Hong Kong, and "Sha Tin" for the largest city. I wonder if this is correct. As I know, a lot of texts would rather put Hong Kong itself as a city, those entities like Central and Sha Tin as areas within a city. In Wikipedia, I found a sentence in the article List of current and former capitals of subnational entities of China that reads like this: "Excluded from the list: First-level units that are cities, such as the municipalities or the two special administrative regions of Hong Kong and Macau." In that way, it seems that Hong Kong is "a first-level administrative region that is a city." By definition, the capital city of a city is the city itself. A good example is Singapore, which is a city-state. Its capital city is Singapore, its only city. Using this logic, should the capital city of the Hong Kong Special Administrative Region be "Hong Kong"? Or, should we put "Not applicable" in the blank for "capital"? Meanwhile, in the blank for "capital", I have put Central as the de facto capital of Hong Kong, and mentioned that it is the location of the Government headquarters. Similarly, in the "administrative divisions" section, some users added that "There are several cities and towns within Hong Kong, the largest of which include Kowloon." I wonder if the wording should be changed. - 70.231.51.124 08:07, 31 March 2006 (UTC)
What does the English word city means can be viewed from different perspectives, e.g., geographical, ceremonial, and administrative. Geographically there're several urbanised areas within the territory of Hong Kong, that are geographically qualified to be considered cities or towns. Administratively, Hong Kong is unitary and there's no sub entity designated as city (or town). The extents of the City of Victoria, Kowloon and New Kowloon, are respectively demarcated by law. So far I have not found any information showing if Victoria City (or any other part of Hong Kong) has received a charter from the Queen/King or not.
Victoria City, legally speaking, still exists, and many government offices, including the headquarters of almost all departments are within Victoria City. But in modern conversations few people actually use this name. They call the names of the areas instead. It's also interesting to note that the boundary of the City of Victoria does not follow those of the modern districts.
If you're taken a geographical perspective, Kowloon (including New Kowloon) would be the urbanised area with the largest population, wheareas the City of Victoria would be the legal entity where the government headquarters are located. — Insta ntnood 21:12, 31 March 2006 (UTC)
It seems that the currect info box is not really suitable for the article about Hong Kong. Because it is the standard country info box. Although some users have been repeatedly arguing that Hong Kong is a country on its own, Hong Kong is not quite the same kind of entity as those common examples of countries that we can come up with, like the United States, the Russian Federation, the Republic of Korea, the People's Republic of China (PRC) etc. The fundamental policy of the Hong Kong Special Administrative Region (HKSAR) is "One Country, Two System", which means practicing two political systems (the one within the HKSAR and the one in the rest of the PRC) in one country (the PRC). Therefore, it would be more correct to say that the HKSAR + the rest of the PRC = the entirety of the PRC = one country, rather than the HKSAR = one country. But when Hong Kong was a British colony before 1997, Hong Kong is not an integral part of Britain. Due to this historical, and pragmatical reason, Hong Kong has usually been put in a separate entry in a list of countries. However, Hong Kong is now a special administrative region (SAR), and does not have all the characteristics possessed by those common countries like the United States, the Russian Federation. An SAR is a very special kind of political entity / administrative division of the PRC. It would be useful to design a unique info box specifically for an SAR. If we insist to use the standard country info box, we really don't know what to put for "capital city". It seems silly and providing no useful information to say that the capital city of Hong Kong is Hong Kong. I would prefer, as some users suggested above, changing the "capital city" to "seat of the Government headquarter", and the "largest city" to "largest district". This would make the info box tailor-made for the special situation of Hong Kong. - Alan 00:05, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
Let's take a look at the article " Political divisions of China", the subsection about "Special Administrative Regions" is listed under the section "Province level". In the "Summary" section, "special administrative regions" is again placed in the box for "Province level". Apart from this, in both the articles " List of China administrative divisions by population" and " List of China administrative divisions by population density", the first sentence is "This is a list of the first-level administrative divisions of People's Republic of China." Meanwhile, the two special administrative regions - Hong Kong and Macau - are included in the lists. These clearly shows that special administrative regions are province-level, i.e. first-level, administrative regions of the PR China. That is, Hong Kong and Macau are part of the hierachy of the administrative regions of the PR China. I feel that some Hong Kong Wikipedians have been trying to deny this fact for many times, but no matter what, that is the fact. As a first-level administrative region of the PR China, it makes sense for the "Hong Kong" article to use the kind of info box that has been used in the articles for other first-level administrative regions, such as Shanghai, Guangdong, Guangxi, Beijing etc. But this could have a certain extent of flexibility.
Although a lot of people like to compare Hong Kong with Singapore, their status in the hierachy of administrative divisions should not be equated. Singapore is an independent state, or a city-state. Hong Kong is a special administrative region of the PR China, and coincidently a city. Regardless of whether a special administrative region is automatically a city, it is a first-level administrative region. - Alan 03:01, 10 April 2006 (UTC)
Hong Kong simply doesn't have a capital,
according to an government official. Thus IMO it is ridiculous to put Central / Victority City as the "capital" of Hong Kong. You can call Central as the administrative center but not "capital". --
Lorenzarius
09:04, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
If anybody cares about Instantnood's current revert war on this article: [1] [2] [3] SchmuckyTheCat 19:30, 22 April 2006 (UTC)
Hi, we need Chinese language help at Chinese wine. There's a wine which isn't yet discussed that is sold as "hung-lu" wine. It is reddish in color, with a sharp smell and is sold by the Oriental Mascot brand (which also makes mijiu and formerly also made Shaoxing jiu). The largest photo of this wine is here, but the characters aren't easily readable. I think "hung-lu" isn't Hanyu pinyin. Can someone provide information about this wine, the characters, etc.? Thank you! http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/images/B0000DJZ0F/ref=dp_primary-product-display_0/102-4042702-9901704?%5Fencoding=UTF8&n=3370831&s=gourmet-food Badagnani 22:34, 22 April 2006 (UTC)
I made a major change to the infobox so we no longer use the country template to rid us of the problems associated with it. I've adopted an infobox a few other Chinese cities use (not a template) and made it very HK specific. Discuss if there is something missing or problematic. SchmuckyTheCat 03:58, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
The 'new' infobox is not easy on the eyes. It is more difficult to read. What were the problems associated with the Template:Infobox Country?— MJCdetroit 16:19, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
This will need consensus, here and at Wikipedia:WikiProject Countries, to be implemented. I oppose. Entities with sufficient autonomy (i.e., those given separate entries at the World Factbook) have the WikiProject Countries applied to them. For example, Puerto Rico has the country template, not the US state template.-- Jiang 19:42, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
Amidst the revert wars, I can't believed nobody noticed 17 footnotes missing from the article due to the missing <references/> tag. I have inserted it. Also, reworded the caption in the Victoria Harbour by night photo. Kimchi. sg 15:23, 3 May 2006 (UTC)
Footnotes not in any proper citation format. Skinnyweed 14:42, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
I see this at the Chinese page: [9] no idea what it is, but it looks very cool. Consider copying it to Commons, using it here and nominating as featured picture? Stevage 20:00, 15 May 2006 (UTC)
This article says only 25% of the land in Hong Kong is developed. When I looked at the google satellite photo of Hong Kong, I doubt if the 25% is accurate because only a small portion of the land looked "gray" (urban) and most of Hong Kong is covered by vegetations. I remembered reading a tourist brochure from Hong Kong which said Hong Kong is one of the greeniest cities in Asia despite its high population because its population density is vertically stacked. Kowloonese 01:15, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
According to surveys, Hong Kong is 94% urbanised, so it can't be a greeniest city... Also, according to Guiness Record, "Ap Lei Chau" which is an Island in Hong Kong, is the most densely populated Island in the world. Cherubfish 11:04, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
But I agree with you. There are pretty much outlying islands in Hong Kong that have no settlements on. My flat used to face the sea and there was a lot of these islands. Cherubfish 16:45, 17 May 2006 (UTC)
I'm not sure if anyone has had a smell of the fragrant harbour, the sight of stuff floating in the surrounding waters or the brown haze in sky around HK. Maybe it is green in the NT, but not in Kowloon of Hong Kong Island. Recycling is a joke in HK, there is too much packaging. Autos, lorries and buses still emit dirty emissions that coat the buildings in the urban areas of HK. HK is still auto dependent and throw away society. Don't blame China for the pollution, HK contributes its part to the South China area. User:fat_pig73 17:03, 13 June 2006 (EST)
The symbol in the top right corner covers the original small star for featured article. -- Samwingkit 13:27, 17 May 2006 (UTC)
Just look the summer of 2006. The pollution levels have been unacceptable. The city is covered in heavy smog most of the time, and the air is hardly breathable. Calling Hong Kong green is like calling a toxic waste dump refreshingly natural.