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In the second Test at the MCG he was on the field for all but seventeen minutes of a six-day match. See scorecard. The match lasted for seven days (which I have edited already) but the 17 minutes stat is wrong. From the scorecard it is obvious that it refers to the second innings (Chapman came in at the fall of Sutcliffe at 280 and he batted for 16 minutes).
In the first innings, Sutcliffe was fifth out with the score at 404. The last five wickets took the score to 479 in approximately 66 minutes.
Unless someone has an objection, I intend to change seventeen minutes to 'an hour or so'.-- Tintin1107 12:34, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)
If I am not mistaken, Bradman's average is 99.94, which is much higher than Sutcliffe. No disrespect to the player, for he was in a league of his own, but to say that Bradman's was only a scratch higher is a misrepresentation. I haven't changed it, because I do not know how to word it in context of the sentence. I will leave it up to someone else. -- Argonavtica) 00:42, 22 Dec 2005 (UTC)
I don't know where the "seventeen minutes" came from, but it may be wrong.
One thing I must say is: how did Sutcliffe fail to gain a single nomination in the 2000 Wisden Cricketer Of The Century poll?? The 2000 Wisden itself is remarkable for not noticing this fact: his figures, given the conditions he faced, were at his peak without comparison, really.
Only if you restrict the filter to those who have completed their careers: as I write, Hick has 38,125 runs at 53.47. I've edited the text slightly for this reason, but my wording is a bit inelegant so maybe someone else can find a better form of words. Besides, Hick's career is very much in its later stages now, and he's likely to end up with a better average than Sutcliffe even once he's retired.
Also, Cricinfo give Sutcliffe a f-c average of 52.02 (as reflected in the Infobox) as opposed to 51.95 in the text; presumably this is a similar disagreement as with the number of Hobbs' f-c centuries (where Cricinfo claim 199, rather than the usual 197). Personally I'd prefer to use Wisden stats, but in an Infobox, with Cricinfo explicitly mentioned as the source, I think I really do have to use the precise numbers they give. Loganberry ( Talk) 00:42, 27 Jun 2005 (UTC)
-- 88.72.16.2 10:05, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
I am overwhlemed to see that Herbert's name still lives strong. I am his great grandaughter, grandaughter of one of his two children Barbara. I am currently on teaching practice, studying to become a PE teacher and came across this whilst researching cricket and teaching styles. Keep it up! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.219.81.179 ( talk) 10:04, 5 May 2009 (UTC)
A key source for this article should be Herbert Sutcliffe: Cricket Maestro by Alan Hill, published 2007 (2nd edition) by Stadia. The book has won the Cricket Society Literary Award. ---- Jack | talk page 03:56, 5 June 2010 (UTC)
There should I think be more on his partnerships with Hobbs for England, including the number of ventury partnerships they shared (which I think is still a record for any pair of England openers), and more about the famous partnership against Australia at The Oval in 1926. Also there is no mention of Percy Holmes in the article at all! There needs to be something about their opening partnerships for Yorkshire. Again their number of century partnerships should be included, and their famous 555 partnership of 555 at Leyton - breaking Brown and Tunnicliffe's existing f-c record (I think for any wicket, not just the first) - should be covered. (I wrote something about that partnership for the Leyton Cricket Ground article, which you are welcome to use. JH ( talk page) 19:47, 5 June 2010 (UTC)
With regard to his not being the typical Yorkshire professional, it's noteworthy that - as the article mentions early on - he became a commissioned officer during WW1. Maybe the Army was more progressive than Yorkshire CCC! Incidentally, did Neville Cardus really "resent" Sutcliffe's Saville Row suits? If so, it seems rather hypocritical of him, given his own poor background and subsequent career.
Some initial thoughts:
I've done a little copy-editing of the lead and Childhood sections. JH ( talk page) 18:16, 12 July 2010 (UTC)
I know that we already have a lot of quotations, but I can't resist adding one more, by A. A. Thomson, as I think it's illuminating. Some text was emphasised in the original text by being in italics. I've attempted to preserve the emphasis by making those words unitalicised ("Sutcliffean" and "I love a dog-fight") where the rest is in italics. JH ( talk page) 19:39, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
A few points gleaned from CMJ's entry on Sutcliffe in the ODNB [1] (usually subscription only but currently free as a "life of the week" [2]):
Some of these points could be incorporated in this article, but I will leave the authors to decide which. -- Ferma ( talk) 16:46, 19 July 2012 (UTC)
I have a copy of Herbert's School enrollment at Darley and his birthdate is given as 24 Feb 1895. The GRO confirms that he was registered Ist the first quarter of 1895. I note that in the 1901 census he is staying in Pudsey with his Grandparents and aunts.
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![]() | Herbert Sutcliffe is a former featured article candidate. Please view the links under Article milestones below to see why the nomination failed. For older candidates, please check the archive. | |||||||||
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In the second Test at the MCG he was on the field for all but seventeen minutes of a six-day match. See scorecard. The match lasted for seven days (which I have edited already) but the 17 minutes stat is wrong. From the scorecard it is obvious that it refers to the second innings (Chapman came in at the fall of Sutcliffe at 280 and he batted for 16 minutes).
In the first innings, Sutcliffe was fifth out with the score at 404. The last five wickets took the score to 479 in approximately 66 minutes.
Unless someone has an objection, I intend to change seventeen minutes to 'an hour or so'.-- Tintin1107 12:34, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)
If I am not mistaken, Bradman's average is 99.94, which is much higher than Sutcliffe. No disrespect to the player, for he was in a league of his own, but to say that Bradman's was only a scratch higher is a misrepresentation. I haven't changed it, because I do not know how to word it in context of the sentence. I will leave it up to someone else. -- Argonavtica) 00:42, 22 Dec 2005 (UTC)
I don't know where the "seventeen minutes" came from, but it may be wrong.
One thing I must say is: how did Sutcliffe fail to gain a single nomination in the 2000 Wisden Cricketer Of The Century poll?? The 2000 Wisden itself is remarkable for not noticing this fact: his figures, given the conditions he faced, were at his peak without comparison, really.
Only if you restrict the filter to those who have completed their careers: as I write, Hick has 38,125 runs at 53.47. I've edited the text slightly for this reason, but my wording is a bit inelegant so maybe someone else can find a better form of words. Besides, Hick's career is very much in its later stages now, and he's likely to end up with a better average than Sutcliffe even once he's retired.
Also, Cricinfo give Sutcliffe a f-c average of 52.02 (as reflected in the Infobox) as opposed to 51.95 in the text; presumably this is a similar disagreement as with the number of Hobbs' f-c centuries (where Cricinfo claim 199, rather than the usual 197). Personally I'd prefer to use Wisden stats, but in an Infobox, with Cricinfo explicitly mentioned as the source, I think I really do have to use the precise numbers they give. Loganberry ( Talk) 00:42, 27 Jun 2005 (UTC)
-- 88.72.16.2 10:05, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
I am overwhlemed to see that Herbert's name still lives strong. I am his great grandaughter, grandaughter of one of his two children Barbara. I am currently on teaching practice, studying to become a PE teacher and came across this whilst researching cricket and teaching styles. Keep it up! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.219.81.179 ( talk) 10:04, 5 May 2009 (UTC)
A key source for this article should be Herbert Sutcliffe: Cricket Maestro by Alan Hill, published 2007 (2nd edition) by Stadia. The book has won the Cricket Society Literary Award. ---- Jack | talk page 03:56, 5 June 2010 (UTC)
There should I think be more on his partnerships with Hobbs for England, including the number of ventury partnerships they shared (which I think is still a record for any pair of England openers), and more about the famous partnership against Australia at The Oval in 1926. Also there is no mention of Percy Holmes in the article at all! There needs to be something about their opening partnerships for Yorkshire. Again their number of century partnerships should be included, and their famous 555 partnership of 555 at Leyton - breaking Brown and Tunnicliffe's existing f-c record (I think for any wicket, not just the first) - should be covered. (I wrote something about that partnership for the Leyton Cricket Ground article, which you are welcome to use. JH ( talk page) 19:47, 5 June 2010 (UTC)
With regard to his not being the typical Yorkshire professional, it's noteworthy that - as the article mentions early on - he became a commissioned officer during WW1. Maybe the Army was more progressive than Yorkshire CCC! Incidentally, did Neville Cardus really "resent" Sutcliffe's Saville Row suits? If so, it seems rather hypocritical of him, given his own poor background and subsequent career.
Some initial thoughts:
I've done a little copy-editing of the lead and Childhood sections. JH ( talk page) 18:16, 12 July 2010 (UTC)
I know that we already have a lot of quotations, but I can't resist adding one more, by A. A. Thomson, as I think it's illuminating. Some text was emphasised in the original text by being in italics. I've attempted to preserve the emphasis by making those words unitalicised ("Sutcliffean" and "I love a dog-fight") where the rest is in italics. JH ( talk page) 19:39, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
A few points gleaned from CMJ's entry on Sutcliffe in the ODNB [1] (usually subscription only but currently free as a "life of the week" [2]):
Some of these points could be incorporated in this article, but I will leave the authors to decide which. -- Ferma ( talk) 16:46, 19 July 2012 (UTC)
I have a copy of Herbert's School enrollment at Darley and his birthdate is given as 24 Feb 1895. The GRO confirms that he was registered Ist the first quarter of 1895. I note that in the 1901 census he is staying in Pudsey with his Grandparents and aunts.
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I have just modified 2 external links on Herbert Sutcliffe. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
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source check}}
(last update: 5 June 2024).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 10:23, 1 April 2017 (UTC)