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Tables Information

Untitled

A first experiment:

Cunedda

Cunedda
TypipaunOsmail (§ 32)Rumaun (§ 32)Dunaut CereticAbloyc Enniaun girtDocmail (§ 32)Etern (§ 32)
MeriaunEbiaunIusay Catgolaun Lauhir Eugein dantguin
GatgulartDinacatSerguil Mailcun Cinglas
Guurgint barmbtruchMouricBodgu RunMeic
GlitnothEbiaunArtbodgu BeliCangan
GueinothIsaacClitauc Artgloys IacobCatgual crisban
IudrisPopgenSeissil CatmanYtigoy
SualdaPopdelguArthgen Catgollaun [1]Enniaun
BrocmailEbiaunDumnguallaun CatgualartRumaun
EgeniudBrochmailMouric Iutguaul Caratauc
IutnimetEiciaunGuocaun (§ 26)
( Ceredigion)
RotriHiguel (§ 3)
( Rhôs)
BrochmailIouanaul Cinnan
Cinan (§ 18)
( Meirionnydd)
CarataucEtthil
Bleydiud Merin
Cuhelm (§ 17)
( Dunoding)
Rotri
Catell
Higuel
Ouen (§ 1) [2]
( Gwynedd)

Hen Ogledd

Coel Hen

Coil Hen
CeneuGarbaniaun
Gurgust letlwm [3]Masguic clop Pappo post Prydain [4]Dumngual moilmut
MerchianumEleuther cascord maurLaenauc Dunaut (§ 11) Samuil pennisselBran Hen
Cinmarc Gurci (§ 12) Peretur (§ 12) Guallauc (§ 9)GuitcunCincar (or brother)
Urbgen (§ 8)Catguallaun (§ 19) Morgant bulc
Coledauc
Morcant (§ 10)

Dumnugual ('Hen') and the rulers of Alt Clut

The ancestors listed for Dumnugual Hen under § 5 are, in chronological order (from father to son): Confer ("ipse est uero olitauc dimor meton uenditus est"), Fer, Cursalem, Cluim, Cinhil, Cynloyp, Ceretic Guletic and Cinuit.

Ceretic Guletic
Cinuit (§ 5)
Dumnagual Hen
'Guipno', Gwyddno Clinoch'Cinbelim'
Neithon TutagualClinog Etin (§ 7)
Beli (I) Riderch Hen (§ 6)
Eugein
Elfin [5]
Beli (II) [6]
Teudebur
Dumnagual (III) [7]
Eugein (II)
Riderch (II)
Dumnagual (IV)
Arthgal
Rhun (§ 5)
  1. ^ Cf: Cadafael Cadomedd ap Cynfeddw
  2. ^ The pedigree of Owain's mother Elen is also listed and traced back many generations, to one Guortepir among others (§ 2).
  3. ^ "Gurgust" (§ 8), "[Gurgust] letlum" (§ 12).
  4. ^ "Pappo" (§ 11), nicknamed post Prydain in § 19.
  5. ^ The list may have omitted Guri, known only from the Annales Cambriae.
  6. ^ The list may have omitted Dumnagual (II), known only from Irish annals.
  7. ^ The list may have omitted Rotri, known only from the Annales Cambriae.

Re the experiment

Useful, see-it-at-a-glance presentation. And best to follow the exact spellings as given. The red link for "Merin" (son of Etthil, father of Rotri) should go to Merfyn Frych. Minutia ... perhaps instead of "(§-space-12)" use "(§-non breaking space-12)" to ensure that line breaks do not occur where they are not wanted. Regards, Notuncurious ( talk) 15:27, 29 September 2009 (UTC) reply

Thanks for your comments. Yeah, graphic representations can be of great help with bare, tediously long lists of names like the Harleian genealogies. Of course, keeping in mind that they are just a primary source rather than a definitive assessment of royal pedigrees or something. It's a lot of work just getting the boxes aligned properly, so no doubt I haven't paid much attention to certain details, but all in good time. Non-breaking space looks like a better plan. Cavila ( talk) 17:58, 29 September 2009 (UTC) reply
Done (§§). BTW, good work on the many improvements you've made to the articles on early Brythonic rulers. Cavila ( talk) 18:16, 29 September 2009 (UTC) reply
Thanks for the kind words! Very much more to do, and those articles still need to be expanded and enhanced ... work in progress (much like genealogies, right?). Regards, Notuncurious ( talk) 14:43, 30 September 2009 (UTC) reply
At least one can't complain of having nothing to work on and I guess that (under)statement might still hold in true in 2030. Did you know btw that an electronic version of Peter Bartrum's work on medieval Welsh genealogies is underway? It's scheduled for publication in late 2009 (so maybe 2010?) and will be made available through the Welsh Dept of the University of Aberystwyth. Cavila ( talk) 15:34, 30 September 2009 (UTC) reply
Always good to have premier references on-line and universally available; of course, by then we'll know all there is to know on the topic, right? Regards, Notuncurious ( talk) 19:11, 30 September 2009 (UTC) reply
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Tables Information

Untitled

A first experiment:

Cunedda

Cunedda
TypipaunOsmail (§ 32)Rumaun (§ 32)Dunaut CereticAbloyc Enniaun girtDocmail (§ 32)Etern (§ 32)
MeriaunEbiaunIusay Catgolaun Lauhir Eugein dantguin
GatgulartDinacatSerguil Mailcun Cinglas
Guurgint barmbtruchMouricBodgu RunMeic
GlitnothEbiaunArtbodgu BeliCangan
GueinothIsaacClitauc Artgloys IacobCatgual crisban
IudrisPopgenSeissil CatmanYtigoy
SualdaPopdelguArthgen Catgollaun [1]Enniaun
BrocmailEbiaunDumnguallaun CatgualartRumaun
EgeniudBrochmailMouric Iutguaul Caratauc
IutnimetEiciaunGuocaun (§ 26)
( Ceredigion)
RotriHiguel (§ 3)
( Rhôs)
BrochmailIouanaul Cinnan
Cinan (§ 18)
( Meirionnydd)
CarataucEtthil
Bleydiud Merin
Cuhelm (§ 17)
( Dunoding)
Rotri
Catell
Higuel
Ouen (§ 1) [2]
( Gwynedd)

Hen Ogledd

Coel Hen

Coil Hen
CeneuGarbaniaun
Gurgust letlwm [3]Masguic clop Pappo post Prydain [4]Dumngual moilmut
MerchianumEleuther cascord maurLaenauc Dunaut (§ 11) Samuil pennisselBran Hen
Cinmarc Gurci (§ 12) Peretur (§ 12) Guallauc (§ 9)GuitcunCincar (or brother)
Urbgen (§ 8)Catguallaun (§ 19) Morgant bulc
Coledauc
Morcant (§ 10)

Dumnugual ('Hen') and the rulers of Alt Clut

The ancestors listed for Dumnugual Hen under § 5 are, in chronological order (from father to son): Confer ("ipse est uero olitauc dimor meton uenditus est"), Fer, Cursalem, Cluim, Cinhil, Cynloyp, Ceretic Guletic and Cinuit.

Ceretic Guletic
Cinuit (§ 5)
Dumnagual Hen
'Guipno', Gwyddno Clinoch'Cinbelim'
Neithon TutagualClinog Etin (§ 7)
Beli (I) Riderch Hen (§ 6)
Eugein
Elfin [5]
Beli (II) [6]
Teudebur
Dumnagual (III) [7]
Eugein (II)
Riderch (II)
Dumnagual (IV)
Arthgal
Rhun (§ 5)
  1. ^ Cf: Cadafael Cadomedd ap Cynfeddw
  2. ^ The pedigree of Owain's mother Elen is also listed and traced back many generations, to one Guortepir among others (§ 2).
  3. ^ "Gurgust" (§ 8), "[Gurgust] letlum" (§ 12).
  4. ^ "Pappo" (§ 11), nicknamed post Prydain in § 19.
  5. ^ The list may have omitted Guri, known only from the Annales Cambriae.
  6. ^ The list may have omitted Dumnagual (II), known only from Irish annals.
  7. ^ The list may have omitted Rotri, known only from the Annales Cambriae.

Re the experiment

Useful, see-it-at-a-glance presentation. And best to follow the exact spellings as given. The red link for "Merin" (son of Etthil, father of Rotri) should go to Merfyn Frych. Minutia ... perhaps instead of "(§-space-12)" use "(§-non breaking space-12)" to ensure that line breaks do not occur where they are not wanted. Regards, Notuncurious ( talk) 15:27, 29 September 2009 (UTC) reply

Thanks for your comments. Yeah, graphic representations can be of great help with bare, tediously long lists of names like the Harleian genealogies. Of course, keeping in mind that they are just a primary source rather than a definitive assessment of royal pedigrees or something. It's a lot of work just getting the boxes aligned properly, so no doubt I haven't paid much attention to certain details, but all in good time. Non-breaking space looks like a better plan. Cavila ( talk) 17:58, 29 September 2009 (UTC) reply
Done (§§). BTW, good work on the many improvements you've made to the articles on early Brythonic rulers. Cavila ( talk) 18:16, 29 September 2009 (UTC) reply
Thanks for the kind words! Very much more to do, and those articles still need to be expanded and enhanced ... work in progress (much like genealogies, right?). Regards, Notuncurious ( talk) 14:43, 30 September 2009 (UTC) reply
At least one can't complain of having nothing to work on and I guess that (under)statement might still hold in true in 2030. Did you know btw that an electronic version of Peter Bartrum's work on medieval Welsh genealogies is underway? It's scheduled for publication in late 2009 (so maybe 2010?) and will be made available through the Welsh Dept of the University of Aberystwyth. Cavila ( talk) 15:34, 30 September 2009 (UTC) reply
Always good to have premier references on-line and universally available; of course, by then we'll know all there is to know on the topic, right? Regards, Notuncurious ( talk) 19:11, 30 September 2009 (UTC) reply

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