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I changed the line "some consider him one of the greatest pitchers in major league baseball, but some consider him to be highly overrated" back to "generally thought as being one of the greatest pitchers in the history of Major League Baseball" because there are very few people who consider him overrated, especially from achieving 300 wins all in an era of a 5 man rotation staff and increased relieve pitching.04:58, 27 April 2006 (UTC)
Is it just me, or is the main body of the text very unorganized? It seems to jump around a lot.—Preceding unsigned comment added by Cinquad ( talk • contribs)
I would agree - I have added sections as well as an info-box - please feel free to add any extra info you can find to the box, as well as moving text around and adding/changing the name of sections. Mrmaroon25
This is a nice page, though, it is indeed a bit unorganized. The info is fine, it just needs a bit of restructuring. However, It does lack a section on Maddux's career with the Cubs. I'll work on it. Yadin twelve 20:57, 23 April 2006 (UTC)
I'd like to contribute to this page. I agree that we cannot compare ERA's of relief pitchers' and starting pitchers. I have a different question: I remember watching Maddux's first game pitched in the ML. He threw a complete game, but lost. I cannot remember who he faced (or any other detail, other than it was late in the seaons and he was called up from AAA Iowa). Does anyone have any info on this (I am currently searching). Em-jay-es 06:18, 8 May 2006 (UTC)
I removed the part of the "Statistics" section that referred to Maddux's 2006 stats. Aside from that section not being updated in a month, it would have to be updated after every start to remain accurate. In addition, the content is not particularly encyclopedic- knowing what Maddux's season ERA as of some date ix X.XX means nothing five days later. -- Kicking222 20:38, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
I'm no John Franco fan, and never have been. I'm a Cubs fan, so my bias (if any) is actually for Greg Maddux. But ERA has the same meaning whether SP or RP, and John Franco and Pedro Martinez are the only "active" pitchers with a significant number of IP (1000 is the cutoff on MLB.com) that have an ERA lower than that of Maddux. For example, Trevor Hoffman and Mariano Rivera both have just over 800 IP; Armando Benitez has under 700; Troy Percival has just over 600; and Brad Lidge, Felix Rodriguez, and Chad Cordero all have under 300 IP. Jpers36 06:18, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
A baseball traditionalist, Maddux insists that the Cubs wear their white home jersey on the days that he is their starting pitcher.
And yet the pic shows him wearing blue? Tromboneguy0186 15:29, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
The pic comes from Spring Training, when the team wears batting practice jereseys on the road.
Why isnt there a picture of Greg Maddux? Patbaseball2221 21:33, 31 July 2006 (UTC)
does anyone have any numbers on how many starts Maddux has missed in his career? Kingturtle 14:30, 9 August 2006 (UTC)
Greg Maddux missed one start... it was while on the DL... He has had some scares while in spring training which has caused him to start the second game of the season... maddux31holytrinity sep 2, 2006
I removed the no reference tag in the team tenure section. None of the statistics list their references either. The tenures listed are accurate and can be easily checked through three of the external links. Petedoane 18:15, 12 August 2006 (UTC)
The section called "The Braves Years" has one paragraph dealing with Maddux's time with the Braves, and four paragraphs that have nothing to do with the Braves at all. Any objections to just eliminating the heading and moving the info to the Teams or Accomplishments sections as appropriate? Mrquizzical 06:57, 27 November 2006 (UTC)
I'd actually like to see the section rewritten, not necessary deleated. The teams section delt with his Cub years.-- Maddux31holytrinity 02:00, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
Actually I took a look at the Roger Clemens page, and since many fans consider the two to be close, i figured the pages should be somewhat alike. I've used to clemenes page as a model for this one. i've also moved some of the information that has nothing to do with the Braves. this whole article is still quite messy to me.-- Maddux31holytrinity 02:18, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
Where could we find a place to mention his nicknames "Mad Dog" and "The Professor"? 216.246.231.112 13:37, 24 May 2007 (UTC)
The quotes in the Carlos Zambrano article that you cited seem very different than the deleted Greg Maddux quotes. (Frankly, the Zambrano pullquotes-- "I made one mistake"; "I felt good today"; "I threw strikes and made my pitches"-- are all boilerplate drivel that could apply to any pitcher ever.) The Maddux quotes under discussion are longer, true, but not at all generic. Consequently, they are far more illustrative of his character, savvy, and style of pitching.
I would ask you to compare the disputed internal quotes and pullquotes for Maddux NOT to Zambrano's-- where the quotes are barely worthwhile-- but instead, to the various quotes in the Wiki articles for Lou Gehrig, Rickey Henderson, Pete Rose, Phil Rizzuto, Alex Rodriguez, Albert Belle, Satchel Paige, Ty Cobb, Barry Bonds, Pedro Martinez, Stan Musial, and numerous others. For many athletes, supplemental material (including quotes by and about the subject) has been requested by editors and admins, to keep articles from focusing too much on the bland recitation of statistics. (i.e. "In 1995, he scored 15 touchdowns. In 1996, he scored 22 touchdowns. In 1996, he was injured. In 1997...")
I have not re-reinserted the quotes, because their relevance and value should be discussed here first. However, I hope you will reconsider your edits in this light. Thanks! 208.120.227.69 04:48, 9 July 2007 (UTC)
For note, Until either SD, LA, or the MLB releases an official statement that confirms the trade went through, this article is best left stating Maddux is still with the Padres. Please see WP:Crystal Ball for further reference. -- StarScream1007 ►Talk 02:39, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
I've semi-protected the article. Mackensen (talk) 03:04, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
No, because I'm not talking about rumors at all. A rumor from anywhere should not be added as fact because it is not. A report from ESPN stating Greg Maddux is a Dodger as fact (assuming there are no reports from sources saying it has NOT happened) should without question be added. Obviously, if you have the Dodgers' GM saying "we have not yet acquired Maddux" that would void the ESPN report's verifiability. But if all you had was an ESPN article stating it as fact, then it would pass WP:VERIFY and need to be included. Whether or not the report turned out to be incorrect is irrelevant.► Chris Nelson Holla! 04:50, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
Maddux last MLB appearance should be listed as October 15, 2008. It was the NLCS game against the Phillies. http://mlb.mlb.com/news/wrap.jsp?ymd=20081015&content_id=3623499&vkey=wrapup2005&fext=.jsp&team=home Hunnydaisy ( talk) 00:13, 21 August 2009 (UTC)
I'm kind of surprised not to see a reference to these commercials with Glavine, featuring Maddux's immortal tag line. At the time, it was referenced incessantly by the media and fans. Even now, sportswriters still sometimes use a "chicks dig the long ball" reference when discussing the steroid controversy. Would anybody consider adding this? BeRose ( talk) 16:11, 31 August 2009 (UTC)
I think the "Talent and accomplishments section" lacks focus and really has several parts to it that don't necessarily mix.
1. At the beginning it talk about the stories of his 'preternatural abilities' and being perceived as a super intelligent pitcher. I like this part but I think it should be in a different section. Either the pitching style section or a legacy/mythology (or something along those lines) section that could be added somewhere around there. There are several more stories that I think are pretty interesting/valuable that could be added. What do people think of this?
2. The two paragraphs with Koufax, Gibson, and Seaver don't seem to be applicable at all in that section. I'm inclined just to remove them (maybe leave the "People think I'm smart" quote with the mythology). Thoughts?
3. The rest of this section actually seem to fit the "Talent and Accomplishments" billing. This should be the entire section I think.
I didn't want to make this moves without getting feedback first but if there are no responses or objections I'll probably just make the changes in a week or so.
TommyALong (
talk) 15:42, 7 January 2011 (UTC)
Seems like a table that shows wins, losses, ERA, errors, etc. season by season would be very good and helpful content. TCO ( talk) 17:07, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
While I don't doubt that the recently added statistics notes are correct, I wonder if they are notable or trivial. I'd feel more comfortable if they were mentioned in a reliable source other than a stats site. Thoughts?— Bagumba ( talk) 09:04, 26 January 2012 (UTC)
A side note is that urls should be provided for the references if these do stay.— Bagumba ( talk) 09:04, 26 January 2012 (UTC)
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I changed the line "some consider him one of the greatest pitchers in major league baseball, but some consider him to be highly overrated" back to "generally thought as being one of the greatest pitchers in the history of Major League Baseball" because there are very few people who consider him overrated, especially from achieving 300 wins all in an era of a 5 man rotation staff and increased relieve pitching.04:58, 27 April 2006 (UTC)
Is it just me, or is the main body of the text very unorganized? It seems to jump around a lot.—Preceding unsigned comment added by Cinquad ( talk • contribs)
I would agree - I have added sections as well as an info-box - please feel free to add any extra info you can find to the box, as well as moving text around and adding/changing the name of sections. Mrmaroon25
This is a nice page, though, it is indeed a bit unorganized. The info is fine, it just needs a bit of restructuring. However, It does lack a section on Maddux's career with the Cubs. I'll work on it. Yadin twelve 20:57, 23 April 2006 (UTC)
I'd like to contribute to this page. I agree that we cannot compare ERA's of relief pitchers' and starting pitchers. I have a different question: I remember watching Maddux's first game pitched in the ML. He threw a complete game, but lost. I cannot remember who he faced (or any other detail, other than it was late in the seaons and he was called up from AAA Iowa). Does anyone have any info on this (I am currently searching). Em-jay-es 06:18, 8 May 2006 (UTC)
I removed the part of the "Statistics" section that referred to Maddux's 2006 stats. Aside from that section not being updated in a month, it would have to be updated after every start to remain accurate. In addition, the content is not particularly encyclopedic- knowing what Maddux's season ERA as of some date ix X.XX means nothing five days later. -- Kicking222 20:38, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
I'm no John Franco fan, and never have been. I'm a Cubs fan, so my bias (if any) is actually for Greg Maddux. But ERA has the same meaning whether SP or RP, and John Franco and Pedro Martinez are the only "active" pitchers with a significant number of IP (1000 is the cutoff on MLB.com) that have an ERA lower than that of Maddux. For example, Trevor Hoffman and Mariano Rivera both have just over 800 IP; Armando Benitez has under 700; Troy Percival has just over 600; and Brad Lidge, Felix Rodriguez, and Chad Cordero all have under 300 IP. Jpers36 06:18, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
A baseball traditionalist, Maddux insists that the Cubs wear their white home jersey on the days that he is their starting pitcher.
And yet the pic shows him wearing blue? Tromboneguy0186 15:29, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
The pic comes from Spring Training, when the team wears batting practice jereseys on the road.
Why isnt there a picture of Greg Maddux? Patbaseball2221 21:33, 31 July 2006 (UTC)
does anyone have any numbers on how many starts Maddux has missed in his career? Kingturtle 14:30, 9 August 2006 (UTC)
Greg Maddux missed one start... it was while on the DL... He has had some scares while in spring training which has caused him to start the second game of the season... maddux31holytrinity sep 2, 2006
I removed the no reference tag in the team tenure section. None of the statistics list their references either. The tenures listed are accurate and can be easily checked through three of the external links. Petedoane 18:15, 12 August 2006 (UTC)
The section called "The Braves Years" has one paragraph dealing with Maddux's time with the Braves, and four paragraphs that have nothing to do with the Braves at all. Any objections to just eliminating the heading and moving the info to the Teams or Accomplishments sections as appropriate? Mrquizzical 06:57, 27 November 2006 (UTC)
I'd actually like to see the section rewritten, not necessary deleated. The teams section delt with his Cub years.-- Maddux31holytrinity 02:00, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
Actually I took a look at the Roger Clemens page, and since many fans consider the two to be close, i figured the pages should be somewhat alike. I've used to clemenes page as a model for this one. i've also moved some of the information that has nothing to do with the Braves. this whole article is still quite messy to me.-- Maddux31holytrinity 02:18, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
Where could we find a place to mention his nicknames "Mad Dog" and "The Professor"? 216.246.231.112 13:37, 24 May 2007 (UTC)
The quotes in the Carlos Zambrano article that you cited seem very different than the deleted Greg Maddux quotes. (Frankly, the Zambrano pullquotes-- "I made one mistake"; "I felt good today"; "I threw strikes and made my pitches"-- are all boilerplate drivel that could apply to any pitcher ever.) The Maddux quotes under discussion are longer, true, but not at all generic. Consequently, they are far more illustrative of his character, savvy, and style of pitching.
I would ask you to compare the disputed internal quotes and pullquotes for Maddux NOT to Zambrano's-- where the quotes are barely worthwhile-- but instead, to the various quotes in the Wiki articles for Lou Gehrig, Rickey Henderson, Pete Rose, Phil Rizzuto, Alex Rodriguez, Albert Belle, Satchel Paige, Ty Cobb, Barry Bonds, Pedro Martinez, Stan Musial, and numerous others. For many athletes, supplemental material (including quotes by and about the subject) has been requested by editors and admins, to keep articles from focusing too much on the bland recitation of statistics. (i.e. "In 1995, he scored 15 touchdowns. In 1996, he scored 22 touchdowns. In 1996, he was injured. In 1997...")
I have not re-reinserted the quotes, because their relevance and value should be discussed here first. However, I hope you will reconsider your edits in this light. Thanks! 208.120.227.69 04:48, 9 July 2007 (UTC)
For note, Until either SD, LA, or the MLB releases an official statement that confirms the trade went through, this article is best left stating Maddux is still with the Padres. Please see WP:Crystal Ball for further reference. -- StarScream1007 ►Talk 02:39, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
I've semi-protected the article. Mackensen (talk) 03:04, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
No, because I'm not talking about rumors at all. A rumor from anywhere should not be added as fact because it is not. A report from ESPN stating Greg Maddux is a Dodger as fact (assuming there are no reports from sources saying it has NOT happened) should without question be added. Obviously, if you have the Dodgers' GM saying "we have not yet acquired Maddux" that would void the ESPN report's verifiability. But if all you had was an ESPN article stating it as fact, then it would pass WP:VERIFY and need to be included. Whether or not the report turned out to be incorrect is irrelevant.► Chris Nelson Holla! 04:50, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
Maddux last MLB appearance should be listed as October 15, 2008. It was the NLCS game against the Phillies. http://mlb.mlb.com/news/wrap.jsp?ymd=20081015&content_id=3623499&vkey=wrapup2005&fext=.jsp&team=home Hunnydaisy ( talk) 00:13, 21 August 2009 (UTC)
I'm kind of surprised not to see a reference to these commercials with Glavine, featuring Maddux's immortal tag line. At the time, it was referenced incessantly by the media and fans. Even now, sportswriters still sometimes use a "chicks dig the long ball" reference when discussing the steroid controversy. Would anybody consider adding this? BeRose ( talk) 16:11, 31 August 2009 (UTC)
I think the "Talent and accomplishments section" lacks focus and really has several parts to it that don't necessarily mix.
1. At the beginning it talk about the stories of his 'preternatural abilities' and being perceived as a super intelligent pitcher. I like this part but I think it should be in a different section. Either the pitching style section or a legacy/mythology (or something along those lines) section that could be added somewhere around there. There are several more stories that I think are pretty interesting/valuable that could be added. What do people think of this?
2. The two paragraphs with Koufax, Gibson, and Seaver don't seem to be applicable at all in that section. I'm inclined just to remove them (maybe leave the "People think I'm smart" quote with the mythology). Thoughts?
3. The rest of this section actually seem to fit the "Talent and Accomplishments" billing. This should be the entire section I think.
I didn't want to make this moves without getting feedback first but if there are no responses or objections I'll probably just make the changes in a week or so.
TommyALong (
talk) 15:42, 7 January 2011 (UTC)
Seems like a table that shows wins, losses, ERA, errors, etc. season by season would be very good and helpful content. TCO ( talk) 17:07, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
While I don't doubt that the recently added statistics notes are correct, I wonder if they are notable or trivial. I'd feel more comfortable if they were mentioned in a reliable source other than a stats site. Thoughts?— Bagumba ( talk) 09:04, 26 January 2012 (UTC)
A side note is that urls should be provided for the references if these do stay.— Bagumba ( talk) 09:04, 26 January 2012 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
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