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The environmental effects of lead in gasoline are extremely difficult to measure and have not been measured in real world settings. Theory suggests that there should be some bad effects, but it is very unclear if these should be called "major". There has been and still is some controversy about this.
Also lead was used in high performance military gasoline during WW2. I'm not sure if it might be even older than that. "1960s" is certainly too late for its introduction.
The form of lead used in gasoline is tetra-ethyl lead.
There are several lead substitutes used in modern lead-free gasoline:
dimethyl sulfur: smells horrible. Slightly corrosive to engines. Not sure if it is dangerous. This was used in small quantities back to the 1930s. The amount used is now much higher in some countries where cheap high octane gasoline without lead is desired.
aromatic hydrocarbons (especially benzene, toluene, xylene): Really seriously poisonous and carcinogenic. Much more dangerous than lead. Slightly corrosive to some engine parts. Civilised countries limit these by law to a very small percentage. These are present to some extent in crude oil, and small quantities have always been present in gasoline.
branched hydrocarbons: comparitively safe, but they add significantly to the cost, given the large quantities needed.
-- GPoss 10:21, Jul 22, 2004 (UTC)
Someone should write something about Ignacy Łukasiewicz. He discovered the paraffin lamp and opened the world's first petroleum refinery in 1856. [ [1]]
--QUESTION What is the generated heat (J/kg) obtained by burning gasoline?
--ANSWER
Fuel kJ/g kwh/kg Kerosene 48 15.5 Gasoline 50 Diesel 45 15.5
--QUESTION What is the freezing point of gasoline?
so it would need proper wikification/rewrite anyway. -- Malyctenar 15:21, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
Could we please have this in SI units instead of 40 hogsheads to the rod units?
Why does it have this in the overview paragraph? "The United States use 360 million US liquid gallons (1.36 billion litres) of gasoline each day."
It seems as though it has been stuck in there as a quick shot against the US. I'm canadian, but i think it maked the entire paragraph flow oddly. any other opinions? SECProto 19:28, May 29, 2005 (UTC)
The acticle overall is not that clear re octane rating for gasoline. In the US what you see on the pump when is says "87 octane" is actually not the RON (Research Octane Number) but an average of the RON and the MON (Motor Octane Number). Typical gasoline has a difference (called the sensitivity) between RON and MON of around 10: so in theUSA 87 octane is typically 92 RON, 82 MON.
Elsewhere in the world (gEurpoe, Asia, Aust: not sure about other places such as Latin America) what is normally quoted is just the RON (there will often be a separte specification for MON, but the general public does not tend to worry about it).
Question is: is this all too techy for wikipedia or should I go ahead and revise.
Also: re the debate re petrol and gasoline: within the industry people refer to "gasoline" all over the world: but the general public uses petrol in english speaking countries outside Nth America. The term Mogas, for Motor Gasoline (to distinguish from Avgas (Aviation gasoline) is also common everywhere). Another term is Motor Spirit, or Spirit for short. Once again...too much detail???
-- GPoss 10:21, Jul 22, 2004 (UTC)
I think we need a lock on this article for the moment. GraemeLeggett 14:34, 11 July 2005 (UTC)
Well that was fun. Come get me next time before it lasts this long. -- Golbez 00:19, July 13, 2005 (UTC)
I still am confused as to why gasoline octane ratings refer to a percentage (which, in this case can't be over 100%) but fuels with octanes of over 100 exist.
I learned in my economics course that leaded gasoline had faded out of use, because it had a negative impact on the growth of children (it supposedly caused mental disorders and what not). Could someone investigate this and incorporate it into the article? -- Ted 05:53, August 17, 2005 (UTC)
Does fuel REALLY freeze at -108*C (-150*F) as they say in that movie when the RAF helicopters go down?
apples have smells, so do woods...while we classify these things as solids, how do you explain the smell?
So which is it? Does "petrol" come from "petroleum spirit" (opening) or from French "petrole"? (Pharmeceutical section) -- Tysto 22:21, 26 September 2005 (UTC)
Actually I think it's more complicated than that. Pre-War there was a retail brand of motor gasoline in the UK that had the clever name "Petrol" - from all the derivatins you cite. It became a household term in the UK - much as Kleenex or Hoover or Zipper - for mogas/gasoline/benzin/essence/gas or any of the other terms for motor gasoline around the world. 212.24.224.18 10:54, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
Reference to the French page http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/P%C3%A9trole will show that petrole is the French for crude oil, as in Compagnie Francaise des Petroles. The French for petrol is essence. Bearfoot 17:20, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
In the industry the failure of Carless to register their trade name "Petrol" is often cited as a cautionary tale for those using and misusing trade names. Bearfoot 17:20, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
This article needs some information on origin of the terms Gasoline and Petrol, especially so for the "petrol" people who have to conform to the American usage. Personally I've always viewed the usage of "gasoline" as unfortunate because of the shortened term "gas". - Diceman 17:27, 11 October 2005 (UTC)
I was adding the figures from the Diesel article to the table when I realized that:
1. the figure for diesel looks wrong
2. the figure for gasoline looks wrong
3. there is no single source of data for this table.
I'd like to get a table published by some verifiable source, something like the Society of Automotive Engineers, but have not turned up any easily verifiable tables to use as references.
RPellessier |
Talk
18:50, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
Without the record prices of the 70s included, the graph does not tell the whole story. Cshay 19:23, 4 December 2005 (UTC)
It would be nice to have a graph of gasoline prices for the last 100 years adjusted for inflation. Trojancowboy ( talk) 02:49, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
I think what "clear gasoline" is should be mentioned in the article. From my research, it appears to be gasoline that hasn't had dye added to it. Tax exempt gasoline can only be used for certain applications, so it is dyed to catch violaters. Does anyone have conflicting information? -- Kjkolb 09:01, 26 December 2005 (UTC)
These two things contradict:
Note that the main reason for the lower energy content (per litre) of LPG in comparison to gasoline is that it has a lower density. Energy content per kilogram is higher than for gasoline (higher hydrogen to carbon ratio). In simple terms, we burn mass, not volume!
Fuel type MJ/L MJ/kg BTU/ imp gal BTU/US gal Research octane
number (RON)Gasoline 29.0 45 150,000 125,000 91–98 LPG 22.16 34.39 114,660 95,475 115
If the energey content per kilogram, for LPG, is higher than that for gasoline, why does the table say gasoline = 45MJ/kg, LPG = 34.39MJ/kg?
So, due to heat loss, friction, etc, real engines can only extract maybe 10%-40% of the total energy contained in gasoline. So my question is: Are the numbers listed in the table the "ideal" values of energy density? Or are they the average amount of energy a real engine could extract? JabberWok 20:56, 2 March 2006 (UTC)
The current text is misleading, RFG formerly had a federal requirement to contain oxygen, but there is separate gasoline called 'oxegenated'. I will clean that up, sometime soon.-- CorvetteZ51 23:15, 8 March 2006 (UTC)
I'm interest in learning about Petrol Diesel Mixes, i've heard that its something like when they mix petrol and diesel badly, and it produces incorrect fuel is this true? and does it cost anything, i'm asuming it is a waste material and that it is free, i'm probably wrong, but i'm hoping someone else can clean this up. as i hav been told my truck will run on even the crudest of mixes
I believe gasoline was first marketed as a cleaning product - does anyone have further information on this?
The link, Gasoline Images - Vintage American gas station and fuel dispenser stock photography, link courtesy of http://www.coolstock.com Links to a 404... Am I allowed to fix/remove it? --— Preceding unsigned comment added by The Cheese Pirate ( talk • contribs) 4 October 2005
From Super:
In Florda and Alska, as well as in continental Europe, Super was the name for a number of years commonly given to leaded high octane petrol (gasoline). Originally the name denoted premium leaded petrol, as opposed to Standard, which was non-premium leaded petrol. However, with the introduction of unleaded petrol in the early 1980s, Standard petrol was discontinued, leaving only Super, which then became a synonym for leaded petrol in general. This continued until the late 1990s, when leaded petrol began to be eliminated in favour of various different blends of unleaded petrol contain special additives for use with leaded vehicles. The name of these blends varies from oil company to oil company.
--— Preceding unsigned comment added by Ewlyahoocom ( talk • contribs) 8 January 2006
I have noticed the Australian fuel price is out of date seeing as Petrol has dropped in price significantly over the last few weeks ($1.40/litre listed here, its now down around $1.10/litre). I am hopeless at maths but have used the Google Calculator to convert it to $US/gallon (it says $AUD1.11/litre = $US3.13/gallon) but I am not sure how accurate it is. Could someone with the skills to do so calculate this correctly? or... could someone list the equation for this type of conversion? Nickuss - 4 October 2006.
I'm not an expert, but the energy content of gasoline is listed as approximately 32 MJ/l or 131 MJ/USgal. I think perhaps that should be 121 MJ/USgal, assuming about 3.79 l/USgal. Could someone in charge of this article please check that? Thanks for maintaining this great information resource! SteveVTS 16 Nov 2006.
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | Archive 2 | Archive 3 | Archive 4 |
The environmental effects of lead in gasoline are extremely difficult to measure and have not been measured in real world settings. Theory suggests that there should be some bad effects, but it is very unclear if these should be called "major". There has been and still is some controversy about this.
Also lead was used in high performance military gasoline during WW2. I'm not sure if it might be even older than that. "1960s" is certainly too late for its introduction.
The form of lead used in gasoline is tetra-ethyl lead.
There are several lead substitutes used in modern lead-free gasoline:
dimethyl sulfur: smells horrible. Slightly corrosive to engines. Not sure if it is dangerous. This was used in small quantities back to the 1930s. The amount used is now much higher in some countries where cheap high octane gasoline without lead is desired.
aromatic hydrocarbons (especially benzene, toluene, xylene): Really seriously poisonous and carcinogenic. Much more dangerous than lead. Slightly corrosive to some engine parts. Civilised countries limit these by law to a very small percentage. These are present to some extent in crude oil, and small quantities have always been present in gasoline.
branched hydrocarbons: comparitively safe, but they add significantly to the cost, given the large quantities needed.
-- GPoss 10:21, Jul 22, 2004 (UTC)
Someone should write something about Ignacy Łukasiewicz. He discovered the paraffin lamp and opened the world's first petroleum refinery in 1856. [ [1]]
--QUESTION What is the generated heat (J/kg) obtained by burning gasoline?
--ANSWER
Fuel kJ/g kwh/kg Kerosene 48 15.5 Gasoline 50 Diesel 45 15.5
--QUESTION What is the freezing point of gasoline?
so it would need proper wikification/rewrite anyway. -- Malyctenar 15:21, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)
Could we please have this in SI units instead of 40 hogsheads to the rod units?
Why does it have this in the overview paragraph? "The United States use 360 million US liquid gallons (1.36 billion litres) of gasoline each day."
It seems as though it has been stuck in there as a quick shot against the US. I'm canadian, but i think it maked the entire paragraph flow oddly. any other opinions? SECProto 19:28, May 29, 2005 (UTC)
The acticle overall is not that clear re octane rating for gasoline. In the US what you see on the pump when is says "87 octane" is actually not the RON (Research Octane Number) but an average of the RON and the MON (Motor Octane Number). Typical gasoline has a difference (called the sensitivity) between RON and MON of around 10: so in theUSA 87 octane is typically 92 RON, 82 MON.
Elsewhere in the world (gEurpoe, Asia, Aust: not sure about other places such as Latin America) what is normally quoted is just the RON (there will often be a separte specification for MON, but the general public does not tend to worry about it).
Question is: is this all too techy for wikipedia or should I go ahead and revise.
Also: re the debate re petrol and gasoline: within the industry people refer to "gasoline" all over the world: but the general public uses petrol in english speaking countries outside Nth America. The term Mogas, for Motor Gasoline (to distinguish from Avgas (Aviation gasoline) is also common everywhere). Another term is Motor Spirit, or Spirit for short. Once again...too much detail???
-- GPoss 10:21, Jul 22, 2004 (UTC)
I think we need a lock on this article for the moment. GraemeLeggett 14:34, 11 July 2005 (UTC)
Well that was fun. Come get me next time before it lasts this long. -- Golbez 00:19, July 13, 2005 (UTC)
I still am confused as to why gasoline octane ratings refer to a percentage (which, in this case can't be over 100%) but fuels with octanes of over 100 exist.
I learned in my economics course that leaded gasoline had faded out of use, because it had a negative impact on the growth of children (it supposedly caused mental disorders and what not). Could someone investigate this and incorporate it into the article? -- Ted 05:53, August 17, 2005 (UTC)
Does fuel REALLY freeze at -108*C (-150*F) as they say in that movie when the RAF helicopters go down?
apples have smells, so do woods...while we classify these things as solids, how do you explain the smell?
So which is it? Does "petrol" come from "petroleum spirit" (opening) or from French "petrole"? (Pharmeceutical section) -- Tysto 22:21, 26 September 2005 (UTC)
Actually I think it's more complicated than that. Pre-War there was a retail brand of motor gasoline in the UK that had the clever name "Petrol" - from all the derivatins you cite. It became a household term in the UK - much as Kleenex or Hoover or Zipper - for mogas/gasoline/benzin/essence/gas or any of the other terms for motor gasoline around the world. 212.24.224.18 10:54, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
Reference to the French page http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/P%C3%A9trole will show that petrole is the French for crude oil, as in Compagnie Francaise des Petroles. The French for petrol is essence. Bearfoot 17:20, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
In the industry the failure of Carless to register their trade name "Petrol" is often cited as a cautionary tale for those using and misusing trade names. Bearfoot 17:20, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
This article needs some information on origin of the terms Gasoline and Petrol, especially so for the "petrol" people who have to conform to the American usage. Personally I've always viewed the usage of "gasoline" as unfortunate because of the shortened term "gas". - Diceman 17:27, 11 October 2005 (UTC)
I was adding the figures from the Diesel article to the table when I realized that:
1. the figure for diesel looks wrong
2. the figure for gasoline looks wrong
3. there is no single source of data for this table.
I'd like to get a table published by some verifiable source, something like the Society of Automotive Engineers, but have not turned up any easily verifiable tables to use as references.
RPellessier |
Talk
18:50, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
Without the record prices of the 70s included, the graph does not tell the whole story. Cshay 19:23, 4 December 2005 (UTC)
It would be nice to have a graph of gasoline prices for the last 100 years adjusted for inflation. Trojancowboy ( talk) 02:49, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
I think what "clear gasoline" is should be mentioned in the article. From my research, it appears to be gasoline that hasn't had dye added to it. Tax exempt gasoline can only be used for certain applications, so it is dyed to catch violaters. Does anyone have conflicting information? -- Kjkolb 09:01, 26 December 2005 (UTC)
These two things contradict:
Note that the main reason for the lower energy content (per litre) of LPG in comparison to gasoline is that it has a lower density. Energy content per kilogram is higher than for gasoline (higher hydrogen to carbon ratio). In simple terms, we burn mass, not volume!
Fuel type MJ/L MJ/kg BTU/ imp gal BTU/US gal Research octane
number (RON)Gasoline 29.0 45 150,000 125,000 91–98 LPG 22.16 34.39 114,660 95,475 115
If the energey content per kilogram, for LPG, is higher than that for gasoline, why does the table say gasoline = 45MJ/kg, LPG = 34.39MJ/kg?
So, due to heat loss, friction, etc, real engines can only extract maybe 10%-40% of the total energy contained in gasoline. So my question is: Are the numbers listed in the table the "ideal" values of energy density? Or are they the average amount of energy a real engine could extract? JabberWok 20:56, 2 March 2006 (UTC)
The current text is misleading, RFG formerly had a federal requirement to contain oxygen, but there is separate gasoline called 'oxegenated'. I will clean that up, sometime soon.-- CorvetteZ51 23:15, 8 March 2006 (UTC)
I'm interest in learning about Petrol Diesel Mixes, i've heard that its something like when they mix petrol and diesel badly, and it produces incorrect fuel is this true? and does it cost anything, i'm asuming it is a waste material and that it is free, i'm probably wrong, but i'm hoping someone else can clean this up. as i hav been told my truck will run on even the crudest of mixes
I believe gasoline was first marketed as a cleaning product - does anyone have further information on this?
The link, Gasoline Images - Vintage American gas station and fuel dispenser stock photography, link courtesy of http://www.coolstock.com Links to a 404... Am I allowed to fix/remove it? --— Preceding unsigned comment added by The Cheese Pirate ( talk • contribs) 4 October 2005
From Super:
In Florda and Alska, as well as in continental Europe, Super was the name for a number of years commonly given to leaded high octane petrol (gasoline). Originally the name denoted premium leaded petrol, as opposed to Standard, which was non-premium leaded petrol. However, with the introduction of unleaded petrol in the early 1980s, Standard petrol was discontinued, leaving only Super, which then became a synonym for leaded petrol in general. This continued until the late 1990s, when leaded petrol began to be eliminated in favour of various different blends of unleaded petrol contain special additives for use with leaded vehicles. The name of these blends varies from oil company to oil company.
--— Preceding unsigned comment added by Ewlyahoocom ( talk • contribs) 8 January 2006
I have noticed the Australian fuel price is out of date seeing as Petrol has dropped in price significantly over the last few weeks ($1.40/litre listed here, its now down around $1.10/litre). I am hopeless at maths but have used the Google Calculator to convert it to $US/gallon (it says $AUD1.11/litre = $US3.13/gallon) but I am not sure how accurate it is. Could someone with the skills to do so calculate this correctly? or... could someone list the equation for this type of conversion? Nickuss - 4 October 2006.
I'm not an expert, but the energy content of gasoline is listed as approximately 32 MJ/l or 131 MJ/USgal. I think perhaps that should be 121 MJ/USgal, assuming about 3.79 l/USgal. Could someone in charge of this article please check that? Thanks for maintaining this great information resource! SteveVTS 16 Nov 2006.