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Both of these articles refer to the same place, but I'm not sure if they are two conflicting spellings or if it's just that one of them is a typo. If there are different spellings then use the accepted one for the main page and have the other one to redirect there. And if it's just a typo then we can delete the incorrect one. I'll try and find out what's right when I get a chance if nobody else has done. Iancaddy 15:53, 22 April 2006 (UTC)
I rearranged some things and added some subtitles. Some editing as well. Lots more that can be done (the "Economy" section is obviously lacking for instance). -- A12n 17:56, 3 December 2006 (UTC)
Did various relatively minor edits. The intro paragraph could be substantially rewritten, moving details about the origin of the name into another section. It might make sense to move this article to an English spelling - "Futa Jal(l)on" - which would harmonize with Imamate of Futa Jallon and the more or less English spellings used for Fuuta Tooro (i.e., Futa Tooro & Imamate of Futa Toro).-- A12n ( talk) 08:09, 8 March 2013 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Not moved. All the participants use good arguments, but there is no agreement here on the need for a move nor on what to move it to. My own limited probes with Google suggested that the French-looking spelling we have now is surprisingly popular in English writings. Dr. Blofeld's Google Books results seemed to follow this pattern. As Aymatth2 points out, even the Library of Congress Subject Headings can't seem to agree internally about this. It will be hard for us to enforce consistency here when the external world hasn't decided how to spell this term. EdJohnston ( talk) 02:07, 9 April 2013 (UTC)
Fouta Djallon → ? –
{{
cite book}}
: Unknown parameter |coauthors=
ignored (|author=
suggested) (
help), which recommends Futa Jallon for the region but Fouta Djallon for the mountain range.
Aymatth2 (
talk)
12:13, 5 April 2013 (UTC)The above move proposal was perhaps doomed to fail. It presented two targets (Futa Jallon or Futa Jalon), did not point out the relevant policy and did not give evidence for the prevalent English usage. The question of whether the name should be consistent with other articles also muddied the water. But the closing comment seemed more like a casual opinion than a summary of the discussion. I did some more checking. On Google Books, selecting language=English (meaning mostly English) and scrolling to the bottom of the list, gave:
So "Futa" is the most common form in English, but there is surprising lack of consensus between Djallon versus Jallon versus Jalon. The lists should technically be reviewed to eliminate duplicates, non-English entries, very old books and books such as novels or personal narratives. That will reduce all the counts, but might reduce "Fouta Djallon" count a bit more than others. A spot check of seven "Fouta Djallon" results pages (5, 10, 15, 20, 25, 30 and 35) gave 19 French entries, or 27% French. Eliminating books where the only use is in a quote or citation of a French-language work may also cut down the frequency of "Fouta Djallon". But the shift is not likely to present a dominant form.
A search on Google Scholar gives a different pattern. It does not seem possible to select by language. When I run the queries that follow, most of the earlier results are in English, reflecting Google's view of my preference, but at least half the "Djallon" results are in French, which dominates later results. Results are:
A search in JSTOR gives
With JSTOR, even more of the "Djallon" results were in French than was the case with Scholar. "Futa Jallon" dominates results in the English Scholar and JSTOR papers.
Is there some missing factor that explains this variance? Yes. User:In ictu oculi makes the excellent point that "some 'Futa Jallon' references are to the Imamate of Futa Jallon 1727-1896", which should be excluded. Yes indeed. For most of the life of the imamate no Europeans ventured in. A few rumors would have reached the coastal factories, but the primary sources would all be in Arabic, or perhaps Fulani in an Ajami script. English scholars writing about the imamate would naturally transcribe phonetically as Futa Jallon or Futa Jalon. But modern English books about today's Fouta Djallon region - travel books and books or papers by naturalists, geologists and anthropologists - may well use the spelling that their hosts use. A quick scan of the results sets seems to confirm that distinction. The Scholar and JSTOR results are biased towards history or historical ethnography, and the Books are biased towards modern Guinea.
So my guess is that "Futa Jallon" is and will long remain the standard English spelling for the historical imamate. But "Fouta Djallon" is on its way to becoming the standard English spelling for the region in modern Guinea. Aymatth2 ( talk) 13:18, 12 April 2013 (UTC)
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Fuuta Jaloo is actually a Fula-wide geographic name, even if its origin and primary use is in Futa Jalon itself, so I added that after the initial usage. Also pulled the brief discussion of the name into a new section. An alternative way of handling that discussion might be like in Futa Tooro to put it under history (the name reflects the history). -- A12n ( talk) 18:38, 23 August 2019 (UTC)
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Both of these articles refer to the same place, but I'm not sure if they are two conflicting spellings or if it's just that one of them is a typo. If there are different spellings then use the accepted one for the main page and have the other one to redirect there. And if it's just a typo then we can delete the incorrect one. I'll try and find out what's right when I get a chance if nobody else has done. Iancaddy 15:53, 22 April 2006 (UTC)
I rearranged some things and added some subtitles. Some editing as well. Lots more that can be done (the "Economy" section is obviously lacking for instance). -- A12n 17:56, 3 December 2006 (UTC)
Did various relatively minor edits. The intro paragraph could be substantially rewritten, moving details about the origin of the name into another section. It might make sense to move this article to an English spelling - "Futa Jal(l)on" - which would harmonize with Imamate of Futa Jallon and the more or less English spellings used for Fuuta Tooro (i.e., Futa Tooro & Imamate of Futa Toro).-- A12n ( talk) 08:09, 8 March 2013 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Not moved. All the participants use good arguments, but there is no agreement here on the need for a move nor on what to move it to. My own limited probes with Google suggested that the French-looking spelling we have now is surprisingly popular in English writings. Dr. Blofeld's Google Books results seemed to follow this pattern. As Aymatth2 points out, even the Library of Congress Subject Headings can't seem to agree internally about this. It will be hard for us to enforce consistency here when the external world hasn't decided how to spell this term. EdJohnston ( talk) 02:07, 9 April 2013 (UTC)
Fouta Djallon → ? –
{{
cite book}}
: Unknown parameter |coauthors=
ignored (|author=
suggested) (
help), which recommends Futa Jallon for the region but Fouta Djallon for the mountain range.
Aymatth2 (
talk)
12:13, 5 April 2013 (UTC)The above move proposal was perhaps doomed to fail. It presented two targets (Futa Jallon or Futa Jalon), did not point out the relevant policy and did not give evidence for the prevalent English usage. The question of whether the name should be consistent with other articles also muddied the water. But the closing comment seemed more like a casual opinion than a summary of the discussion. I did some more checking. On Google Books, selecting language=English (meaning mostly English) and scrolling to the bottom of the list, gave:
So "Futa" is the most common form in English, but there is surprising lack of consensus between Djallon versus Jallon versus Jalon. The lists should technically be reviewed to eliminate duplicates, non-English entries, very old books and books such as novels or personal narratives. That will reduce all the counts, but might reduce "Fouta Djallon" count a bit more than others. A spot check of seven "Fouta Djallon" results pages (5, 10, 15, 20, 25, 30 and 35) gave 19 French entries, or 27% French. Eliminating books where the only use is in a quote or citation of a French-language work may also cut down the frequency of "Fouta Djallon". But the shift is not likely to present a dominant form.
A search on Google Scholar gives a different pattern. It does not seem possible to select by language. When I run the queries that follow, most of the earlier results are in English, reflecting Google's view of my preference, but at least half the "Djallon" results are in French, which dominates later results. Results are:
A search in JSTOR gives
With JSTOR, even more of the "Djallon" results were in French than was the case with Scholar. "Futa Jallon" dominates results in the English Scholar and JSTOR papers.
Is there some missing factor that explains this variance? Yes. User:In ictu oculi makes the excellent point that "some 'Futa Jallon' references are to the Imamate of Futa Jallon 1727-1896", which should be excluded. Yes indeed. For most of the life of the imamate no Europeans ventured in. A few rumors would have reached the coastal factories, but the primary sources would all be in Arabic, or perhaps Fulani in an Ajami script. English scholars writing about the imamate would naturally transcribe phonetically as Futa Jallon or Futa Jalon. But modern English books about today's Fouta Djallon region - travel books and books or papers by naturalists, geologists and anthropologists - may well use the spelling that their hosts use. A quick scan of the results sets seems to confirm that distinction. The Scholar and JSTOR results are biased towards history or historical ethnography, and the Books are biased towards modern Guinea.
So my guess is that "Futa Jallon" is and will long remain the standard English spelling for the historical imamate. But "Fouta Djallon" is on its way to becoming the standard English spelling for the region in modern Guinea. Aymatth2 ( talk) 13:18, 12 April 2013 (UTC)
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Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 00:54, 5 October 2017 (UTC)
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Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 17:47, 26 December 2017 (UTC)
Fuuta Jaloo is actually a Fula-wide geographic name, even if its origin and primary use is in Futa Jalon itself, so I added that after the initial usage. Also pulled the brief discussion of the name into a new section. An alternative way of handling that discussion might be like in Futa Tooro to put it under history (the name reflects the history). -- A12n ( talk) 18:38, 23 August 2019 (UTC)