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I've rewritten the lead to explicitly state the number of annual honorees. This is sort of WP:OR but also sort of WP:CALC. My concern is that to do otherwise would leave the door open for misrepresenting the significance of the award. I have seen far, far too many Wikipedia articles which use press releases to just say so-and-so "was listed as one of Forbes 30 Under 30" without actually mentioning that there are far more than just 30 listed every year. Far too many promotional mentions do not actually mention which list is being cited. Again, this is arguably a bit WP:OR, but WP:NPOV would be damaged by leaving this info out. Grayfell ( talk) 00:48, 24 October 2016 (UTC)
I've axed the 'List of honorees' section. As a form of promotion, the list is frequently cited by press releases and passing mentions which totally fail to provide any meaningful context for what the list signifies. There's also the issue that by listing some famous names without listing the thousands of non-famous people, the article is implying that the award is more significant than it actually is. We simply cannot list every honoree, so we need a clearly defined and highly selective criteria. Even doing a spin-off per-year list article would be excessively long and of very little encylopedic value. If any neutral sources of real substance cite specific people as being good examples of what the award means, or the type of person who is honored, that could be evaluated. Otherwise a listing like this is doomed to be arbitrary. Grayfell ( talk) 00:54, 24 October 2016 (UTC)
Per WP:No original research, please do not add material to this entry unless reliable secondary sources indicates its connection to the topic of Forbes 30 Under 30. Innisfree987 ( talk) 04:14, 13 July 2017 (UTC)
Came here wondering what "30 under 30" meant, and I'm still not clear what "under 30" means. Is it a funding thing? An age thing? The article makes no mention. Brianetta Brian Ronald, UK. Talk here 11:52, 13 October 2017 (UTC)
Hi WatersPhD, thanks for your additions to this page. I see they are all sourced to Forbes own site, making them stray a bit into the realm of original research and promotion which we try to avoid. Have any independent reliable sources discussed these events? Such sources would help us make sure we are giving a neutral account. Thanks! Innisfree987 ( talk) 19:23, 17 March 2021 (UTC)
Creating a list of 30 people under the age of 30 whose names are public is quite trivial. The WP:LEAD here says "a set of lists of people under 30 years old" without saying what Forbes claims is the reason for listing those 30 people. Is it really only the fact that they are under 30?
We need a sourced description of why Forbes claims it thinks that these people should become notable, apart from the recursive fact that they become notable by being placed on the list. Boud ( talk) 18:23, 29 October 2022 (UTC)
Is "business and industry figures" supposed to be the criterion for listing? Boud ( talk) 18:24, 29 October 2022 (UTC)
Removed this paragraph that said "fraud" as it is based on an opinion piece and it is not objective. The source that was used was just an opinion piece and does not reflect the list as a whole. It is not the list's fault that only 4 individuals out of thousands of people on the list happened to have committed a white collar crime. Also, Elizabeth Holmes is irrelevant as she was not even on this list. If you look at any alumni of colleges for example, you would also find some fraudulent alumni but you wouldn't add a "fraud" paragraph on their pages just because some of them attended the college. This is a subjective paragraph and should be removed, since it is misleading, and especially since it is based on an opinion piece. It is misleading and makes it look like they committed fraud because or for the list when that is inaccurate. Statistically, there will always be a small percentage of people on a list with thousands of people who end up being in a bad light, but that does not reflect the list as a whole. I am sure the four people referenced like SBF and Holmes were also on lists from other publications, but nobody has added their names on other publications' pages either.-- Lingodu ( talk) 20:12, 19 July 2023 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Forbes 30 Under 30 article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
I've rewritten the lead to explicitly state the number of annual honorees. This is sort of WP:OR but also sort of WP:CALC. My concern is that to do otherwise would leave the door open for misrepresenting the significance of the award. I have seen far, far too many Wikipedia articles which use press releases to just say so-and-so "was listed as one of Forbes 30 Under 30" without actually mentioning that there are far more than just 30 listed every year. Far too many promotional mentions do not actually mention which list is being cited. Again, this is arguably a bit WP:OR, but WP:NPOV would be damaged by leaving this info out. Grayfell ( talk) 00:48, 24 October 2016 (UTC)
I've axed the 'List of honorees' section. As a form of promotion, the list is frequently cited by press releases and passing mentions which totally fail to provide any meaningful context for what the list signifies. There's also the issue that by listing some famous names without listing the thousands of non-famous people, the article is implying that the award is more significant than it actually is. We simply cannot list every honoree, so we need a clearly defined and highly selective criteria. Even doing a spin-off per-year list article would be excessively long and of very little encylopedic value. If any neutral sources of real substance cite specific people as being good examples of what the award means, or the type of person who is honored, that could be evaluated. Otherwise a listing like this is doomed to be arbitrary. Grayfell ( talk) 00:54, 24 October 2016 (UTC)
Per WP:No original research, please do not add material to this entry unless reliable secondary sources indicates its connection to the topic of Forbes 30 Under 30. Innisfree987 ( talk) 04:14, 13 July 2017 (UTC)
Came here wondering what "30 under 30" meant, and I'm still not clear what "under 30" means. Is it a funding thing? An age thing? The article makes no mention. Brianetta Brian Ronald, UK. Talk here 11:52, 13 October 2017 (UTC)
Hi WatersPhD, thanks for your additions to this page. I see they are all sourced to Forbes own site, making them stray a bit into the realm of original research and promotion which we try to avoid. Have any independent reliable sources discussed these events? Such sources would help us make sure we are giving a neutral account. Thanks! Innisfree987 ( talk) 19:23, 17 March 2021 (UTC)
Creating a list of 30 people under the age of 30 whose names are public is quite trivial. The WP:LEAD here says "a set of lists of people under 30 years old" without saying what Forbes claims is the reason for listing those 30 people. Is it really only the fact that they are under 30?
We need a sourced description of why Forbes claims it thinks that these people should become notable, apart from the recursive fact that they become notable by being placed on the list. Boud ( talk) 18:23, 29 October 2022 (UTC)
Is "business and industry figures" supposed to be the criterion for listing? Boud ( talk) 18:24, 29 October 2022 (UTC)
Removed this paragraph that said "fraud" as it is based on an opinion piece and it is not objective. The source that was used was just an opinion piece and does not reflect the list as a whole. It is not the list's fault that only 4 individuals out of thousands of people on the list happened to have committed a white collar crime. Also, Elizabeth Holmes is irrelevant as she was not even on this list. If you look at any alumni of colleges for example, you would also find some fraudulent alumni but you wouldn't add a "fraud" paragraph on their pages just because some of them attended the college. This is a subjective paragraph and should be removed, since it is misleading, and especially since it is based on an opinion piece. It is misleading and makes it look like they committed fraud because or for the list when that is inaccurate. Statistically, there will always be a small percentage of people on a list with thousands of people who end up being in a bad light, but that does not reflect the list as a whole. I am sure the four people referenced like SBF and Holmes were also on lists from other publications, but nobody has added their names on other publications' pages either.-- Lingodu ( talk) 20:12, 19 July 2023 (UTC)