This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Daily pageviews of this article
A graph should have been displayed here but
graphs are temporarily disabled. Until they are enabled again, visit the interactive graph at
pageviews.wmcloud.org |
It would be a good idea. This article postdated Yurodivy by over a year, and the editor who contributed it may not have been aware of the older article. This one presents a peculiar POV ("maverick asceticism"?) and uses a non-standard translation to express the concept; it's usually "Fool for Christ.
However, in the long run both these articles need to be combined as part of something more general. They discuss the Fool-for-Christ as almost exclusively a Russian context, but as this article notes it was known in Constantinople. It is, however, not exclusive to Eastern Christianity, but under the name "Holy Fool" was also known in the West. (Although I have to admit I know of no sainted Western Fools-for-Christ.) It might be best to have an article Holy Fool (now a redirect to Yurodivy) that treats the subject comprehensively. TCC (talk) (contribs) 11:13, 24 November 2005 (UTC)
I don't think it would be appropriate to merge yurodivy (holy fool)with "Foolishness in Christ" because the holy fool as far as I know is a literary archetype present in both Southern and Russian literature separate from this other entry.
None of you know what the hell you are talking about -- sqwauk, sqwauk -- so shut up and live a little life. its all in your head. :D Yurodivyigoes 03:14, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
The concept of Fool for Christ is present throughout the Eastern churches, not just Russian Orthodoxy. Shouldn't it be shown as its own article? Majoreditor 03:51, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
No one did the move, so I did. I'm also going to fix the redirect, Fool for Christ. This is a very popular saying in the English-speaking world, and even though I have Russian ancestors, this is the English Wikipedia.
If we need separate articles, I'm happy to help. For example the primary article could have sections on Fool for Christ and the Yurodivy. I'd also like to know more about non-Christian traditions that may have a similar kind of holy fool. Maybe Buddhism? -- Uncle Ed ( talk) 18:41, 9 December 2007 (UTC)
According to the article about her, she lived in the 18th century and was canonized in 1988. That maked her an 18th century f-f-c... -- Illythr ( talk) 18:49, 20 April 2008 (UTC)
The material on Rasputin definitely violates NPOV and is taken almost word for word from a single source: http://www.theguardian.com/books/2000/mar/18/biography.isobelmontgomery
The Wikipedia Rasputin article is vastly different from this, which makes definitive claims about what is certainly disputable--including the material in Wikipedia's own article. Please fix! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.99.18.252 ( talk) 20:46, 2 July 2014 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on Foolishness for Christ. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 18 January 2022).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 17:05, 14 December 2017 (UTC)
This would benefit from a short explanation of the symbolism of fire pertaining to the Holy Spirit, of which there are (at least Christian) references to the Holy Spirit acting as a guide, or directing action, [1] which I think is very relevant to the main topic. Also, the content currently in the section is unsourced, or at least unclear as to the source, and I don't think it counts as common knowledge. Musicalmather ( talk) 18:34, 3 September 2020 (UTC)
I removed the following content from Makarii Marchenko, although I thought it might be useful to add to this article. See that page history for attribution.
The (yurodivy) юродивый, the Russian version of foolishness for Christ, is a peculiar form of Eastern Orthodox asceticism. [1] The юродивый is a Holy Fool, one who acts foolish in the eyes of men.
The prototypical story of the Holy Fool is that of the young man who asks to accompany the prophet Elijah:
One day a fervent disciple asked Elijah for permission to accompany the prophet on one of his many journeys. "You may come with me," said Elijah, "if you promise not to ask any questions about anything I do. For as soon as you ask for an explanation, we must part company." The young man promised and they started on their way.
As night fell they came to the house of a poor man whose only possession was a cow. The man and his wife received Elijah and his young friend gladly, gave them food to eat and a comfortable place in which to sleep. Before they left in the morning, Elijah prayed that the poor man’s cow should die. The disciple was surprised at the prophet’s prayer, but he kept his promise and did not ask any questions.
The next night they stopped at a mansion. The rich man paid no attention to his guests, offered them nothing to eat or drink, and sent them to sleep in the barn. As they were leaving the next morning, Elijah noticed a wall, near the house, that had crumbled away. Elijah prayed that the wall repair itself; and the wall rose before them complete and whole. Again they went on their way. And again the disciple refrained from asking questions.
The next day they came to a magnificent temple, with pews of gold and pews of silver. But none of the worshipers invited the wayfarers to their home. They went on their way and Elijah prayed that all the worshippers should become leaders. The disciple’s bewilderment grew, but again he refrained from asking questions.
At the next town they reached all the people were friendly and welcomed the strangers, offering them food and drink. When they had rested and were ready to leave, Elijah prayed that God should give them one leader. The disciple could contain himself no longer and asked: "Where is the justice of your prayers, Elijah?"
And Elijah answered: "The poor man’s wife was destined to die the day we left them, and I prayed to God to accept the cow as a vicarious sacrifice. Under the crumbling wall of the rich miser was hidden a treasure of gold which he would have discovered had he rebuilt the wall himself. The grudging worshipers in the temple will all become leaders and be ruined by many disputes. But the inhabitants of this good town, united under one wise leader, will always prosper."
"Now," said the disciple humbly, "I see that there is always justice in God’s acts, even when the evildoers seem to prosper." "Yes," said Elijah. "And now, also, since you have asked for an explanation, we must part company." [2]
A variant of this story is also found in the Koran, in the 18th Surah, where Moses and El Khidr travel together. [3]
This foolish behavior "is caused neither by mistake nor by feeble-mindedness, but is deliberate, irritating, even provocative." [4] Such behavior is meant give society in general and individuals in particular some insight into their own behavior.
Daask ( talk) 18:14, 14 March 2022 (UTC)
References
This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Daily pageviews of this article
A graph should have been displayed here but
graphs are temporarily disabled. Until they are enabled again, visit the interactive graph at
pageviews.wmcloud.org |
It would be a good idea. This article postdated Yurodivy by over a year, and the editor who contributed it may not have been aware of the older article. This one presents a peculiar POV ("maverick asceticism"?) and uses a non-standard translation to express the concept; it's usually "Fool for Christ.
However, in the long run both these articles need to be combined as part of something more general. They discuss the Fool-for-Christ as almost exclusively a Russian context, but as this article notes it was known in Constantinople. It is, however, not exclusive to Eastern Christianity, but under the name "Holy Fool" was also known in the West. (Although I have to admit I know of no sainted Western Fools-for-Christ.) It might be best to have an article Holy Fool (now a redirect to Yurodivy) that treats the subject comprehensively. TCC (talk) (contribs) 11:13, 24 November 2005 (UTC)
I don't think it would be appropriate to merge yurodivy (holy fool)with "Foolishness in Christ" because the holy fool as far as I know is a literary archetype present in both Southern and Russian literature separate from this other entry.
None of you know what the hell you are talking about -- sqwauk, sqwauk -- so shut up and live a little life. its all in your head. :D Yurodivyigoes 03:14, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
The concept of Fool for Christ is present throughout the Eastern churches, not just Russian Orthodoxy. Shouldn't it be shown as its own article? Majoreditor 03:51, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
No one did the move, so I did. I'm also going to fix the redirect, Fool for Christ. This is a very popular saying in the English-speaking world, and even though I have Russian ancestors, this is the English Wikipedia.
If we need separate articles, I'm happy to help. For example the primary article could have sections on Fool for Christ and the Yurodivy. I'd also like to know more about non-Christian traditions that may have a similar kind of holy fool. Maybe Buddhism? -- Uncle Ed ( talk) 18:41, 9 December 2007 (UTC)
According to the article about her, she lived in the 18th century and was canonized in 1988. That maked her an 18th century f-f-c... -- Illythr ( talk) 18:49, 20 April 2008 (UTC)
The material on Rasputin definitely violates NPOV and is taken almost word for word from a single source: http://www.theguardian.com/books/2000/mar/18/biography.isobelmontgomery
The Wikipedia Rasputin article is vastly different from this, which makes definitive claims about what is certainly disputable--including the material in Wikipedia's own article. Please fix! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.99.18.252 ( talk) 20:46, 2 July 2014 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on Foolishness for Christ. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 18 January 2022).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 17:05, 14 December 2017 (UTC)
This would benefit from a short explanation of the symbolism of fire pertaining to the Holy Spirit, of which there are (at least Christian) references to the Holy Spirit acting as a guide, or directing action, [1] which I think is very relevant to the main topic. Also, the content currently in the section is unsourced, or at least unclear as to the source, and I don't think it counts as common knowledge. Musicalmather ( talk) 18:34, 3 September 2020 (UTC)
I removed the following content from Makarii Marchenko, although I thought it might be useful to add to this article. See that page history for attribution.
The (yurodivy) юродивый, the Russian version of foolishness for Christ, is a peculiar form of Eastern Orthodox asceticism. [1] The юродивый is a Holy Fool, one who acts foolish in the eyes of men.
The prototypical story of the Holy Fool is that of the young man who asks to accompany the prophet Elijah:
One day a fervent disciple asked Elijah for permission to accompany the prophet on one of his many journeys. "You may come with me," said Elijah, "if you promise not to ask any questions about anything I do. For as soon as you ask for an explanation, we must part company." The young man promised and they started on their way.
As night fell they came to the house of a poor man whose only possession was a cow. The man and his wife received Elijah and his young friend gladly, gave them food to eat and a comfortable place in which to sleep. Before they left in the morning, Elijah prayed that the poor man’s cow should die. The disciple was surprised at the prophet’s prayer, but he kept his promise and did not ask any questions.
The next night they stopped at a mansion. The rich man paid no attention to his guests, offered them nothing to eat or drink, and sent them to sleep in the barn. As they were leaving the next morning, Elijah noticed a wall, near the house, that had crumbled away. Elijah prayed that the wall repair itself; and the wall rose before them complete and whole. Again they went on their way. And again the disciple refrained from asking questions.
The next day they came to a magnificent temple, with pews of gold and pews of silver. But none of the worshipers invited the wayfarers to their home. They went on their way and Elijah prayed that all the worshippers should become leaders. The disciple’s bewilderment grew, but again he refrained from asking questions.
At the next town they reached all the people were friendly and welcomed the strangers, offering them food and drink. When they had rested and were ready to leave, Elijah prayed that God should give them one leader. The disciple could contain himself no longer and asked: "Where is the justice of your prayers, Elijah?"
And Elijah answered: "The poor man’s wife was destined to die the day we left them, and I prayed to God to accept the cow as a vicarious sacrifice. Under the crumbling wall of the rich miser was hidden a treasure of gold which he would have discovered had he rebuilt the wall himself. The grudging worshipers in the temple will all become leaders and be ruined by many disputes. But the inhabitants of this good town, united under one wise leader, will always prosper."
"Now," said the disciple humbly, "I see that there is always justice in God’s acts, even when the evildoers seem to prosper." "Yes," said Elijah. "And now, also, since you have asked for an explanation, we must part company." [2]
A variant of this story is also found in the Koran, in the 18th Surah, where Moses and El Khidr travel together. [3]
This foolish behavior "is caused neither by mistake nor by feeble-mindedness, but is deliberate, irritating, even provocative." [4] Such behavior is meant give society in general and individuals in particular some insight into their own behavior.
Daask ( talk) 18:14, 14 March 2022 (UTC)
References