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A couple of observations — thought I'd share them because it feels too big for one person (at least, too big for this one):
Others [programs for Flower Drum Song] acknowledged the internment of Japanese American actors during the 1940s and explained how some actors had changed their names—from the Japanese Goro Suzuki to the Chinese-sounding Jack Soo, for instance—as a way of avoiding the anti-Japanese racism.- Anon
Moved recent discussion to the bottom of the page, where it belongs. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 02:56, 2 March 2013 (UTC)
I agree with the observations (above) by Lawikitejana. Taking this step by step, here is what I think might--hopefully--make this article more understandable and clear: (NOTE: I am not telling anyone what to do, this is just my way of figuring out things)
I am sure there's more, but that is my anaylsis so far (really these are working notes to me, as much as thinking out loud). I may attempt to start this work, but do not have the time right now. JeanColumbia 20:35, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
If you split off the film article, I'll write a synopsis for the Broadway version(s). Also, please look at your pronouns in the first few paragraphs. It is not always clear to me from the prose which version or person you are referring to. -- Ssilvers 15:05, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
I moved film links over to the film article (or added links for actors in both musical and film). Please check "What links here" to see if I missed any. Probably you need to add film links to some other people involved in both. -- Ssilvers 19:41, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
Image:TimePatSuzukiDec22-1958.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
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With Wehwalt's recent improvements, I have changed the assessment to C-class. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 01:56, 25 October 2010 (UTC)
Hi. I'm not sure why all the ELs were deleted. I agree that there are too many of them now, but many of them contain information that should be mined for the article, and then the link will become a footnote. So, for now, I consider these links a list of research. Feel free to disagree and say why. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 18:36, 28 October 2010 (UTC)
Here's a treasure trove of stuff about this musical from the now-defunct American Musical Theatre of San Jose -- Ssilvers ( talk) 16:19, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
OK. I just ran across it and thought it could help you - I like their introduction (really just the second paragraph under "Production History") about the importance and innovations of the 1958 production. Did you look at the PDF version? Frankly, I don't see why a professional theatre company's "education guide" would be less reliable than their theater program; in either case, the theatre company is the publisher. Indeed, I rather think it was prepared and published with far more care than their theatre programs, which are necessarily published in a hurry. Still, it doesn't have a masthead, which is strange, and I agree that there is not as much accountability without it. If your objective is to bring this to FA, I agree that you shouldn't cite to it. If you're planning on stopping at B-class ... well, it's a published source and appears to be neutrally written and helpful.... -- Ssilvers ( talk) 03:50, 2 November 2010 (UTC)
Ah. Good to know the plan. :p Well, if R&H don't deserve it, I don't know who do. I'm happy to keep copy editing as you go, but I don't have any books that discuss the show. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 04:39, 2 November 2010 (UTC)
Can we put them in the infobox if they have to be anywhere. If they don't play a role in the story, then they are just names to the reader, and why have them in the text?-- Wehwalt ( talk) 05:15, 3 November 2010 (UTC)
For 2002, we already mentioned set, costume and lights, but not hair/wigs, which is not even an award category at the major awards. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 05:47, 3 November 2010 (UTC)
Are we saying "Madam" Liang, or "Madame" Liang? IBDB says Madam. Go ahead and choose then do a global replace to make it consistent throughout. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 16:12, 3 November 2010 (UTC)
OK. I gave it a read. See Wikipedia:WikiProject_Musical_Theatre/Article_Structure for ideas on what else is needed. See also Hair (musical) for more ideas. You need a musical analysis section, for one thing, including a brief discussion of recordings. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 05:37, 4 November 2010 (UTC)
As I said, see Wikipedia:WikiProject Musical Theatre/Article Structure and Hair (musical) for more ideas. Yes, we do put the "major"song titles (that is, the ones influencing the plot) into the plot summary thus: Linda rejoices in her femininity ("I enjoy being a girl"). OR: Linda tells Fong, "I enjoy being a girl". I do not have the script either, but If you are going to FA, I think you need to check it out of the library to check the plot summary. I'll review the new music section as soon as I can. Best regards! -- Ssilvers ( talk) 15:07, 4 November 2010 (UTC)
I think we have our wires crossed. Mei Li is only "Mei-li" when we are talking about the 2002 production. In the book and previous versions, she is "Mei Li". Also, we need to keep our citation formats consistent. As the bulk of them seem to be cite format, I suggest that when either of us adds a reference, that it be in cite format if a template is used.-- Wehwalt ( talk) 01:54, 5 November 2010 (UTC)
Plot sections look good with song titles. Good job. As for cites, if you want to use the cite templates, you will need to deal with all the cites yourself. I urge you to reconvert them to not use the cite templates, which, as I say, I think simply are designed to turn people off of Wikipedia. All the best! -- Ssilvers ( talk) 04:02, 5 November 2010 (UTC)
Can we get a public domain sound clip? Maybe the defunct American Musical Theatre of San Jose will let us use a clip. I'll e-mail a San Jose-based accompanist I know. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 04:32, 5 November 2010 (UTC)
Yes! See: [4] and [5]. This article makes some interesting statements about the context of the show: [6]. It was a full-scale professional production. But, I don't care if we list regional productions. If you google around, you'll see that there have been quite a few of them. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 15:43, 5 November 2010 (UTC)
Do we want a list showing that, or is that too much?-- Wehwalt ( talk) 11:41, 5 November 2010 (UTC)
Well, if the idea is just to identify the songs included/excluded from the revision, we've done that now. If the idea is to list all the changes, that is where they occur in the musical and who sings them, possibly best to just redo the whole thing, because it is entirely different, as a glance at the 2002 synopsis shows. Incidentally, I agree with the Broadway critics, I did not go to see it in 2002, but the script utterly sucks.-- Wehwalt ( talk) 23:35, 5 November 2010 (UTC)
I've ordered copies of the script and of Lee's book, but they may take a week or more to arrive. Brianboulton has begun a review which I asked him to post here when he is done, but he is not feeling well at present. One question he did have which I am unable to answer other than with the obvious: what is a flower drum song? Or perhaps, what is it's significance?-- Wehwalt ( talk) 02:02, 7 November 2010 (UTC)
Here's another interesting article about Lee and the musical: http://www.chinainsight.info/culture/community/72-events/288-c-y-lee-author-of-flower-drum-song-to-attend-opening-night-performance.html -- Ssilvers ( talk) 03:25, 7 November 2010 (UTC)
This is my review, transferred from a sandbox. Brianboulton ( talk) 00:57, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
That is all; not a lot, really. Nice work - but I really think there has to be some indication of what a "flower drum song" is, or indeed a flower drum. The title seems to have no relevance either to the original plot or the revision. Brianboulton ( talk) 16:20, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
I would rather that you did not nominate this for FAC until after you have read and added material from the new book. I am still planning to go through the ELs and either add info or delete them; that will take me more than a week, because this week is crazy for me. I suggest going to GA now. I like to go through GA first, though I know you hard core FA types often skip it. But GA reviewers often give very useful feedback and a reality check. Thanks, -- Ssilvers ( talk) 15:39, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
You're the boss. I'm just along for the ride on this one. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 15:53, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
Anyway, just finished Lee's book, not bad in a wordy old fashioned sort of way. There is really no discussion of what a flower drum song is, May Li (another spelling!) and her drunkard dad (no professor here) do a couple, but they aren't really talked about. Suggest we just go forward.-- Wehwalt ( talk) 02:35, 13 November 2010 (UTC)
It's rather unfortunate that the source chooses the Pirate King's song as an example, when the Major General's is not only perhaps the ultimate "I am" song, but is far better known, I am sure to the reader.-- Wehwalt ( talk) 20:04, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
This is a great source from the EL section: http://www.tcg.org/publications/at/2002/drum.cfm I'm not done using it, but I'll have to resume sometime later in the next days, as I have to run now. All the best, -- Ssilvers ( talk) 23:19, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
The order of the table doesn't make sense to me. Shouldn't it go Wang, Ta, Mei Li, Linda (or maybe Mei Li first) then the others in whatever order? If you agree, can you fix it? -- Ssilvers ( talk) 16:22, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
Really, the sources don't say much about it. All Nolan says is "Altering the staging of one song, "She Is Beautiful", consumed a good deal of time. Only when Oscar hit on the idea of reshaping it to make it "You Are Beautiful" could director Gene Kelly make it work." Lewis says the Boston critics liked "She Is Beautiful".-- Wehwalt ( talk) 00:24, 16 November 2010 (UTC)
Well, the source said that they "reshaped" the song, and changed its title. The change must have been significant, or your source wouldn't have mentioned it specifically. We can report that fact, as we do, in order to give the reader, together with the other things we say there, an idea of how many significant changes were made. So, I don't mind the sentence, and on balance I think it is helpful, if not totally satisfying. On the other hand, I would not mourn its passing for too long, so you can keep or delete it as you please. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 02:31, 30 November 2010 (UTC)
Why capitalize oriental? It's not part of a proper noun. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 19:38, 22 November 2010 (UTC)
See what Tony says. I also asked User:Awadewit, who is another English usage expert. I don't really think Eastern should be capped, although I haven't objected to it before, 'cause I thought you had thought it thru already. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 22:28, 22 November 2010 (UTC)
No word from either of these? I am pretty confident that it should be lower case. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 23:00, 30 November 2010 (UTC)
I've been through all except the last two, but I've got to go to bed now, so will resume in the next days. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 06:45, 29 November 2010 (UTC)
OK, just checking. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 22:59, 30 November 2010 (UTC)
The [Talkin' Broadway] review reminded me that we need more information about the London production. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 22:59, 30 November 2010 (UTC)
What kind of reviews did it get? The reviews may discuss other matters of interest (apparently Lewis does discuss some of the reviews). Were any of the designers notable? Any change in creative team - for example, same director and choreographer? -- Ssilvers ( talk) 00:07, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
We describe Hall as an African American; we describe Patrick Adiarte as a Filipino-American. I guess we should be consistent.-- Wehwalt ( talk) 11:25, 29 November 2010 (UTC)
Oh, I just saw the problem here. It's ok as is. In one case we use it as an adjective (hyphen needed), in the other as a noun (no hyphen). -- Ssilvers ( talk) 05:54, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
What line is this about?: "Rodgers later recalled that one of the actors sang the same line incorrectly for seven consecutive performances. Hammerstein, whom Rodgers described as the most self-controlled individual he had ever known, said only, "I'm not very good-natured about this anymore." I must say that this is not a very interesting story, unless they fired the guy, or the line he substituted was very funny.... Less is more, IMO. You've done a good job of putting in the info; I'd resist the urge to pad it with this sort of fluffy stuff, unless it's a really great story. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 00:25, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
It doesn't fit textually. If you are not knowledgeable about the theatre, it seems a random interjection. Perhaps someplace else?
The other articles are gone and we are ready for launch. Any objection?-- Wehwalt ( talk) 18:36, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
The Book review says that Lewis ignores the production but later discusses the reviews of it. BTW, we also need to mention that subsequent productions that have used the Hwang script. I'll look on Google. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 20:35, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
Here is a long list of recordings of the show. Do we need to mention any others beside the original cast albums?: http://castalbums.org/shows/Flower_Drum_Song/113 -- Ssilvers ( talk) 22:47, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
Here's an interesting article. Should it be an EL?: http://www.playbill.com/news/article/125775-Leung-Long-Ceraulo-and-More-Will-Celebrate-Flower-Drum-Songs-50th-Anniversary -- Ssilvers ( talk) 23:49, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
I'm finished. Chita Rivera did FDS in 1966 in Milwaukee. See this. Would you kindly add this to the Subsequent prods. section? Thanks! -- Ssilvers ( talk) 00:18, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
Here's another ref that you may or may not want to use about Gene Kelly and the show: http://geneius.webs.com/readyforyourshow.htm There's a lot of stuff here about it, but not much that's new.... What a nice site! -- Ssilvers ( talk) 00:33, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
I don't think we're going to get away with using that as an infobox image. NFCC #8. I know Fasach Nua and if he responds at all if we put in a fair use rationale, he will say that it doesn't expand his understanding of the article. If this article was Flower Drum Song (cast recording) then maybe we could. Not seeing it here.-- Wehwalt ( talk) 21:38, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
Here's the London theatre program cover: http://cgi.ebay.ca/Rodgers-Hammerstein-FLOWER-DRUM-SONG-1960-London-/400170728298?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5d2c08bb6a -- Ssilvers ( talk) 23:00, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
Think it is very good so far. I think a media file in the music section is needed, and potentially a slightly more detailed plot summary, and more on critical analysis. Was a very nice read though. Mark E ( talk) 11:25, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
Jean Columbia pointed us to some sources for the awards section, including these: Source for Ovation Awards: [14]; Official Tony Awards site: [15]; and [16]. For Theatre World Award: see 1958-59.
Great work here. I had been doing a little editing to the author article, and there's a whole section i tagged as needing citations, around critical reception, modern views on the book/play/film. If anyone has any energy left from their FA work, could they look over the author article and see if any of that section can stand or just be deleted? i may do it as well, but im much less familiar at this point with the subject. Mercurywoodrose ( talk) 06:47, 19 December 2010 (UTC)
Yes, sorry, Lee is outside my areas of interest on Wikipedia. There may be some information and references in this article, though, that you can copy over to Lee's article. Happy holidays. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 20:50, 19 December 2010 (UTC)
I can't find http://www.rnh.com/show_history.asp?id=FD in archive.org ... SandyGeorgia ( Talk) 17:20, 9 November 2011 (UTC)
Well, we should probably get with the program, so to speak, and add some images. I was looking through the program for FDS on line with the NYPL here and first it might be wise if we identified the scenes
Thoughts on which ones to use?-- Wehwalt ( talk) 02:42, 11 February 2013 (UTC)
I like page 2 and the bottom of p. 18 the most (there's a bigger image of p. 18 here). I like all the headshots if you want an image where we describe a cast or crew member. I love the one of the lighting designer and her dog, but I doubt we should use it. :-) I'm not crazy about the Playbill at all. What's the copyright status of this? and this? and this? and this? and this? I don't care about the bumper sticker. If you have a place for it, I don't mind it. I know we can't use this, but I saw this production on Broadway. I didn't like it, but Lea Salonga is adorable. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 06:30, 12 February 2013 (UTC)
In 1958, the jazz vocalist and Broadway veteran Adelaide Hall was cast and signed up to appear in the show and share the lead with Pat Suzuki. Newspaper reference from the Washington Afro American 12 August 1958 - http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=8zsmAAAAIBAJ&sjid=u_4FAAAAIBAJ&pg=6535,2933764&dq=adelaide+hall&hl=en I have tried to include this relevant piece of information on the actual Flower Drum Song Wikipedia page. Unfortunately it has been deleted twice by a reader who goes by the name of Wehwalt who appears to feel the information is not relevant. I totally disagree with their opinion, as without this piece of information it is rewriting history, and I believe that is something Wikipedia does not wish to encourage. Surely, by adding this information, it may prompt another reader to expand on the reason why Miss Hall left the cast to return to the UK. I would therefore like to bring this to the attention of WIKIPEDIA. At the moment, the CASTING section in this article does not give a true reflection of all the actors who were originally cast in the roles, thereby I believe it is rewriting history and gives a false impression. I find it strange that Wehwalt felt the need to edit the heading to my explanation about including this relevant piece of information above. Is it now practice to edit the TALK sections as well?
I have brought this matter to the attention of WIKIPEDIA regarding the omitted mention of Adelaide Hall from the Wikipedia article as it does not give a true reflection of who was originally cast and signed for the production. The matter of Miss Hall leaving the cast could be cited as unknown e.g Adelaide Hall left the cast before the production was staged, reason unknown. Surely that would not confuse any reader who reads the article! The fact that the producer and the director of the show and Rogers and Hammerstein cast Miss Hall in the role is I believe extremely significant. I rest my case. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Eurovisa ( talk • contribs) 22:07, 1 March 2013 (UTC)
I have no great objection to what you originally wrote so long as you are able to cite the second part of it. The way you had it the second time left the question of her participation in the play hanging. I think it would make a very useful addition to the article. But everything must be cited. Regarding the synopsis I think changing the part about being a girl as you propose would be overly stiff. The synopsis is written in a more popular tone then the rest of the article as I think of the typical reader as someone who is going to the theater and it's hastily reviewing the plot in advance of seeing it for the first time. But certainly we can discuss all these things.-- Wehwalt ( talk) 22:35, 1 March 2013 (UTC)
Dear Eurovisa, Welcome to Wikipedia! Here's what you proposed putting into the article: "Jazz singer and veteran Broadway star Adelaide Hall was signed to share the lead with Pat Suzuki", citing this newspaper article. I read the news article, and it does indeed say, as of August 12, 1958, that Hall had been signed. It is not crystal clear (and I think the writer of the article was confused on the point), whether she was to share the role of Linda Low with Suzuki, or to share the stage with Suzuki by playing Mei Li. In any event, rehearsals began in September, and by the time the show had its out-of-town tryouts beginning on October 27, 1958, Hall was gone from the cast. None of the major sources mention Hall, so it is likely that she left the cast before rehearsals began. In musical theatre, casting changes that are made before a show opens are only of significant interest if they generate press interest or some kind of scandal. In this case, an early casting choice (at least according to this one newspaper) was changed and received no attention from the historians who have written about this show, so I think that it is not significant here, unless you can find some other press interest about why Hall never performed the role. However, I agree that it is of interest in Hall's own article to the extent that the source confirms the information. All the best! -- Ssilvers ( talk) 02:56, 2 March 2013 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: No move. There is strong consensus not to move the articles. Cúchullain t/ c 14:20, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
– "The Flower Drum Song" should redirect to the disambiguation because I do not believe there is a primary topic for this term. The musical is based on the novel but has significantly higher page views. It is also often referred to as "The Flower Drum Song" so I don't see why the novel should occupy this title. The editor whose username is Z0 13:59, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
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A couple of observations — thought I'd share them because it feels too big for one person (at least, too big for this one):
Others [programs for Flower Drum Song] acknowledged the internment of Japanese American actors during the 1940s and explained how some actors had changed their names—from the Japanese Goro Suzuki to the Chinese-sounding Jack Soo, for instance—as a way of avoiding the anti-Japanese racism.- Anon
Moved recent discussion to the bottom of the page, where it belongs. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 02:56, 2 March 2013 (UTC)
I agree with the observations (above) by Lawikitejana. Taking this step by step, here is what I think might--hopefully--make this article more understandable and clear: (NOTE: I am not telling anyone what to do, this is just my way of figuring out things)
I am sure there's more, but that is my anaylsis so far (really these are working notes to me, as much as thinking out loud). I may attempt to start this work, but do not have the time right now. JeanColumbia 20:35, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
If you split off the film article, I'll write a synopsis for the Broadway version(s). Also, please look at your pronouns in the first few paragraphs. It is not always clear to me from the prose which version or person you are referring to. -- Ssilvers 15:05, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
I moved film links over to the film article (or added links for actors in both musical and film). Please check "What links here" to see if I missed any. Probably you need to add film links to some other people involved in both. -- Ssilvers 19:41, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
Image:TimePatSuzukiDec22-1958.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. -- BetacommandBot ( talk) 19:50, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
With Wehwalt's recent improvements, I have changed the assessment to C-class. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 01:56, 25 October 2010 (UTC)
Hi. I'm not sure why all the ELs were deleted. I agree that there are too many of them now, but many of them contain information that should be mined for the article, and then the link will become a footnote. So, for now, I consider these links a list of research. Feel free to disagree and say why. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 18:36, 28 October 2010 (UTC)
Here's a treasure trove of stuff about this musical from the now-defunct American Musical Theatre of San Jose -- Ssilvers ( talk) 16:19, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
OK. I just ran across it and thought it could help you - I like their introduction (really just the second paragraph under "Production History") about the importance and innovations of the 1958 production. Did you look at the PDF version? Frankly, I don't see why a professional theatre company's "education guide" would be less reliable than their theater program; in either case, the theatre company is the publisher. Indeed, I rather think it was prepared and published with far more care than their theatre programs, which are necessarily published in a hurry. Still, it doesn't have a masthead, which is strange, and I agree that there is not as much accountability without it. If your objective is to bring this to FA, I agree that you shouldn't cite to it. If you're planning on stopping at B-class ... well, it's a published source and appears to be neutrally written and helpful.... -- Ssilvers ( talk) 03:50, 2 November 2010 (UTC)
Ah. Good to know the plan. :p Well, if R&H don't deserve it, I don't know who do. I'm happy to keep copy editing as you go, but I don't have any books that discuss the show. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 04:39, 2 November 2010 (UTC)
Can we put them in the infobox if they have to be anywhere. If they don't play a role in the story, then they are just names to the reader, and why have them in the text?-- Wehwalt ( talk) 05:15, 3 November 2010 (UTC)
For 2002, we already mentioned set, costume and lights, but not hair/wigs, which is not even an award category at the major awards. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 05:47, 3 November 2010 (UTC)
Are we saying "Madam" Liang, or "Madame" Liang? IBDB says Madam. Go ahead and choose then do a global replace to make it consistent throughout. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 16:12, 3 November 2010 (UTC)
OK. I gave it a read. See Wikipedia:WikiProject_Musical_Theatre/Article_Structure for ideas on what else is needed. See also Hair (musical) for more ideas. You need a musical analysis section, for one thing, including a brief discussion of recordings. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 05:37, 4 November 2010 (UTC)
As I said, see Wikipedia:WikiProject Musical Theatre/Article Structure and Hair (musical) for more ideas. Yes, we do put the "major"song titles (that is, the ones influencing the plot) into the plot summary thus: Linda rejoices in her femininity ("I enjoy being a girl"). OR: Linda tells Fong, "I enjoy being a girl". I do not have the script either, but If you are going to FA, I think you need to check it out of the library to check the plot summary. I'll review the new music section as soon as I can. Best regards! -- Ssilvers ( talk) 15:07, 4 November 2010 (UTC)
I think we have our wires crossed. Mei Li is only "Mei-li" when we are talking about the 2002 production. In the book and previous versions, she is "Mei Li". Also, we need to keep our citation formats consistent. As the bulk of them seem to be cite format, I suggest that when either of us adds a reference, that it be in cite format if a template is used.-- Wehwalt ( talk) 01:54, 5 November 2010 (UTC)
Plot sections look good with song titles. Good job. As for cites, if you want to use the cite templates, you will need to deal with all the cites yourself. I urge you to reconvert them to not use the cite templates, which, as I say, I think simply are designed to turn people off of Wikipedia. All the best! -- Ssilvers ( talk) 04:02, 5 November 2010 (UTC)
Can we get a public domain sound clip? Maybe the defunct American Musical Theatre of San Jose will let us use a clip. I'll e-mail a San Jose-based accompanist I know. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 04:32, 5 November 2010 (UTC)
Yes! See: [4] and [5]. This article makes some interesting statements about the context of the show: [6]. It was a full-scale professional production. But, I don't care if we list regional productions. If you google around, you'll see that there have been quite a few of them. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 15:43, 5 November 2010 (UTC)
Do we want a list showing that, or is that too much?-- Wehwalt ( talk) 11:41, 5 November 2010 (UTC)
Well, if the idea is just to identify the songs included/excluded from the revision, we've done that now. If the idea is to list all the changes, that is where they occur in the musical and who sings them, possibly best to just redo the whole thing, because it is entirely different, as a glance at the 2002 synopsis shows. Incidentally, I agree with the Broadway critics, I did not go to see it in 2002, but the script utterly sucks.-- Wehwalt ( talk) 23:35, 5 November 2010 (UTC)
I've ordered copies of the script and of Lee's book, but they may take a week or more to arrive. Brianboulton has begun a review which I asked him to post here when he is done, but he is not feeling well at present. One question he did have which I am unable to answer other than with the obvious: what is a flower drum song? Or perhaps, what is it's significance?-- Wehwalt ( talk) 02:02, 7 November 2010 (UTC)
Here's another interesting article about Lee and the musical: http://www.chinainsight.info/culture/community/72-events/288-c-y-lee-author-of-flower-drum-song-to-attend-opening-night-performance.html -- Ssilvers ( talk) 03:25, 7 November 2010 (UTC)
This is my review, transferred from a sandbox. Brianboulton ( talk) 00:57, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
That is all; not a lot, really. Nice work - but I really think there has to be some indication of what a "flower drum song" is, or indeed a flower drum. The title seems to have no relevance either to the original plot or the revision. Brianboulton ( talk) 16:20, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
I would rather that you did not nominate this for FAC until after you have read and added material from the new book. I am still planning to go through the ELs and either add info or delete them; that will take me more than a week, because this week is crazy for me. I suggest going to GA now. I like to go through GA first, though I know you hard core FA types often skip it. But GA reviewers often give very useful feedback and a reality check. Thanks, -- Ssilvers ( talk) 15:39, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
You're the boss. I'm just along for the ride on this one. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 15:53, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
Anyway, just finished Lee's book, not bad in a wordy old fashioned sort of way. There is really no discussion of what a flower drum song is, May Li (another spelling!) and her drunkard dad (no professor here) do a couple, but they aren't really talked about. Suggest we just go forward.-- Wehwalt ( talk) 02:35, 13 November 2010 (UTC)
It's rather unfortunate that the source chooses the Pirate King's song as an example, when the Major General's is not only perhaps the ultimate "I am" song, but is far better known, I am sure to the reader.-- Wehwalt ( talk) 20:04, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
This is a great source from the EL section: http://www.tcg.org/publications/at/2002/drum.cfm I'm not done using it, but I'll have to resume sometime later in the next days, as I have to run now. All the best, -- Ssilvers ( talk) 23:19, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
The order of the table doesn't make sense to me. Shouldn't it go Wang, Ta, Mei Li, Linda (or maybe Mei Li first) then the others in whatever order? If you agree, can you fix it? -- Ssilvers ( talk) 16:22, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
Really, the sources don't say much about it. All Nolan says is "Altering the staging of one song, "She Is Beautiful", consumed a good deal of time. Only when Oscar hit on the idea of reshaping it to make it "You Are Beautiful" could director Gene Kelly make it work." Lewis says the Boston critics liked "She Is Beautiful".-- Wehwalt ( talk) 00:24, 16 November 2010 (UTC)
Well, the source said that they "reshaped" the song, and changed its title. The change must have been significant, or your source wouldn't have mentioned it specifically. We can report that fact, as we do, in order to give the reader, together with the other things we say there, an idea of how many significant changes were made. So, I don't mind the sentence, and on balance I think it is helpful, if not totally satisfying. On the other hand, I would not mourn its passing for too long, so you can keep or delete it as you please. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 02:31, 30 November 2010 (UTC)
Why capitalize oriental? It's not part of a proper noun. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 19:38, 22 November 2010 (UTC)
See what Tony says. I also asked User:Awadewit, who is another English usage expert. I don't really think Eastern should be capped, although I haven't objected to it before, 'cause I thought you had thought it thru already. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 22:28, 22 November 2010 (UTC)
No word from either of these? I am pretty confident that it should be lower case. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 23:00, 30 November 2010 (UTC)
I've been through all except the last two, but I've got to go to bed now, so will resume in the next days. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 06:45, 29 November 2010 (UTC)
OK, just checking. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 22:59, 30 November 2010 (UTC)
The [Talkin' Broadway] review reminded me that we need more information about the London production. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 22:59, 30 November 2010 (UTC)
What kind of reviews did it get? The reviews may discuss other matters of interest (apparently Lewis does discuss some of the reviews). Were any of the designers notable? Any change in creative team - for example, same director and choreographer? -- Ssilvers ( talk) 00:07, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
We describe Hall as an African American; we describe Patrick Adiarte as a Filipino-American. I guess we should be consistent.-- Wehwalt ( talk) 11:25, 29 November 2010 (UTC)
Oh, I just saw the problem here. It's ok as is. In one case we use it as an adjective (hyphen needed), in the other as a noun (no hyphen). -- Ssilvers ( talk) 05:54, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
What line is this about?: "Rodgers later recalled that one of the actors sang the same line incorrectly for seven consecutive performances. Hammerstein, whom Rodgers described as the most self-controlled individual he had ever known, said only, "I'm not very good-natured about this anymore." I must say that this is not a very interesting story, unless they fired the guy, or the line he substituted was very funny.... Less is more, IMO. You've done a good job of putting in the info; I'd resist the urge to pad it with this sort of fluffy stuff, unless it's a really great story. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 00:25, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
It doesn't fit textually. If you are not knowledgeable about the theatre, it seems a random interjection. Perhaps someplace else?
The other articles are gone and we are ready for launch. Any objection?-- Wehwalt ( talk) 18:36, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
The Book review says that Lewis ignores the production but later discusses the reviews of it. BTW, we also need to mention that subsequent productions that have used the Hwang script. I'll look on Google. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 20:35, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
Here is a long list of recordings of the show. Do we need to mention any others beside the original cast albums?: http://castalbums.org/shows/Flower_Drum_Song/113 -- Ssilvers ( talk) 22:47, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
Here's an interesting article. Should it be an EL?: http://www.playbill.com/news/article/125775-Leung-Long-Ceraulo-and-More-Will-Celebrate-Flower-Drum-Songs-50th-Anniversary -- Ssilvers ( talk) 23:49, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
I'm finished. Chita Rivera did FDS in 1966 in Milwaukee. See this. Would you kindly add this to the Subsequent prods. section? Thanks! -- Ssilvers ( talk) 00:18, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
Here's another ref that you may or may not want to use about Gene Kelly and the show: http://geneius.webs.com/readyforyourshow.htm There's a lot of stuff here about it, but not much that's new.... What a nice site! -- Ssilvers ( talk) 00:33, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
I don't think we're going to get away with using that as an infobox image. NFCC #8. I know Fasach Nua and if he responds at all if we put in a fair use rationale, he will say that it doesn't expand his understanding of the article. If this article was Flower Drum Song (cast recording) then maybe we could. Not seeing it here.-- Wehwalt ( talk) 21:38, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
Here's the London theatre program cover: http://cgi.ebay.ca/Rodgers-Hammerstein-FLOWER-DRUM-SONG-1960-London-/400170728298?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5d2c08bb6a -- Ssilvers ( talk) 23:00, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
Think it is very good so far. I think a media file in the music section is needed, and potentially a slightly more detailed plot summary, and more on critical analysis. Was a very nice read though. Mark E ( talk) 11:25, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
Jean Columbia pointed us to some sources for the awards section, including these: Source for Ovation Awards: [14]; Official Tony Awards site: [15]; and [16]. For Theatre World Award: see 1958-59.
Great work here. I had been doing a little editing to the author article, and there's a whole section i tagged as needing citations, around critical reception, modern views on the book/play/film. If anyone has any energy left from their FA work, could they look over the author article and see if any of that section can stand or just be deleted? i may do it as well, but im much less familiar at this point with the subject. Mercurywoodrose ( talk) 06:47, 19 December 2010 (UTC)
Yes, sorry, Lee is outside my areas of interest on Wikipedia. There may be some information and references in this article, though, that you can copy over to Lee's article. Happy holidays. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 20:50, 19 December 2010 (UTC)
I can't find http://www.rnh.com/show_history.asp?id=FD in archive.org ... SandyGeorgia ( Talk) 17:20, 9 November 2011 (UTC)
Well, we should probably get with the program, so to speak, and add some images. I was looking through the program for FDS on line with the NYPL here and first it might be wise if we identified the scenes
Thoughts on which ones to use?-- Wehwalt ( talk) 02:42, 11 February 2013 (UTC)
I like page 2 and the bottom of p. 18 the most (there's a bigger image of p. 18 here). I like all the headshots if you want an image where we describe a cast or crew member. I love the one of the lighting designer and her dog, but I doubt we should use it. :-) I'm not crazy about the Playbill at all. What's the copyright status of this? and this? and this? and this? and this? I don't care about the bumper sticker. If you have a place for it, I don't mind it. I know we can't use this, but I saw this production on Broadway. I didn't like it, but Lea Salonga is adorable. -- Ssilvers ( talk) 06:30, 12 February 2013 (UTC)
In 1958, the jazz vocalist and Broadway veteran Adelaide Hall was cast and signed up to appear in the show and share the lead with Pat Suzuki. Newspaper reference from the Washington Afro American 12 August 1958 - http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=8zsmAAAAIBAJ&sjid=u_4FAAAAIBAJ&pg=6535,2933764&dq=adelaide+hall&hl=en I have tried to include this relevant piece of information on the actual Flower Drum Song Wikipedia page. Unfortunately it has been deleted twice by a reader who goes by the name of Wehwalt who appears to feel the information is not relevant. I totally disagree with their opinion, as without this piece of information it is rewriting history, and I believe that is something Wikipedia does not wish to encourage. Surely, by adding this information, it may prompt another reader to expand on the reason why Miss Hall left the cast to return to the UK. I would therefore like to bring this to the attention of WIKIPEDIA. At the moment, the CASTING section in this article does not give a true reflection of all the actors who were originally cast in the roles, thereby I believe it is rewriting history and gives a false impression. I find it strange that Wehwalt felt the need to edit the heading to my explanation about including this relevant piece of information above. Is it now practice to edit the TALK sections as well?
I have brought this matter to the attention of WIKIPEDIA regarding the omitted mention of Adelaide Hall from the Wikipedia article as it does not give a true reflection of who was originally cast and signed for the production. The matter of Miss Hall leaving the cast could be cited as unknown e.g Adelaide Hall left the cast before the production was staged, reason unknown. Surely that would not confuse any reader who reads the article! The fact that the producer and the director of the show and Rogers and Hammerstein cast Miss Hall in the role is I believe extremely significant. I rest my case. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Eurovisa ( talk • contribs) 22:07, 1 March 2013 (UTC)
I have no great objection to what you originally wrote so long as you are able to cite the second part of it. The way you had it the second time left the question of her participation in the play hanging. I think it would make a very useful addition to the article. But everything must be cited. Regarding the synopsis I think changing the part about being a girl as you propose would be overly stiff. The synopsis is written in a more popular tone then the rest of the article as I think of the typical reader as someone who is going to the theater and it's hastily reviewing the plot in advance of seeing it for the first time. But certainly we can discuss all these things.-- Wehwalt ( talk) 22:35, 1 March 2013 (UTC)
Dear Eurovisa, Welcome to Wikipedia! Here's what you proposed putting into the article: "Jazz singer and veteran Broadway star Adelaide Hall was signed to share the lead with Pat Suzuki", citing this newspaper article. I read the news article, and it does indeed say, as of August 12, 1958, that Hall had been signed. It is not crystal clear (and I think the writer of the article was confused on the point), whether she was to share the role of Linda Low with Suzuki, or to share the stage with Suzuki by playing Mei Li. In any event, rehearsals began in September, and by the time the show had its out-of-town tryouts beginning on October 27, 1958, Hall was gone from the cast. None of the major sources mention Hall, so it is likely that she left the cast before rehearsals began. In musical theatre, casting changes that are made before a show opens are only of significant interest if they generate press interest or some kind of scandal. In this case, an early casting choice (at least according to this one newspaper) was changed and received no attention from the historians who have written about this show, so I think that it is not significant here, unless you can find some other press interest about why Hall never performed the role. However, I agree that it is of interest in Hall's own article to the extent that the source confirms the information. All the best! -- Ssilvers ( talk) 02:56, 2 March 2013 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: No move. There is strong consensus not to move the articles. Cúchullain t/ c 14:20, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
– "The Flower Drum Song" should redirect to the disambiguation because I do not believe there is a primary topic for this term. The musical is based on the novel but has significantly higher page views. It is also often referred to as "The Flower Drum Song" so I don't see why the novel should occupy this title. The editor whose username is Z0 13:59, 30 August 2018 (UTC)