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I've been working along with RedHarvest to expand this article to a more appropriate length than heretofore. I have no more time to edit this afternoon, but I did find an additional online source (first source listed under "General References") which I hope to study and make more use of when I get back to editing. Any additional help or sources would be greatly appreciated! - Ecjmartin ( talk) 18:46, 28 July 2008 (UTC)
Thanks for your comments. I live only 20 miles or so from Lexington, and used to be a frequent visitor to the battlefield and museum, though it's been a while since my last visit. I think the article looks pretty decent now, though it might stand further expansion after reading the reports on that link (if it is decided that further details are warrented or desired, or if corrections need to be made). What do you think? - Ecjmartin ( talk) 01:50, 29 July 2008 (UTC)
This one is tricky because both sides have valid points. I need to hunt down references to support it but I undestand the Southern argument that the house was in such a commanding position that it really was not suitable as a hospital, and putting a hospital flag on it to prevent if from being used that way was unacceptable. On the other hand the lack of attention to defending it suggests that Mulligan's intentions were that it would be sufficiently in the rear that it would be a good site. My personal interpretation is that he or someone before him miscalculated and assumed that there would not be any force chosing to place itself between there and the river. At any rate, I see both sides as having merit.
Similarly, when it was taken the Federals who retook it had been instructed to consider those holding it in violation of the Laws of War. The MSG inside didn't just up and surrender, they were overwhelmed and compelled to surrender after inflicting considerable casualties. Again, both points of view have some validity. Interestingly, those who executed the men in the hospital don't seem to have been singled out and executed by the MSG following the battle. (That is the sort of outcome I would have expected if the MSG commanders felt strongly in the right on this.) Red Harvest ( talk) 21:33, 28 July 2008 (UTC)
I'm looking for some confirmation on this one. I've heard a time or two that the cannonball was removed or replaced at some point. I started hunting around for a source today and found the following: "During the Battle of Lexington in 1861, a cannonball struck the top of this column of the Lafayette County Courthouse. A trajectory study has shown that it was probably fired from a Confederate cannon that overshot the Union trenches. The cannonball fell right out, but, around 1920, what was accepted to be the original cannonball was screwed on a two-foot iron rod that was inserted in a hole drilled in the column, to make sure it stayed there permanently." This came from Roger E. Slusher's Lexington (Images of America series) p. 25--a 2013 publication via the Lexington Historical Assoc. A http://lexingtonmo.com/files/A-Cannonball,-A-Calaboose--Count-Basie.pdf brochure repeats an almost identical story: "A cannonball hit the left column of the portico during the Battle of Lexington. It immediately fell out, but was picked up by a man who later swore it was the original ball. In the early 1900s, he brought it to the County Commissioners, who had the ball attached to the column with an iron rod. It has since become the symbol of Lexington." Red Harvest ( talk) 06:28, 8 June 2014 (UTC)
I've noticed in Larry Wood's new book about Lexington that the initial skirmish is listed as the 12th, rather than the 13th commonly given. The 13th date appears to be a legacy error from the original compilation in the Official Records from the 1881 volume including Lexington, probably stemming from Price's report where the skirmish is given as on the 13th. A much later volume to the O.R. from 1898 contains many more MSG reports from Lexington and those that I've looked at all list the skirmish as the 12th, not the 13th. Additionally, Major Van Horn who commanded a portion of the Union skirmishers gives the date as the 12th in his own post-war account published by the Lexington Historical Society in 1903. Mulligan also gave the date as the 12th in a wartime newspaper account (his Official Report was never published.) Unfortunately, Price's 13th date is also used for the O.R. heading/list of operations. This will require changes and cites in the body of the article, but I'm not sure what to do about the heading dates in intro or info box. Red Harvest ( talk) 17:48, 9 June 2014 (UTC)
Another thing worth noting is that the O.R. lists this as a "siege" rather than a singular battle. The NPS/CWSAC summaries call nearly everything a battle, whether a skirmish, a battle, or a siege. This engagement has all of the hallmarks of a siege, rather than a battle. This particular NPS summary is weak and should not be used as a reliable source if any others are available. (For examples the casualties on both sides are erroneous when compared to reports or various other sources.) Red Harvest ( talk) 17:48, 9 June 2014 (UTC)
Unfortunately, as has happened on many other pages that relied on online links for ref/cites, many of the links are now dead or just default to home pages. I'm replacing these on the main page as I come to them and find paper text to cite. In the meantime, if editors can ID the original source, and find the same in traditional paper volumes, it would be best to replace the electronic sources with ink based sources (e.g. things like after-action reports from the "Official Records".) Red Harvest ( talk) 21:37, 12 June 2014 (UTC)
From the entry: "The Federals were then paroled by General Price...."
I would like to expand this to include a definition of what "parole" means in this instance.
Also, my great-grandfather Jesse J. Ridgell fought on the Union side in this battle but our family history says he was taken to a prisoner-of-war camp in Virginia from where he later escaped. He returned to the Union Army in Missouri but was declared unfit for battle owing to what was probably chronic viral bronchitis. Were any Union prisoners taken to POW camps after the first battle or were they all paroled? What would have happened to soldiers (other than the ones who are mentioned in the entry) who broke their parole?
Jesse served in the 14th Home Guard Ridgell's Co. under his uncle, Captain Richard W. Ridgell.
Thank you. Rissa, copy editor ( talk) 23:11, 15 June 2014 (UTC)
What are "hemp shocks" and couldn't that just be changed to "hemp bales"? Especially given that "shocks" doesn't link to anything agricultural. Rissa, Guild of Copy Editors ( talk) 01:58, 18 March 2015 (UTC)
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![]() | It is requested that a map or maps be
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improve its quality. Wikipedians in Missouri may be able to help! |
I've been working along with RedHarvest to expand this article to a more appropriate length than heretofore. I have no more time to edit this afternoon, but I did find an additional online source (first source listed under "General References") which I hope to study and make more use of when I get back to editing. Any additional help or sources would be greatly appreciated! - Ecjmartin ( talk) 18:46, 28 July 2008 (UTC)
Thanks for your comments. I live only 20 miles or so from Lexington, and used to be a frequent visitor to the battlefield and museum, though it's been a while since my last visit. I think the article looks pretty decent now, though it might stand further expansion after reading the reports on that link (if it is decided that further details are warrented or desired, or if corrections need to be made). What do you think? - Ecjmartin ( talk) 01:50, 29 July 2008 (UTC)
This one is tricky because both sides have valid points. I need to hunt down references to support it but I undestand the Southern argument that the house was in such a commanding position that it really was not suitable as a hospital, and putting a hospital flag on it to prevent if from being used that way was unacceptable. On the other hand the lack of attention to defending it suggests that Mulligan's intentions were that it would be sufficiently in the rear that it would be a good site. My personal interpretation is that he or someone before him miscalculated and assumed that there would not be any force chosing to place itself between there and the river. At any rate, I see both sides as having merit.
Similarly, when it was taken the Federals who retook it had been instructed to consider those holding it in violation of the Laws of War. The MSG inside didn't just up and surrender, they were overwhelmed and compelled to surrender after inflicting considerable casualties. Again, both points of view have some validity. Interestingly, those who executed the men in the hospital don't seem to have been singled out and executed by the MSG following the battle. (That is the sort of outcome I would have expected if the MSG commanders felt strongly in the right on this.) Red Harvest ( talk) 21:33, 28 July 2008 (UTC)
I'm looking for some confirmation on this one. I've heard a time or two that the cannonball was removed or replaced at some point. I started hunting around for a source today and found the following: "During the Battle of Lexington in 1861, a cannonball struck the top of this column of the Lafayette County Courthouse. A trajectory study has shown that it was probably fired from a Confederate cannon that overshot the Union trenches. The cannonball fell right out, but, around 1920, what was accepted to be the original cannonball was screwed on a two-foot iron rod that was inserted in a hole drilled in the column, to make sure it stayed there permanently." This came from Roger E. Slusher's Lexington (Images of America series) p. 25--a 2013 publication via the Lexington Historical Assoc. A http://lexingtonmo.com/files/A-Cannonball,-A-Calaboose--Count-Basie.pdf brochure repeats an almost identical story: "A cannonball hit the left column of the portico during the Battle of Lexington. It immediately fell out, but was picked up by a man who later swore it was the original ball. In the early 1900s, he brought it to the County Commissioners, who had the ball attached to the column with an iron rod. It has since become the symbol of Lexington." Red Harvest ( talk) 06:28, 8 June 2014 (UTC)
I've noticed in Larry Wood's new book about Lexington that the initial skirmish is listed as the 12th, rather than the 13th commonly given. The 13th date appears to be a legacy error from the original compilation in the Official Records from the 1881 volume including Lexington, probably stemming from Price's report where the skirmish is given as on the 13th. A much later volume to the O.R. from 1898 contains many more MSG reports from Lexington and those that I've looked at all list the skirmish as the 12th, not the 13th. Additionally, Major Van Horn who commanded a portion of the Union skirmishers gives the date as the 12th in his own post-war account published by the Lexington Historical Society in 1903. Mulligan also gave the date as the 12th in a wartime newspaper account (his Official Report was never published.) Unfortunately, Price's 13th date is also used for the O.R. heading/list of operations. This will require changes and cites in the body of the article, but I'm not sure what to do about the heading dates in intro or info box. Red Harvest ( talk) 17:48, 9 June 2014 (UTC)
Another thing worth noting is that the O.R. lists this as a "siege" rather than a singular battle. The NPS/CWSAC summaries call nearly everything a battle, whether a skirmish, a battle, or a siege. This engagement has all of the hallmarks of a siege, rather than a battle. This particular NPS summary is weak and should not be used as a reliable source if any others are available. (For examples the casualties on both sides are erroneous when compared to reports or various other sources.) Red Harvest ( talk) 17:48, 9 June 2014 (UTC)
Unfortunately, as has happened on many other pages that relied on online links for ref/cites, many of the links are now dead or just default to home pages. I'm replacing these on the main page as I come to them and find paper text to cite. In the meantime, if editors can ID the original source, and find the same in traditional paper volumes, it would be best to replace the electronic sources with ink based sources (e.g. things like after-action reports from the "Official Records".) Red Harvest ( talk) 21:37, 12 June 2014 (UTC)
From the entry: "The Federals were then paroled by General Price...."
I would like to expand this to include a definition of what "parole" means in this instance.
Also, my great-grandfather Jesse J. Ridgell fought on the Union side in this battle but our family history says he was taken to a prisoner-of-war camp in Virginia from where he later escaped. He returned to the Union Army in Missouri but was declared unfit for battle owing to what was probably chronic viral bronchitis. Were any Union prisoners taken to POW camps after the first battle or were they all paroled? What would have happened to soldiers (other than the ones who are mentioned in the entry) who broke their parole?
Jesse served in the 14th Home Guard Ridgell's Co. under his uncle, Captain Richard W. Ridgell.
Thank you. Rissa, copy editor ( talk) 23:11, 15 June 2014 (UTC)
What are "hemp shocks" and couldn't that just be changed to "hemp bales"? Especially given that "shocks" doesn't link to anything agricultural. Rissa, Guild of Copy Editors ( talk) 01:58, 18 March 2015 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 3 external links on First Battle of Lexington. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at {{
Sourcecheck}}
).
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 5 June 2024).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 07:35, 21 July 2016 (UTC)