A fact from Fall of the Fascist regime in Italy appeared on Wikipedia's
Main Page in the
Did you know column on 25 July 2013 (
check views). The text of the entry was as follows:
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A fact from this article was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the On this day section on July 25, 2013. |
This article is rated B-class on Wikipedia's
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This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 13 February 2019 and 3 May 2019. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Jordankelseyh.
Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT ( talk) 21:03, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: no consensus. Jenks24 ( talk) 14:22, 13 August 2015 (UTC)
25 Luglio →
??? – "25 Luglio" is not the common name for this series of events in English historiography—or Italian, to my knowledge. A descriptive title would be better, perhaps
Grandi motion or
Fall of Mussolini.
Srnec (
talk) 02:00, 28 July 2015 (UTC) Relisted.
Jenks24 (
talk) 12:56, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: no consensus. Apologies for doing this again, but despite the level of support for the proposed title, the concern that this move would significantly narrow the article's scope is a serious one and it has not been addressed. This is an unusual step, having already had a recent RM, but I would say there should be no prejudice against a new RM discussing the merits of Alex2006's and Pincrete's proposed titles. Jenks24 ( talk) 16:52, 29 August 2015 (UTC)
25 Luglio →
Dismissal and arrest of Mussolini – "25 Luglio" is just a date. While some events are known primarily by their date, this isn't one of them (in English). Almost every instance of this Italian term in English comes in a citation to an Italian work. It is almost never used on its own as a
term of art. There is no evidence that it ever "denotes" several weeks' worth of events, as the intro claims. The Italian Wikipedia prefers
it:Ordine del giorno Grandi ("Grandi's order of the day").
Srnec (
talk) 19:02, 13 August 2015 (UTC) Relisted
Calidum 03:13, 21 August 2015 (UTC)
*'''Support'''
or *'''Oppose'''
, then sign your comment with ~~~~
. Since
polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account
Wikipedia's policy on article titles.Hallo all, since I think that now there is consensus about changing the name of the article, I propose to discuss candidates for the new name here and then to change it. Please give me a couple of days to have a look to the Italian bibliography about the subject in order to find a valid alternative. Alex2006 ( talk) 18:45, 29 August 2015 (UTC)
For whatever it's worth, the Italian article has since changed to "Fall of fascism", making the current 25 Luglio title even more awkward when it isn't even considered the main name in Italian. The only asterisk about using the Italian WP title is that it suggests a more final fall, when the Italian Social Republic would still exist. "Dismissal and arrest of Mussolini" still works IMO, as would perhaps "Overthrow of Mussolini" which would more clearly include events prior to July. Any thoughts? @ Srnec: @ Alessandro57: SnowFire ( talk) 01:43, 4 November 2016 (UTC)
Belated, but @ Alessandro57:, I think you should probably just move it yourself, since you did write the article originally, after all. I can file another RM if we want, but it seems everyone agrees that there are better terms than "25 Luglio", even in the original RM, but picking which one is hard. You should just flip a coin and pick one. SnowFire ( talk) 20:38, 30 November 2016 (UTC)
The English of the article is in bad need of an overhaul. Could a native speaker please do the job? Thanks.14:42, 24 December 2016 (UTC)
Why is there a description of the size and shape of the table the grand council met at and the chandelier in the room? This is totally irrelevant to the article. Maybe someone would want to know what Venezia had for dinner that night? Unless someone objects, I'm going to delete a lot of this needless prose. briardew ( talk) 21:52, 4 July 2017 (UTC)
Maybe to help set the tone for the situation? I don't know what rule it violates, and it's sourced. So removing it wouldn't serve much of a purpose. ShimonChai ( talk) 18:28, 24 July 2017 (UTC)
Struggling to come to terms with the concept of Mussolini as a shy man, I have replaced this text with material from another source, which carries the same sense. Clivemacd ( talk) 23:15, 18 July 2017 (UTC)
Howdy! I will be editing this article as part of a student project. Before doing so, I would like to outline what I plan to work on:
I also had a few questions: Are statements like the one about Hitler monologuing considered non-neutral? Also, does anyone know about the sources used for this article? Most of them are relatively old Italian books and I presume they are reliable, but the article might benefit from a source that is online or in English for the purpose of verifying information.
I plan to draft in my user sandbox, so feel free to check that out. Any major work I plan on doing I will outline on here first. Looking forward to working with you all Jordankelseyh ( talk) 19:05, 1 March 2019 (UTC)
Hello,
I wanted to see what everyone thought about renaming the section "Losers and done for". I think it should be renamed because the purpose of a heading is to provide a natural and precise description of what the following section is about. A heading also should not contain a citation (according to WP:MOS and WP:CS). For those who do not read the reference attached to the section name, "Losers and done for" would be lacking context, especially since it is not mentioned at any other point in the article or that section. If there is an appropriate spot within the article to discuss the phrase, it might make it a more appropriate header? I do think it is an interesting pun that is worth mentioning; I just don't know where.
The text in "Losers and done for" covers a large scope of information, so I had a hard time coming up with a potential name. The best I could come up with would be somewhere along the lines of "The Reich, the reign and militant government" or "Plans for Italy, the King, and Mussolini", both of which don't feel like the best rename but could be a step in the right direction. A good bulk of that section is about Germany moving forward with their plan to control Italy and about Grandi, so if anyone has any ideas for a name please let me know. Jordankelseyh ( talk) 23:18, 12 March 2019 (UTC)
This article still has room for improvement!
These are just things to think about when moving forward! Best of luck to those editing; it is a very thorough, well sourced article! Jordankelseyh ( talk) 20:17, 18 March 2019 (UTC)
A fact from Fall of the Fascist regime in Italy appeared on Wikipedia's
Main Page in the
Did you know column on 25 July 2013 (
check views). The text of the entry was as follows:
|
A fact from this article was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the On this day section on July 25, 2013. |
This article is rated B-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||
|
This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 13 February 2019 and 3 May 2019. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Jordankelseyh.
Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT ( talk) 21:03, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: no consensus. Jenks24 ( talk) 14:22, 13 August 2015 (UTC)
25 Luglio →
??? – "25 Luglio" is not the common name for this series of events in English historiography—or Italian, to my knowledge. A descriptive title would be better, perhaps
Grandi motion or
Fall of Mussolini.
Srnec (
talk) 02:00, 28 July 2015 (UTC) Relisted.
Jenks24 (
talk) 12:56, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: no consensus. Apologies for doing this again, but despite the level of support for the proposed title, the concern that this move would significantly narrow the article's scope is a serious one and it has not been addressed. This is an unusual step, having already had a recent RM, but I would say there should be no prejudice against a new RM discussing the merits of Alex2006's and Pincrete's proposed titles. Jenks24 ( talk) 16:52, 29 August 2015 (UTC)
25 Luglio →
Dismissal and arrest of Mussolini – "25 Luglio" is just a date. While some events are known primarily by their date, this isn't one of them (in English). Almost every instance of this Italian term in English comes in a citation to an Italian work. It is almost never used on its own as a
term of art. There is no evidence that it ever "denotes" several weeks' worth of events, as the intro claims. The Italian Wikipedia prefers
it:Ordine del giorno Grandi ("Grandi's order of the day").
Srnec (
talk) 19:02, 13 August 2015 (UTC) Relisted
Calidum 03:13, 21 August 2015 (UTC)
*'''Support'''
or *'''Oppose'''
, then sign your comment with ~~~~
. Since
polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account
Wikipedia's policy on article titles.Hallo all, since I think that now there is consensus about changing the name of the article, I propose to discuss candidates for the new name here and then to change it. Please give me a couple of days to have a look to the Italian bibliography about the subject in order to find a valid alternative. Alex2006 ( talk) 18:45, 29 August 2015 (UTC)
For whatever it's worth, the Italian article has since changed to "Fall of fascism", making the current 25 Luglio title even more awkward when it isn't even considered the main name in Italian. The only asterisk about using the Italian WP title is that it suggests a more final fall, when the Italian Social Republic would still exist. "Dismissal and arrest of Mussolini" still works IMO, as would perhaps "Overthrow of Mussolini" which would more clearly include events prior to July. Any thoughts? @ Srnec: @ Alessandro57: SnowFire ( talk) 01:43, 4 November 2016 (UTC)
Belated, but @ Alessandro57:, I think you should probably just move it yourself, since you did write the article originally, after all. I can file another RM if we want, but it seems everyone agrees that there are better terms than "25 Luglio", even in the original RM, but picking which one is hard. You should just flip a coin and pick one. SnowFire ( talk) 20:38, 30 November 2016 (UTC)
The English of the article is in bad need of an overhaul. Could a native speaker please do the job? Thanks.14:42, 24 December 2016 (UTC)
Why is there a description of the size and shape of the table the grand council met at and the chandelier in the room? This is totally irrelevant to the article. Maybe someone would want to know what Venezia had for dinner that night? Unless someone objects, I'm going to delete a lot of this needless prose. briardew ( talk) 21:52, 4 July 2017 (UTC)
Maybe to help set the tone for the situation? I don't know what rule it violates, and it's sourced. So removing it wouldn't serve much of a purpose. ShimonChai ( talk) 18:28, 24 July 2017 (UTC)
Struggling to come to terms with the concept of Mussolini as a shy man, I have replaced this text with material from another source, which carries the same sense. Clivemacd ( talk) 23:15, 18 July 2017 (UTC)
Howdy! I will be editing this article as part of a student project. Before doing so, I would like to outline what I plan to work on:
I also had a few questions: Are statements like the one about Hitler monologuing considered non-neutral? Also, does anyone know about the sources used for this article? Most of them are relatively old Italian books and I presume they are reliable, but the article might benefit from a source that is online or in English for the purpose of verifying information.
I plan to draft in my user sandbox, so feel free to check that out. Any major work I plan on doing I will outline on here first. Looking forward to working with you all Jordankelseyh ( talk) 19:05, 1 March 2019 (UTC)
Hello,
I wanted to see what everyone thought about renaming the section "Losers and done for". I think it should be renamed because the purpose of a heading is to provide a natural and precise description of what the following section is about. A heading also should not contain a citation (according to WP:MOS and WP:CS). For those who do not read the reference attached to the section name, "Losers and done for" would be lacking context, especially since it is not mentioned at any other point in the article or that section. If there is an appropriate spot within the article to discuss the phrase, it might make it a more appropriate header? I do think it is an interesting pun that is worth mentioning; I just don't know where.
The text in "Losers and done for" covers a large scope of information, so I had a hard time coming up with a potential name. The best I could come up with would be somewhere along the lines of "The Reich, the reign and militant government" or "Plans for Italy, the King, and Mussolini", both of which don't feel like the best rename but could be a step in the right direction. A good bulk of that section is about Germany moving forward with their plan to control Italy and about Grandi, so if anyone has any ideas for a name please let me know. Jordankelseyh ( talk) 23:18, 12 March 2019 (UTC)
This article still has room for improvement!
These are just things to think about when moving forward! Best of luck to those editing; it is a very thorough, well sourced article! Jordankelseyh ( talk) 20:17, 18 March 2019 (UTC)