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![]() | A fact from this article was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the On this day section on January 28, 2006, January 28, 2007, January 28, 2008, and January 28, 2010. |
Two articles, one on Gottlieb von Bellingshausen and one on Edward Bransfield, both claim the discovery of Antarctica for their protagonists. The two claims are apparently separated by only two days of real time, but even so, there ought to be some resolution of this question.
I am concerned that this article violates the NPOV criterion. While Bellingshausen did discover substantial parts of Antarctica, and may have been the first to sight the continent, this article does not make it plain that the priority is disputed and that Bransfield was sent as a result of the discovery of the South Shetland Islands (usually regarded as part of Antarctica) by Smith in February 1819. There is also the partisan statement (which I have corrected) that Bellingshausen discovered the South Shetland Islands, which he most certainly did not, although he visited them.
Incidentally, everyone forgets that Cook, although he did not sight the continent, confidently stated that it existed on the perfectly correct reasoning that the vast icebergs of the southern oceans must originate on a continent. -- APRCooper 20:05, 28 January 2006 (UTC)
The article states that Bellingshausen "discovered" the South Shetland Islands. This is certainly not so, as they were sighted by Capt. William Smith of the brig Williams in February 1819, before Bellingshausen left Portsmouth! The reference for this is the US and Chilean entries in the Composite Gazetteer of Antarctica ( [1]). They were visited by sealers in 1820. -- APRCooper 19:58, 28 January 2006 (UTC)
Weddell (interested in southward distance) mentions that Bellinghausen said "We continued our cruise to the south-east, sailing between large masses of ice; but, notwithstanding all our efforts, we never could pass the 70° of south latitude, and this only in one place. In all others, we could only advance 69½°." — Edinburgh Philosophical Journal, No. 23, p. 177. I don't know what else might be in Edinburgh Philosophical. ( SEWilco 07:33, 28 February 2007 (UTC))
There is in fact no list of open tasks at WikiProject Antarctica but this page should be high on it. The problems, however, are daunting and complicated, as contributors have noted above.
I did say it was complicated. On some of the simpler points above, Bellingshausen discovered six new islands in the South Shetlands, mainly because he surveyed their southern aspects more thoroughly than Bransfield was able to do. Weddell is not much help to us because there never was a volume 23 in the Edinburgh Philosophical Journal. And yes, Cook has often been treated rather badly by people who did not choose to notice that he said himself that "South Sandwich Land" could very well be a group of islands — as Bellingshausen showed later, or that he expressed his firm belief in the existence of land further south than he was able to sail, even adding at one point that he could well have seen it himself without recognizing what it was. But I'm afraid this continues to be one of those topics on which people hear only what they want to hear and read only what they want to read...
wouldnt he be Prussian? I mean there is no way he was Russian, just because he was born in an area which at that time belonged to the Russian Empire. Norum 08:58, 10 November 2011 (UTC)
Way to go, guys!
Instead of admitting that Bellingshausen was a Russian explorer of Baltic-German descent, you call him a "Baltic German!" Read the first paragraph of this article, you will only have a vague idea that he was actually first and foremost a Russian navy officer.
How about Joseph Stalin, he is not a Soviet dictator anymore, obviously he must be mentioned as "a Georgian politician in the head of the Soviet Union"? Hitler also should not be called a German dictator, he is "an Austrian politician who was the head of the Third Reich in 1933-1945"? And Martin Luther King was obviously not an American, but instead should be called a whatever-African-country his ancestors came from.
Baltic Germans constituted a large portion of the Russian Navy and military officers. In WWI, thousands of them died fighting Germany. For each of them, calling them "Germans" instead of "Russian officers" would be a disgrace, they would probably try to kill you in a duel for that. But today's generation of Wikipedia writers has no idea of such things as honour and valour. Wikipedia is turning more and more into a collection of trivia and politically biased nonsense, thanks to articles like this. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.196.187.179 ( talk) 16:39, 17 April 2016 (UTC)
The article notes (and the supporting reference confirms) that he visited Ship Cove in New Zealand during the time of the "First Russian Antarctic expedition". However, the map showing this expedition's track doesn't go to New Zealand. Can anyone explain this discrepancy? Ross Finlayson ( talk) 08:21, 5 October 2018 (UTC)
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![]() | A fact from this article was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the On this day section on January 28, 2006, January 28, 2007, January 28, 2008, and January 28, 2010. |
Two articles, one on Gottlieb von Bellingshausen and one on Edward Bransfield, both claim the discovery of Antarctica for their protagonists. The two claims are apparently separated by only two days of real time, but even so, there ought to be some resolution of this question.
I am concerned that this article violates the NPOV criterion. While Bellingshausen did discover substantial parts of Antarctica, and may have been the first to sight the continent, this article does not make it plain that the priority is disputed and that Bransfield was sent as a result of the discovery of the South Shetland Islands (usually regarded as part of Antarctica) by Smith in February 1819. There is also the partisan statement (which I have corrected) that Bellingshausen discovered the South Shetland Islands, which he most certainly did not, although he visited them.
Incidentally, everyone forgets that Cook, although he did not sight the continent, confidently stated that it existed on the perfectly correct reasoning that the vast icebergs of the southern oceans must originate on a continent. -- APRCooper 20:05, 28 January 2006 (UTC)
The article states that Bellingshausen "discovered" the South Shetland Islands. This is certainly not so, as they were sighted by Capt. William Smith of the brig Williams in February 1819, before Bellingshausen left Portsmouth! The reference for this is the US and Chilean entries in the Composite Gazetteer of Antarctica ( [1]). They were visited by sealers in 1820. -- APRCooper 19:58, 28 January 2006 (UTC)
Weddell (interested in southward distance) mentions that Bellinghausen said "We continued our cruise to the south-east, sailing between large masses of ice; but, notwithstanding all our efforts, we never could pass the 70° of south latitude, and this only in one place. In all others, we could only advance 69½°." — Edinburgh Philosophical Journal, No. 23, p. 177. I don't know what else might be in Edinburgh Philosophical. ( SEWilco 07:33, 28 February 2007 (UTC))
There is in fact no list of open tasks at WikiProject Antarctica but this page should be high on it. The problems, however, are daunting and complicated, as contributors have noted above.
I did say it was complicated. On some of the simpler points above, Bellingshausen discovered six new islands in the South Shetlands, mainly because he surveyed their southern aspects more thoroughly than Bransfield was able to do. Weddell is not much help to us because there never was a volume 23 in the Edinburgh Philosophical Journal. And yes, Cook has often been treated rather badly by people who did not choose to notice that he said himself that "South Sandwich Land" could very well be a group of islands — as Bellingshausen showed later, or that he expressed his firm belief in the existence of land further south than he was able to sail, even adding at one point that he could well have seen it himself without recognizing what it was. But I'm afraid this continues to be one of those topics on which people hear only what they want to hear and read only what they want to read...
wouldnt he be Prussian? I mean there is no way he was Russian, just because he was born in an area which at that time belonged to the Russian Empire. Norum 08:58, 10 November 2011 (UTC)
Way to go, guys!
Instead of admitting that Bellingshausen was a Russian explorer of Baltic-German descent, you call him a "Baltic German!" Read the first paragraph of this article, you will only have a vague idea that he was actually first and foremost a Russian navy officer.
How about Joseph Stalin, he is not a Soviet dictator anymore, obviously he must be mentioned as "a Georgian politician in the head of the Soviet Union"? Hitler also should not be called a German dictator, he is "an Austrian politician who was the head of the Third Reich in 1933-1945"? And Martin Luther King was obviously not an American, but instead should be called a whatever-African-country his ancestors came from.
Baltic Germans constituted a large portion of the Russian Navy and military officers. In WWI, thousands of them died fighting Germany. For each of them, calling them "Germans" instead of "Russian officers" would be a disgrace, they would probably try to kill you in a duel for that. But today's generation of Wikipedia writers has no idea of such things as honour and valour. Wikipedia is turning more and more into a collection of trivia and politically biased nonsense, thanks to articles like this. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.196.187.179 ( talk) 16:39, 17 April 2016 (UTC)
The article notes (and the supporting reference confirms) that he visited Ship Cove in New Zealand during the time of the "First Russian Antarctic expedition". However, the map showing this expedition's track doesn't go to New Zealand. Can anyone explain this discrepancy? Ross Finlayson ( talk) 08:21, 5 October 2018 (UTC)