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How did the European Communities act 1972 impact upon the UK legal system? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.64.87.123 ( talk) 16:03, 31 March 2019 (UTC)
Although the repeal of the Act would make the European Communities/Union Treaties unenforceable in United Kingdom law, the United Kingdom as a state would still be bound by its treaty obligations to the European Union; because the act of ratification of those treaties is very much seperate from the passage of this act. Rahowell ( talk) 21:26, 13 July 2008 (UTC)
I've removed the statement again. Please don't reference books that don't support the statement or class as definitive proof, I didn't enjoy having to go out and find the book in order to repeal a source when I should be doing that to add sources! Again, until a source that actually supports the statement is found, we'll stick to the facts. Also, try not to insult a me about facts concerning British constitutional law when you're creating information from thin air; Erroneous means there was error in the derision of a statement, whereas my comment is based upon reality and therefore not erroneous. So once again, British constitutional conventions do not bind any Government over and above the repealing of the Act of Parliament that makes the Treaty law. - Jimmi Hugh ( talk) 18:50, 2 June 2009 (UTC)
Can we please include more information about the passage of this app as there is no information about how the act came into being all its progression through both Houses of Parliament given its such a constitutionally important piece of legislation. ( 2A02:C7F:5621:2A00:2508:D7CA:1129:9615 ( talk) 09:07, 24 July 2017 (UTC))
Given that sources give 1 January 1973 as the date when the Act came into force, I think we need at least a citation and an explanatory footnote for the date 18 October 1972. The problem, as I understand it, is that the Act may have technically come into force the day after it received royal assent, but it "effectively" came into force with the treaty in January 1973. However, I couldn't find a source that explains this in citable form.
Some sources that give 1 January 1973 (and where that seems the sensible date to give in context):
So Parliament exercised its sovereignty and the European Communities Act 1972 came into force on 1 January 1973
In an ideal world, Parliament would have gone through every Act of Parliament that had been passed prior to 1 January 1973, the date on which the European Communities Act 1972 came into force, and amended it. Clearly, this was not possible ...
-- Boson ( talk) 10:22, 25 July 2017 (UTC)
I have expanded the article last night to include more information about the Act itself. ( MOTORAL1987 ( talk) 10:31, 27 July 2017 (UTC))
So what should we do about the commencement date? The current version has Commencement= "7 October 1972 (partly in force) 1 January 1973 (wholly in force)" However sure of that an editor may be, it is not as obvious as the sky is blue and is contradicted by sources, so we need a published source. Since it may be a matter of correct interpretation, an expert (published) secondary source would be preferable to a primary source. We have several reasonably reliable sources that give 1 January 1973 as the date that the act came into force, and that appears to be appropriate for most purposes, since it is the date that the relevant accession treaty came into force. On the other hand, we are not required to state things that are supported by sources when we have good reason to believe them to be untrue. Apart from anything else, the fact that the act itself states that specific sections come into force on 1 January 1973 strongly implies that that does not apply to all the provisions of the act (inclusio unius est exclusio alterius), but I'm not sure that we can explicitly state as fact something that relies on an editor's interpretation of the applicability of, say, the Interpretation Act 1978. But we still need a source for what we state explicitly. The date of the royal assent is given. The assumption that the act technically came into force on that date is of practically no encyclopedic relevance, and may mislead the reader (there is a reason that books give 1 January 1973). I would, therefore, suggest that we give the date of commencement as 1 January 1973, with a footnote stating that this is the date that the accession treaty came into force and the (explicit) date that certain provisions of the act came into force. That way we give the reader the relevant information but avoid making unqualified statements that cannot be sourced. If we found a reliable source that states explicitly that the other provisions all came into force on the date of royal assent, we could put that in the footnote, as well. So my suggestion is "Commencement: 1 January 1973 [1] [a]
Notes
References
So Parliament exercised its sovereignty and the European Communities Act 1972 came into force on 1 January 1973
-- Boson ( talk) 13:50, 1 August 2017 (UTC)
The text has recently been changed to state that the Act "... is binding on all [my emphasis] legislation passed by the Parliament of the United Kingdom...". This is unsourced and unexplained and would appear to rule out repeal of the Act by explicit legislation. I am inclined to revert the change, but perhaps someone has a suggestion (with references) that takes better account of parliamentary sovereignty, the supremacy of EU law, and the dualist approach.-- Boson ( talk) 23:16, 18 January 2018 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: consensus not to move the page to the proposed title at this time, per the discussion below. Dekimasu よ! 20:20, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
European Communities Act 1972 (UK) → European Communities Act 1972 – Most people know the ECA1972 that everyone talks about comes from the UK so there is no need for the (UK) as it is never confused with the Irish version of the Act especially as the Irish version has the (Ireland) written into its article however unlike the UK version it is far less contentious and less known. 2A02:C7F:5621:2A00:C6B:C7D:1681:99A6 ( talk) 07:07, 16 August 2018 (UTC)
What is the offical status of the Act going to be after Jan 31 then the UK has left the EU. The way I see it Legally the Act is repealed however the effect of the Act is being saved by a amendment the European Union (Withdrawal) Act 2018 until December 2020 so after Friday do we class the Act itself as “repealed” or “effect saved” as this is seems to be a unique status for a UK act of Parliament to be repealed yet still have legal force. ( MOTORAL1987 ( talk) 19:05, 27 January 2020 (UTC))
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How did the European Communities act 1972 impact upon the UK legal system? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.64.87.123 ( talk) 16:03, 31 March 2019 (UTC)
Although the repeal of the Act would make the European Communities/Union Treaties unenforceable in United Kingdom law, the United Kingdom as a state would still be bound by its treaty obligations to the European Union; because the act of ratification of those treaties is very much seperate from the passage of this act. Rahowell ( talk) 21:26, 13 July 2008 (UTC)
I've removed the statement again. Please don't reference books that don't support the statement or class as definitive proof, I didn't enjoy having to go out and find the book in order to repeal a source when I should be doing that to add sources! Again, until a source that actually supports the statement is found, we'll stick to the facts. Also, try not to insult a me about facts concerning British constitutional law when you're creating information from thin air; Erroneous means there was error in the derision of a statement, whereas my comment is based upon reality and therefore not erroneous. So once again, British constitutional conventions do not bind any Government over and above the repealing of the Act of Parliament that makes the Treaty law. - Jimmi Hugh ( talk) 18:50, 2 June 2009 (UTC)
Can we please include more information about the passage of this app as there is no information about how the act came into being all its progression through both Houses of Parliament given its such a constitutionally important piece of legislation. ( 2A02:C7F:5621:2A00:2508:D7CA:1129:9615 ( talk) 09:07, 24 July 2017 (UTC))
Given that sources give 1 January 1973 as the date when the Act came into force, I think we need at least a citation and an explanatory footnote for the date 18 October 1972. The problem, as I understand it, is that the Act may have technically come into force the day after it received royal assent, but it "effectively" came into force with the treaty in January 1973. However, I couldn't find a source that explains this in citable form.
Some sources that give 1 January 1973 (and where that seems the sensible date to give in context):
So Parliament exercised its sovereignty and the European Communities Act 1972 came into force on 1 January 1973
In an ideal world, Parliament would have gone through every Act of Parliament that had been passed prior to 1 January 1973, the date on which the European Communities Act 1972 came into force, and amended it. Clearly, this was not possible ...
-- Boson ( talk) 10:22, 25 July 2017 (UTC)
I have expanded the article last night to include more information about the Act itself. ( MOTORAL1987 ( talk) 10:31, 27 July 2017 (UTC))
So what should we do about the commencement date? The current version has Commencement= "7 October 1972 (partly in force) 1 January 1973 (wholly in force)" However sure of that an editor may be, it is not as obvious as the sky is blue and is contradicted by sources, so we need a published source. Since it may be a matter of correct interpretation, an expert (published) secondary source would be preferable to a primary source. We have several reasonably reliable sources that give 1 January 1973 as the date that the act came into force, and that appears to be appropriate for most purposes, since it is the date that the relevant accession treaty came into force. On the other hand, we are not required to state things that are supported by sources when we have good reason to believe them to be untrue. Apart from anything else, the fact that the act itself states that specific sections come into force on 1 January 1973 strongly implies that that does not apply to all the provisions of the act (inclusio unius est exclusio alterius), but I'm not sure that we can explicitly state as fact something that relies on an editor's interpretation of the applicability of, say, the Interpretation Act 1978. But we still need a source for what we state explicitly. The date of the royal assent is given. The assumption that the act technically came into force on that date is of practically no encyclopedic relevance, and may mislead the reader (there is a reason that books give 1 January 1973). I would, therefore, suggest that we give the date of commencement as 1 January 1973, with a footnote stating that this is the date that the accession treaty came into force and the (explicit) date that certain provisions of the act came into force. That way we give the reader the relevant information but avoid making unqualified statements that cannot be sourced. If we found a reliable source that states explicitly that the other provisions all came into force on the date of royal assent, we could put that in the footnote, as well. So my suggestion is "Commencement: 1 January 1973 [1] [a]
Notes
References
So Parliament exercised its sovereignty and the European Communities Act 1972 came into force on 1 January 1973
-- Boson ( talk) 13:50, 1 August 2017 (UTC)
The text has recently been changed to state that the Act "... is binding on all [my emphasis] legislation passed by the Parliament of the United Kingdom...". This is unsourced and unexplained and would appear to rule out repeal of the Act by explicit legislation. I am inclined to revert the change, but perhaps someone has a suggestion (with references) that takes better account of parliamentary sovereignty, the supremacy of EU law, and the dualist approach.-- Boson ( talk) 23:16, 18 January 2018 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: consensus not to move the page to the proposed title at this time, per the discussion below. Dekimasu よ! 20:20, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
European Communities Act 1972 (UK) → European Communities Act 1972 – Most people know the ECA1972 that everyone talks about comes from the UK so there is no need for the (UK) as it is never confused with the Irish version of the Act especially as the Irish version has the (Ireland) written into its article however unlike the UK version it is far less contentious and less known. 2A02:C7F:5621:2A00:C6B:C7D:1681:99A6 ( talk) 07:07, 16 August 2018 (UTC)
What is the offical status of the Act going to be after Jan 31 then the UK has left the EU. The way I see it Legally the Act is repealed however the effect of the Act is being saved by a amendment the European Union (Withdrawal) Act 2018 until December 2020 so after Friday do we class the Act itself as “repealed” or “effect saved” as this is seems to be a unique status for a UK act of Parliament to be repealed yet still have legal force. ( MOTORAL1987 ( talk) 19:05, 27 January 2020 (UTC))