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![]() | This article was nominated for merging with vulture fund on 7 August 2014. The result of the discussion was move vulture fund to distressed equity fund. |
"Known Distressed Funds" seems inappropriate, unless someone is prepared to keep it up-to-date. There also appears to be no cited basis for these. I'll remove this in a few days unless anyone has a different POV. Martin 12:45, 25 January 2007 (UTC) Agreed —Preceding unsigned comment added by Huntingtonjbear ( talk • contribs) 01:46, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
Can anyone provide a reference to the statement that distressed credit instruments provide higher yields than their riskyness warrants? Zain Ebrahim 11:29, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
I cleaned up a few things here and there; mostly cosmetics. I do, however, see at least 2 things that need to be cited and/or rewarded. Perhaps, most troubling is the following sentence:
Historically, distressed securities have traded at deep discounts to a rational assessment of their risk-adjusted value <...> This has led to above average returns (adjusted for risk) from investors in this asset class.
One can certainly make an argument that much of stressed/distressed/defaulted debt trades at a discount to its "intrinsic value" and many active players in the market have produced notorious risk-adjusted returns. However, when one looks at some broad market proxies (Altman-Salomon index is one; I think Merrill Lynch have an index of their own too), the picture is not particularly rosy. Altman's numbers (I linked to the report in the article) imply an abysmally low Sharpe ratio. And what are these "average returns" anyway that the author claims distressed securities beat?
Secondly, is there any data available on the capital raised in this space in recent years? I certainly catch a lot of hearsay, but I have yet to see some hard numbers. Index capitalization doesn't cut it - since we just entered what appears to be a vicious credit cycle, spreads haven't yet widened tremendously and corporate credit hasn't started defaulting in massive amounts like in 2002. The actual "market" now is actually smaller than it was in, say, '98... Agorboun 03:50, 5 September 2007 (UTC)
Why is this article called Distressed Securities which is limited subset of Distressed Debt? Distressed debt which consists of junk bonds, as well as distressed securities and any other distressed asset, is not limited to "securities"... This article really needs to be enlarged to encompass a genuine financial topic rather than this esoteric article... Stevenmitchell ( talk) 02:20, 27 February 2011 (UTC)
I propose that vulture fund be merged and redirected into distressed securities. Merging the vulture fund page with distressed securities will not make the new page too long nor will any material be lost in transition. Rather the being too long, the proposed merge will properly expand the distressed securities page to include other types of distressed debt mentioned by Stevenmitchell in the above comment, and discussed on the vulture fund talk page. Comatmebro ~Come at me~ 00:04, 7 August 2014 (UTC)
I support this as interim step, subject to the conditions previously noted on talk:vulture fund and with the caveat that I intend to spin out a separate article at some stage covering the earlier history of the term. Jonathan A Jones ( talk) 10:30, 8 August 2014 (UTC)
I propose that distressed securities fund be merged into distressed securities. Most of the content in the distressed securities fund article overlaps with the content in the distressed securities page. A merge between the two pages will create one, concise, detailed article rather than having two separate articles sharing similar content. Because most of the content overlaps, a merge will not make the distressed securities article too long or cause any issues. Comatmebro ~Come at me~ 14:19, 12 September 2014 (UTC)
![]() | This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||
|
![]() | This article was nominated for merging with vulture fund on 7 August 2014. The result of the discussion was move vulture fund to distressed equity fund. |
"Known Distressed Funds" seems inappropriate, unless someone is prepared to keep it up-to-date. There also appears to be no cited basis for these. I'll remove this in a few days unless anyone has a different POV. Martin 12:45, 25 January 2007 (UTC) Agreed —Preceding unsigned comment added by Huntingtonjbear ( talk • contribs) 01:46, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
Can anyone provide a reference to the statement that distressed credit instruments provide higher yields than their riskyness warrants? Zain Ebrahim 11:29, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
I cleaned up a few things here and there; mostly cosmetics. I do, however, see at least 2 things that need to be cited and/or rewarded. Perhaps, most troubling is the following sentence:
Historically, distressed securities have traded at deep discounts to a rational assessment of their risk-adjusted value <...> This has led to above average returns (adjusted for risk) from investors in this asset class.
One can certainly make an argument that much of stressed/distressed/defaulted debt trades at a discount to its "intrinsic value" and many active players in the market have produced notorious risk-adjusted returns. However, when one looks at some broad market proxies (Altman-Salomon index is one; I think Merrill Lynch have an index of their own too), the picture is not particularly rosy. Altman's numbers (I linked to the report in the article) imply an abysmally low Sharpe ratio. And what are these "average returns" anyway that the author claims distressed securities beat?
Secondly, is there any data available on the capital raised in this space in recent years? I certainly catch a lot of hearsay, but I have yet to see some hard numbers. Index capitalization doesn't cut it - since we just entered what appears to be a vicious credit cycle, spreads haven't yet widened tremendously and corporate credit hasn't started defaulting in massive amounts like in 2002. The actual "market" now is actually smaller than it was in, say, '98... Agorboun 03:50, 5 September 2007 (UTC)
Why is this article called Distressed Securities which is limited subset of Distressed Debt? Distressed debt which consists of junk bonds, as well as distressed securities and any other distressed asset, is not limited to "securities"... This article really needs to be enlarged to encompass a genuine financial topic rather than this esoteric article... Stevenmitchell ( talk) 02:20, 27 February 2011 (UTC)
I propose that vulture fund be merged and redirected into distressed securities. Merging the vulture fund page with distressed securities will not make the new page too long nor will any material be lost in transition. Rather the being too long, the proposed merge will properly expand the distressed securities page to include other types of distressed debt mentioned by Stevenmitchell in the above comment, and discussed on the vulture fund talk page. Comatmebro ~Come at me~ 00:04, 7 August 2014 (UTC)
I support this as interim step, subject to the conditions previously noted on talk:vulture fund and with the caveat that I intend to spin out a separate article at some stage covering the earlier history of the term. Jonathan A Jones ( talk) 10:30, 8 August 2014 (UTC)
I propose that distressed securities fund be merged into distressed securities. Most of the content in the distressed securities fund article overlaps with the content in the distressed securities page. A merge between the two pages will create one, concise, detailed article rather than having two separate articles sharing similar content. Because most of the content overlaps, a merge will not make the distressed securities article too long or cause any issues. Comatmebro ~Come at me~ 14:19, 12 September 2014 (UTC)