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Digimon Adventure (1999 TV series) article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
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 | On 11 August 2023, it was proposed that this article be moved from Digimon Adventure to Digimon Adventure (1999 TV series). The result of the discussion was moved. |
| On 10 January 2024, it was proposed that this article be moved to Digimon: Digital Monsters (1999 TV series). The result of the discussion was not moved. |
Existentialism is touched on a great deal in the first and second seasons of Digimon. Could somebody install a section on this please?
- The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
The result of the move request was: not moved. ( closed by non-admin page mover) NmWTfs85lXusaybq ( talk) 02:27, 17 January 2024 (UTC)
Digimon Adventure (1999 TV series) → Digimon: Digital Monsters (1999 TV series) – The title of this page should be changed to the english title of the show which is Digimon: Digital Monsters. I found the old discussion concerning this and the consensus was nobody knew why the page wasn't Digimon: Digital Monsters other than it might create less confusion with the franchise page. That is no longer the case since the franchise page is just called "Digimon" and with the release of the new Digimon Adventure show this page being Digimon Adventure creates more confusion since wikipedia does not redirect to this page when Digimon Digital Monsters is put into the search nor does it redirect to the franchise page nor does it redirect to the new show page.
Using Wikipedia guidance on Artitle titles [1]. Digimon's first season was in a pre-internet time and the kids from that time would know that season best as "Digimon: Digital Monsters" especially if they did not keep up with the franchise which means that Digital Monsters will be the name that is recognised most by someone with knowledge but not an expert. Digital Monsters is the title that most people are looking for and the one that it is actually called. You can see this when you look for physical releases of this season and in the analytics for the page since the move as whilst they are still close this page has more hits. Since the removal of Digital Monsters from the franchise page having the season be called Digimon: Digital Monsters would set it apart from other parts of the franchise. This would create distinction between all of the series' and it would provide consistency with other anime shows on wikipedia by using their original release title and the name of the physical releases in the english speaking world.
— Preceding unsigned comment added by LeggoRing ( talk • contribs) 23:49, 9 January 2024 (UTC)
- Note: WikiProject Anime and manga has been notified of this discussion. Vanderwaalforces ( talk) 06:30, 10 January 2024 (UTC)
- Oppose No proof given that this is the current
WP:COMMONNAME. The argument is based on personal assumptions without evidence.
ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (
ᴛ)
13:12, 10 January 2024 (UTC)
- IMDB: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0210418/
- TVDB: https://thetvdb.com/series/digimon-digital-monsters
- TMDB: /tv/31654
- Toei Animation DVD Release:
https://www.animebluray.co.uk/Home/Product/218
LeggoRing (
talk)
14:45, 10 January 2024 (UTC)
- Those are directory listings, not proof of a common name used in everyday discussions about the series. For example,
this article calls it "Digimon Adventure", seeming to contradict the claim that "Digimon: Digital Monsters" is more common.
This article also calls it "Digimon Adventure". I have my doubts that proof that "Digimon: Digital Monsters" is the common name will surface.
ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (
ᴛ)
18:21, 10 January 2024 (UTC)
- Digimon Adventure is the translation of the original japanese and this page has always been called Digimon Adventure. Is this wikipedia influencing culture through this fact? Or the fact that in more recent times less and less shows are being translated with altered names.
- Or think about whether this page is about Digimon Adventure the japanese show or Digimon: Digital Monsters the english translation. Episodes are named in their dubbed name first, which means the page is about Digital Monsters but people call the show Digimon Adventure which is the subbed version of the show.
- This person calls it the "English version" and then talks about the differences between them.
- This person who is asking about the show but is not an expert calls it Digimon: Digital Monsters
- Here is an archive calling it Digital Monsters.
- Digital Monsters refers to the English dub of the show which according all the information surrounding this page that is what this page is referring to as all the names for digimon on the characters pages are called by their english names instead of their japanese ones.
LeggoRing (
talk)
19:49, 10 January 2024 (UTC)
- Whether Wikipedia has influenced culture or not, now is not the time to WP:RIGHTGREATWRONGS if that is truly the case. The cultural influence has already happened and that is the common name. Wikipedia still has to follow it.
- User posts rather than journalist articles don't really indicate anything, since anyone can write them.
ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (
ᴛ)
03:42, 15 January 2024 (UTC)
- This article calls the dub Digital Monsters
- Here we have another review calling the dub Digital Monsters.
- Here is a blu ray tracker showing that its called Digital Monsters.
- Common sense media also calls it Digital Monsters
- and here is the official announcement for the blu ray release calling the english dub Digital Monsters
- In the other direction here is Bandai selling toys under Digimon Adventure with their Japanese names first
- Whilst its not the time to right those wrongs. WP:Commonname is what seems to be subject of debate but Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Anime and manga#Article names and disambiguation that if there are multiple official titles then "use the one that is best known and that has contributed most to the work's becoming known in the broader English-speaking world" and considering this series lead the franchise to the west I believe that Digimon: Digital Monsters contributed to it being known more in the west rather than the japanese dub in 1999.
- Then we have the ambiguity of Digimon Adventure which could refer to this page OR Digimon Adventure 02 Digimon Adventure (2020 TV series) Digimon Adventure tri. Digimon Adventure (film) Digimon Adventure (video game) and that's without the stuff that also uses the Adventure franchise name. Yet [ Digimon: Digital Monsters] redirects to the main Digimon franchise page which would help it stand out from all the other pages. LeggoRing ( talk) 18:37, 15 January 2024 (UTC)
- Those are directory listings, not proof of a common name used in everyday discussions about the series. For example,
this article calls it "Digimon Adventure", seeming to contradict the claim that "Digimon: Digital Monsters" is more common.
This article also calls it "Digimon Adventure". I have my doubts that proof that "Digimon: Digital Monsters" is the common name will surface.
ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (
ᴛ)
18:21, 10 January 2024 (UTC)
- Comment: I understand
WP:OFFICIAL and
WP:USEENGLISH, but this would also affect
Digimon Adventure 02,
Digimon Tamers, and
Digimon Frontier, because they were released as different seasons of Digimon: Digital Monsters.
lullabying (
talk)
03:49, 11 January 2024 (UTC)
- I think tamers and frontier will require editing to correct them but WP:COMMONNAME since the marketing calls those season 3 of the show but they are still heavily pushed officially and in english as Tamers/Frontier. Adventure 02 is more of an issue since that is the translated name and even Discotek when referring to the dub version of Digimon Adventure 02 calls it Season 2 LeggoRing ( talk) 10:49, 12 January 2024 (UTC)
- Oppose – Per @
Zxcvbnm. Even on MyAnimeList the main name is Digimon Adventures. Both nomenclatures are correct, so it makes more sense to keep the most used one.
Svartner (
talk)
00:04, 15 January 2024 (UTC)
- MyAnimeList is not a reliable source per WP:ANIME/RS. lullabying ( talk) 01:54, 15 January 2024 (UTC)
- Oppose because there is no clear indication that it is a more common name among English speakers (which also include non-native English speakers, which often prefer e.g. original Japanese sound with English subtitles over the English dub). If there it not clear which title might be more common, or if they are roughly equally common, then in would make more sense to use the original title, which also happens to be more
WP:CONCISE. Finally, the article is not about the English dub, so it would make sense for its title to reflect that.
Niokog (
talk)
12:29, 15 January 2024 (UTC)
- If the article isn't about the english dub then why are the english dub names used for everything except the name of the series. If the article is about the japanese series then it should be made clear that that is the case by making sure that all of the media attached to the page are as well as all names of characters have their original japanese names first.
LeggoRing (
talk)
17:05, 15 January 2024 (UTC)
- Choice of character names is a separate topic, which could also be separately discussed, but its current state should not be used as an argument for the choice of the article title because that would be similar to WP:OTHERSTUFF arguments. Besides that, while content in the plot section seems to use exclusively names and terms from the American dub, content in the media section seems to be more focused on Japanese content, so even the article itself might not be entirely "consistent" in that respect. Niokog ( talk) 09:48, 16 January 2024 (UTC)
- If the article isn't about the english dub then why are the english dub names used for everything except the name of the series. If the article is about the japanese series then it should be made clear that that is the case by making sure that all of the media attached to the page are as well as all names of characters have their original japanese names first.
LeggoRing (
talk)
17:05, 15 January 2024 (UTC)
I've cleaned up the article and made it more in-line with other pages. I've removed most links to the films and such since they have their own page. I removed the CDs and mangas since the content was small and 20 years ago it probably belongs on a Digimon focused wiki. I've made it clearer about where Digimon: Digital Monsters sits and added links about season 2,3 and 4 linking to 02, Frontier and Tamers. I've did a plot cleanup and the page looks less like the fandom wiki for Digimon Adventure. The plot is probably too tight and needs to be expanded out with links to the character pages. The actual manga should be mentioned as well. LeggoRing ( talk) 22:47, 18 January 2024 (UTC)
I know its controversial in the Digimon sphere to refer to Tamers/Frontier as Season 3 and 4 of Digimon but it was licensed and released as such and should be mentioned within the article somewhere. All western home releases of Tamers and Frontier refer to it as Season 3 and 4 including the ones referenced in the article so please don't remove the references to these releases without discussion. LeggoRing ( talk) 09:06, 19 January 2024 (UTC)
- No need for that in this article, even more when those titles are not even mentioned in the respective articles, and you didn't provide any source for that names (where they should be cited at least), so I don't get which are the references that you're saying shouldn't be removed. Xexerss ( talk) 13:59, 19 January 2024 (UTC)
- "References" refers to sources in this context, and even though Tamers and Frontier were released as seasons 3 and 4, it seems like Digimon Adventure is about season 1 only. Even then, you mentioned every single Digimon animated series which isn't necessary and aren't marketed under the Digimon: Digital Monsters title in the West. In addition, the information you mentioned is better included on Digimon, not Digimon Adventure. lullabying ( talk) 05:27, 20 January 2024 (UTC)
| This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Digimon Adventure (1999 TV series) article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
| Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
|
Archives:
1Auto-archiving period: 280 days
|
|
| This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||
| ||||||||||||||
| On 11 August 2023, it was proposed that this article be moved from Digimon Adventure to Digimon Adventure (1999 TV series). The result of the discussion was moved. |
| On 10 January 2024, it was proposed that this article be moved to Digimon: Digital Monsters (1999 TV series). The result of the discussion was not moved. |
Existentialism is touched on a great deal in the first and second seasons of Digimon. Could somebody install a section on this please?
- The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
The result of the move request was: not moved. ( closed by non-admin page mover) NmWTfs85lXusaybq ( talk) 02:27, 17 January 2024 (UTC)
Digimon Adventure (1999 TV series) → Digimon: Digital Monsters (1999 TV series) – The title of this page should be changed to the english title of the show which is Digimon: Digital Monsters. I found the old discussion concerning this and the consensus was nobody knew why the page wasn't Digimon: Digital Monsters other than it might create less confusion with the franchise page. That is no longer the case since the franchise page is just called "Digimon" and with the release of the new Digimon Adventure show this page being Digimon Adventure creates more confusion since wikipedia does not redirect to this page when Digimon Digital Monsters is put into the search nor does it redirect to the franchise page nor does it redirect to the new show page.
Using Wikipedia guidance on Artitle titles [1]. Digimon's first season was in a pre-internet time and the kids from that time would know that season best as "Digimon: Digital Monsters" especially if they did not keep up with the franchise which means that Digital Monsters will be the name that is recognised most by someone with knowledge but not an expert. Digital Monsters is the title that most people are looking for and the one that it is actually called. You can see this when you look for physical releases of this season and in the analytics for the page since the move as whilst they are still close this page has more hits. Since the removal of Digital Monsters from the franchise page having the season be called Digimon: Digital Monsters would set it apart from other parts of the franchise. This would create distinction between all of the series' and it would provide consistency with other anime shows on wikipedia by using their original release title and the name of the physical releases in the english speaking world.
— Preceding unsigned comment added by LeggoRing ( talk • contribs) 23:49, 9 January 2024 (UTC)
- Note: WikiProject Anime and manga has been notified of this discussion. Vanderwaalforces ( talk) 06:30, 10 January 2024 (UTC)
- Oppose No proof given that this is the current
WP:COMMONNAME. The argument is based on personal assumptions without evidence.
ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (
ᴛ)
13:12, 10 January 2024 (UTC)
- IMDB: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0210418/
- TVDB: https://thetvdb.com/series/digimon-digital-monsters
- TMDB: /tv/31654
- Toei Animation DVD Release:
https://www.animebluray.co.uk/Home/Product/218
LeggoRing (
talk)
14:45, 10 January 2024 (UTC)
- Those are directory listings, not proof of a common name used in everyday discussions about the series. For example,
this article calls it "Digimon Adventure", seeming to contradict the claim that "Digimon: Digital Monsters" is more common.
This article also calls it "Digimon Adventure". I have my doubts that proof that "Digimon: Digital Monsters" is the common name will surface.
ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (
ᴛ)
18:21, 10 January 2024 (UTC)
- Digimon Adventure is the translation of the original japanese and this page has always been called Digimon Adventure. Is this wikipedia influencing culture through this fact? Or the fact that in more recent times less and less shows are being translated with altered names.
- Or think about whether this page is about Digimon Adventure the japanese show or Digimon: Digital Monsters the english translation. Episodes are named in their dubbed name first, which means the page is about Digital Monsters but people call the show Digimon Adventure which is the subbed version of the show.
- This person calls it the "English version" and then talks about the differences between them.
- This person who is asking about the show but is not an expert calls it Digimon: Digital Monsters
- Here is an archive calling it Digital Monsters.
- Digital Monsters refers to the English dub of the show which according all the information surrounding this page that is what this page is referring to as all the names for digimon on the characters pages are called by their english names instead of their japanese ones.
LeggoRing (
talk)
19:49, 10 January 2024 (UTC)
- Whether Wikipedia has influenced culture or not, now is not the time to WP:RIGHTGREATWRONGS if that is truly the case. The cultural influence has already happened and that is the common name. Wikipedia still has to follow it.
- User posts rather than journalist articles don't really indicate anything, since anyone can write them.
ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (
ᴛ)
03:42, 15 January 2024 (UTC)
- This article calls the dub Digital Monsters
- Here we have another review calling the dub Digital Monsters.
- Here is a blu ray tracker showing that its called Digital Monsters.
- Common sense media also calls it Digital Monsters
- and here is the official announcement for the blu ray release calling the english dub Digital Monsters
- In the other direction here is Bandai selling toys under Digimon Adventure with their Japanese names first
- Whilst its not the time to right those wrongs. WP:Commonname is what seems to be subject of debate but Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Anime and manga#Article names and disambiguation that if there are multiple official titles then "use the one that is best known and that has contributed most to the work's becoming known in the broader English-speaking world" and considering this series lead the franchise to the west I believe that Digimon: Digital Monsters contributed to it being known more in the west rather than the japanese dub in 1999.
- Then we have the ambiguity of Digimon Adventure which could refer to this page OR Digimon Adventure 02 Digimon Adventure (2020 TV series) Digimon Adventure tri. Digimon Adventure (film) Digimon Adventure (video game) and that's without the stuff that also uses the Adventure franchise name. Yet [ Digimon: Digital Monsters] redirects to the main Digimon franchise page which would help it stand out from all the other pages. LeggoRing ( talk) 18:37, 15 January 2024 (UTC)
- Those are directory listings, not proof of a common name used in everyday discussions about the series. For example,
this article calls it "Digimon Adventure", seeming to contradict the claim that "Digimon: Digital Monsters" is more common.
This article also calls it "Digimon Adventure". I have my doubts that proof that "Digimon: Digital Monsters" is the common name will surface.
ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (
ᴛ)
18:21, 10 January 2024 (UTC)
- Comment: I understand
WP:OFFICIAL and
WP:USEENGLISH, but this would also affect
Digimon Adventure 02,
Digimon Tamers, and
Digimon Frontier, because they were released as different seasons of Digimon: Digital Monsters.
lullabying (
talk)
03:49, 11 January 2024 (UTC)
- I think tamers and frontier will require editing to correct them but WP:COMMONNAME since the marketing calls those season 3 of the show but they are still heavily pushed officially and in english as Tamers/Frontier. Adventure 02 is more of an issue since that is the translated name and even Discotek when referring to the dub version of Digimon Adventure 02 calls it Season 2 LeggoRing ( talk) 10:49, 12 January 2024 (UTC)
- Oppose – Per @
Zxcvbnm. Even on MyAnimeList the main name is Digimon Adventures. Both nomenclatures are correct, so it makes more sense to keep the most used one.
Svartner (
talk)
00:04, 15 January 2024 (UTC)
- MyAnimeList is not a reliable source per WP:ANIME/RS. lullabying ( talk) 01:54, 15 January 2024 (UTC)
- Oppose because there is no clear indication that it is a more common name among English speakers (which also include non-native English speakers, which often prefer e.g. original Japanese sound with English subtitles over the English dub). If there it not clear which title might be more common, or if they are roughly equally common, then in would make more sense to use the original title, which also happens to be more
WP:CONCISE. Finally, the article is not about the English dub, so it would make sense for its title to reflect that.
Niokog (
talk)
12:29, 15 January 2024 (UTC)
- If the article isn't about the english dub then why are the english dub names used for everything except the name of the series. If the article is about the japanese series then it should be made clear that that is the case by making sure that all of the media attached to the page are as well as all names of characters have their original japanese names first.
LeggoRing (
talk)
17:05, 15 January 2024 (UTC)
- Choice of character names is a separate topic, which could also be separately discussed, but its current state should not be used as an argument for the choice of the article title because that would be similar to WP:OTHERSTUFF arguments. Besides that, while content in the plot section seems to use exclusively names and terms from the American dub, content in the media section seems to be more focused on Japanese content, so even the article itself might not be entirely "consistent" in that respect. Niokog ( talk) 09:48, 16 January 2024 (UTC)
- If the article isn't about the english dub then why are the english dub names used for everything except the name of the series. If the article is about the japanese series then it should be made clear that that is the case by making sure that all of the media attached to the page are as well as all names of characters have their original japanese names first.
LeggoRing (
talk)
17:05, 15 January 2024 (UTC)
I've cleaned up the article and made it more in-line with other pages. I've removed most links to the films and such since they have their own page. I removed the CDs and mangas since the content was small and 20 years ago it probably belongs on a Digimon focused wiki. I've made it clearer about where Digimon: Digital Monsters sits and added links about season 2,3 and 4 linking to 02, Frontier and Tamers. I've did a plot cleanup and the page looks less like the fandom wiki for Digimon Adventure. The plot is probably too tight and needs to be expanded out with links to the character pages. The actual manga should be mentioned as well. LeggoRing ( talk) 22:47, 18 January 2024 (UTC)
I know its controversial in the Digimon sphere to refer to Tamers/Frontier as Season 3 and 4 of Digimon but it was licensed and released as such and should be mentioned within the article somewhere. All western home releases of Tamers and Frontier refer to it as Season 3 and 4 including the ones referenced in the article so please don't remove the references to these releases without discussion. LeggoRing ( talk) 09:06, 19 January 2024 (UTC)
- No need for that in this article, even more when those titles are not even mentioned in the respective articles, and you didn't provide any source for that names (where they should be cited at least), so I don't get which are the references that you're saying shouldn't be removed. Xexerss ( talk) 13:59, 19 January 2024 (UTC)
- "References" refers to sources in this context, and even though Tamers and Frontier were released as seasons 3 and 4, it seems like Digimon Adventure is about season 1 only. Even then, you mentioned every single Digimon animated series which isn't necessary and aren't marketed under the Digimon: Digital Monsters title in the West. In addition, the information you mentioned is better included on Digimon, not Digimon Adventure. lullabying ( talk) 05:27, 20 January 2024 (UTC)