![]() | This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Hey Larry, thanks for the excellent link
Dejima also serves a fictional role as a man-made island and home to refugees in the world of Ghost in the Shell: 2nd Gig, who grow to become separatist due to elaborate circumstances.
--
This is going to seem like a stupid question, but if the Dutch couldn't leave Dejima to go to Nagasaki, and the Japanese generally couldn't go to Dejima (other than prostitutes), how did the two peoples' trade?
In contrast to daimyo, the Japanese delegation traveled to Edo yearly between 1660 and 1790 and once every four years thereafter.
I suppose this is "Dutch" instead of "Japanese". David.Monniaux 11:49, 26 October 2005 (UTC)
The claim that the Japanese couldn't go to the island is restricted to "regular Japanese". The government still had a steady contingent of officials (who would conduct trade), staff, cooks and the like on the island. These people were all hand-picked and thoroughly checked for loyalty to the shogunate, so as not to reveal any, even the most trivial, data about the Japan of the time. In itself, the claim that only prostitutes were allowed to freely enter and leave the island seems a bit absurd. If every Japanese that had access to the island was severly checked, why would the government allow just about any prostitute from the street to enter? Would this not make all the background checks of every other Japanese on the island futile? If anybody, a prostitute would be expected to spill information that the shogunate was so desperate to conceal. No, in my opinion, the prostitutes themselves were "part of the staff", and I would imagine just as thoroughly checked for loyalty as any other Japanese on the island. So claiming that the prostitutes on the island were part of the regular populace seems like cleansing of a historical truth - that the prostitutes were probably there on official shogunate business, as much as the government officials. 213.172.254.119 08:47, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
The article on Engelbert Kaempfer says he is a German physician, not Dutch. Should this be changed? -- Lost-theory 04:37, 29 January 2007 (UTC)
Do we need this gigantic list? I think it belongs in another article, say List of Dutch Captains who landed at Dejima? - Amake 07:30, 2 August 2007 (UTC)
I don't see how Dejima could be understood to have been a Portugese colony; but if there were some source which supported that perceived construct, the discovery would be a real eye-opener. Frankly, I'd rather be wrong than right on this one. Bluedenim added Dejima to the category of Former Portuguese colonies; and I reverted that edit.
In the undo-edit summary, I invited further discussion here. -- Ooperhoofd 17:48, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
Given this article's historical interest, I wanted to know if I was looking at images created at the same time or later than events, so added dates to them. I think it's important for accuracy in an article of this type. Also, in the same way, it may be appropriate to label the images from Malaysia, for instance. The clothing of the Chinese in 1880 likely is not the same as what people would have seen in the early 19th c. at Dejima. Interesting photos, images and topic. Although the governors of Dejima have apparently had pages written about them, so they are blue-linked, perhaps the list could be simplified by using only the years of their tenure here, rather than including days and months, since the more detailed information can be found elsewhere. All those numbers seem too much. Parkwells ( talk) 19:49, 30 May 2011 (UTC) ,
What in the world does the 1880s Malaysian picture of the Fujianese worker and the Chinese-costumed official have to do with this article at all? I don't see the link to Dejima. Grasping at straws, the Japanese did occupy Malaysia for a time in the 1940s but there was no Japanese presence in Malaysia in 1880 except for about a hundred workers. This may be mislabeled or misplaced. (Just noticed in passing - I don't have enough expertise to be certain one way or the other)
![]() | This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Hey Larry, thanks for the excellent link
Dejima also serves a fictional role as a man-made island and home to refugees in the world of Ghost in the Shell: 2nd Gig, who grow to become separatist due to elaborate circumstances.
--
This is going to seem like a stupid question, but if the Dutch couldn't leave Dejima to go to Nagasaki, and the Japanese generally couldn't go to Dejima (other than prostitutes), how did the two peoples' trade?
In contrast to daimyo, the Japanese delegation traveled to Edo yearly between 1660 and 1790 and once every four years thereafter.
I suppose this is "Dutch" instead of "Japanese". David.Monniaux 11:49, 26 October 2005 (UTC)
The claim that the Japanese couldn't go to the island is restricted to "regular Japanese". The government still had a steady contingent of officials (who would conduct trade), staff, cooks and the like on the island. These people were all hand-picked and thoroughly checked for loyalty to the shogunate, so as not to reveal any, even the most trivial, data about the Japan of the time. In itself, the claim that only prostitutes were allowed to freely enter and leave the island seems a bit absurd. If every Japanese that had access to the island was severly checked, why would the government allow just about any prostitute from the street to enter? Would this not make all the background checks of every other Japanese on the island futile? If anybody, a prostitute would be expected to spill information that the shogunate was so desperate to conceal. No, in my opinion, the prostitutes themselves were "part of the staff", and I would imagine just as thoroughly checked for loyalty as any other Japanese on the island. So claiming that the prostitutes on the island were part of the regular populace seems like cleansing of a historical truth - that the prostitutes were probably there on official shogunate business, as much as the government officials. 213.172.254.119 08:47, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
The article on Engelbert Kaempfer says he is a German physician, not Dutch. Should this be changed? -- Lost-theory 04:37, 29 January 2007 (UTC)
Do we need this gigantic list? I think it belongs in another article, say List of Dutch Captains who landed at Dejima? - Amake 07:30, 2 August 2007 (UTC)
I don't see how Dejima could be understood to have been a Portugese colony; but if there were some source which supported that perceived construct, the discovery would be a real eye-opener. Frankly, I'd rather be wrong than right on this one. Bluedenim added Dejima to the category of Former Portuguese colonies; and I reverted that edit.
In the undo-edit summary, I invited further discussion here. -- Ooperhoofd 17:48, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
Given this article's historical interest, I wanted to know if I was looking at images created at the same time or later than events, so added dates to them. I think it's important for accuracy in an article of this type. Also, in the same way, it may be appropriate to label the images from Malaysia, for instance. The clothing of the Chinese in 1880 likely is not the same as what people would have seen in the early 19th c. at Dejima. Interesting photos, images and topic. Although the governors of Dejima have apparently had pages written about them, so they are blue-linked, perhaps the list could be simplified by using only the years of their tenure here, rather than including days and months, since the more detailed information can be found elsewhere. All those numbers seem too much. Parkwells ( talk) 19:49, 30 May 2011 (UTC) ,
What in the world does the 1880s Malaysian picture of the Fujianese worker and the Chinese-costumed official have to do with this article at all? I don't see the link to Dejima. Grasping at straws, the Japanese did occupy Malaysia for a time in the 1940s but there was no Japanese presence in Malaysia in 1880 except for about a hundred workers. This may be mislabeled or misplaced. (Just noticed in passing - I don't have enough expertise to be certain one way or the other)