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The key that the published sheet music is in is irrelevant. Those are frequently wrong (sometimes about much more than just the key.) The official version of the song is in F#. Try it out at the piano if you're not sure. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.232.135.20 ( talk) 02:56, 30 May 2012 (UTC)
I added microphone pole to everything that said she was singing in front of a microphone. Since there is no microphone at all. Sobercool Here2Help 15:22, 14 June 2011 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved as proposed. SST flyer 16:02, 6 August 2016 (UTC)
Dancing on My Own →
Dancing On My Own – "On" isn't a preposition here. She's not dancing on top of something called "My Own", she's dancing on her own.
Unreal7 (
talk) 15:46, 26 July 2016 (UTC)--Relisting.
Andrewa (
talk)
16:14, 3 August 2016 (UTC))
Under this reasoning, you should move
Out Here on My Own too. I happen to disagree, so get ready for my Oppose statement if you do
—
JFG
talk
14:43, 10 August 2016 (UTC)
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I don't even know why they bother with block quotes on here if there's going to be mass deletion for copyright violation despite citation without clarifying the ratio.
Even paraphrasing their lines may get the axe so why bother trying. How much can be quoted is never clarified.
If anyone wants to try and wants to go the mod's edit page for the 9+ different sources that are now gone and try, have at it. Good luck. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Onan808 ( talk • contribs) 17:08, 14 July 2020 (UTC)
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Reviewer: K. Peake ( talk · contribs) 07:17, 29 January 2021 (UTC)
Good Article review progress box
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I will review this like I suggested previously but as the article is massive at 133,792 bytes, the review will come in stages and may take up to a week. -- K. Peake 07:17, 29 January 2021 (UTC)
"Patrik Berger, a 38-year-old who has spent his entire life messing around with sound, has other ideas. His studio is in a little house, not much bigger than a shack, in a hidden courtyard off a main drag on the Stockholm island of Sodermalm. There, he brings me over to a Korg Mono/Poly synthesizer along the red-velvet wall of the back room, and starts fiddling with a knob: It was this synth, in this room, that helped him shape the iconic, throbbing bass backbone to Robyn's Grammy-nominated 2010 single Dancing On My Own. The song put him in the spotlight as an in-demand songwriter and producer. "It was one of those songs where people came up to me, talking about how much it mattered," he says." https://www.theglobeandmail.com/arts/music/how-stockholm-became-a-dominant-force-in-global-popmusic/article37541953/ Onan808 ( talk) 00:17, 12 February 2021 (UTC)
Heavy revamp of entire section to heavily condense quotes, move around segments and improve MOS:QUOTE issues- much of below prior edit instruction likely no longer relevant Onan808 ( talk) 00:29, 25 February 2021 (UTC)
>>Completely retooled this to move sections from this and put them elsewhere in article as they weren't as relevant to the topic at hand. What remained I felt was too short to justify having its own section so I've condensed it with the music video section but if you think it still should have its own/be expanded/etc. let me know.
Onan808 (
talk) 16:21, 28 February 2021 (UTC)
Entire section removed: Parts deleted or moved to different sections where more relevant.
Onan808 (
talk)
00:08, 1 March 2021 (UTC)
Re: below remaining portion of section - putting these comments here for the record for other users.: Multiple dead links on release history, formats, and countries, but especially when the track was put to radio adds in the U.S. which numerous searches I have come up empty on - a lot of dead links given the time that's elapsed and no archiving of pages from when this article was first created. I have deleted all mention of the above including the entire release format section later in this article to save space and because references of when they were first released on each specific format should suffice unless an editor/mod feels otherwise. Onan808 ( talk) 16:01, 28 February 2021 (UTC)
Trying to revise several quotes in this article from YouTube clips from her Z100 interview in 2011 with JJ Kincaid that give vital context (especially in Lyrics section). The quotes were deemed "original research" in first attempted Good Article review by Kyle Peake and there's been incredible difficulty replicating this context from other sources. If anyone's able to find an official source that has the Z100 interview transcript from 2011 or a workaround to include similar context from that interview without using YouTube as a source please message me personally or include with a note on its edit and we'll discuss whether it would work. Please honor request to forgo GA nomination until this is accomplished. Onan808 ( talk) 16:23, 2 February 2021 (UTC)
Regarding the size of the article, I looked at a sampling of song articles that have achieved WP:FA status, to see how big they are, and only a very few are larger than this one, which is currently 135k of code. Below is a list of the FA songs I looked at, with their current sizes.
Arguably, the Rihanna and Beyoncé songs at the top of the list could be trimmed back. But a lot of their code size comes from the massive number of references, and all the lists, charts and tables. If you look only at "readable prose" size, things look pretty different.
The point of all this is that I think this article is too large for its topic. It needs pruning for concision. Very influential, world-changing songs such as "Like a Rolling Stone", "Imagine" and "Smells Like Teen Spirit" have been described fully to the reader in much smaller format. This song was big in its own way, clearly Robyn's biggest hit, but not so world-changing or globally influential. Binksternet ( talk) 20:44, 2 February 2021 (UTC)
After I'm done addressing Kyle Peake's edits have at it with the cuts yourself. Prune away since that's clearly your desire and we'll debate each point one by one that you decide to cut on its merits. Other than latter portions of the Impact section which I'll concede unless you're conducting the review for a GA article submission I've done the months of research on content and I'm not wasting my time bowing to the whims of a random user/mod that decides to waltz in and insinuates the bulk of the material is frivolous or a waste of the users time without any specifics. Do the work yourself like I've done - let it be known for the record that this article was barely bare-boned for almost a decade before the majority of what's here. As for the 'lists, charts, and tables' I have no idea what you're referring to other than countries charting which I never contributed to. Other than that I'm ready for the debate on each and every point so we can have at it. Whether or not the song was globally influential is up for debate and we clearly disagree. I never remotely claimed the song was more influential than the three you concluded with but the insinuation is really appreciated. Just one more sign to me you're not coming to this process in good faith which isn't remotely reassuring. Onan808 ( talk) 22:46, 2 February 2021 (UTC)
The article keeps climbing upward in size. It's now 57,074 characters of readable prose, more than twice as much as featured article " Smells Like Teen Spirit". I don't understand the need to keep slapping more clay onto the sculpture which is already bloated. Binksternet ( talk) 02:28, 25 February 2021 (UTC)
Okay, I removed a lot of text to bring the article into compliance with GA criteria for concise prose. The word count was reduced from more than ten thousand words down to 6,357 words. There are no more blockquotes, with some of these getting reworked as much smaller regular quotes. The section about Robyn's career is removed. I added a small amount of stuff to emphasize the fact that the song has been called a gay anthem, which was previously hinted at but not made explicit. Binksternet ( talk) 19:54, 7 March 2021 (UTC)
In March I pruned the article down to 6,357 words, but over the next three months Onan808 has expanded it back up to 7,278 words. It's too much. (Again, Featured Article "Halo" uses about 4500 words.) Also, the prose style introduced by Onon808 is terribly recursive, excessively referring back to previous facts, and dropping lengthy descriptions of new facts into the middle of an ongoing thought, making the article difficult to read. The writing is opaque and contorted. This cannot stand. Binksternet ( talk) 17:00, 20 June 2021 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved. Participants showed that MOS:CT calls for the "on" to be lowercased in these titles; no policy basis was provided to counteract that. The opposition largely centered on the argument that a lowercased "on" would imply that the sentence's subject was physically on top of the object of the prepositional phrase; this argument was effectively refuted in the discussion, leading me to find a consensus to move. ( closed by non-admin page mover) ModernDayTrilobite ( talk • contribs) 17:12, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
– Most titles with "on My Own" treat "on" as a preposition, lowercase, which seems correct, but strangely was not the interpretation on this article back in 2016, in a thinly attended RM. Now this one is being used as a precedent at Talk:Always On the Run (Isaak song)#Requested move 18 February 2024; we should fix it instead, along with the few others like it. Dicklyon ( talk) 11:25, 21 February 2024 (UTC)
I'm always on the run, run, run, run[2]. Analysing this: I (subject) am (verb) always (adverb) on (preposition) the run (object, noun phrase with definite article). See also Cambridge and Mirriam-Webster definitions and examples of when on acts as either a preposition, adverb or adjective.
I keep dancing on my own, with keep being the verb [3] [4] and dancing, an adverb. Cinderella157 ( talk) 11:04, 24 February 2024 (UTC)
"Moving On Up" can be interpreted as the phrasal verb "moving on" (going forward/past something) followed by "up" serving in a role that some would classify as an adverb and some as a determiner lacking an explicitly declared, "understood" referent, but essentially taking the object role in the overall constuction (a role usually filled by a noun, noun phrase, or pronoun), i.e. with "up" basically serving as a destination for "on", a "location", if you will, of an improved status. More plausibly, the phrase can also be differently interpreted as the simple verb "moving" followed by the compound preposition "on up" (a construction common in Southern and African-American English, whence this particular phrase, the title of the theme song to The Jeffersons, with a synergistic implication of progress or advancement), with an unspecified "understood" object of some better destination, namely again a higher social status in the Jeffersons' case. Either way, the "On" gets capitalized as part of a phrasal verb, or as the start of a compound preposition. If we had different rules for those cases, then we'd have a new argument to go through.
"Dancing on My Own", though, is both structurally and meaningfully equivalent to Billy Idol's "Dancing with Myself" (and someone else's hypothetical song "Dancing by Myself") other than that "my+self" has become an orthographically fused compound while my+own has not. No one would [sensibly] argue that "with" or "by" isn't serving a prepositional function in those. "On" is, too, just a metaphorical one. If I say "I'm in the doldrums" I metaphorically mean I'm experiencing a lack of productivity, inspiration, activity, etc.; not that I'm literally in (within, inside of, enclosed by) something (nor, for that matter, that the something is an unwanted windless calm at sea that had stranded me for the time being). Even "with" and "by" aren't serving a literal function here; no one can actually be with (alongside, accompanying) or by (beside, next to) oneself. It's pure accident that one of these phrases has "on" in it and others have "with" or "by". Lots of English idioms are this way, and conventionalized to a broad extent between the Early Modern and Modern English phases from inconsistent dialectal variations that had conflicting prepositions. You can see a lot of that kind of variation in Shakespeare and the King James Bible (e.g. "such stuff as dreams are made on" instead of "... made of").
If we had a song title of, say, "Dancing On into the Sunset", then we'd have a simple verb followed by a colloquial compound preposition of "on into", or a phrasal verb of "dancing on" followed by a one-word preposition "into"; they don't even have quite identical interpretations (we'd probably have to examine the lyrics to be sure which was intended). Either way, that construction is very different from "Dancing on My Own", which is simply verb + preposition + noun phrase (own as noun modified by pronoun determiner). That "own" in this sense (usually modified by "my", "your", or some other pronoun, or a proper name as in "Jane's own") is serving as a noun can be confirmed with The American Heritage Dictionary and various other such works. When it modifies a stand-alone noun, then pronoun/name+own is adjectival, as in "sleeping in your own bed". Contrast that with "sleeping on your own" (V+Pr+NP), where again the "on" isn't conveying a literal meaning of "on top of". No one, though, would argue that "sleeping on" in this sense is a phrasal verb (it could be in, e.g., "sleeping on until noon") or that "on" otherwise isn't a preposition here; it's just not one conveying its most common meaning, as "on" also isn't in "dancing on my own". Yet "sleeping on your own" and "dancing on my own" are structurally equivalent phrases, right down the role and form of every single element in them. — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼 00:18, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
![]() | Dancing on My Own was a Music good articles nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There may be suggestions below for improving the article. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake. | |||||||||
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The key that the published sheet music is in is irrelevant. Those are frequently wrong (sometimes about much more than just the key.) The official version of the song is in F#. Try it out at the piano if you're not sure. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.232.135.20 ( talk) 02:56, 30 May 2012 (UTC)
I added microphone pole to everything that said she was singing in front of a microphone. Since there is no microphone at all. Sobercool Here2Help 15:22, 14 June 2011 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved as proposed. SST flyer 16:02, 6 August 2016 (UTC)
Dancing on My Own →
Dancing On My Own – "On" isn't a preposition here. She's not dancing on top of something called "My Own", she's dancing on her own.
Unreal7 (
talk) 15:46, 26 July 2016 (UTC)--Relisting.
Andrewa (
talk)
16:14, 3 August 2016 (UTC))
Under this reasoning, you should move
Out Here on My Own too. I happen to disagree, so get ready for my Oppose statement if you do
—
JFG
talk
14:43, 10 August 2016 (UTC)
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I don't even know why they bother with block quotes on here if there's going to be mass deletion for copyright violation despite citation without clarifying the ratio.
Even paraphrasing their lines may get the axe so why bother trying. How much can be quoted is never clarified.
If anyone wants to try and wants to go the mod's edit page for the 9+ different sources that are now gone and try, have at it. Good luck. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Onan808 ( talk • contribs) 17:08, 14 July 2020 (UTC)
GA toolbox |
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Reviewing |
Reviewer: K. Peake ( talk · contribs) 07:17, 29 January 2021 (UTC)
Good Article review progress box
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I will review this like I suggested previously but as the article is massive at 133,792 bytes, the review will come in stages and may take up to a week. -- K. Peake 07:17, 29 January 2021 (UTC)
"Patrik Berger, a 38-year-old who has spent his entire life messing around with sound, has other ideas. His studio is in a little house, not much bigger than a shack, in a hidden courtyard off a main drag on the Stockholm island of Sodermalm. There, he brings me over to a Korg Mono/Poly synthesizer along the red-velvet wall of the back room, and starts fiddling with a knob: It was this synth, in this room, that helped him shape the iconic, throbbing bass backbone to Robyn's Grammy-nominated 2010 single Dancing On My Own. The song put him in the spotlight as an in-demand songwriter and producer. "It was one of those songs where people came up to me, talking about how much it mattered," he says." https://www.theglobeandmail.com/arts/music/how-stockholm-became-a-dominant-force-in-global-popmusic/article37541953/ Onan808 ( talk) 00:17, 12 February 2021 (UTC)
Heavy revamp of entire section to heavily condense quotes, move around segments and improve MOS:QUOTE issues- much of below prior edit instruction likely no longer relevant Onan808 ( talk) 00:29, 25 February 2021 (UTC)
>>Completely retooled this to move sections from this and put them elsewhere in article as they weren't as relevant to the topic at hand. What remained I felt was too short to justify having its own section so I've condensed it with the music video section but if you think it still should have its own/be expanded/etc. let me know.
Onan808 (
talk) 16:21, 28 February 2021 (UTC)
Entire section removed: Parts deleted or moved to different sections where more relevant.
Onan808 (
talk)
00:08, 1 March 2021 (UTC)
Re: below remaining portion of section - putting these comments here for the record for other users.: Multiple dead links on release history, formats, and countries, but especially when the track was put to radio adds in the U.S. which numerous searches I have come up empty on - a lot of dead links given the time that's elapsed and no archiving of pages from when this article was first created. I have deleted all mention of the above including the entire release format section later in this article to save space and because references of when they were first released on each specific format should suffice unless an editor/mod feels otherwise. Onan808 ( talk) 16:01, 28 February 2021 (UTC)
Trying to revise several quotes in this article from YouTube clips from her Z100 interview in 2011 with JJ Kincaid that give vital context (especially in Lyrics section). The quotes were deemed "original research" in first attempted Good Article review by Kyle Peake and there's been incredible difficulty replicating this context from other sources. If anyone's able to find an official source that has the Z100 interview transcript from 2011 or a workaround to include similar context from that interview without using YouTube as a source please message me personally or include with a note on its edit and we'll discuss whether it would work. Please honor request to forgo GA nomination until this is accomplished. Onan808 ( talk) 16:23, 2 February 2021 (UTC)
Regarding the size of the article, I looked at a sampling of song articles that have achieved WP:FA status, to see how big they are, and only a very few are larger than this one, which is currently 135k of code. Below is a list of the FA songs I looked at, with their current sizes.
Arguably, the Rihanna and Beyoncé songs at the top of the list could be trimmed back. But a lot of their code size comes from the massive number of references, and all the lists, charts and tables. If you look only at "readable prose" size, things look pretty different.
The point of all this is that I think this article is too large for its topic. It needs pruning for concision. Very influential, world-changing songs such as "Like a Rolling Stone", "Imagine" and "Smells Like Teen Spirit" have been described fully to the reader in much smaller format. This song was big in its own way, clearly Robyn's biggest hit, but not so world-changing or globally influential. Binksternet ( talk) 20:44, 2 February 2021 (UTC)
After I'm done addressing Kyle Peake's edits have at it with the cuts yourself. Prune away since that's clearly your desire and we'll debate each point one by one that you decide to cut on its merits. Other than latter portions of the Impact section which I'll concede unless you're conducting the review for a GA article submission I've done the months of research on content and I'm not wasting my time bowing to the whims of a random user/mod that decides to waltz in and insinuates the bulk of the material is frivolous or a waste of the users time without any specifics. Do the work yourself like I've done - let it be known for the record that this article was barely bare-boned for almost a decade before the majority of what's here. As for the 'lists, charts, and tables' I have no idea what you're referring to other than countries charting which I never contributed to. Other than that I'm ready for the debate on each and every point so we can have at it. Whether or not the song was globally influential is up for debate and we clearly disagree. I never remotely claimed the song was more influential than the three you concluded with but the insinuation is really appreciated. Just one more sign to me you're not coming to this process in good faith which isn't remotely reassuring. Onan808 ( talk) 22:46, 2 February 2021 (UTC)
The article keeps climbing upward in size. It's now 57,074 characters of readable prose, more than twice as much as featured article " Smells Like Teen Spirit". I don't understand the need to keep slapping more clay onto the sculpture which is already bloated. Binksternet ( talk) 02:28, 25 February 2021 (UTC)
Okay, I removed a lot of text to bring the article into compliance with GA criteria for concise prose. The word count was reduced from more than ten thousand words down to 6,357 words. There are no more blockquotes, with some of these getting reworked as much smaller regular quotes. The section about Robyn's career is removed. I added a small amount of stuff to emphasize the fact that the song has been called a gay anthem, which was previously hinted at but not made explicit. Binksternet ( talk) 19:54, 7 March 2021 (UTC)
In March I pruned the article down to 6,357 words, but over the next three months Onan808 has expanded it back up to 7,278 words. It's too much. (Again, Featured Article "Halo" uses about 4500 words.) Also, the prose style introduced by Onon808 is terribly recursive, excessively referring back to previous facts, and dropping lengthy descriptions of new facts into the middle of an ongoing thought, making the article difficult to read. The writing is opaque and contorted. This cannot stand. Binksternet ( talk) 17:00, 20 June 2021 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved. Participants showed that MOS:CT calls for the "on" to be lowercased in these titles; no policy basis was provided to counteract that. The opposition largely centered on the argument that a lowercased "on" would imply that the sentence's subject was physically on top of the object of the prepositional phrase; this argument was effectively refuted in the discussion, leading me to find a consensus to move. ( closed by non-admin page mover) ModernDayTrilobite ( talk • contribs) 17:12, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
– Most titles with "on My Own" treat "on" as a preposition, lowercase, which seems correct, but strangely was not the interpretation on this article back in 2016, in a thinly attended RM. Now this one is being used as a precedent at Talk:Always On the Run (Isaak song)#Requested move 18 February 2024; we should fix it instead, along with the few others like it. Dicklyon ( talk) 11:25, 21 February 2024 (UTC)
I'm always on the run, run, run, run[2]. Analysing this: I (subject) am (verb) always (adverb) on (preposition) the run (object, noun phrase with definite article). See also Cambridge and Mirriam-Webster definitions and examples of when on acts as either a preposition, adverb or adjective.
I keep dancing on my own, with keep being the verb [3] [4] and dancing, an adverb. Cinderella157 ( talk) 11:04, 24 February 2024 (UTC)
"Moving On Up" can be interpreted as the phrasal verb "moving on" (going forward/past something) followed by "up" serving in a role that some would classify as an adverb and some as a determiner lacking an explicitly declared, "understood" referent, but essentially taking the object role in the overall constuction (a role usually filled by a noun, noun phrase, or pronoun), i.e. with "up" basically serving as a destination for "on", a "location", if you will, of an improved status. More plausibly, the phrase can also be differently interpreted as the simple verb "moving" followed by the compound preposition "on up" (a construction common in Southern and African-American English, whence this particular phrase, the title of the theme song to The Jeffersons, with a synergistic implication of progress or advancement), with an unspecified "understood" object of some better destination, namely again a higher social status in the Jeffersons' case. Either way, the "On" gets capitalized as part of a phrasal verb, or as the start of a compound preposition. If we had different rules for those cases, then we'd have a new argument to go through.
"Dancing on My Own", though, is both structurally and meaningfully equivalent to Billy Idol's "Dancing with Myself" (and someone else's hypothetical song "Dancing by Myself") other than that "my+self" has become an orthographically fused compound while my+own has not. No one would [sensibly] argue that "with" or "by" isn't serving a prepositional function in those. "On" is, too, just a metaphorical one. If I say "I'm in the doldrums" I metaphorically mean I'm experiencing a lack of productivity, inspiration, activity, etc.; not that I'm literally in (within, inside of, enclosed by) something (nor, for that matter, that the something is an unwanted windless calm at sea that had stranded me for the time being). Even "with" and "by" aren't serving a literal function here; no one can actually be with (alongside, accompanying) or by (beside, next to) oneself. It's pure accident that one of these phrases has "on" in it and others have "with" or "by". Lots of English idioms are this way, and conventionalized to a broad extent between the Early Modern and Modern English phases from inconsistent dialectal variations that had conflicting prepositions. You can see a lot of that kind of variation in Shakespeare and the King James Bible (e.g. "such stuff as dreams are made on" instead of "... made of").
If we had a song title of, say, "Dancing On into the Sunset", then we'd have a simple verb followed by a colloquial compound preposition of "on into", or a phrasal verb of "dancing on" followed by a one-word preposition "into"; they don't even have quite identical interpretations (we'd probably have to examine the lyrics to be sure which was intended). Either way, that construction is very different from "Dancing on My Own", which is simply verb + preposition + noun phrase (own as noun modified by pronoun determiner). That "own" in this sense (usually modified by "my", "your", or some other pronoun, or a proper name as in "Jane's own") is serving as a noun can be confirmed with The American Heritage Dictionary and various other such works. When it modifies a stand-alone noun, then pronoun/name+own is adjectival, as in "sleeping in your own bed". Contrast that with "sleeping on your own" (V+Pr+NP), where again the "on" isn't conveying a literal meaning of "on top of". No one, though, would argue that "sleeping on" in this sense is a phrasal verb (it could be in, e.g., "sleeping on until noon") or that "on" otherwise isn't a preposition here; it's just not one conveying its most common meaning, as "on" also isn't in "dancing on my own". Yet "sleeping on your own" and "dancing on my own" are structurally equivalent phrases, right down the role and form of every single element in them. — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼 00:18, 2 March 2024 (UTC)