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Archive 1 |
WikiProject Biography Assessment
The article may be improved by following the WikiProject Biography 11 easy steps to producing at least a B article. -- Yamara 04:39, 28 May 2007 (UTC)
please remove the inflammatory statements towards me as i first announced his death and was banned for no reason its a shame — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.254.201.108 ( talk) 22:14, 16 October 2011 (UTC)
Too much speculation, not enough actual information. |
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The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
Thank you for the semi protection...it was getting to be a pain to hit undo every 30 seconds. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dirwulf ( talk • contribs) 21:34, 16 October 2011 (UTC) please keep personal attacks off wikipedia 96.254.201.108 - you need to stop posting false statements or you will be banned — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dirwulf ( talk • contribs) 21:24, 16 October 2011 (UTC) Danica just burst into tears in the garage upon hearing confirmation of Dan WHeldon's death — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.254.201.108 ( talk) 21:10, 16 October 2011 (UTC) While the situation is grim, you really should refrain from declaring him dead until there is some official announcement. Otherwise, it's sort of ghoulish. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rawalex ( talk • contribs) 21:01, 16 October 2011 (UTC) I am at the race he is dead. The top half of his car was ripped off including his upper body. All the drivers saw it happen. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.254.201.108 ( talk) 20:54, 16 October 2011 (UTC) Nothing has been reported on a death, just speculation 99.139.138.139 ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 20:43, 16 October 2011 (UTC). Does anyone know whether he's related to the former Rallycross driver Hugh Wheldon? -- MartinUK 10:58, 10 April 2006 (UTC) What is his winning time???? and what is his number??? According to Autosport (March 1 2007) He's chasing a Nascar drive. (Page 17) Britmax 18:12, 4 March 2007 (UTC) Dan Wheldon is not related in any direct way to Hugh Wheldon. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 137.73.88.101 ( talk) 09:49, April 18, 2008 How can this site report him dead when there has been no announcement. Shamefull At 4:50 EST Oct 16. Wikipedia is reporting that Dan Wheldon is dead with an obituary date. There is no confirmation from any source that this is indeed, true. Cite for non verifiaability at this time. It was just announced I am searching for a source I was not the one to change it but I am actively working to find one as they just announced that he died -Supereditor8000 is Cousin's Nephew--- == named Joey?! What on earth is this all about? Dan is not dead, but alive in a stable condition in hospital Sky are reporting - but with no hardcore source. Please stop posting death dates WITHOUT confirmation from the IndyCar Stewards OR officials. Paddiiee (Patrick Carney) ( talk) 21:03, 16 October 2011 (UTC) |
The page had too many images of the driver, so I am moving one here until there is more text. Royalbroil 04:15, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
I know he is wearing white sunnies, but that photo in the article sure doesn't look like Wheldon to me. Looks more like Scott Dixon to me. Comments? Kaiwhakahaere ( talk) 22:22, 10 August 2008 (UTC)
Can someone show me where Difficult Dan came from. I can't find it independently, I can only find word for word quotes in a couple of blogs. I'm thinking someone made it up. Snetter2007 ( talk) 11:00, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
Wheldon's career might be ending today. :'( ( AutoRacingGenie ( talk) 20:42, 16 October 2011 (UTC))
Can anybody who knows how to, ask for semi-protection? ( Edmurbobby ( talk) 21:05, 16 October 2011 (UTC))
This is hardly reliable, but watching the coverage on ABC, and everything seems to say to me that he's gone. Most telling: the media was told that the drivers would not be available for interviews until IndyCar makes a statement. And Tony Kanaan is visibly crying on camera... rdfox 76 ( talk) 21:58, 16 October 2011 (UTC)
ABC news just confirmed Wheldon has died. [----]
Dan had started in last place and was racing for $5million. He had moved up 10 positions at the time of the crash. 3 other drivers also went to the hospital. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tonrunner ( talk • contribs) 22:51, 16 October 2011 (UTC)
OK so if you see the ongoing edits that have occurred you will see that there is quite a conflict as to what lap the crash was on most sources including the one I added with the original edit say 13 but people are changing it again most sources including many recently updated articles say that it was lap 13 so I have been maintaining that with in the article people have been changing it with out proper source and leaving the source that says it was lap 13. I will continue to monitor the news outlets and change if necessary. Thanks and RIP Dan Wheldon. Supereditor8000 ( talk) 22:57, 16 October 2011 (UTC)
Supereditor8000, why don't you cite IndyCar as the source for the Lap 11? That might reduce the back-and-forth somewhat if people can see in the article that Indy has said it was Lap 11. And I second your RIP Dan Wheldon. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Don Branson ( talk • contribs) 01:49, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
Just a quick update (happened to be looking back at this page remembering the whole "lap issue") the official IRL website 404ed the page with the information that has the lap number in which the crash occurred. I will leave it be for right now until I find something else that is in agreement with what the IRL formerly had on their site. Just wanted to give everyone a heads up in case someone noticed things being changed in what was a bit of a back and forth originally. Supereditor8000 ( talk) 08:09, 5 February 2013 (UTC)
Apparently multiple sources are stating the crash took place on lap 13. This is a case where the otherwise-reliable sources are wrong. The wreck occured during lap 11, the red flag came out during lap 13. Note IndyCar official timing and scoring showed, as of the completion of lap 12, Wheldon and the rest of the wrecked cars at "Diff.: 2 LAPS", i.e. two laps behind the leader, who had completed 12 laps, therefore having completed 10 laps with the wreck occuring on lap 11. - The Bushranger One ping only 22:58, 16 October 2011 (UTC)
Sorry did not see your post change if you deem necessary and no hard feelings about the back and forth between what lap it I agree that clearly no one knows for sure what lap it occurred on and maybe it would be better to eliminate that until it becomes clear. Supereditor8000 ( talk) 23:02, 16 October 2011 (UTC)
I agree I am hands off on that if one of you want to make the change but IndyCar would be the best source. Thanks Supereditor8000 ( talk) 23:07, 16 October 2011 (UTC)
The IRL website confirms lap 11. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.115.71.200 ( talk) 00:57, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
Yes, IndyCar says lap 11, not 13 as reported by BBC and CBS. Sorry for contributing to the back-and-forth! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Don Branson ( talk • contribs) 01:36, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
Who were the other 14 drivers involved in the crash? Watching the video replays shows there were two separate crashes, one right after the other. Both caused by one car swerving down the track and colliding with the car just behind. Dan Wheldon was involved in the second crash. Bizzybody ( talk) 00:17, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
It said that Cunningham clipped James Hinchcliffe, so wouldn't James Hinchcliffe have been involved in the crash? Also, it said that James Jakes was in the pits after crash. Marty Reid said that his car didn't have damage, even though he was out of the cockpit. Ptb1997 Talk 10:46, May 25, 2015 (CDT)
Why is there a link to Find a Grave. Mr Wheldon has not even been buried yet. I find what some have tried to put on this page disgusting. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.4.107.152 ( talk) 03:41, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
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please change The reasoning behind the move was that the level of investment needed to fund his racing career in the UK wasn't able to be provided by his family, to The reasoning behind the move was that the level of investment needed to fund his racing career in the UK was beyond his family's resources.
79.44.13.114 ( talk) 05:03, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
The death section should link to the race article 2011 IZOD IndyCar World Championship (this is the name of the race, not the season). And the intro section should as well. Probably a piped link for "race". 70.24.251.158 ( talk) 07:08, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
All the above nonsense would be avoided if some editors didn't treat Wikipedia as if it were a news site which has to be updated instantly to include recent events. There should be a Wikipedia policy that only events more than say a year old can be included. That would allow the dust to settled and more accurate information to become available. An encyclopaedia shouldn't encourage short termism. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.154.64.107 ( talk) 07:54, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
Agree with this. People go to news sites for up to the minute news, they come to Wikipedia for an accurate account of events after the fact. 86.149.101.102 ( talk) 10:15, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
I don't agree with this completely. First of all, the "wait a year"-idea is random and does not make sense. The only thing we need here is the rule to only include information once there are sources to back them up (which already is a rule that just is not enforced that well). Waiting a year is way too long. If something happened, then something happened and it could be included. We don't need to destroy one of the advantages of the medium by making the Wikipedia slower than books. And while I completely agree that Wikipedia is not a news site, the Wikipedia itself undermines that idea by including a "In the news" block at the top of the home page. While this is not necessarily a problem, it gives people the impression that news are part of the Wikipedia, which is annoying since people already don't understand what an encyclopedia is. But that said, recent events ARE part of an encyclopedia. They just never were, because it took so long for the print products to come out. -- 78.54.19.112 ( talk) 11:42, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
The image of the crash is tagged with a (c) watermark; would that make it ineligible for inclusion even though it was botted over with CC licensing? I'm new to image editing, so I don't want to start an FfD case if it is allowed. 67.160.116.66 ( talk) 10:20, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
Licensing issues aside, I have to question whether we should even have a picture of the crash here. In an article about the race or the crash, absolutely it's appropriate. Here in the biographical article, it strikes me as slightly morbid. -- Bongwarrior ( talk) 01:45, 18 October 2011 (UTC)
Personally, I think images and footage of the incident SHOULD NOT be used ANYWHERE by ANY MEDIA OUTLET. I was appalled enough that ESPN chose to replay the video of the crash after the announcement of Dan's death, but usage of it beyond that is outrightly disrespectful to Dan, his family, crew, fellow competitors, friends, fans, and the motorsporting community as a whole. We deserve better than to have this tragedy exploited for commercial purposes and the entertainment of the morbid. Think of how any of you would feel if it had been your loved one. We're civilized human beings; we're supposed to be beyond such barbaric practices. If the section really needs an image, you should use one of the five-lap tribute or the fan memorial outside the track instead. 68.44.244.172 ( talk) 05:20, 18 October 2011 (UTC)
The argument that showing images of the accident is alright because it's "difficult to ascertain" which car is his is wrong for multiple reasons:
No human deserves the indignity of having their death exploited for entertainment purposes, which, quite frankly, is what the news is about these days. Life is precious and should be respected above all else. I applaud the fact that the image has been removed from the article since my initial appeal. -- 68.44.244.172 ( talk) 00:17, 19 October 2011 (UTC)
This article should be spelt in British English. So it is "lap of honour" not "honor". 86.136.210.142 ( talk) 12:16, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
The tragedy occurred at Las Vegas Motor Speedway which is in fact in unincorporated Clark County, Nevada, not in the city of Las Vegas, Nevada as currently indicated in the article. I'm going to change it for accuracy. -- Oakshade ( talk) 16:01, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
Please add information about their participation in Xbox Game "IndyCar Series 2002 and 2005" source is http://www.gamespot.com/xbox/driving/indycarseries2005/review.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by XemDenots ( talk • contribs) 16:07, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
Can we get a better picture? The current one makes him look like a sleazeball. AmericanLeMans ( talk) 17:57, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
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68.224.149.138 (
talk)
18:46, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
Death of Dan Wheldon
My name is Heather and I personally was at the race when this tragity occured. It happened during the 12th lap and involved 13 drivers. Your statments on Wiki are not accurate.
Not done - Hello and welcome. Unfortunately, the IndyCar's official website confirms that the crash occurred in the 11th lap and 15 cars were involved.
Darth
Sjones23 (
talk -
contributions)
18:59, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
...to add a link to the "Find a grave" site for the freshly deceased, long before there is one to find. "Open" can be very ugly. -- 80.171.56.5 ( talk) 04:56, 18 October 2011 (UTC)
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Reviewing |
Reviewer: Harrias ( talk · contribs) 08:14, 30 April 2019 (UTC)
I can't resist this one; an article I had considered working on myself in the past.
Harrias
talk
08:14, 30 April 2019 (UTC)
"The name of a flag's political entity should appear adjacent to the first use of the flag, as no reader is familiar with every flag, and many flags differ only in minor details."
All look good on a quick first pass. I can't access ref #117 ("Indy 500 another way for Wheldon to validate career") in the UK, but I have no reason to believe there is any issue with it. There are a couple of short passages that could bear further paraphrasing though:
"The chassis of the 77 impacted (upon) a post along the right side of the tub, and created a deep defect in the tub that extended from the bulkhead, along the upper border of the tub and through the cockpit"
"He collided with a fence post along his tub's right-hand side, creating a deep defect in the tub that extended from the pedal bulkhead along its upper section and through the cockpit."
"What was also witnessed was unlimited movement on the track surface under race conditions."
"and the unlimited movement on the track surface under racing conditions"
Detailed prose review to follow. Harrias talk 09:08, 30 April 2019 (UTC)
"The following year, Wheldon moved to AGR, winning nine races (including the 2005 Indianapolis 500) and finishing as the runner-up in the 2004 series championship."Is this right? The 2005 Indy, but he 2004 championship?
"He won the drivers' title in 2005 with the record for most victories during a season in his time with the team."I'm not quite sure what purpose "in his time with the team" is serving here?
"and the fifth Indianapolis 500 winner to die in the same year as winning the race."This feels a bit like trivia, and perhaps not necessary in the lead.
"Wheldon was born in the farming village of Emberton..."Most British villages could be described as "farming villages" to be honest. This isn't mentioned in the reference provided.
"and his mother acted as his timekeeper."Clarification is needed here; was she timekeeper for Dan, or Clive?
"He went to the private Bedford School.."Do we have any details on how someone who
"did not have a wealthy background"went to private school?
"...races for second in the standings."Might sound more encyclopaedic as "..races to finish second in the standings."
"The following year, Wheldon was fourth in both the British Formula Ford Championship and the European Formula Ford Championship for Andy Welch Racing with seven victories."Seven victories in each, or combined?
"...Van Diemen team and drove a Mygale in 1998."The phrasing make it sound like these are two different events; he improved to third and he drove a Mygale. Maybe change to "...Van Diemen team, driving a Mygale, in 1998."?
"With Button taking the titles..."Avoid using "with" as a conjunction like this; can the sentence be reworded to get rid of it?
"With Button taking the titles, Wheldon did not have the necessary level of funding from his father..."A further issue is that the current wording make it sound like it was Button's fault that Wheldon's father didn't have the funding. I assume that the titles came with sponsorship opportunities? If so, this should be spelt out more clearly.
"Thus, at the suggestion of his former team principal and car manufacturer.."Remove "Thus", it's superfluous.
"His funding was provided by his team and Van Diemen.Which team, his Van Diemen team from 1998, or the Jayhard/Primus Racing for 1999?
"During the 2000 Toyota Atlantic Championship, he drove..."This is a sudden jump; can more information on his move to the Toyota Atlantic Championship from the U.S. F2000 National Championship be included; was this a step up, a sideways shift, what?
"..in series' history.."No need for the apostrophe; it would only be needed for "..in the series' history..".
"..in the championship standings with 159 points with a further.."The quick repetition of "with" is uncomfortable, can it be reworked?
"Wheldon was named the series' Rookie of the Year for his season's performance."The last bit, "..for his season's performance." is superfluous and can be cut.
"For the 2001 season, Wheldon moved to PacWest Lights to compete in Indy Lights.Again a bit more explanation could be provided. First, clarify that "PacWest Lights" is a racing team, rather than a series. Secondly, can it be clarified whether a move to Indy Lights is a step up, sideways, or whatever.
Okay, taking a break. Harrias talk 10:28, 30 April 2019 (UTC)
"He came 15th in the season-closing..."As this number is essentially been compared with the seventh place quali and tenth place finish in the previous race, I think we need to write fifteenth, per MOS:NUMNOTES.
"He finished his two-race campaign 36th in the points standings with 35 accrued."It might be overkill, but for clarity I'd spell out "with 35 points accrued."
"He was called up later to drive when regular driver Dario Franchitti broke his vertebrae in a motor bike accident in Scotland."The end of the previous paragraph sort of implied that Wheldon would be driving, so it would be worth making it clear that the sponsorship presumably wasn't found for him to drive in 2003 (at least at the start of the season).
"He qualified for his first Indianapolis 500 in fifth after his team changed his car number to 26."This wording almost seems to suggest that he qualified in fifth because of the number change. Do we really need to mention the number change at all? If we do, can it be given less prominence somehow?
"In late-race, he..."Maybe change to "Late in the race, he..."
"Wheldon was retained as a driver following the retirement of team owner Michael Andretti who mentored him."Is there any suggestion that Andretti retired specifically to make way for Wheldon? It would be interesting to note that if so.
"Wheldon's performances enhanced his reputation exponentially..."A couple of issues here; "exponentially" is PUFFERY in this context, and should be removed. The suggestion that his reputation was enhanced is quite subjective, and could possibly do with inline attribution ("according to so-and-so...").
"...Wheldon won his first career pole position and finished third after his teammate Tony Kanaan passed him on the first lap.Is the fact that Kanaan passed him specifically relevant? At least one other driver overtook him for him to finish third, so it seems odd to mention Kanaan.
"Wheldon became the first British driver to win an American open-wheel championship since Nigel Mansell in 1993, and the first to win both the Indianapolis 500 and the title since Jacques Villeneuve in 1995.This (note a) seems to imply that Jacques Villeneuve was a British driver. It might be solved by just adding "driver" again after "and the first"?
"He hit Sam Hornish Jr. in the pit lane during a caution period at the 2006 Grand Prix of St. Petersburg."Is this significant enough to include in his biography?
"He started eighteenth in the Indianapolis 500 finishing six places higher in 12th.."Needs to be twelfth to match eighteenth and second.
"He was released from his CGR contract on 3 September as Dario Franchitti left NASCAR and returned to IndyCar."Did that mean that he missed the end of the season then?
"He was tenth in the championship standings with 354 points,[81] his lowest finish since he placed 11th in 2003.""tenth" and "11th" need to match.
That's me for tonight, too tired to read any more! Harrias talk 21:22, 1 May 2019 (UTC)
"...being eliminated from the Round of 16 by Sébastien Bourdais in a buggy car."I don't know whether "Round" needs to be capitalised here. I'd also recommend removing "in a buggy car", as it could give the impression that Wheldon was in a 'real' car, and Bourdais beat him while only driving a buggy!
"The trio won its class and overall..."Given that winning the race overall would automatically mean they won their class, I think this is a bit redundant. Can it be rephrased to basically just say that they won the race?
"...due to it sustaining three accidents during the event."Remove "it".
"$5 million would be divided equally between the driver and a randomly selected fan..."Per MOS:NUMNOTES, avoid starting a sentence with a number.
"..and travelling on the inside line.."This could do with a note to explain what it means.
"..towards the infield and collected fellow competitors..""Collected" might be jargon here, consider a more accessible alternative.
"..along his tub's right-hand side, creating a deep defect in the tub that went.."Explanation of what "tub" means needed. Could we just use "car" the first time, and "chassis" the second?
"That deformed its roll hoop and sheared from the tub."I'm a little lost here; did the roll hoop shear from the tub? If so, rephrase to "That deformed its roll hoop, which sheared from the tub."
"..by the trackside safety team and their Las Vegas-based colleagues.."Are the trackside safety team not LV based? This feels like excessive detail.
"He was 33 years old."I umm and arr about this. Technically is is a purely factual statement. However, placing it alone in a sentence like this adds to the emotional impact, and I'm not sure that's appropriate in an encyclopedia.
"..and unlimited track movement while racing created more car-to-car contact.."What does this mean?
"During the 2016 Kobalt 400 at Las Vegas Motor Speedway, pit reporter Jamie Little, who covered that INDYCAR race and was assigned to the trauma centre after the crash, and motorsport publicist Brent Brush, who helped Wheldon's sponsorship deals, placed a Dan Wheldon Memorial plaque outside turn two, near the point where he was killed."This is a long sentence which is trying to say too much for me. It either needs splitting down, or some of the information removing. Note also the inconsistent format "INDYCAR".
"In May, a book entitled Lionheart: Remembering Dan Wheldon covering his life.."Add the year for clarity.
All done. Great work; do you have plans to take this on to FA? Harrias talk 09:27, 3 May 2019 (UTC)
The Early and personal life section says Wheldon "...did not have a wealthy background". Why is that worth a mention? It's hardly breathtakingly unusual -- most people in the world don't come from a wealthy background. As well, Wheldon didn't come from a poor background either. Moriori ( talk) 20:52, 3 May 2019 (UTC)
It wasn’t Amazing Grace that they played after the accident during the 5 lap tribute, it was Danny Boy, on bagpipes. I was there in person. 2600:8802:E00:3B9:6591:D301:B9C2:754C ( talk) 00:05, 18 October 2023 (UTC)
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 |
WikiProject Biography Assessment
The article may be improved by following the WikiProject Biography 11 easy steps to producing at least a B article. -- Yamara 04:39, 28 May 2007 (UTC)
please remove the inflammatory statements towards me as i first announced his death and was banned for no reason its a shame — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.254.201.108 ( talk) 22:14, 16 October 2011 (UTC)
Too much speculation, not enough actual information. |
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The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
Thank you for the semi protection...it was getting to be a pain to hit undo every 30 seconds. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dirwulf ( talk • contribs) 21:34, 16 October 2011 (UTC) please keep personal attacks off wikipedia 96.254.201.108 - you need to stop posting false statements or you will be banned — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dirwulf ( talk • contribs) 21:24, 16 October 2011 (UTC) Danica just burst into tears in the garage upon hearing confirmation of Dan WHeldon's death — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.254.201.108 ( talk) 21:10, 16 October 2011 (UTC) While the situation is grim, you really should refrain from declaring him dead until there is some official announcement. Otherwise, it's sort of ghoulish. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rawalex ( talk • contribs) 21:01, 16 October 2011 (UTC) I am at the race he is dead. The top half of his car was ripped off including his upper body. All the drivers saw it happen. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.254.201.108 ( talk) 20:54, 16 October 2011 (UTC) Nothing has been reported on a death, just speculation 99.139.138.139 ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 20:43, 16 October 2011 (UTC). Does anyone know whether he's related to the former Rallycross driver Hugh Wheldon? -- MartinUK 10:58, 10 April 2006 (UTC) What is his winning time???? and what is his number??? According to Autosport (March 1 2007) He's chasing a Nascar drive. (Page 17) Britmax 18:12, 4 March 2007 (UTC) Dan Wheldon is not related in any direct way to Hugh Wheldon. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 137.73.88.101 ( talk) 09:49, April 18, 2008 How can this site report him dead when there has been no announcement. Shamefull At 4:50 EST Oct 16. Wikipedia is reporting that Dan Wheldon is dead with an obituary date. There is no confirmation from any source that this is indeed, true. Cite for non verifiaability at this time. It was just announced I am searching for a source I was not the one to change it but I am actively working to find one as they just announced that he died -Supereditor8000 is Cousin's Nephew--- == named Joey?! What on earth is this all about? Dan is not dead, but alive in a stable condition in hospital Sky are reporting - but with no hardcore source. Please stop posting death dates WITHOUT confirmation from the IndyCar Stewards OR officials. Paddiiee (Patrick Carney) ( talk) 21:03, 16 October 2011 (UTC) |
The page had too many images of the driver, so I am moving one here until there is more text. Royalbroil 04:15, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
I know he is wearing white sunnies, but that photo in the article sure doesn't look like Wheldon to me. Looks more like Scott Dixon to me. Comments? Kaiwhakahaere ( talk) 22:22, 10 August 2008 (UTC)
Can someone show me where Difficult Dan came from. I can't find it independently, I can only find word for word quotes in a couple of blogs. I'm thinking someone made it up. Snetter2007 ( talk) 11:00, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
Wheldon's career might be ending today. :'( ( AutoRacingGenie ( talk) 20:42, 16 October 2011 (UTC))
Can anybody who knows how to, ask for semi-protection? ( Edmurbobby ( talk) 21:05, 16 October 2011 (UTC))
This is hardly reliable, but watching the coverage on ABC, and everything seems to say to me that he's gone. Most telling: the media was told that the drivers would not be available for interviews until IndyCar makes a statement. And Tony Kanaan is visibly crying on camera... rdfox 76 ( talk) 21:58, 16 October 2011 (UTC)
ABC news just confirmed Wheldon has died. [----]
Dan had started in last place and was racing for $5million. He had moved up 10 positions at the time of the crash. 3 other drivers also went to the hospital. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tonrunner ( talk • contribs) 22:51, 16 October 2011 (UTC)
OK so if you see the ongoing edits that have occurred you will see that there is quite a conflict as to what lap the crash was on most sources including the one I added with the original edit say 13 but people are changing it again most sources including many recently updated articles say that it was lap 13 so I have been maintaining that with in the article people have been changing it with out proper source and leaving the source that says it was lap 13. I will continue to monitor the news outlets and change if necessary. Thanks and RIP Dan Wheldon. Supereditor8000 ( talk) 22:57, 16 October 2011 (UTC)
Supereditor8000, why don't you cite IndyCar as the source for the Lap 11? That might reduce the back-and-forth somewhat if people can see in the article that Indy has said it was Lap 11. And I second your RIP Dan Wheldon. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Don Branson ( talk • contribs) 01:49, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
Just a quick update (happened to be looking back at this page remembering the whole "lap issue") the official IRL website 404ed the page with the information that has the lap number in which the crash occurred. I will leave it be for right now until I find something else that is in agreement with what the IRL formerly had on their site. Just wanted to give everyone a heads up in case someone noticed things being changed in what was a bit of a back and forth originally. Supereditor8000 ( talk) 08:09, 5 February 2013 (UTC)
Apparently multiple sources are stating the crash took place on lap 13. This is a case where the otherwise-reliable sources are wrong. The wreck occured during lap 11, the red flag came out during lap 13. Note IndyCar official timing and scoring showed, as of the completion of lap 12, Wheldon and the rest of the wrecked cars at "Diff.: 2 LAPS", i.e. two laps behind the leader, who had completed 12 laps, therefore having completed 10 laps with the wreck occuring on lap 11. - The Bushranger One ping only 22:58, 16 October 2011 (UTC)
Sorry did not see your post change if you deem necessary and no hard feelings about the back and forth between what lap it I agree that clearly no one knows for sure what lap it occurred on and maybe it would be better to eliminate that until it becomes clear. Supereditor8000 ( talk) 23:02, 16 October 2011 (UTC)
I agree I am hands off on that if one of you want to make the change but IndyCar would be the best source. Thanks Supereditor8000 ( talk) 23:07, 16 October 2011 (UTC)
The IRL website confirms lap 11. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.115.71.200 ( talk) 00:57, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
Yes, IndyCar says lap 11, not 13 as reported by BBC and CBS. Sorry for contributing to the back-and-forth! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Don Branson ( talk • contribs) 01:36, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
Who were the other 14 drivers involved in the crash? Watching the video replays shows there were two separate crashes, one right after the other. Both caused by one car swerving down the track and colliding with the car just behind. Dan Wheldon was involved in the second crash. Bizzybody ( talk) 00:17, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
It said that Cunningham clipped James Hinchcliffe, so wouldn't James Hinchcliffe have been involved in the crash? Also, it said that James Jakes was in the pits after crash. Marty Reid said that his car didn't have damage, even though he was out of the cockpit. Ptb1997 Talk 10:46, May 25, 2015 (CDT)
Why is there a link to Find a Grave. Mr Wheldon has not even been buried yet. I find what some have tried to put on this page disgusting. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.4.107.152 ( talk) 03:41, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
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please change The reasoning behind the move was that the level of investment needed to fund his racing career in the UK wasn't able to be provided by his family, to The reasoning behind the move was that the level of investment needed to fund his racing career in the UK was beyond his family's resources.
79.44.13.114 ( talk) 05:03, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
The death section should link to the race article 2011 IZOD IndyCar World Championship (this is the name of the race, not the season). And the intro section should as well. Probably a piped link for "race". 70.24.251.158 ( talk) 07:08, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
All the above nonsense would be avoided if some editors didn't treat Wikipedia as if it were a news site which has to be updated instantly to include recent events. There should be a Wikipedia policy that only events more than say a year old can be included. That would allow the dust to settled and more accurate information to become available. An encyclopaedia shouldn't encourage short termism. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.154.64.107 ( talk) 07:54, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
Agree with this. People go to news sites for up to the minute news, they come to Wikipedia for an accurate account of events after the fact. 86.149.101.102 ( talk) 10:15, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
I don't agree with this completely. First of all, the "wait a year"-idea is random and does not make sense. The only thing we need here is the rule to only include information once there are sources to back them up (which already is a rule that just is not enforced that well). Waiting a year is way too long. If something happened, then something happened and it could be included. We don't need to destroy one of the advantages of the medium by making the Wikipedia slower than books. And while I completely agree that Wikipedia is not a news site, the Wikipedia itself undermines that idea by including a "In the news" block at the top of the home page. While this is not necessarily a problem, it gives people the impression that news are part of the Wikipedia, which is annoying since people already don't understand what an encyclopedia is. But that said, recent events ARE part of an encyclopedia. They just never were, because it took so long for the print products to come out. -- 78.54.19.112 ( talk) 11:42, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
The image of the crash is tagged with a (c) watermark; would that make it ineligible for inclusion even though it was botted over with CC licensing? I'm new to image editing, so I don't want to start an FfD case if it is allowed. 67.160.116.66 ( talk) 10:20, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
Licensing issues aside, I have to question whether we should even have a picture of the crash here. In an article about the race or the crash, absolutely it's appropriate. Here in the biographical article, it strikes me as slightly morbid. -- Bongwarrior ( talk) 01:45, 18 October 2011 (UTC)
Personally, I think images and footage of the incident SHOULD NOT be used ANYWHERE by ANY MEDIA OUTLET. I was appalled enough that ESPN chose to replay the video of the crash after the announcement of Dan's death, but usage of it beyond that is outrightly disrespectful to Dan, his family, crew, fellow competitors, friends, fans, and the motorsporting community as a whole. We deserve better than to have this tragedy exploited for commercial purposes and the entertainment of the morbid. Think of how any of you would feel if it had been your loved one. We're civilized human beings; we're supposed to be beyond such barbaric practices. If the section really needs an image, you should use one of the five-lap tribute or the fan memorial outside the track instead. 68.44.244.172 ( talk) 05:20, 18 October 2011 (UTC)
The argument that showing images of the accident is alright because it's "difficult to ascertain" which car is his is wrong for multiple reasons:
No human deserves the indignity of having their death exploited for entertainment purposes, which, quite frankly, is what the news is about these days. Life is precious and should be respected above all else. I applaud the fact that the image has been removed from the article since my initial appeal. -- 68.44.244.172 ( talk) 00:17, 19 October 2011 (UTC)
This article should be spelt in British English. So it is "lap of honour" not "honor". 86.136.210.142 ( talk) 12:16, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
The tragedy occurred at Las Vegas Motor Speedway which is in fact in unincorporated Clark County, Nevada, not in the city of Las Vegas, Nevada as currently indicated in the article. I'm going to change it for accuracy. -- Oakshade ( talk) 16:01, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
Please add information about their participation in Xbox Game "IndyCar Series 2002 and 2005" source is http://www.gamespot.com/xbox/driving/indycarseries2005/review.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by XemDenots ( talk • contribs) 16:07, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
Can we get a better picture? The current one makes him look like a sleazeball. AmericanLeMans ( talk) 17:57, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
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68.224.149.138 (
talk)
18:46, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
Death of Dan Wheldon
My name is Heather and I personally was at the race when this tragity occured. It happened during the 12th lap and involved 13 drivers. Your statments on Wiki are not accurate.
Not done - Hello and welcome. Unfortunately, the IndyCar's official website confirms that the crash occurred in the 11th lap and 15 cars were involved.
Darth
Sjones23 (
talk -
contributions)
18:59, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
...to add a link to the "Find a grave" site for the freshly deceased, long before there is one to find. "Open" can be very ugly. -- 80.171.56.5 ( talk) 04:56, 18 October 2011 (UTC)
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Reviewing |
Reviewer: Harrias ( talk · contribs) 08:14, 30 April 2019 (UTC)
I can't resist this one; an article I had considered working on myself in the past.
Harrias
talk
08:14, 30 April 2019 (UTC)
"The name of a flag's political entity should appear adjacent to the first use of the flag, as no reader is familiar with every flag, and many flags differ only in minor details."
All look good on a quick first pass. I can't access ref #117 ("Indy 500 another way for Wheldon to validate career") in the UK, but I have no reason to believe there is any issue with it. There are a couple of short passages that could bear further paraphrasing though:
"The chassis of the 77 impacted (upon) a post along the right side of the tub, and created a deep defect in the tub that extended from the bulkhead, along the upper border of the tub and through the cockpit"
"He collided with a fence post along his tub's right-hand side, creating a deep defect in the tub that extended from the pedal bulkhead along its upper section and through the cockpit."
"What was also witnessed was unlimited movement on the track surface under race conditions."
"and the unlimited movement on the track surface under racing conditions"
Detailed prose review to follow. Harrias talk 09:08, 30 April 2019 (UTC)
"The following year, Wheldon moved to AGR, winning nine races (including the 2005 Indianapolis 500) and finishing as the runner-up in the 2004 series championship."Is this right? The 2005 Indy, but he 2004 championship?
"He won the drivers' title in 2005 with the record for most victories during a season in his time with the team."I'm not quite sure what purpose "in his time with the team" is serving here?
"and the fifth Indianapolis 500 winner to die in the same year as winning the race."This feels a bit like trivia, and perhaps not necessary in the lead.
"Wheldon was born in the farming village of Emberton..."Most British villages could be described as "farming villages" to be honest. This isn't mentioned in the reference provided.
"and his mother acted as his timekeeper."Clarification is needed here; was she timekeeper for Dan, or Clive?
"He went to the private Bedford School.."Do we have any details on how someone who
"did not have a wealthy background"went to private school?
"...races for second in the standings."Might sound more encyclopaedic as "..races to finish second in the standings."
"The following year, Wheldon was fourth in both the British Formula Ford Championship and the European Formula Ford Championship for Andy Welch Racing with seven victories."Seven victories in each, or combined?
"...Van Diemen team and drove a Mygale in 1998."The phrasing make it sound like these are two different events; he improved to third and he drove a Mygale. Maybe change to "...Van Diemen team, driving a Mygale, in 1998."?
"With Button taking the titles..."Avoid using "with" as a conjunction like this; can the sentence be reworded to get rid of it?
"With Button taking the titles, Wheldon did not have the necessary level of funding from his father..."A further issue is that the current wording make it sound like it was Button's fault that Wheldon's father didn't have the funding. I assume that the titles came with sponsorship opportunities? If so, this should be spelt out more clearly.
"Thus, at the suggestion of his former team principal and car manufacturer.."Remove "Thus", it's superfluous.
"His funding was provided by his team and Van Diemen.Which team, his Van Diemen team from 1998, or the Jayhard/Primus Racing for 1999?
"During the 2000 Toyota Atlantic Championship, he drove..."This is a sudden jump; can more information on his move to the Toyota Atlantic Championship from the U.S. F2000 National Championship be included; was this a step up, a sideways shift, what?
"..in series' history.."No need for the apostrophe; it would only be needed for "..in the series' history..".
"..in the championship standings with 159 points with a further.."The quick repetition of "with" is uncomfortable, can it be reworked?
"Wheldon was named the series' Rookie of the Year for his season's performance."The last bit, "..for his season's performance." is superfluous and can be cut.
"For the 2001 season, Wheldon moved to PacWest Lights to compete in Indy Lights.Again a bit more explanation could be provided. First, clarify that "PacWest Lights" is a racing team, rather than a series. Secondly, can it be clarified whether a move to Indy Lights is a step up, sideways, or whatever.
Okay, taking a break. Harrias talk 10:28, 30 April 2019 (UTC)
"He came 15th in the season-closing..."As this number is essentially been compared with the seventh place quali and tenth place finish in the previous race, I think we need to write fifteenth, per MOS:NUMNOTES.
"He finished his two-race campaign 36th in the points standings with 35 accrued."It might be overkill, but for clarity I'd spell out "with 35 points accrued."
"He was called up later to drive when regular driver Dario Franchitti broke his vertebrae in a motor bike accident in Scotland."The end of the previous paragraph sort of implied that Wheldon would be driving, so it would be worth making it clear that the sponsorship presumably wasn't found for him to drive in 2003 (at least at the start of the season).
"He qualified for his first Indianapolis 500 in fifth after his team changed his car number to 26."This wording almost seems to suggest that he qualified in fifth because of the number change. Do we really need to mention the number change at all? If we do, can it be given less prominence somehow?
"In late-race, he..."Maybe change to "Late in the race, he..."
"Wheldon was retained as a driver following the retirement of team owner Michael Andretti who mentored him."Is there any suggestion that Andretti retired specifically to make way for Wheldon? It would be interesting to note that if so.
"Wheldon's performances enhanced his reputation exponentially..."A couple of issues here; "exponentially" is PUFFERY in this context, and should be removed. The suggestion that his reputation was enhanced is quite subjective, and could possibly do with inline attribution ("according to so-and-so...").
"...Wheldon won his first career pole position and finished third after his teammate Tony Kanaan passed him on the first lap.Is the fact that Kanaan passed him specifically relevant? At least one other driver overtook him for him to finish third, so it seems odd to mention Kanaan.
"Wheldon became the first British driver to win an American open-wheel championship since Nigel Mansell in 1993, and the first to win both the Indianapolis 500 and the title since Jacques Villeneuve in 1995.This (note a) seems to imply that Jacques Villeneuve was a British driver. It might be solved by just adding "driver" again after "and the first"?
"He hit Sam Hornish Jr. in the pit lane during a caution period at the 2006 Grand Prix of St. Petersburg."Is this significant enough to include in his biography?
"He started eighteenth in the Indianapolis 500 finishing six places higher in 12th.."Needs to be twelfth to match eighteenth and second.
"He was released from his CGR contract on 3 September as Dario Franchitti left NASCAR and returned to IndyCar."Did that mean that he missed the end of the season then?
"He was tenth in the championship standings with 354 points,[81] his lowest finish since he placed 11th in 2003.""tenth" and "11th" need to match.
That's me for tonight, too tired to read any more! Harrias talk 21:22, 1 May 2019 (UTC)
"...being eliminated from the Round of 16 by Sébastien Bourdais in a buggy car."I don't know whether "Round" needs to be capitalised here. I'd also recommend removing "in a buggy car", as it could give the impression that Wheldon was in a 'real' car, and Bourdais beat him while only driving a buggy!
"The trio won its class and overall..."Given that winning the race overall would automatically mean they won their class, I think this is a bit redundant. Can it be rephrased to basically just say that they won the race?
"...due to it sustaining three accidents during the event."Remove "it".
"$5 million would be divided equally between the driver and a randomly selected fan..."Per MOS:NUMNOTES, avoid starting a sentence with a number.
"..and travelling on the inside line.."This could do with a note to explain what it means.
"..towards the infield and collected fellow competitors..""Collected" might be jargon here, consider a more accessible alternative.
"..along his tub's right-hand side, creating a deep defect in the tub that went.."Explanation of what "tub" means needed. Could we just use "car" the first time, and "chassis" the second?
"That deformed its roll hoop and sheared from the tub."I'm a little lost here; did the roll hoop shear from the tub? If so, rephrase to "That deformed its roll hoop, which sheared from the tub."
"..by the trackside safety team and their Las Vegas-based colleagues.."Are the trackside safety team not LV based? This feels like excessive detail.
"He was 33 years old."I umm and arr about this. Technically is is a purely factual statement. However, placing it alone in a sentence like this adds to the emotional impact, and I'm not sure that's appropriate in an encyclopedia.
"..and unlimited track movement while racing created more car-to-car contact.."What does this mean?
"During the 2016 Kobalt 400 at Las Vegas Motor Speedway, pit reporter Jamie Little, who covered that INDYCAR race and was assigned to the trauma centre after the crash, and motorsport publicist Brent Brush, who helped Wheldon's sponsorship deals, placed a Dan Wheldon Memorial plaque outside turn two, near the point where he was killed."This is a long sentence which is trying to say too much for me. It either needs splitting down, or some of the information removing. Note also the inconsistent format "INDYCAR".
"In May, a book entitled Lionheart: Remembering Dan Wheldon covering his life.."Add the year for clarity.
All done. Great work; do you have plans to take this on to FA? Harrias talk 09:27, 3 May 2019 (UTC)
The Early and personal life section says Wheldon "...did not have a wealthy background". Why is that worth a mention? It's hardly breathtakingly unusual -- most people in the world don't come from a wealthy background. As well, Wheldon didn't come from a poor background either. Moriori ( talk) 20:52, 3 May 2019 (UTC)
It wasn’t Amazing Grace that they played after the accident during the 5 lap tribute, it was Danny Boy, on bagpipes. I was there in person. 2600:8802:E00:3B9:6591:D301:B9C2:754C ( talk) 00:05, 18 October 2023 (UTC)