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i know we had (and still have) pipex dial here in the uk before we got ADSL. Also webcache.dsl.pipex.com seems to point at a uunet box. Can anyone clarify the details of what happened? Plugwash 19:36, 15 October 2005 (UTC)
But this article doesn't mention anything about the new pipex doing dial at all. If he indeed bought the pipex dial buisness along with the pipex name that needs to be mentioned (preferablly with a source). Also your comments still don't explain why the web cache they tell thier users to use identifies itself as a UUNET box (although maybe thats just thrown in with a transit agreement or something) Plugwash 18:26, 4 November 2005 (UTC)
Daisy wholesale resells BT openreach ADSL and Fibre, a host of other suppliers (Talk Talk, Sky, etc who all just use openreach infrastructure) as well as Virgin Fibre. I'm not an expert but I believe that the only other company to lay their own cable is Vodafone for some business customers. There's numerous offices around the UK, the work is still subcontracted out to Openreach engineers and essentially Daisy are the middlemen and another layer of bureaucracy. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:C7D:7853:2B00:5975:FC62:4A18:46DD ( talk) 19:21, 25 February 2018 (UTC)
David Rickards did indeed purchase the PIPEX Dial customers from MCI and formed PIPEX Internet Ltd to run the service. Prior to this he owned and ran a company called Highway Response which had contract with MCI to run the billing and sales for the PIPEX DIAL service. The meant that PIPEX Internet became a wholesaler of the MCI network. Because the old PIPEX domains were integrated with very old legacy systems, it took MCI many years to sort these out and hand over the ownership of the domains to PIPEX. The PIPEX Dial service was still run on the MCI backbone servers and slowly over several years, PIPEX built their own mail, news & web servers and migrated customers to these. Please note I am privvy to this information as I was one of the company directors from 1997 - 2003 and worked for Mr Rickards from 1995. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.105.251.12 ( talk) 01:29, 1 February 2008 (UTC)
This phrase doesn't make sense to me. i presume it was mean to be either "it aquired" or "it was aquired by". i'd guess the latter but i don't wan't to change it without confirmation. Plugwash 21:45, 26 December 2005 (UTC)
The recently added "analysis" of "market position and power" seems to be a spam by the "research" company "backchannel".
The text is littered with speculation and the accomanying heavily-branded chart is meaningless.
This section needs rewriting for objectivity or deleting. 212.42.15.50 22:21, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
I added information about the current Pipex advertising campaign on UK TV featuring David Hasselhoff together with a link to a website critical of his product endorsement and of Pipex products. I have personal knowledge of the site in question. Without mention of the critical website, which contains comments by a number of disgruntled Pipex clients, the article about Pipex reads like a long advert for the company and its products. With the inclusion of the website reference, it is slightly more balanced. The positive information still greatly outweighs the negative. John Donovan 12 Sept 2006
I note that someone subsequently deleted the information about the website critical of Pipex. It seems that this article is considered to be a PR platform for Pipex and is perhaps patrolled and protected on that basis. The information was then put back in, not by me.
Visited the Pipex article again on 24 Sept 2006. Information about the website critical of Pipex has again been deleted. Someone seems determined that this article must serve solely as a PR/Advertising feature for Pipex and edits the article accordingly. They would apparently prefer to have no mention of the current "King of the Internet" TV adverts featuring David Hasselhoff, than have reference to the related critical website. I will leave it to others to decide whether this is acceptable. John Donovan.
There are four website links, all to sites critical of Pipex. A vast amount of information and evidence is displayed on the sites. No visitor to this article is compelled to click on any of the links to view the negative material. It they choose to do so, it might be because they have a genuine interest in reading what some Pipex users have to say so that they can form a balanced opinion. Surely the purpose of the article in not merely to provide a PR platform for Pipex. Does it not suggest that something a very amiss when four different individuals feel sufficiently aggrieved to take the time and trouble and spend money to set up the gripe websites. I cannot think of any other company which has generated so many gripe sites. If anyone takes the trouble to read the correspondence on the sites they will find that it is far from being a rant. Johnadonovan 22:24, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!
maru (talk) contribs 04:29, 27 July 2006 (UTC)
I removed the following:
However, Pipex is not necessarily one of the worst offenders in the UK telecoms market and the majority of anti-Pipex blogs and gripe websites (such as Poopex) have been set up by disgruntled current or former customers with a grudge and therefore may not mirror the level of customer service enjoyed by most Pipex clients.
There is evidence that customers loathe Pipex more than their competitors (the index listed). There's none that Pipex *isn't* the worst. Also, of course the anti-Pipex blogs have been set up by disgruntled customers. What, you expect them to have been set up by happy customers? This stuff is either obvious, or unsourced, so I removed it.
You might think that this is POV, but I had never even heard of Pipex until I found this article via RC. I live in the US, so they don't affect me at all. Novalis 22:10, 23 April 2007 (UTC)
I reinstated the "Pipex customer service" section which was entirely deleted without anyone even explaining why on this discussion page. I have removed links which no longer function. -- Johnadonovan 21:21, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
This article is subjective in its content about rumours and opinion on customer service. These references have been removed or edited, both from the point of view of removing blatent PR from Pipex and Wikipedia being used as a corporate bashing site from disgruntled customers. RR 12:10, 19 May 2007 (UTC)
I have reinstated the section on Pipex Customer Service but in a shortened version removing personal opinion. The anti-Pipex gripe sites are a fact. Quotes about Pipex customer service are taken from reputable publications. I do not believe that it is appropriate for one person – especially one who is apparently not an administrator - to take it upon themselves to remove a whole section developed over time by several contributors. Some of the content was inappropriate but other parts are factual and verifiable as being such. Johnadonovan 22:38, 20 May 2007 (UTC) I have edited down slightly claims of pipexcommunications website being the "original" as this can't be backed up. RR 12:10, 10 June 2007 (UTC)
I have removed a paragraph which set out the personal opinion/POV of a contributor. They are of course entitled to their opinion, but POV is not allowed under Wikipedia rules. There must presumably be some evidence/research obtainable from a reputable verifiable source confirming the positive views expressed about Pipex Customer support. I will leave it to the relevant contributor to find the information and insert it in the article with appropriate source verification links.
Johnadonovan 15:08, 22 May 2007 (UTC)
It might be worth noting though that the CS is terrible and staff retention as well as careers there are pretty rubbish. Obviously if you're unlucky enough to work there YMMV. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:C7D:7853:2B00:5975:FC62:4A18:46DD ( talk) 19:23, 25 February 2018 (UTC)
"This was done to both save money and provide the customers with a better service" This is currently stated as a fact with no attibutions as to who said it, nor any citations. If this is the party line of tiscali corporate then it needs to be clearly marked as such. Plugwash ( talk) 22:49, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
I updated (appropriately, I hope) the external links section of this article to provived readers with direct links for some of the sites of companies which are part of the Freedom4 Group. Please add, edit, remove as needed.
Nildram redirects here, but I'm not sure this is correct. Nildram (as part of Pipex) is currently owned by Tiscali. Which I think is now (or soon will be) part of TalkTalk -- but I'm getting conflicting accounts trying to research this. Anyhow for the moment it seems to be that Nildram should redirect somewhere else, perhaps Tiscali for the moment... any thoughts/objections? -- Muntfish ( talk) 13:23, 28 July 2009 (UTC)
Just to confuse things even more, this company appears to have renamed to Daisy Group plc[ [1]], which appears to combine Daisy Communications, Freedom4 PLC and Vialtus Solutions. Sounds like an accountants nightmare. It's getting difficult to track this and keep this article accurate. Any suggestions? -- Hm2k ( talk) 13:55, 28 July 2009 (UTC)
Can confirm that as of Oct 2015 they were 'Daisy Group' which includes daisy wholesale, and other companies. There's also some link with SSE too. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:C7D:7853:2B00:5975:FC62:4A18:46DD ( talk) 19:18, 25 February 2018 (UTC)
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i know we had (and still have) pipex dial here in the uk before we got ADSL. Also webcache.dsl.pipex.com seems to point at a uunet box. Can anyone clarify the details of what happened? Plugwash 19:36, 15 October 2005 (UTC)
But this article doesn't mention anything about the new pipex doing dial at all. If he indeed bought the pipex dial buisness along with the pipex name that needs to be mentioned (preferablly with a source). Also your comments still don't explain why the web cache they tell thier users to use identifies itself as a UUNET box (although maybe thats just thrown in with a transit agreement or something) Plugwash 18:26, 4 November 2005 (UTC)
Daisy wholesale resells BT openreach ADSL and Fibre, a host of other suppliers (Talk Talk, Sky, etc who all just use openreach infrastructure) as well as Virgin Fibre. I'm not an expert but I believe that the only other company to lay their own cable is Vodafone for some business customers. There's numerous offices around the UK, the work is still subcontracted out to Openreach engineers and essentially Daisy are the middlemen and another layer of bureaucracy. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:C7D:7853:2B00:5975:FC62:4A18:46DD ( talk) 19:21, 25 February 2018 (UTC)
David Rickards did indeed purchase the PIPEX Dial customers from MCI and formed PIPEX Internet Ltd to run the service. Prior to this he owned and ran a company called Highway Response which had contract with MCI to run the billing and sales for the PIPEX DIAL service. The meant that PIPEX Internet became a wholesaler of the MCI network. Because the old PIPEX domains were integrated with very old legacy systems, it took MCI many years to sort these out and hand over the ownership of the domains to PIPEX. The PIPEX Dial service was still run on the MCI backbone servers and slowly over several years, PIPEX built their own mail, news & web servers and migrated customers to these. Please note I am privvy to this information as I was one of the company directors from 1997 - 2003 and worked for Mr Rickards from 1995. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.105.251.12 ( talk) 01:29, 1 February 2008 (UTC)
This phrase doesn't make sense to me. i presume it was mean to be either "it aquired" or "it was aquired by". i'd guess the latter but i don't wan't to change it without confirmation. Plugwash 21:45, 26 December 2005 (UTC)
The recently added "analysis" of "market position and power" seems to be a spam by the "research" company "backchannel".
The text is littered with speculation and the accomanying heavily-branded chart is meaningless.
This section needs rewriting for objectivity or deleting. 212.42.15.50 22:21, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
I added information about the current Pipex advertising campaign on UK TV featuring David Hasselhoff together with a link to a website critical of his product endorsement and of Pipex products. I have personal knowledge of the site in question. Without mention of the critical website, which contains comments by a number of disgruntled Pipex clients, the article about Pipex reads like a long advert for the company and its products. With the inclusion of the website reference, it is slightly more balanced. The positive information still greatly outweighs the negative. John Donovan 12 Sept 2006
I note that someone subsequently deleted the information about the website critical of Pipex. It seems that this article is considered to be a PR platform for Pipex and is perhaps patrolled and protected on that basis. The information was then put back in, not by me.
Visited the Pipex article again on 24 Sept 2006. Information about the website critical of Pipex has again been deleted. Someone seems determined that this article must serve solely as a PR/Advertising feature for Pipex and edits the article accordingly. They would apparently prefer to have no mention of the current "King of the Internet" TV adverts featuring David Hasselhoff, than have reference to the related critical website. I will leave it to others to decide whether this is acceptable. John Donovan.
There are four website links, all to sites critical of Pipex. A vast amount of information and evidence is displayed on the sites. No visitor to this article is compelled to click on any of the links to view the negative material. It they choose to do so, it might be because they have a genuine interest in reading what some Pipex users have to say so that they can form a balanced opinion. Surely the purpose of the article in not merely to provide a PR platform for Pipex. Does it not suggest that something a very amiss when four different individuals feel sufficiently aggrieved to take the time and trouble and spend money to set up the gripe websites. I cannot think of any other company which has generated so many gripe sites. If anyone takes the trouble to read the correspondence on the sites they will find that it is far from being a rant. Johnadonovan 22:24, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!
maru (talk) contribs 04:29, 27 July 2006 (UTC)
I removed the following:
However, Pipex is not necessarily one of the worst offenders in the UK telecoms market and the majority of anti-Pipex blogs and gripe websites (such as Poopex) have been set up by disgruntled current or former customers with a grudge and therefore may not mirror the level of customer service enjoyed by most Pipex clients.
There is evidence that customers loathe Pipex more than their competitors (the index listed). There's none that Pipex *isn't* the worst. Also, of course the anti-Pipex blogs have been set up by disgruntled customers. What, you expect them to have been set up by happy customers? This stuff is either obvious, or unsourced, so I removed it.
You might think that this is POV, but I had never even heard of Pipex until I found this article via RC. I live in the US, so they don't affect me at all. Novalis 22:10, 23 April 2007 (UTC)
I reinstated the "Pipex customer service" section which was entirely deleted without anyone even explaining why on this discussion page. I have removed links which no longer function. -- Johnadonovan 21:21, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
This article is subjective in its content about rumours and opinion on customer service. These references have been removed or edited, both from the point of view of removing blatent PR from Pipex and Wikipedia being used as a corporate bashing site from disgruntled customers. RR 12:10, 19 May 2007 (UTC)
I have reinstated the section on Pipex Customer Service but in a shortened version removing personal opinion. The anti-Pipex gripe sites are a fact. Quotes about Pipex customer service are taken from reputable publications. I do not believe that it is appropriate for one person – especially one who is apparently not an administrator - to take it upon themselves to remove a whole section developed over time by several contributors. Some of the content was inappropriate but other parts are factual and verifiable as being such. Johnadonovan 22:38, 20 May 2007 (UTC) I have edited down slightly claims of pipexcommunications website being the "original" as this can't be backed up. RR 12:10, 10 June 2007 (UTC)
I have removed a paragraph which set out the personal opinion/POV of a contributor. They are of course entitled to their opinion, but POV is not allowed under Wikipedia rules. There must presumably be some evidence/research obtainable from a reputable verifiable source confirming the positive views expressed about Pipex Customer support. I will leave it to the relevant contributor to find the information and insert it in the article with appropriate source verification links.
Johnadonovan 15:08, 22 May 2007 (UTC)
It might be worth noting though that the CS is terrible and staff retention as well as careers there are pretty rubbish. Obviously if you're unlucky enough to work there YMMV. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:C7D:7853:2B00:5975:FC62:4A18:46DD ( talk) 19:23, 25 February 2018 (UTC)
"This was done to both save money and provide the customers with a better service" This is currently stated as a fact with no attibutions as to who said it, nor any citations. If this is the party line of tiscali corporate then it needs to be clearly marked as such. Plugwash ( talk) 22:49, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
I updated (appropriately, I hope) the external links section of this article to provived readers with direct links for some of the sites of companies which are part of the Freedom4 Group. Please add, edit, remove as needed.
Nildram redirects here, but I'm not sure this is correct. Nildram (as part of Pipex) is currently owned by Tiscali. Which I think is now (or soon will be) part of TalkTalk -- but I'm getting conflicting accounts trying to research this. Anyhow for the moment it seems to be that Nildram should redirect somewhere else, perhaps Tiscali for the moment... any thoughts/objections? -- Muntfish ( talk) 13:23, 28 July 2009 (UTC)
Just to confuse things even more, this company appears to have renamed to Daisy Group plc[ [1]], which appears to combine Daisy Communications, Freedom4 PLC and Vialtus Solutions. Sounds like an accountants nightmare. It's getting difficult to track this and keep this article accurate. Any suggestions? -- Hm2k ( talk) 13:55, 28 July 2009 (UTC)
Can confirm that as of Oct 2015 they were 'Daisy Group' which includes daisy wholesale, and other companies. There's also some link with SSE too. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:C7D:7853:2B00:5975:FC62:4A18:46DD ( talk) 19:18, 25 February 2018 (UTC)
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