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Cypriot refugees article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
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The subject of this article is controversial and content may be in dispute. When updating the article, be bold, but not reckless. Feel free to try to improve the article, but don't take it personally if your changes are reversed; instead, come here to the talk page to discuss them. Content must be written from a neutral point of view. Include citations when adding content and consider tagging or removing unsourced information. |
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“On August 2, 1975 the two parties reached in Vienna the Voluntary Exchange of Population Agreement, implemented under United Nations auspices.”
Utter rubbish! No such thing as a “Voluntary Exchange of Population Agreement” EVER took place! What you seem to be (intentionally) confusing is the…
The Third Vienna Agreement - August 1975
http://www.mfa.gov.cy/mfa/mfa2006.nsf/All/0658E5B2F4D1A538C22571D30034D15D/$file/August%201975.pdf
Where you’ll find that the words “population” and/or “exchange” are not even mentioned in this document! It was a temporary humanitarian UN facilitation for broken families and missing persons and certainly not a “population exchange”!
Get your facts right and article credible!
All references to “agreement” in political articles should be escorted by a credible link to that agreement, so the reader may observe what you’re talking about! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.149.182.112 ( talk) 10:33, 1 August 2010 (UTC)
Bits like The human rights of the refugees wishing to return to their former homes and properties are currently being violated as their return is denied by the Turkish army.
Is now out of date, as under a order from the ECHR, . So far I believe that 3 cases have been concluded so far (Despite oposition from the Greek Cypriot government)
http://www.turkishweekly.net/news.php?id=34015 -- SolDrury 11:26, 25 September 2006 (UTC)
Your reference claims exactly the opposite of what you describe, please read your reference.
It seems that this mechanism aims in recognizing TRNC and not offering properties back to rightfull owners.
In Short, Bits like The human rights of the refugees wishing to return to their former homes and properties are currently being violated as their return is denied by the Turkish army. are the essence of the article, true and verifiable. I think the link you have supplied needs to be added in the externals for reference. Aristovoul0s 15:41, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
Please contribute freely Aristovoul0s 18:00, 24 September 2006 (UTC)
Another great nationalist contribution to Wikipedia. Greek Cypriots are not the only refugees in Cyprus. TC's became refugees long before 74 when the Greek army under Grivas was terrorising their villages. Inflated GC figures, original research, words like "Turkish Brutality", accusations that TC ministers shot GC protestors, usual legal documents criticisng Turkey etc etc. Need i say more. -- A.Garnet 19:54, 24 September 2006 (UTC)
Please feel free to pinpoint what is not cited. Feel free to add about TC's refugees. If you are willing to give me a hand lets also write about Cyprus refugees and displaced people during the Ottoman Empire. Aristovoul0s 22:19, 24 September 2006 (UTC)
I've deleted the "comparisons" section as it was unencyclopedic. It's like having an article about the Iraq War and having a section saying "imagine if America was invaded - here's what it would be like". — Khoi khoi 22:58, 24 September 2006 (UTC)
Although some encyclopedias do have "comparisons" i can live with that. Aristovoul0s 15:42, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
There were too many images depicting the Greek POV, so I decided to add one that is well-known to most Turks. Hopefully this won't cause any problems. — Khoi khoi 23:15, 24 September 2006 (UTC)
I just don't get where all this animosity comes from, it is because of this very reason that Wikipedia's standing takes a hit.. Maybe the world doesn't merit an open encyclopedia because there are way too many people who harbor so much animosity and have agendas.. Ditto A. Garnet Baristarim 23:53, 24 September 2006 (UTC)
Please assume good faith in my person. I do not want to confront you both like this but seeing your comment and your edits to this article someone could say that it is YOU who have an agenda. Why dont you add constructively??? Aristovoul0s 15:46, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
Doesnt the content of this article fall in the older article Civilian casualties and displacements during the Cyprus conflict? -- A.Garnet 08:54, 25 September 2006 (UTC)
I disagree Civilian casualties and displacements during the Cyprus conflict covers the civilian casualties and displacements that occurred between 1963 and 1975 — from the outbreak of the intercommunal fighting until the end of displacements following the Turkish Invasion of Cyprus. "Cypriot refugee" though focuses with the still ongoing strife of cypriot refugees, from 1974 onwards. 87.228.212.10 19:58, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
And i quote : Charter of the United Nations Article 2 "The Organization and its Members, in pursuit of the Purposes stated in Article 1, shall act in accordance with the following Principles".
4. All Members shall refrain in their international relations from the threat or use of force against the territorial integrity or political independence of any state, or in any other manner inconsistent with the Purposes of the United Nations. Both Turkey and Republic of Cyprus are members. Turkey has obligation under the charter to respect the Sovereignty of the Republic of Cyprus. If otherwise then she is violating her obligation. I hold that the word illegal should be used and i back it up by the UN member countries take away Turkey. How many countries hold your view? Aristovoul0s 18:40, 29 September 2006 (UTC)
I agree with the addition of this article to the Civilian casualties and displacements during the Cyprus conflict article as a separate section, cause Civilian casualties and displacements during the Cyprus conflict is more general than this one. E104421 12:56, 29 September 2006 (UTC)
This article is highly biased. — Khoi khoi 15:08, 5 October 2006 (UTC)
Please elaborate khoikoi... or at least justify your comment... Aristovoul0s 15:35, 5 October 2006 (UTC)
This page is contentious because of the ingrained bias of the Greeks and Greek Cypriots against anything Turkish. Turkish Cypriots can never feel safe in a unitary state, and their having to become enclaved refugees between 1963-1974, and the pushing out of the T/C's to the north as part of the population 'exchanges' of 1975 means that there is plenty of blame that can be laid at the G/C's door. Expatkiwi
A refugee by UN definition is someone forced to flee their country's borders, therefore this article implicity recognises two countries in Cyprus :) -- A.Garnet 22:51, 8 October 2006 (UTC)
No my friend, the coup had not already failed. The Treaty was broken on July 15 with the Athens backed coup and installment of Nicos Sampson, literally a known murderer, who had already taken the Presidential oath. Turkey intervenes July 20th, junta and coup fail July 23rd. Therefore praise be to Turkey for being the liberators of Greece! :) -- A.Garnet 00:51, 9 October 2006 (UTC)
Please list your cited arguments and we will discuss them all, one by one. Thanks Aristovoul0s 17:07, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
I have told you before. GC's were not the only refugees, and this problem did certainly not start in 1974. The whole thing either needs rewriting, or merging with the other civilian casualty article. How you can create an article like this, and not expect people to significantly change it is beyond me. -- A.Garnet 18:11, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
Issues so far (please contribute to the list preferable if you provide sources, Thanks) Aristovoul0s 20:09, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
Really Aristovolous, what you have done in my opinion is gone to the kypros website, absorbed all the rubbish there (i have come across that before, and you will be hard pushed to find one mention of a TC casualty there) and regurgitated it here. How can you create an article like this and not feel ashamed that you will be accused of nationalist pov pushing? Do you not even realise that Turkish Cypriots were victims in this conflict also? -- A.Garnet 20:21, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
Any more concerns? Please list them Aristovoul0s 15:42, 12 October 2006 (UTC)
Do you speak on behalf of all? If you dont let others contribute as well otherwise we can begin discussing points top down. Aristovoul0s 16:32, 13 October 2006 (UTC)
Is the Turkish military occupying 37 or 38% of the island? Trantellinas 23:15, 23 October 2006 (UTC)Trantellinas
That 1963 background paragraph is the biggest load of BS on wikipedia. Are you (Aristovouls) SERIOUSLY suggesting that the TCs abandonned their homes to live in horrible conditions JUST to get Turkey to invade and seperate the island. YOu fail to mention the TCs that were being murdered by EOKA (A&B) at the time. Im not going to touch this article as Ive given up editing Cyprus related articles on Wikipedia but your blatant and hateful re-writing of history is desicable. Its shameful, really and truely shameful. I also notice that none of our less nationalistic greek editors have seen fit to attempt to balance out that entry. This is why Wikipedia is a flawed concept and will only ever be of use for non controversial subjects. Adam777 16:30, 2 November 2006 (UTC)
Adam777, The reason TCs were being murdered by EOKA A is quite justifiably because the TCs sided with the British when GCs took up arms to fight against British colonialism (1955-1959).
The murdered TCs you're refering to are actually TMT members are they not? When GCs eventually won independance from Britain (with blood, sweat, and tears) the TCs were understandably left looking rather uncomfortable! Wouldn't you? (Posted by Marios Polycarpou)
I don't know you tell me, but what about the Turkish Cypriot thug hired by Turkey who on the 7th June 1958 placed a bomb outside the Turkish press office in Nicosia and ended up sparking the inter-communal fighting? Was that a kid too? (Posted by Marios Polycarpou)
Thanks for the offer. As much as I'd like to contribute I'm already full-on with letters/articles on the Cyprus issue in various other places :) Regards MP.
Niko, unfortunately I would need to enable cookies to log on and I can't have that on my system for security reasons but feel free to write at marios-polycarpou[at]cytanet[dot]com[dot]cy An thelete obote ehete provlima me kapion gia tin kipro mborite na mou stilete to keimeno tou kai ego tha sas stilo biso abantisi gia afto tin idia mera. Me katalaves?
Turkey currently does not recognize the 1960 Treaty of Guarantee This statement is false, infact Turkish policy about Cyprus is based on Treaty of Guarantee.-- Hattusili 06:19, 27 November 2006 (UTC)
I believe only now the article resembles something morelike an encylopedia entry. I tried to focus it just on displacement and property, removing all repeated information concerning casualties and the conflict from other articles. Removed all the politically charged pictures, Greek and Turkish, added relevant info about the Annan plan, EU accesion and Turkish Cypriot property commision. -- A.Garnet 14:14, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
This is the second time i am reverting what you personaly dont like seeing. The first time was right before you took the article to afd Aristovouλos (T) 16:54, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
"Tasos Isaak beaten to death within the Buffer Zone, have a close look at who gives the final blow."
- Francis Tyers · 18:31, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
Maybe this is better, What do you think? Aristovouλos (T) 18:44, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
Hector, de jure only the Republic of Cyprus can tell him what to do. Aristovouλos (T) 18:47, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
LOL: http://www.hr-action.org/ — looks "reliable" to me. Haha, and another one: " http://agrino.org/humrights/hr06/derynia.htm" - Francis Tyers · 19:03, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
There is a void during the period of 1963-1974. I believe there were peaceful attempts to resolve this deadlock over the functioning of the government, the enclaves and with both side tantalizingly close to an agreement in the months before the 1974 events.
I am anticipating that people may argue that the "void" is due to the fact that there was Turkish-Cypriot non-participation in the government of the Republic of Cyprus. Nevertheless, events between these years reflect, either significantly or insignificantly depending on apparent point of view the diligence of Cypriots to try to resolve the constitutional differences.
(
UNFanatic
20:50, 1 December 2006 (UTC))
Why were the pictures removed from the page? Chaldean 06:27, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
No, things aren't as self-explanatory as you think. Which specific parts of the article did you disagree with, and why? You can't simply reject it in its entirety and replace it without a consensus on this talk page. I have already suggested that the sections on the women protestors and the murders of Isaak and Solomou should be reinstated as they are more than noteworthy. I am sure you'll agree that what happened to them wasn't simply a figment of the Greeks' imagination. As for the specific wording, that can be hammered out here if you find the existing wording objectionable. I eagerly await your proposals. ·ΚέκρωΨ· 16:12, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
Now now, WP:NPA. User:Aristovoul0s is not subhuman for disagreeing with you. Far from having a "better formal tone", the current version is rather poorly written, with Turkish POV throughout and consistently bad spelling and grammar. The old version simply has more raw material to work with. ·ΚέκρωΨ· 16:20, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
So the property commision should be more than a side note since it is set to become one of the major structures to deal with the property problems of refugees.. That's all... Baristarim 18:45, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
Question: I know that Turkey was one of the guarantor powers, the others being Greece and the UK. Thus within this role as a guarantor power, it recognizes the Republic of Cyprus, to which it is a signitory of the treaties of the establishment of the country. When did Turkey withdraw recognition of the Republic of Cyprus? From my understanding, not recognizing the Republic of Cyprus entails an abandonment of the role as both a guarnator power and an abandonment of the right to intervene to return the country to the original status quo of the treaty, to which it has never done.( UNFanatic 21:23, 7 December 2006 (UTC))
The current version is an improvement, although tilts the balance over to the other POV. I think this version is a much better starting point for improving the article. The references are good (nothing from hilariously propagandistic Greek sites). Many more (reliable) references are required, and the bit about Turkey joining the EU should go. This version reads much better than the previous version in terms of style and neutrality, although there are a number of spelling mistakes (although possibly not more than the previous version). I think that Kekrops suggestion is good, wrt. "Makarios proposed several amendments to the constitution which Turkish Cypriots viewed as a threat to their constitutional status".
Also, the "1963-74 background" summary needs to be neutralised a bit. All-in-all a much better article to start work with. It would be great if you guys could work together here to improve the article with a view to getting the protection lifted. You might try raising issues, or making suggestions for expansion, and then see how the others see it. I'll start off:
In the paragraph starting "Through the years multiple demonstrations and rallies...", I'm curious, were the womens protests for the same reasons (e.g. return of property?) I thought there were some protests due to "disappeared" husbands and sons. If there were, these should be mentioned. This might not be a specific thing about refugees and might to better in one of the other articles though. - Francis Tyers · 14:26, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
im not a Turk first of all but statements made in this article does not at all reflect the reality and show no parallellism to what I've been teaching and learning throughout my teaching career on European History. To depict Turkish army and policy of the time in such negative terms must be what you should re-consider before warning anybody who edits these inaccurate and non-real, non-academic free-writing drafts; you should not call them articles. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.164.189.39 ( talk) 08:16, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
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This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Cypriot refugees article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
The subject of this article is controversial and content may be in dispute. When updating the article, be bold, but not reckless. Feel free to try to improve the article, but don't take it personally if your changes are reversed; instead, come here to the talk page to discuss them. Content must be written from a neutral point of view. Include citations when adding content and consider tagging or removing unsourced information. |
This article was nominated for deletion on October 20, 2006. The result of the discussion was keep. |
This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||
|
This article may be within the scope of Greek and Turkish wikipedians cooperation board. Please see the project page for more details, to request intervention on the notification board or peruse other tasks. |
“On August 2, 1975 the two parties reached in Vienna the Voluntary Exchange of Population Agreement, implemented under United Nations auspices.”
Utter rubbish! No such thing as a “Voluntary Exchange of Population Agreement” EVER took place! What you seem to be (intentionally) confusing is the…
The Third Vienna Agreement - August 1975
http://www.mfa.gov.cy/mfa/mfa2006.nsf/All/0658E5B2F4D1A538C22571D30034D15D/$file/August%201975.pdf
Where you’ll find that the words “population” and/or “exchange” are not even mentioned in this document! It was a temporary humanitarian UN facilitation for broken families and missing persons and certainly not a “population exchange”!
Get your facts right and article credible!
All references to “agreement” in political articles should be escorted by a credible link to that agreement, so the reader may observe what you’re talking about! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.149.182.112 ( talk) 10:33, 1 August 2010 (UTC)
Bits like The human rights of the refugees wishing to return to their former homes and properties are currently being violated as their return is denied by the Turkish army.
Is now out of date, as under a order from the ECHR, . So far I believe that 3 cases have been concluded so far (Despite oposition from the Greek Cypriot government)
http://www.turkishweekly.net/news.php?id=34015 -- SolDrury 11:26, 25 September 2006 (UTC)
Your reference claims exactly the opposite of what you describe, please read your reference.
It seems that this mechanism aims in recognizing TRNC and not offering properties back to rightfull owners.
In Short, Bits like The human rights of the refugees wishing to return to their former homes and properties are currently being violated as their return is denied by the Turkish army. are the essence of the article, true and verifiable. I think the link you have supplied needs to be added in the externals for reference. Aristovoul0s 15:41, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
Please contribute freely Aristovoul0s 18:00, 24 September 2006 (UTC)
Another great nationalist contribution to Wikipedia. Greek Cypriots are not the only refugees in Cyprus. TC's became refugees long before 74 when the Greek army under Grivas was terrorising their villages. Inflated GC figures, original research, words like "Turkish Brutality", accusations that TC ministers shot GC protestors, usual legal documents criticisng Turkey etc etc. Need i say more. -- A.Garnet 19:54, 24 September 2006 (UTC)
Please feel free to pinpoint what is not cited. Feel free to add about TC's refugees. If you are willing to give me a hand lets also write about Cyprus refugees and displaced people during the Ottoman Empire. Aristovoul0s 22:19, 24 September 2006 (UTC)
I've deleted the "comparisons" section as it was unencyclopedic. It's like having an article about the Iraq War and having a section saying "imagine if America was invaded - here's what it would be like". — Khoi khoi 22:58, 24 September 2006 (UTC)
Although some encyclopedias do have "comparisons" i can live with that. Aristovoul0s 15:42, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
There were too many images depicting the Greek POV, so I decided to add one that is well-known to most Turks. Hopefully this won't cause any problems. — Khoi khoi 23:15, 24 September 2006 (UTC)
I just don't get where all this animosity comes from, it is because of this very reason that Wikipedia's standing takes a hit.. Maybe the world doesn't merit an open encyclopedia because there are way too many people who harbor so much animosity and have agendas.. Ditto A. Garnet Baristarim 23:53, 24 September 2006 (UTC)
Please assume good faith in my person. I do not want to confront you both like this but seeing your comment and your edits to this article someone could say that it is YOU who have an agenda. Why dont you add constructively??? Aristovoul0s 15:46, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
Doesnt the content of this article fall in the older article Civilian casualties and displacements during the Cyprus conflict? -- A.Garnet 08:54, 25 September 2006 (UTC)
I disagree Civilian casualties and displacements during the Cyprus conflict covers the civilian casualties and displacements that occurred between 1963 and 1975 — from the outbreak of the intercommunal fighting until the end of displacements following the Turkish Invasion of Cyprus. "Cypriot refugee" though focuses with the still ongoing strife of cypriot refugees, from 1974 onwards. 87.228.212.10 19:58, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
And i quote : Charter of the United Nations Article 2 "The Organization and its Members, in pursuit of the Purposes stated in Article 1, shall act in accordance with the following Principles".
4. All Members shall refrain in their international relations from the threat or use of force against the territorial integrity or political independence of any state, or in any other manner inconsistent with the Purposes of the United Nations. Both Turkey and Republic of Cyprus are members. Turkey has obligation under the charter to respect the Sovereignty of the Republic of Cyprus. If otherwise then she is violating her obligation. I hold that the word illegal should be used and i back it up by the UN member countries take away Turkey. How many countries hold your view? Aristovoul0s 18:40, 29 September 2006 (UTC)
I agree with the addition of this article to the Civilian casualties and displacements during the Cyprus conflict article as a separate section, cause Civilian casualties and displacements during the Cyprus conflict is more general than this one. E104421 12:56, 29 September 2006 (UTC)
This article is highly biased. — Khoi khoi 15:08, 5 October 2006 (UTC)
Please elaborate khoikoi... or at least justify your comment... Aristovoul0s 15:35, 5 October 2006 (UTC)
This page is contentious because of the ingrained bias of the Greeks and Greek Cypriots against anything Turkish. Turkish Cypriots can never feel safe in a unitary state, and their having to become enclaved refugees between 1963-1974, and the pushing out of the T/C's to the north as part of the population 'exchanges' of 1975 means that there is plenty of blame that can be laid at the G/C's door. Expatkiwi
A refugee by UN definition is someone forced to flee their country's borders, therefore this article implicity recognises two countries in Cyprus :) -- A.Garnet 22:51, 8 October 2006 (UTC)
No my friend, the coup had not already failed. The Treaty was broken on July 15 with the Athens backed coup and installment of Nicos Sampson, literally a known murderer, who had already taken the Presidential oath. Turkey intervenes July 20th, junta and coup fail July 23rd. Therefore praise be to Turkey for being the liberators of Greece! :) -- A.Garnet 00:51, 9 October 2006 (UTC)
Please list your cited arguments and we will discuss them all, one by one. Thanks Aristovoul0s 17:07, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
I have told you before. GC's were not the only refugees, and this problem did certainly not start in 1974. The whole thing either needs rewriting, or merging with the other civilian casualty article. How you can create an article like this, and not expect people to significantly change it is beyond me. -- A.Garnet 18:11, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
Issues so far (please contribute to the list preferable if you provide sources, Thanks) Aristovoul0s 20:09, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
Really Aristovolous, what you have done in my opinion is gone to the kypros website, absorbed all the rubbish there (i have come across that before, and you will be hard pushed to find one mention of a TC casualty there) and regurgitated it here. How can you create an article like this and not feel ashamed that you will be accused of nationalist pov pushing? Do you not even realise that Turkish Cypriots were victims in this conflict also? -- A.Garnet 20:21, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
Any more concerns? Please list them Aristovoul0s 15:42, 12 October 2006 (UTC)
Do you speak on behalf of all? If you dont let others contribute as well otherwise we can begin discussing points top down. Aristovoul0s 16:32, 13 October 2006 (UTC)
Is the Turkish military occupying 37 or 38% of the island? Trantellinas 23:15, 23 October 2006 (UTC)Trantellinas
That 1963 background paragraph is the biggest load of BS on wikipedia. Are you (Aristovouls) SERIOUSLY suggesting that the TCs abandonned their homes to live in horrible conditions JUST to get Turkey to invade and seperate the island. YOu fail to mention the TCs that were being murdered by EOKA (A&B) at the time. Im not going to touch this article as Ive given up editing Cyprus related articles on Wikipedia but your blatant and hateful re-writing of history is desicable. Its shameful, really and truely shameful. I also notice that none of our less nationalistic greek editors have seen fit to attempt to balance out that entry. This is why Wikipedia is a flawed concept and will only ever be of use for non controversial subjects. Adam777 16:30, 2 November 2006 (UTC)
Adam777, The reason TCs were being murdered by EOKA A is quite justifiably because the TCs sided with the British when GCs took up arms to fight against British colonialism (1955-1959).
The murdered TCs you're refering to are actually TMT members are they not? When GCs eventually won independance from Britain (with blood, sweat, and tears) the TCs were understandably left looking rather uncomfortable! Wouldn't you? (Posted by Marios Polycarpou)
I don't know you tell me, but what about the Turkish Cypriot thug hired by Turkey who on the 7th June 1958 placed a bomb outside the Turkish press office in Nicosia and ended up sparking the inter-communal fighting? Was that a kid too? (Posted by Marios Polycarpou)
Thanks for the offer. As much as I'd like to contribute I'm already full-on with letters/articles on the Cyprus issue in various other places :) Regards MP.
Niko, unfortunately I would need to enable cookies to log on and I can't have that on my system for security reasons but feel free to write at marios-polycarpou[at]cytanet[dot]com[dot]cy An thelete obote ehete provlima me kapion gia tin kipro mborite na mou stilete to keimeno tou kai ego tha sas stilo biso abantisi gia afto tin idia mera. Me katalaves?
Turkey currently does not recognize the 1960 Treaty of Guarantee This statement is false, infact Turkish policy about Cyprus is based on Treaty of Guarantee.-- Hattusili 06:19, 27 November 2006 (UTC)
I believe only now the article resembles something morelike an encylopedia entry. I tried to focus it just on displacement and property, removing all repeated information concerning casualties and the conflict from other articles. Removed all the politically charged pictures, Greek and Turkish, added relevant info about the Annan plan, EU accesion and Turkish Cypriot property commision. -- A.Garnet 14:14, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
This is the second time i am reverting what you personaly dont like seeing. The first time was right before you took the article to afd Aristovouλos (T) 16:54, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
"Tasos Isaak beaten to death within the Buffer Zone, have a close look at who gives the final blow."
- Francis Tyers · 18:31, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
Maybe this is better, What do you think? Aristovouλos (T) 18:44, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
Hector, de jure only the Republic of Cyprus can tell him what to do. Aristovouλos (T) 18:47, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
LOL: http://www.hr-action.org/ — looks "reliable" to me. Haha, and another one: " http://agrino.org/humrights/hr06/derynia.htm" - Francis Tyers · 19:03, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
There is a void during the period of 1963-1974. I believe there were peaceful attempts to resolve this deadlock over the functioning of the government, the enclaves and with both side tantalizingly close to an agreement in the months before the 1974 events.
I am anticipating that people may argue that the "void" is due to the fact that there was Turkish-Cypriot non-participation in the government of the Republic of Cyprus. Nevertheless, events between these years reflect, either significantly or insignificantly depending on apparent point of view the diligence of Cypriots to try to resolve the constitutional differences.
(
UNFanatic
20:50, 1 December 2006 (UTC))
Why were the pictures removed from the page? Chaldean 06:27, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
No, things aren't as self-explanatory as you think. Which specific parts of the article did you disagree with, and why? You can't simply reject it in its entirety and replace it without a consensus on this talk page. I have already suggested that the sections on the women protestors and the murders of Isaak and Solomou should be reinstated as they are more than noteworthy. I am sure you'll agree that what happened to them wasn't simply a figment of the Greeks' imagination. As for the specific wording, that can be hammered out here if you find the existing wording objectionable. I eagerly await your proposals. ·ΚέκρωΨ· 16:12, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
Now now, WP:NPA. User:Aristovoul0s is not subhuman for disagreeing with you. Far from having a "better formal tone", the current version is rather poorly written, with Turkish POV throughout and consistently bad spelling and grammar. The old version simply has more raw material to work with. ·ΚέκρωΨ· 16:20, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
So the property commision should be more than a side note since it is set to become one of the major structures to deal with the property problems of refugees.. That's all... Baristarim 18:45, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
Question: I know that Turkey was one of the guarantor powers, the others being Greece and the UK. Thus within this role as a guarantor power, it recognizes the Republic of Cyprus, to which it is a signitory of the treaties of the establishment of the country. When did Turkey withdraw recognition of the Republic of Cyprus? From my understanding, not recognizing the Republic of Cyprus entails an abandonment of the role as both a guarnator power and an abandonment of the right to intervene to return the country to the original status quo of the treaty, to which it has never done.( UNFanatic 21:23, 7 December 2006 (UTC))
The current version is an improvement, although tilts the balance over to the other POV. I think this version is a much better starting point for improving the article. The references are good (nothing from hilariously propagandistic Greek sites). Many more (reliable) references are required, and the bit about Turkey joining the EU should go. This version reads much better than the previous version in terms of style and neutrality, although there are a number of spelling mistakes (although possibly not more than the previous version). I think that Kekrops suggestion is good, wrt. "Makarios proposed several amendments to the constitution which Turkish Cypriots viewed as a threat to their constitutional status".
Also, the "1963-74 background" summary needs to be neutralised a bit. All-in-all a much better article to start work with. It would be great if you guys could work together here to improve the article with a view to getting the protection lifted. You might try raising issues, or making suggestions for expansion, and then see how the others see it. I'll start off:
In the paragraph starting "Through the years multiple demonstrations and rallies...", I'm curious, were the womens protests for the same reasons (e.g. return of property?) I thought there were some protests due to "disappeared" husbands and sons. If there were, these should be mentioned. This might not be a specific thing about refugees and might to better in one of the other articles though. - Francis Tyers · 14:26, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
im not a Turk first of all but statements made in this article does not at all reflect the reality and show no parallellism to what I've been teaching and learning throughout my teaching career on European History. To depict Turkish army and policy of the time in such negative terms must be what you should re-consider before warning anybody who edits these inaccurate and non-real, non-academic free-writing drafts; you should not call them articles. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.164.189.39 ( talk) 08:16, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
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