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I believe we are having a DDOS attack right now... started at 12:30 EST(summer) august 17th... is that worth a mention? 64.231.193.171 16:36, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
I was prevented from signing on because i used the screenname "thissiteisasham". This contradicts the basic claim of free editing. I am appaled
Yeah, I was IP blocked because I made an account entitled "liberalsrule" with the reason: "now you can rule at wikipedia". What a joke. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 137.99.142.163 ( talk) 22:41, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
Why does this article have to be about wikipedia vs conservapedia. Most of the article is covering either the founder of conservapedia's criticisms of wikipedia, or visa versa. POV
The reason why wikipedia figures heavily into the conservapedia article is because conservapedia was formed as a reaction against wikipedia. Therefore to understand conservapedia one must understand what it was reacting against. Roninbob 04:11, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
There seems to be some disagreement about this. I don't favor the inclusion since we dont have any source that explicitly connects the project with pseudoscience. However, I don't think the recent argument "If wikipedia has a bunch of pseduscientific articles, would it be "pseudoscience" as well?" holds water since Wikipedia doesn't have policies which support pseudoscience. Overall, I think we should leave the cat out for now. JoshuaZ 22:52, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
Maybe there should be some mention of their notoriously slow server. It seems that about half the time their page either doesn't load, or takes an extremely long time to load. For a site that claims to be a definitive conservative source, its server power sure seems to be incredibly rinky-dink. -- Boss hogg01 17:07, 26 May 2007 (UTC)
haha, it's pretty harsh. w/e, Conservapedia = Elitist Christians.
"Our study suggests that Wikipedia is 6 times more liberal than the American public." I think they misspelled neutral :/ (maybe its the homeschooling) -- chandler 18:35, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
Haha lol its ridiculous isnt it, a encylopedia that admits its own bias, I mean honestly 'our study shows' well of course their study would show that crap, because its inherently bias. The probelsm with these far right christiofacists (and yes I am a chrisitan myself) is that they percieve anything left of centre right as liberal, If wikipedia is 6X more liberal than the American public, than the American public must make the gestapo look like child carers. Oh one other thing, I knew these right wingers claimed to be able to do a lot of things, but I never knew they had invented a liberal 'O' meter yet, wikipedia must be a 500 or something on the liberal 'O' meter. A bit off topic I know, but its almost self abasement to say things like that, I mean im no liberal (sometimes I am branded as one as some kind of 'insult', possibly because I believe that all people are equal and that is a liberal idea to these far right wingers) as such, I would call myself centre, or I abstain from politics, but that is just hilarious. 172.214.9.67 11:41, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
As stated elsewhere, they are not comparing like with like - Wikipedia is multinational and multicultural (and probably a fair percentage of people operating in EnglishWikipeda operate in other languages as well).
As for point 11 on their list of criticisms of Wikipedia - the entry on Milton-Keynes-the-person and Stafford Crisp remains.
Point 48 about Wikipedia's fascination with English social distinctions - but read the entry on HM Queen Elizabeth the Queen Mother.
Previous comments regarding the "20 articles survey" (seeing how many short and/or unreferenced articles can be found by clicking on "random article" that number of times, and excluding disambiguation and talk pages etc) still stand (and can be used in other contexts).
Can I mention evowiki at [ [1]] - there is no article in Wikipedia on it yet. Jackiespeel 16:07, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
Does this really add anything to the article? There is quite a bit of original research, and all the cites lead back to RationalWiki, and thus fail WP:RS. Are there any reliable secondary sources on this? -- Transfinite ( Talk / Contribs) 05:02, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
I just cleaned up grammar and style in that section, and then stumbled onto this talk page. Out of curiosity, if everyone here is the section on "RaionalWiki," why is it still included in the article? I guess I won't delete it for now, since it may have been kept for a reason, but please respond if you know why it is in fact still here. Homologeo 18:40, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
The article used to state:
Conservapedia presents evolution as an incorrect interpretation of measurable and observable evidence, phenomena, and claims that all living organisms were created in their current form,
This is not how Conservapedia presents the matter. First, Conservapedia presents "The Theory of evolution" and not "evolution". Secondly, where does Conservapedia state it is an "incorrect interpretation"?
Here is what I replaced the above sentence with which more accurately reflects the Conservapedia article on the Theory of evolution:
Conservapedia presents the theory of evolution as lacking support and states that creationist scientists and some secular science journals state that it is contra-evidence [2]
Jazzman123 22:57, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
It appears to be so at present.
This talk page appears to be wandering towards discussing the pros and cons of Conservapedia itself - not how to improve this article, or describing how the site itself develops (would "evolves" be appropriate?). Jackiespeel 14:54, 6 June 2007 (UTC)
Should we include examples of Conservapedia's plainly ignoring facts? For example, the article on Canada asserts that the current national flag was imposed on the Canadian people by the Liberal government of the time to appease socialists and Québec nationalists. This, needless to say, is not true. The article on communism begins by stating that the ideology has claimed more than 100 million lives and continues to enslave one-fifth of the world's population.
Soviet Canuckistan 01:43, 8 June 2007 (UTC)
I'm afraid examples we come up with rank as original research. My personal choice would be the Hepatitis B vaccine article, in which we "learn" that the vaccine causes multiple sclerosis, and is given for the purpose of enriching the manufacturer. What we don't learn is that it prevents hepatitis B. Yes, that's right: nowhere in the article do we learn the actual reason it is administered; nowhere does the article acknowledge, even grudgingly, that the vaccine prevents hepatitis B.... - Nunh-huh 04:53, 8 June 2007 (UTC)
One article which clearly shows their bias is the one on Deceit (including the discussion), and I was infuriated. Schlafly is simply being deceitful with his statements "Conservatives teach that deceit is wrong. Liberals do not teach that deceit is wrong". The footnote to the first statement goes to the Ten Commandments, the footnote to the second is to a US Supreme Court case saying that you can't put the Ten Commandments on classroom walls in public schools. Apparently, the only way one teaches that deceit is wrong is to post the Ten Commandments on classroom walls. Jhobson1 10:52, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
Now merely describes the town.
The 'Debate Fork or Spoon' remains - and the Falafel/loofah comment has been restored.
The Conservapedia comment on the article link on today's C main - to [ [3]] effectively contradicts what is said in the comments.
The proportion of short and/or unreferenced articles remains.
Jackiespeel 13:46, 8 June 2007 (UTC)
Why are we using http://www.rationalwiki.com as a source? it does not (to me) match WP:RS -- Fredrick day 22:35, 9 June 2007 (UTC)
VanTucky-Why are you pushing the trash about 3000 users being blocked? Firstly, it is 3000 usernames NOT users; secondly, the source you are using, CPs own block log, clearly states that the reason for many of the blocks is trolling, vandalism, sock puppets; also, the log shows that the autoblock is picking up these socks too. Others are obviously blocked for the username, eg FUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCK - not really going to let that one stay, are they? This is just sour grapes bellyaching from VanTucky, attempting to mislead with his edit. Have you been blocked from there or something? And the excuse that "the source does not etc" is total garbage - the source STATES THE REASONS!! 89.241.225.210 23:32, 9 June 2007 (UTC)
So the POV tag is about only the 3000 blocked users? First of all I am not so sure that the sentence belongs in criticism it probably belongs in the description of the site. But what does the anonymous user want the wording to be? Tmtoulouse 16:05, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
It appears that the anonymous user has a dynamic IP address and its getting difficult to track their changes and contributions. May I suggest that they register an account? Tmtoulouse 16:23, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
Personally, I'd like to add that when I tried to make an account there, using the same name (BockBockChicken), I was blocked within the hour - the reason being "name". I haven't made a single edit, nor have I ever made an edit with the IP. Then whenever I signed in with that name, the IP of the computer that I was using gets blocked as well. Now, granted that this name is light-hearted and silly, it's not insulting nor offensive. For their God's sake they allowed the username "Godless Liberal". This sort of preemptive blocking deserve a line or two in listing differences between Wikipedia and Conservapedia. Bockbockchicken 08:03, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
I'd suggest the comment has value because Conservapedia trumpets how many users it has while including among those numbers many have been permanently blocked. While some have been blocked for vandalism, others have been blocked for disagreeing with the syspops, who have the authority to block anyone at the drop of a hat (check out how many comments there are on user talk pages regarding "accidental" blocks). MartinJoh00 17:37, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
I have been blocked for stating that a translation from French in this article ( http://www.conservapedia.com/Claude_Monet ) was awful. The author, Joaquín Martínez who is also a sysop, contacted me suggesting that my criticism was dishonest and that it was a good translation. When I attempted to reply I found that I had been blocked for the following reasons Subtle vandal/troll/silly edits (Bye). They also claim that the LA Times has praised their article on Monet ( http://www.conservapedia.com/Main_Page ) which itself is disingenuous to say the least. Ulysses54 11:21, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
Is Conservapedia's comment on the subject at [ [4]] anywhere near the truth? Jackiespeel 17:02, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
This was about the Scottish Parliament passing a proposal to breed Nessie and Morag. "By some coincidence" the page was corrected shortly after I made the comment. (I presume the Scottish Parliament would approve of being associated with an endangered species breeding programme.) Jackiespeel 17:57, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
I think we should include a paragraph about how the sysops run a dictatorship over there I have a source; [5]. - Ĭ₠ŴΣĐĝё 05:55, 14 June 2007 (UTC)
Since this article is such a contentious one, and NPOV is especially important and difficult to maintain, I would like someone other than the contributer to verify that the source actually says what it says (registration is required). VanTucky 15:43, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
I would edit this a bit. However, I'm a member at RationalWiki (and a perma-banned member at Conservapedia for daring to question a sysop over a Bible-related typo and the ban orgy connected to it), so there's a potential Conflict of Interest.
First of all, the "confirmation" makes it look like RationalWiki has been responsible for the vandalism wave in February. Main issues: The LA Times article does not make this connection at all. In fact, it states that RationalWiki was started after incidents like the Breast Cancer article had happened. Additionally, the World Review article is from a time when various bloggers picked up (and tore apart) Conservapedia, so it should be fairly hard to pinpoint the vandalism of that time to one source (that was only created months or so later).
Additionally, I would edit it to "that, among others, editors from a site formed " - especially since the source's pornography paragraph reads "interlopers from RationalWiki and elsewhere". -- Sid 3050 14:41, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
“ | After administrators blocked their accounts, Lipson and several other editors quit trying to moderate the articles and instead started their own website, RationalWiki.com. From there, they monitor Conservapedia. And — by their own admission — engage in acts of cyber-vandalism. | ” |
Okay, since you both don't like the current language, how about just simply using the following direct quote?
“ | After administrators blocked their accounts, Lipson and several other editors quit trying to moderate the articles and instead started their own website, RationalWiki.com. From there, they monitor Conservapedia. And — by their own admission — engage in acts of cyber-vandalism. Conservapedia's articles have been hit frequently by interlopers from RationalWiki and elsewhere. The vandals have inserted errors, pornographic photos and satire. | ” |
sound NPOV? VanTucky 18:22, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
I don't think we can simply go by the name and there claims. right wing perhaps. Conservative? That is certainly open to debate. Let'd either take out the claim or couch it in such a way that it notes the possibility that it is not conservative
"we" should be going by what is said about them not what they say about themselves . . . but whatever, you seem determined to keep the wording. So be it. Have fun.
"Conservapedia is a wiki-based encyclopedia project with articles written from an arguably??? socially and economically conservative viewpoint supportive of Conservative Christianity and Young Earth creationism.[1][2][3] "
Would everyone rate this article as B-Class? G e o. Talk to me 21:32, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
Perhaps this could go in: [6] I'm afraid it's only a blog, but Schlafly's conflict of interest is probably notable. Opinions? (Opinions, that is, on whether it should be included here. Let's keep this page about this article.) Totnesmartin 13:44, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
Please everyone, let's quit with the edit warring for now and discuss this thing. I think, that as Rationalwiki doesn't have it's own article or any other appropriate place to link it, and it is significantly mentioned in the article, it deserves to be linked. VanTucky 17:18, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
Notability is not a criteria for EL, the article discusses the site and the site provides "meaningful, relevant content that is not suitable for inclusion in an article, such as reviews and interviews." Tmtoulouse 17:36, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
like this
"Some people that believe in Nostradamus's prophecies believe that Andrew Schlafly is Mabus.Nostradamus was known to jumble up the names in his quatrains to prevent the wrong people from reading all the valuable information. People that study Nostradamus's quatrains have figured out that Mabus is a jumbled up form of Andrew Schlafly.[1] They get the M from the W (in Andrew) flipped upside down. The A comes from the first letter in Andrew. The b comes from the d just flipped around. The U comes from the upside down n. Finally, the S comes from the first letter in Schlafly.
or maybe this?
It's mollified by the knowledge that a Wikipedia-like site can only thrive with a relatively free exchange of ideas and some tolerance for vandals, hoaxers, and crackpots, and the gang of beady-eyed zealots running CP are going to stifle it to death while thinking they're 'protecting' it.
Yes this is clearly a high-quality link. -- Fredrick day 20:54, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
Cherry-picking? The first is taken from their article on Andrew Schlafly and the second from their article on Conversapedia - two things, I'd expect to find appropriate material on if the link is to provide additional information of the sort that would match a featured article (or whatever the wording is) - do you honestly think that material is of that quality? Yes I have a bone to pick - I don't think that rationalwiki is a high quality resource and should not be linked to. -- Fredrick day 21:00, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
hopefully others will come by and add it back in. Why hopefully?, you are already canvessing offsite for meatpuppets to do just that. -- Fredrick day 21:04, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
While the irony of turning the CP talk page into a defense of rationalwiki and its purpose is sweetly ironic for me, I don't see it helping much. I will only offer this one defense...one does not have to be serious in order to make a serious point.
Now what can we do to reach a compromise so we can put this issue to bed? EL is out for now, but how would you feel about just hyper-linking the first mention of rationalwiki in the article to its homepage? Tmtoulouse 16:40, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
As this appears to occur intermittently it should be mentioned somewhere in the text.
Has anyone counted the number of books actually used as references by Conservapedia (when it is up)?
Jackiespeel 17:27, 26 June 2007 (UTC)
I meant in the sense of "the usp being unavailable."
Conservapedia got mentioned in a bit on The Daily Show, specifically its article on homosexuality. I'd point this out there, but it seems editing is restricted to logged-in accounts and new accounts are disabled (otherwise I would point it out there instead of here). I guess that's one way to counteract vandalism. Nifboy 04:35, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
Regarding the Tom Flanagan quote, are there perhaps criticisms by other Conservatives that could be included as well? Ericster08 02:47, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
Should we include the criticism about a Pro-American Bias, for example, stating that Mexico is located "directly beneath the United States?"
How does running away from even a perceived bias solve the problem? Let's say for argument sake that Wikipedia leans to the left. Well how does breaking away and forming a conservative answer to Wikipedia create any less bias? All you're going to have is an encyclopedia with a conservative bias. Wouldn't it make more sense to dig in your heels and stay on the "liberal" Wikipedia to balance the perspective on ONE website? Diverging onto one direction does nothing but add to the ridiculous "RED-BLUE" divide in this country. The Righties should stay on Wikipedia so that there's an equal balance between Left and Right. Ericster08 05:33, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
Ah, good point. Ericster08 02:46, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
So the Registration is now closed, I quote:
“ To be allowed to create accounts in this Wiki you have to log in and have the appropriate permissions. ”
I used the create an account URL address of index.php?title=Special:Userlogin&type=signup&returnto=Main_Page ignoring the http://en.wikipedia.org/w/ and then added it to http://www.conservapedia.org to get: http://www.conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Special:Userlogin&type=signup&returnto=Main_Page. I find this funny and this is why I changed the registration to "Invite Only".-- WhereAmI 06:35, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
It may be open but it bans your IP adress upon registration so you can't edit anything on the site. - LordofToasts June 29, 2007
Can someone revert this? 4.253.40.211 15:29, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
I was just wondering, should there be a section pointing out the obvious contradictions, such as the ACLU page, where they begin discussing the Anti-Christian Bias, then cite examples where the ACLU goes to court representing Christians.... or would that just be petty and non official research?
It seems like huge portion of this article focuses on the difference between them and us, perhaps that should be a different article ( Wikipedia and Conservapedia compared anyone?) Cameron Nedland 00:47, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
The website is currently being raided by EBworld and a few other places. It's not very successful due to the disabling of registration, but still, good to see it get what it deserves. NoMercyX 04:12, 10 July 2007 (UTC) (whoops, forgot to sign my post)
Why is this article up for deletion? I cannot seem to find any reason for it? And there has been no comment on the matter from User:Nathaniel B. Heraniaos. Utterly perplexing. - Oh... in previewing this article I notice that he was told to nominate an article for deletion correctly. And, in the process of reading his comments, I discovered that he dislikes Conservapedia. Fair enough. Scarian Talk 02:43, 15 July 2007 (UTC) Dramatica doesn't do the raids you dumbass. Dramatica just records them and provides links. EBaumsworld does the raiding. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.42.73.86 ( talk) 00:54, August 24, 2007 (UTC)
Meh, keep this article on Conservapedia. Conservapedia is so bad, it actually makes Wikipedia look good. Mindraker 17:04, 27 August 2007 (UTC)
Here on Wikipedia it has video games, cartoons (mainly Japan and American made), medicine, TV, movies, people etc. The name Conservapedia seem like it would mainly have info on conservitive people and what conervs. would like. THROUGH FIRE, JUSTICE IS SERVED! 03:16, 15 July 2007 (UTC)
This edit removed what I think is an important point, that perhaps is just not in the right place. I think this point needs to be made in reference to the conservapedia copyright section, in that there is a lot of wikipedia material that is on CP and it could be a problem. Tmtoulouse 01:48, 16 July 2007 (UTC)
However, I am not familiar enough with CP to know whether they are, in fact, incorporating WP content and thus violating WP's copyright and license, nor do I know whether they have taken action to delete such content if and when it was ever brought to their attention.
Per WP:ASR, we should avoid having the Wikipedia article on Conservapedia turn into a justification of Wikipedia against Conservapedia. The focus should be on Conservapedia, not on Conservapedia and Wikipedia in opposition to each other. -- Metropolitan90 03:18, 16 July 2007 (UTC)
I don't know where else to put this, because I couldn't find a place in Wikipedia:Copyright to list pages that violate Wikipedia's copyright, but the following articles on Conservapedia are just a few of potentially many which are copied (at least partially) from Wikipedia without attribution, and without using the GFDL:
-- SteveDeans 17:27, 16 July 2007 (UTC)
I've notices a distinct parallel between aspects of Wikipedia and Conservapedia, most notably the name of the Conservapedia "commandments" (like the ten commandments) seems to be based on the "five pillars" of Wikipedia (similar to the Five Pillars of Islam). Two questions. 1: Is this significant enough to be put into the article? 2: Would it need some sort of citation? Calgary 03:25, 17 July 2007 (UTC)
It seems Conservapedia has a rather large amount of protected pages. Also, from what I can tell some people (like me) have be blocked from the wiki for simply stating there belife. Tesfan 02:23, 20 July 2007 (UTC)
I noticed this as well. I searched many different people, places, ideas, ect., and then tried to edit the pages, but it seems that all are blocked. I couldn't even edit the "Discussion" pages. I also tried to create pages, but apparently they blocked that too. I to create pages for obscure random bands, mainly because that was the only thing I could think of that someone wouldn't have already thought of. Maybe its my account name, or relative newness? Grizzedram
I thought it would be interesting to note, even though I refuse to add it to the article (more of an FYI), that Conservapedia is blocked by all Department of Defense computers, Wikipedia is not. I thought this was a little humorous. Crmadsen 01:02, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
I've never knowlingly added nonsense to Wikipedia, but if ever there was an article that deserved it, it's this one. I'm sure the people at Conservapedia mean well, at least in their minds, but it really is sad. This article should lead with "Conservapedia is a comedy parody of Wikipedia." I genuinely thought Conservapedia was a joke. I hope they put a stork image in the intercourse article (if they ever make one). Perhaps "limbs" could be substituted for "legs" as they did in Victorian times for women's legs. There is plenty in Wikipedia which bothers me, but most of that is because it's the truth, or at least an attempt at the truth! Hopefully Conservapedia doesn't get very far. I shudder to think that there will be kids who eat chicken "mammary glands" for supper. Anyone care to comment? Jimaginator 14:58, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
Legal action is threatened twice on the Conservapedia Commandments page. The first is a warning against "obscenity", which will supposedly be punished under 18 USC § 1470. Obscenity is not defined by Conservapedia or by Title 18 of the US Code. The possible reasons for this range from simple oversight to the discouraing of vandals with a form of fear, uncertainty, and doubt. I find this to be problematic, but not nearly as problematic as the second warning: "vandalism is punishable up to 10 years in jail per 18 USC § 1030." 18 USC § 1030 regards fraud in connection with computers. I'm guessing the basis for this is the idea that vandalism qualifies as "damage". I am not a lawyer, but unless vandalism on Conservapedia means something very different than it does on Wikipedia, I'm certain that the warning shows a profound ignorance of law or it's just disingenuous FUD.
I'd like to see this under differences in editorial philosophies. Can someone tell me if I'm wrong or off base about any of the above or if none of this information should be considered encyclopedic? 72.154.101.7 03:13, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
I've noticed (through the conservapedia list of examples of bias in wikipedia), that the bit about conservapedia's licence not being copyleft being "an issue which has led to some concerns", is sourced to an article that only give Jimbo Wales, as the one raising the concerns. Do we have a source for a more neutral party raising concerns? If not, then I think we should attribute the concerns to Jimbo Wales. Silverfish 11:17, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
"On December 30th of 2006, the site's main page stated that the project had 1950 articles. On December 31st, this number jumped to 14,900.[11]. The figure has stayed the same on the main page through July of 2007.[12]" This is not true at all. The site did not claim to have 14,900 articles from December to July. Ostap R
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | ← | Archive 4 | Archive 5 | Archive 6 | Archive 7 | Archive 8 | → | Archive 10 |
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | ← | Archive 4 | Archive 5 | Archive 6 | Archive 7 | Archive 8 | → | Archive 10 |
I believe we are having a DDOS attack right now... started at 12:30 EST(summer) august 17th... is that worth a mention? 64.231.193.171 16:36, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
I was prevented from signing on because i used the screenname "thissiteisasham". This contradicts the basic claim of free editing. I am appaled
Yeah, I was IP blocked because I made an account entitled "liberalsrule" with the reason: "now you can rule at wikipedia". What a joke. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 137.99.142.163 ( talk) 22:41, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
Why does this article have to be about wikipedia vs conservapedia. Most of the article is covering either the founder of conservapedia's criticisms of wikipedia, or visa versa. POV
The reason why wikipedia figures heavily into the conservapedia article is because conservapedia was formed as a reaction against wikipedia. Therefore to understand conservapedia one must understand what it was reacting against. Roninbob 04:11, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
There seems to be some disagreement about this. I don't favor the inclusion since we dont have any source that explicitly connects the project with pseudoscience. However, I don't think the recent argument "If wikipedia has a bunch of pseduscientific articles, would it be "pseudoscience" as well?" holds water since Wikipedia doesn't have policies which support pseudoscience. Overall, I think we should leave the cat out for now. JoshuaZ 22:52, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
Maybe there should be some mention of their notoriously slow server. It seems that about half the time their page either doesn't load, or takes an extremely long time to load. For a site that claims to be a definitive conservative source, its server power sure seems to be incredibly rinky-dink. -- Boss hogg01 17:07, 26 May 2007 (UTC)
haha, it's pretty harsh. w/e, Conservapedia = Elitist Christians.
"Our study suggests that Wikipedia is 6 times more liberal than the American public." I think they misspelled neutral :/ (maybe its the homeschooling) -- chandler 18:35, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
Haha lol its ridiculous isnt it, a encylopedia that admits its own bias, I mean honestly 'our study shows' well of course their study would show that crap, because its inherently bias. The probelsm with these far right christiofacists (and yes I am a chrisitan myself) is that they percieve anything left of centre right as liberal, If wikipedia is 6X more liberal than the American public, than the American public must make the gestapo look like child carers. Oh one other thing, I knew these right wingers claimed to be able to do a lot of things, but I never knew they had invented a liberal 'O' meter yet, wikipedia must be a 500 or something on the liberal 'O' meter. A bit off topic I know, but its almost self abasement to say things like that, I mean im no liberal (sometimes I am branded as one as some kind of 'insult', possibly because I believe that all people are equal and that is a liberal idea to these far right wingers) as such, I would call myself centre, or I abstain from politics, but that is just hilarious. 172.214.9.67 11:41, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
As stated elsewhere, they are not comparing like with like - Wikipedia is multinational and multicultural (and probably a fair percentage of people operating in EnglishWikipeda operate in other languages as well).
As for point 11 on their list of criticisms of Wikipedia - the entry on Milton-Keynes-the-person and Stafford Crisp remains.
Point 48 about Wikipedia's fascination with English social distinctions - but read the entry on HM Queen Elizabeth the Queen Mother.
Previous comments regarding the "20 articles survey" (seeing how many short and/or unreferenced articles can be found by clicking on "random article" that number of times, and excluding disambiguation and talk pages etc) still stand (and can be used in other contexts).
Can I mention evowiki at [ [1]] - there is no article in Wikipedia on it yet. Jackiespeel 16:07, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
Does this really add anything to the article? There is quite a bit of original research, and all the cites lead back to RationalWiki, and thus fail WP:RS. Are there any reliable secondary sources on this? -- Transfinite ( Talk / Contribs) 05:02, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
I just cleaned up grammar and style in that section, and then stumbled onto this talk page. Out of curiosity, if everyone here is the section on "RaionalWiki," why is it still included in the article? I guess I won't delete it for now, since it may have been kept for a reason, but please respond if you know why it is in fact still here. Homologeo 18:40, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
The article used to state:
Conservapedia presents evolution as an incorrect interpretation of measurable and observable evidence, phenomena, and claims that all living organisms were created in their current form,
This is not how Conservapedia presents the matter. First, Conservapedia presents "The Theory of evolution" and not "evolution". Secondly, where does Conservapedia state it is an "incorrect interpretation"?
Here is what I replaced the above sentence with which more accurately reflects the Conservapedia article on the Theory of evolution:
Conservapedia presents the theory of evolution as lacking support and states that creationist scientists and some secular science journals state that it is contra-evidence [2]
Jazzman123 22:57, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
It appears to be so at present.
This talk page appears to be wandering towards discussing the pros and cons of Conservapedia itself - not how to improve this article, or describing how the site itself develops (would "evolves" be appropriate?). Jackiespeel 14:54, 6 June 2007 (UTC)
Should we include examples of Conservapedia's plainly ignoring facts? For example, the article on Canada asserts that the current national flag was imposed on the Canadian people by the Liberal government of the time to appease socialists and Québec nationalists. This, needless to say, is not true. The article on communism begins by stating that the ideology has claimed more than 100 million lives and continues to enslave one-fifth of the world's population.
Soviet Canuckistan 01:43, 8 June 2007 (UTC)
I'm afraid examples we come up with rank as original research. My personal choice would be the Hepatitis B vaccine article, in which we "learn" that the vaccine causes multiple sclerosis, and is given for the purpose of enriching the manufacturer. What we don't learn is that it prevents hepatitis B. Yes, that's right: nowhere in the article do we learn the actual reason it is administered; nowhere does the article acknowledge, even grudgingly, that the vaccine prevents hepatitis B.... - Nunh-huh 04:53, 8 June 2007 (UTC)
One article which clearly shows their bias is the one on Deceit (including the discussion), and I was infuriated. Schlafly is simply being deceitful with his statements "Conservatives teach that deceit is wrong. Liberals do not teach that deceit is wrong". The footnote to the first statement goes to the Ten Commandments, the footnote to the second is to a US Supreme Court case saying that you can't put the Ten Commandments on classroom walls in public schools. Apparently, the only way one teaches that deceit is wrong is to post the Ten Commandments on classroom walls. Jhobson1 10:52, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
Now merely describes the town.
The 'Debate Fork or Spoon' remains - and the Falafel/loofah comment has been restored.
The Conservapedia comment on the article link on today's C main - to [ [3]] effectively contradicts what is said in the comments.
The proportion of short and/or unreferenced articles remains.
Jackiespeel 13:46, 8 June 2007 (UTC)
Why are we using http://www.rationalwiki.com as a source? it does not (to me) match WP:RS -- Fredrick day 22:35, 9 June 2007 (UTC)
VanTucky-Why are you pushing the trash about 3000 users being blocked? Firstly, it is 3000 usernames NOT users; secondly, the source you are using, CPs own block log, clearly states that the reason for many of the blocks is trolling, vandalism, sock puppets; also, the log shows that the autoblock is picking up these socks too. Others are obviously blocked for the username, eg FUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCK - not really going to let that one stay, are they? This is just sour grapes bellyaching from VanTucky, attempting to mislead with his edit. Have you been blocked from there or something? And the excuse that "the source does not etc" is total garbage - the source STATES THE REASONS!! 89.241.225.210 23:32, 9 June 2007 (UTC)
So the POV tag is about only the 3000 blocked users? First of all I am not so sure that the sentence belongs in criticism it probably belongs in the description of the site. But what does the anonymous user want the wording to be? Tmtoulouse 16:05, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
It appears that the anonymous user has a dynamic IP address and its getting difficult to track their changes and contributions. May I suggest that they register an account? Tmtoulouse 16:23, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
Personally, I'd like to add that when I tried to make an account there, using the same name (BockBockChicken), I was blocked within the hour - the reason being "name". I haven't made a single edit, nor have I ever made an edit with the IP. Then whenever I signed in with that name, the IP of the computer that I was using gets blocked as well. Now, granted that this name is light-hearted and silly, it's not insulting nor offensive. For their God's sake they allowed the username "Godless Liberal". This sort of preemptive blocking deserve a line or two in listing differences between Wikipedia and Conservapedia. Bockbockchicken 08:03, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
I'd suggest the comment has value because Conservapedia trumpets how many users it has while including among those numbers many have been permanently blocked. While some have been blocked for vandalism, others have been blocked for disagreeing with the syspops, who have the authority to block anyone at the drop of a hat (check out how many comments there are on user talk pages regarding "accidental" blocks). MartinJoh00 17:37, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
I have been blocked for stating that a translation from French in this article ( http://www.conservapedia.com/Claude_Monet ) was awful. The author, Joaquín Martínez who is also a sysop, contacted me suggesting that my criticism was dishonest and that it was a good translation. When I attempted to reply I found that I had been blocked for the following reasons Subtle vandal/troll/silly edits (Bye). They also claim that the LA Times has praised their article on Monet ( http://www.conservapedia.com/Main_Page ) which itself is disingenuous to say the least. Ulysses54 11:21, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
Is Conservapedia's comment on the subject at [ [4]] anywhere near the truth? Jackiespeel 17:02, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
This was about the Scottish Parliament passing a proposal to breed Nessie and Morag. "By some coincidence" the page was corrected shortly after I made the comment. (I presume the Scottish Parliament would approve of being associated with an endangered species breeding programme.) Jackiespeel 17:57, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
I think we should include a paragraph about how the sysops run a dictatorship over there I have a source; [5]. - Ĭ₠ŴΣĐĝё 05:55, 14 June 2007 (UTC)
Since this article is such a contentious one, and NPOV is especially important and difficult to maintain, I would like someone other than the contributer to verify that the source actually says what it says (registration is required). VanTucky 15:43, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
I would edit this a bit. However, I'm a member at RationalWiki (and a perma-banned member at Conservapedia for daring to question a sysop over a Bible-related typo and the ban orgy connected to it), so there's a potential Conflict of Interest.
First of all, the "confirmation" makes it look like RationalWiki has been responsible for the vandalism wave in February. Main issues: The LA Times article does not make this connection at all. In fact, it states that RationalWiki was started after incidents like the Breast Cancer article had happened. Additionally, the World Review article is from a time when various bloggers picked up (and tore apart) Conservapedia, so it should be fairly hard to pinpoint the vandalism of that time to one source (that was only created months or so later).
Additionally, I would edit it to "that, among others, editors from a site formed " - especially since the source's pornography paragraph reads "interlopers from RationalWiki and elsewhere". -- Sid 3050 14:41, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
“ | After administrators blocked their accounts, Lipson and several other editors quit trying to moderate the articles and instead started their own website, RationalWiki.com. From there, they monitor Conservapedia. And — by their own admission — engage in acts of cyber-vandalism. | ” |
Okay, since you both don't like the current language, how about just simply using the following direct quote?
“ | After administrators blocked their accounts, Lipson and several other editors quit trying to moderate the articles and instead started their own website, RationalWiki.com. From there, they monitor Conservapedia. And — by their own admission — engage in acts of cyber-vandalism. Conservapedia's articles have been hit frequently by interlopers from RationalWiki and elsewhere. The vandals have inserted errors, pornographic photos and satire. | ” |
sound NPOV? VanTucky 18:22, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
I don't think we can simply go by the name and there claims. right wing perhaps. Conservative? That is certainly open to debate. Let'd either take out the claim or couch it in such a way that it notes the possibility that it is not conservative
"we" should be going by what is said about them not what they say about themselves . . . but whatever, you seem determined to keep the wording. So be it. Have fun.
"Conservapedia is a wiki-based encyclopedia project with articles written from an arguably??? socially and economically conservative viewpoint supportive of Conservative Christianity and Young Earth creationism.[1][2][3] "
Would everyone rate this article as B-Class? G e o. Talk to me 21:32, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
Perhaps this could go in: [6] I'm afraid it's only a blog, but Schlafly's conflict of interest is probably notable. Opinions? (Opinions, that is, on whether it should be included here. Let's keep this page about this article.) Totnesmartin 13:44, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
Please everyone, let's quit with the edit warring for now and discuss this thing. I think, that as Rationalwiki doesn't have it's own article or any other appropriate place to link it, and it is significantly mentioned in the article, it deserves to be linked. VanTucky 17:18, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
Notability is not a criteria for EL, the article discusses the site and the site provides "meaningful, relevant content that is not suitable for inclusion in an article, such as reviews and interviews." Tmtoulouse 17:36, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
like this
"Some people that believe in Nostradamus's prophecies believe that Andrew Schlafly is Mabus.Nostradamus was known to jumble up the names in his quatrains to prevent the wrong people from reading all the valuable information. People that study Nostradamus's quatrains have figured out that Mabus is a jumbled up form of Andrew Schlafly.[1] They get the M from the W (in Andrew) flipped upside down. The A comes from the first letter in Andrew. The b comes from the d just flipped around. The U comes from the upside down n. Finally, the S comes from the first letter in Schlafly.
or maybe this?
It's mollified by the knowledge that a Wikipedia-like site can only thrive with a relatively free exchange of ideas and some tolerance for vandals, hoaxers, and crackpots, and the gang of beady-eyed zealots running CP are going to stifle it to death while thinking they're 'protecting' it.
Yes this is clearly a high-quality link. -- Fredrick day 20:54, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
Cherry-picking? The first is taken from their article on Andrew Schlafly and the second from their article on Conversapedia - two things, I'd expect to find appropriate material on if the link is to provide additional information of the sort that would match a featured article (or whatever the wording is) - do you honestly think that material is of that quality? Yes I have a bone to pick - I don't think that rationalwiki is a high quality resource and should not be linked to. -- Fredrick day 21:00, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
hopefully others will come by and add it back in. Why hopefully?, you are already canvessing offsite for meatpuppets to do just that. -- Fredrick day 21:04, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
While the irony of turning the CP talk page into a defense of rationalwiki and its purpose is sweetly ironic for me, I don't see it helping much. I will only offer this one defense...one does not have to be serious in order to make a serious point.
Now what can we do to reach a compromise so we can put this issue to bed? EL is out for now, but how would you feel about just hyper-linking the first mention of rationalwiki in the article to its homepage? Tmtoulouse 16:40, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
As this appears to occur intermittently it should be mentioned somewhere in the text.
Has anyone counted the number of books actually used as references by Conservapedia (when it is up)?
Jackiespeel 17:27, 26 June 2007 (UTC)
I meant in the sense of "the usp being unavailable."
Conservapedia got mentioned in a bit on The Daily Show, specifically its article on homosexuality. I'd point this out there, but it seems editing is restricted to logged-in accounts and new accounts are disabled (otherwise I would point it out there instead of here). I guess that's one way to counteract vandalism. Nifboy 04:35, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
Regarding the Tom Flanagan quote, are there perhaps criticisms by other Conservatives that could be included as well? Ericster08 02:47, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
Should we include the criticism about a Pro-American Bias, for example, stating that Mexico is located "directly beneath the United States?"
How does running away from even a perceived bias solve the problem? Let's say for argument sake that Wikipedia leans to the left. Well how does breaking away and forming a conservative answer to Wikipedia create any less bias? All you're going to have is an encyclopedia with a conservative bias. Wouldn't it make more sense to dig in your heels and stay on the "liberal" Wikipedia to balance the perspective on ONE website? Diverging onto one direction does nothing but add to the ridiculous "RED-BLUE" divide in this country. The Righties should stay on Wikipedia so that there's an equal balance between Left and Right. Ericster08 05:33, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
Ah, good point. Ericster08 02:46, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
So the Registration is now closed, I quote:
“ To be allowed to create accounts in this Wiki you have to log in and have the appropriate permissions. ”
I used the create an account URL address of index.php?title=Special:Userlogin&type=signup&returnto=Main_Page ignoring the http://en.wikipedia.org/w/ and then added it to http://www.conservapedia.org to get: http://www.conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Special:Userlogin&type=signup&returnto=Main_Page. I find this funny and this is why I changed the registration to "Invite Only".-- WhereAmI 06:35, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
It may be open but it bans your IP adress upon registration so you can't edit anything on the site. - LordofToasts June 29, 2007
Can someone revert this? 4.253.40.211 15:29, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
I was just wondering, should there be a section pointing out the obvious contradictions, such as the ACLU page, where they begin discussing the Anti-Christian Bias, then cite examples where the ACLU goes to court representing Christians.... or would that just be petty and non official research?
It seems like huge portion of this article focuses on the difference between them and us, perhaps that should be a different article ( Wikipedia and Conservapedia compared anyone?) Cameron Nedland 00:47, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
The website is currently being raided by EBworld and a few other places. It's not very successful due to the disabling of registration, but still, good to see it get what it deserves. NoMercyX 04:12, 10 July 2007 (UTC) (whoops, forgot to sign my post)
Why is this article up for deletion? I cannot seem to find any reason for it? And there has been no comment on the matter from User:Nathaniel B. Heraniaos. Utterly perplexing. - Oh... in previewing this article I notice that he was told to nominate an article for deletion correctly. And, in the process of reading his comments, I discovered that he dislikes Conservapedia. Fair enough. Scarian Talk 02:43, 15 July 2007 (UTC) Dramatica doesn't do the raids you dumbass. Dramatica just records them and provides links. EBaumsworld does the raiding. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.42.73.86 ( talk) 00:54, August 24, 2007 (UTC)
Meh, keep this article on Conservapedia. Conservapedia is so bad, it actually makes Wikipedia look good. Mindraker 17:04, 27 August 2007 (UTC)
Here on Wikipedia it has video games, cartoons (mainly Japan and American made), medicine, TV, movies, people etc. The name Conservapedia seem like it would mainly have info on conservitive people and what conervs. would like. THROUGH FIRE, JUSTICE IS SERVED! 03:16, 15 July 2007 (UTC)
This edit removed what I think is an important point, that perhaps is just not in the right place. I think this point needs to be made in reference to the conservapedia copyright section, in that there is a lot of wikipedia material that is on CP and it could be a problem. Tmtoulouse 01:48, 16 July 2007 (UTC)
However, I am not familiar enough with CP to know whether they are, in fact, incorporating WP content and thus violating WP's copyright and license, nor do I know whether they have taken action to delete such content if and when it was ever brought to their attention.
Per WP:ASR, we should avoid having the Wikipedia article on Conservapedia turn into a justification of Wikipedia against Conservapedia. The focus should be on Conservapedia, not on Conservapedia and Wikipedia in opposition to each other. -- Metropolitan90 03:18, 16 July 2007 (UTC)
I don't know where else to put this, because I couldn't find a place in Wikipedia:Copyright to list pages that violate Wikipedia's copyright, but the following articles on Conservapedia are just a few of potentially many which are copied (at least partially) from Wikipedia without attribution, and without using the GFDL:
-- SteveDeans 17:27, 16 July 2007 (UTC)
I've notices a distinct parallel between aspects of Wikipedia and Conservapedia, most notably the name of the Conservapedia "commandments" (like the ten commandments) seems to be based on the "five pillars" of Wikipedia (similar to the Five Pillars of Islam). Two questions. 1: Is this significant enough to be put into the article? 2: Would it need some sort of citation? Calgary 03:25, 17 July 2007 (UTC)
It seems Conservapedia has a rather large amount of protected pages. Also, from what I can tell some people (like me) have be blocked from the wiki for simply stating there belife. Tesfan 02:23, 20 July 2007 (UTC)
I noticed this as well. I searched many different people, places, ideas, ect., and then tried to edit the pages, but it seems that all are blocked. I couldn't even edit the "Discussion" pages. I also tried to create pages, but apparently they blocked that too. I to create pages for obscure random bands, mainly because that was the only thing I could think of that someone wouldn't have already thought of. Maybe its my account name, or relative newness? Grizzedram
I thought it would be interesting to note, even though I refuse to add it to the article (more of an FYI), that Conservapedia is blocked by all Department of Defense computers, Wikipedia is not. I thought this was a little humorous. Crmadsen 01:02, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
I've never knowlingly added nonsense to Wikipedia, but if ever there was an article that deserved it, it's this one. I'm sure the people at Conservapedia mean well, at least in their minds, but it really is sad. This article should lead with "Conservapedia is a comedy parody of Wikipedia." I genuinely thought Conservapedia was a joke. I hope they put a stork image in the intercourse article (if they ever make one). Perhaps "limbs" could be substituted for "legs" as they did in Victorian times for women's legs. There is plenty in Wikipedia which bothers me, but most of that is because it's the truth, or at least an attempt at the truth! Hopefully Conservapedia doesn't get very far. I shudder to think that there will be kids who eat chicken "mammary glands" for supper. Anyone care to comment? Jimaginator 14:58, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
Legal action is threatened twice on the Conservapedia Commandments page. The first is a warning against "obscenity", which will supposedly be punished under 18 USC § 1470. Obscenity is not defined by Conservapedia or by Title 18 of the US Code. The possible reasons for this range from simple oversight to the discouraing of vandals with a form of fear, uncertainty, and doubt. I find this to be problematic, but not nearly as problematic as the second warning: "vandalism is punishable up to 10 years in jail per 18 USC § 1030." 18 USC § 1030 regards fraud in connection with computers. I'm guessing the basis for this is the idea that vandalism qualifies as "damage". I am not a lawyer, but unless vandalism on Conservapedia means something very different than it does on Wikipedia, I'm certain that the warning shows a profound ignorance of law or it's just disingenuous FUD.
I'd like to see this under differences in editorial philosophies. Can someone tell me if I'm wrong or off base about any of the above or if none of this information should be considered encyclopedic? 72.154.101.7 03:13, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
I've noticed (through the conservapedia list of examples of bias in wikipedia), that the bit about conservapedia's licence not being copyleft being "an issue which has led to some concerns", is sourced to an article that only give Jimbo Wales, as the one raising the concerns. Do we have a source for a more neutral party raising concerns? If not, then I think we should attribute the concerns to Jimbo Wales. Silverfish 11:17, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
"On December 30th of 2006, the site's main page stated that the project had 1950 articles. On December 31st, this number jumped to 14,900.[11]. The figure has stayed the same on the main page through July of 2007.[12]" This is not true at all. The site did not claim to have 14,900 articles from December to July. Ostap R
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