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The most senior enlisted guys in the US army are the sergeant majors (E9) equivalent to a Warrant Officer class 1 in the British Army. Certain comparisons can be made such as a British "Regimental Sergeant Major" (a senior WO1 role) being similar to a Command Sergeant Major in the US military. E8 ranks of MSGT and 1stSGT reflect those of a British WO2 (the company sergeant major being not fairly compared to a Top (1stSgt). The number of sergeant grades in the US military and relative low percentage of those holding the rank of private (E1 to E2) muddies the waters. One should consider the significant transition in the British Army in becoming a sergeant. A junior officer backed by sergeant leading a platoon in the British Army is similar to a US platoon with its officer and Sergeant first Class. Squads in the British Army are then led by corporals aided by lance corporals, which really fulfil the roles of the US. Staff sergeants and sergeants respectfully. The U.S. Corporals and PFCs are more like the most senior privates in the British Army, which reflects this by having up to four grades of the lowest rank (4th being fairly matched with a US E1) Where British Staff/Colour and Flight Sergeants some one else might want to comment on I have left them as equivalent to E7 (but evidently more senior than British Sergeants) Dainamo 18:49, 6 August 2006 (UTC)
The British army does not make distinctions between Private soldiers. There is only Private, although different privates are often paid differing amounts of money. there is no 'Private first class/second class' etc. should this not be changed? Lots of Love, Tim
Agreed. Merged the classifications of Private classes 1-3 and Able Rate 1-2 (RN), though a class 4/junior or naval new entrant should arguably remain lower Dainamo 21:25, 4 October 2006 (UTC)
I was kind of taken back to see a RN WO2, because I don't remember there being such a rank, but as it was clarified that this was a fairly recent creation it seems correct. And just out of curiosity where did the practice of pronouncing Lieutenant, "Leftenant", originate. 12.199.96.253 19:10, 17 October 2006 (UTC)
I am reverting to official comparison of enlisted/other ranks.
There is no reference on the rank comparison page to a source that offers any evidence for the alternative equivalents proposed, which are in contradiction of the official comparisons.
Neither cross-referencing of wikipedia articles nor a website talkpage are acceptable as sources for wikipedia. Wikipedia:Attribution and above all Wikipedia:Attribution/FAQ#What kinds of sources are generally regarded as unreliable? are clear in stating that neither source is acceptable. (Both are considered "self-published" and therefore useless as a source). Wikipedia:Attribution/FAQ makes clear what sources are acceptable. The alternative rank comparison must therefore be rejected as unsourced in accordance with Wikipedia:Policies and guidelines. It is one of the six key policies that we need a reliable source.
I will of course be happy to accept any other version when there is a reliable source, acceptable to wikipedia's policy of wikipedia:attribution.i.e. Name of book, author, publisher, and page (ideally also date and place of publication).
Mesoso 17:05, 20 March 2007 (UTC)
I just don't see what this article adds that isn't already covered by Ranks and insignia of NATO and its sub-articles. After all, we don't have Canada and United States military ranks compared or British and Polish military ranks compared nor as far as I can tell articles for any other pair of NATO countries. Besides, the name is problematic, as even if it were kept it would be better off as British and American military ranks compared or United Kingdom and United States military ranks compared. Unless someone can give a convincing reason why this article should exist, I'm going to nominate it for deletion at AfD in about a week. Caerwine Caer’s whines 22:42, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
I've closed the discussion at Afd since no consensus for deletion was made, but feel free to continue the discussion for a title change as several suggested a rename.-- JForget 23:09, 21 October 2007 (UTC)
Note that the U.S. military usually uses O-1 to O-10 to symbolize officers, and not the NATO codes of OF-1 to OF-10 in which all subaltern officers are classed as OF-1 (O-1 and O-2 in US). O-11 is sometimes used for the U.S. OF-10 ranks, but is not official.
A number of comments about OF v O:
Comment about the notes under the table:
My tuppence 2¢ worth.
Pdfpdf (
talk)
11:51, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
Isn't there a rank in the Royal Navy (and equivalent Commonwealth navies) between Sub-Lieutenant and Midshipman called Acting Sub-Lieutenant? -- 121.200.0.46 ( talk) 07:14, 13 April 2009 (UTC)
I would suggest putting the columns in the same order for both of the tables. The OR table seems to have the more readable/understandable order of the two. I would be bold and do it myself, but I'm not comfortable playing with tables quite yet. ArkianNWM ( talk) 05:50, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
Agree - There's a lot of good information here but I still found it rather confusing to be reading about UK/US ranks one minute and US/UK the next
Eclecticizer ( talk) 21:29, 27 April 2014 (UTC) I believe some confusion could be prevented if the US ranks were grouped together and the British ranks were also grouped together. Currently the US Army, Air Force and Marines are found in the second column, when, for clarity's sake, it seems to me that if this column were located next to the US Navy, et al, things would be clearer. When I first read through this table, I did not see the O ranking at the far right, only the OF ranking at the far left. So, I was viewing the ranks assigned as a mistake, not being aware of the NATO ranking structure. It was only after I clicked on the talk tab and read through some of the comments here that I learned of the differences (I confess I skipped over the article's text and went directly to the table).
I would consider making the changes myself, but it's been a few years since I've built any HTML tables and thus would take more time for me to do so than I have available currently.
Note 7 is completely wrong in the Enlisted Rank table. Chief Technician is not Obsolesent in the RAF, nor is LAC. It is Jnr Tech which is being phased out with no more promotions, engineering trades gaining the rank of SAC(T) instead.
18:09, 8 April 2010 (UTC)18:09, 8 April 2010 (UTC)~ —Preceding unsigned comment added by 132.58.234.21 ( talk)
There should be a note about the differing pronounciation of this name.-- 89.241.63.254 ( talk) 22:09, 5 May 2010 (UTC)
Currently states: "In the US Army, First Sergeant is considered senior to and promoted laterally from Master Sergeant when assigned to a First Sergeant billet, typically the senior NCO in a company (troop, battery) sized unit." This is not always true, but it's hard to word an exception. We had one in my battalion, in which the Battalion Command Sergeant Major (CSM) billet was filled by an E-8. Because he wasn't the senior NCO in a company, he was a Master Sergeant, and the 1SG's knew he was the boss. CsikosLo ( talk) 15:17, 24 April 2017 (UTC)
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Aside from a couple of paragraphs there is no expansion or explanation as to how the American military treats the rank of Warrant officer (United_States) compared to the British version. Bit of a glaring oversight. 146.200.202.49 ( talk) 20:52, 17 January 2023 (UTC)
The rank of Ensign has never been used in the Royal Navy. It was once the junior commissioned rank in the infantry. A Navy Ensign is an American invention given to what previously were called Passed Midshipman.
Neither has that rank ever been used in the Royal Marines; the most junior commissioned rank has always been Second Lieutenant. Creuzbourg ( talk) 19:13, 29 March 2023 (UTC)
![]() | This article was nominated for deletion on October 15, 2007. The result of the discussion was Keep/No consensus for deletion/Renamed needed to the title. |
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The most senior enlisted guys in the US army are the sergeant majors (E9) equivalent to a Warrant Officer class 1 in the British Army. Certain comparisons can be made such as a British "Regimental Sergeant Major" (a senior WO1 role) being similar to a Command Sergeant Major in the US military. E8 ranks of MSGT and 1stSGT reflect those of a British WO2 (the company sergeant major being not fairly compared to a Top (1stSgt). The number of sergeant grades in the US military and relative low percentage of those holding the rank of private (E1 to E2) muddies the waters. One should consider the significant transition in the British Army in becoming a sergeant. A junior officer backed by sergeant leading a platoon in the British Army is similar to a US platoon with its officer and Sergeant first Class. Squads in the British Army are then led by corporals aided by lance corporals, which really fulfil the roles of the US. Staff sergeants and sergeants respectfully. The U.S. Corporals and PFCs are more like the most senior privates in the British Army, which reflects this by having up to four grades of the lowest rank (4th being fairly matched with a US E1) Where British Staff/Colour and Flight Sergeants some one else might want to comment on I have left them as equivalent to E7 (but evidently more senior than British Sergeants) Dainamo 18:49, 6 August 2006 (UTC)
The British army does not make distinctions between Private soldiers. There is only Private, although different privates are often paid differing amounts of money. there is no 'Private first class/second class' etc. should this not be changed? Lots of Love, Tim
Agreed. Merged the classifications of Private classes 1-3 and Able Rate 1-2 (RN), though a class 4/junior or naval new entrant should arguably remain lower Dainamo 21:25, 4 October 2006 (UTC)
I was kind of taken back to see a RN WO2, because I don't remember there being such a rank, but as it was clarified that this was a fairly recent creation it seems correct. And just out of curiosity where did the practice of pronouncing Lieutenant, "Leftenant", originate. 12.199.96.253 19:10, 17 October 2006 (UTC)
I am reverting to official comparison of enlisted/other ranks.
There is no reference on the rank comparison page to a source that offers any evidence for the alternative equivalents proposed, which are in contradiction of the official comparisons.
Neither cross-referencing of wikipedia articles nor a website talkpage are acceptable as sources for wikipedia. Wikipedia:Attribution and above all Wikipedia:Attribution/FAQ#What kinds of sources are generally regarded as unreliable? are clear in stating that neither source is acceptable. (Both are considered "self-published" and therefore useless as a source). Wikipedia:Attribution/FAQ makes clear what sources are acceptable. The alternative rank comparison must therefore be rejected as unsourced in accordance with Wikipedia:Policies and guidelines. It is one of the six key policies that we need a reliable source.
I will of course be happy to accept any other version when there is a reliable source, acceptable to wikipedia's policy of wikipedia:attribution.i.e. Name of book, author, publisher, and page (ideally also date and place of publication).
Mesoso 17:05, 20 March 2007 (UTC)
I just don't see what this article adds that isn't already covered by Ranks and insignia of NATO and its sub-articles. After all, we don't have Canada and United States military ranks compared or British and Polish military ranks compared nor as far as I can tell articles for any other pair of NATO countries. Besides, the name is problematic, as even if it were kept it would be better off as British and American military ranks compared or United Kingdom and United States military ranks compared. Unless someone can give a convincing reason why this article should exist, I'm going to nominate it for deletion at AfD in about a week. Caerwine Caer’s whines 22:42, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
I've closed the discussion at Afd since no consensus for deletion was made, but feel free to continue the discussion for a title change as several suggested a rename.-- JForget 23:09, 21 October 2007 (UTC)
Note that the U.S. military usually uses O-1 to O-10 to symbolize officers, and not the NATO codes of OF-1 to OF-10 in which all subaltern officers are classed as OF-1 (O-1 and O-2 in US). O-11 is sometimes used for the U.S. OF-10 ranks, but is not official.
A number of comments about OF v O:
Comment about the notes under the table:
My tuppence 2¢ worth.
Pdfpdf (
talk)
11:51, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
Isn't there a rank in the Royal Navy (and equivalent Commonwealth navies) between Sub-Lieutenant and Midshipman called Acting Sub-Lieutenant? -- 121.200.0.46 ( talk) 07:14, 13 April 2009 (UTC)
I would suggest putting the columns in the same order for both of the tables. The OR table seems to have the more readable/understandable order of the two. I would be bold and do it myself, but I'm not comfortable playing with tables quite yet. ArkianNWM ( talk) 05:50, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
Agree - There's a lot of good information here but I still found it rather confusing to be reading about UK/US ranks one minute and US/UK the next
Eclecticizer ( talk) 21:29, 27 April 2014 (UTC) I believe some confusion could be prevented if the US ranks were grouped together and the British ranks were also grouped together. Currently the US Army, Air Force and Marines are found in the second column, when, for clarity's sake, it seems to me that if this column were located next to the US Navy, et al, things would be clearer. When I first read through this table, I did not see the O ranking at the far right, only the OF ranking at the far left. So, I was viewing the ranks assigned as a mistake, not being aware of the NATO ranking structure. It was only after I clicked on the talk tab and read through some of the comments here that I learned of the differences (I confess I skipped over the article's text and went directly to the table).
I would consider making the changes myself, but it's been a few years since I've built any HTML tables and thus would take more time for me to do so than I have available currently.
Note 7 is completely wrong in the Enlisted Rank table. Chief Technician is not Obsolesent in the RAF, nor is LAC. It is Jnr Tech which is being phased out with no more promotions, engineering trades gaining the rank of SAC(T) instead.
18:09, 8 April 2010 (UTC)18:09, 8 April 2010 (UTC)~ —Preceding unsigned comment added by 132.58.234.21 ( talk)
There should be a note about the differing pronounciation of this name.-- 89.241.63.254 ( talk) 22:09, 5 May 2010 (UTC)
Currently states: "In the US Army, First Sergeant is considered senior to and promoted laterally from Master Sergeant when assigned to a First Sergeant billet, typically the senior NCO in a company (troop, battery) sized unit." This is not always true, but it's hard to word an exception. We had one in my battalion, in which the Battalion Command Sergeant Major (CSM) billet was filled by an E-8. Because he wasn't the senior NCO in a company, he was a Master Sergeant, and the 1SG's knew he was the boss. CsikosLo ( talk) 15:17, 24 April 2017 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 3 external links on Comparison of United Kingdom and United States military ranks. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
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Aside from a couple of paragraphs there is no expansion or explanation as to how the American military treats the rank of Warrant officer (United_States) compared to the British version. Bit of a glaring oversight. 146.200.202.49 ( talk) 20:52, 17 January 2023 (UTC)
The rank of Ensign has never been used in the Royal Navy. It was once the junior commissioned rank in the infantry. A Navy Ensign is an American invention given to what previously were called Passed Midshipman.
Neither has that rank ever been used in the Royal Marines; the most junior commissioned rank has always been Second Lieutenant. Creuzbourg ( talk) 19:13, 29 March 2023 (UTC)