![]() | This article was nominated for deletion on 8 May 2005. The result of the discussion was keep. |
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A few things:
I'm going to start by making a few changes. If anyone wants to help out, please do. -- ran ( talk) 22:27, May 7, 2005 (UTC)
China isn't an empire anymore right? Don't you need an emperor? What is the goal of creating this article?-- Amerinese 17:32, 8 May 2005 (UTC)
The PRC has a policy of encouraging Han migration to Tibet and Xinjiang, which I believe is important in understanding the views of Tibetans and Uighurs. Your edit hides that.
Lapsed Pacifist 18:00, 24 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/Chinese imperialism -- DavidStevenson 21:35, 24 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Macau was a small penninsula with two islands attached which altogether is less than eighty square kilometres... and it was granted to the Portugese in the Sixteenth century, thus it is hardly accurate to call it a territory lost to Portugal in the nineteenth century. In fact, at that point its character was closer to a ghetto than a colony, and the Portugese's behaviour there over the years showed this.
I just reverted this blatant POV. As common knowledge within the boundaries the Russian Federation, ethnic-Russians and the indigenous peoples of Siberia are both considered Russians. - 210.0.204.29 03:18, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
This chunk of text has been deleted, and I can't find a reason here or or in the edit history:
"The Republic of China and the People's Republic of China (established 1949) have since attempted, with varying degrees of success, to re-incorporate some areas that fell outside of Chinese control before and after the collapse of the Qing Dynasty. The PRC's control over Tibet, East Turkestan, and Inner Mongolia, (the first two of which contain majority non-Han populations), is seen by some locals citation needed and outsiders as modern-day imperialism, as are subsequent organized campaigns citation needed of Han immigration into these regions. This is often described by critics as demographic swamping, aimed at destroying the uniqueness of those regions, but defended as the innocuous, routine and benevolent importing of labourers and professionals into sparsely populated and poorly developed regions by supporters. Finally, the PRC's territorial claim over Taiwan, which is still controlled by the Republic of China, is also seen as an example of imperialism by critics. In all these cases supporters consider China's policy to be that of defending the PRC's right to succeed the ROC as well as defend the territorial integrity of China. "
Anyone object to its reinsertion?
Lapsed Pacifist ( talk) 17:16, 2 January 2009 (UTC)
Tibet springs to mind as one country that had pretty much slipped out of Chinese control by the time of the formation of the PRC. The PRC regime often portrays its "development" of countries like East Turkestan and Tibet as benevolent. Many have spoken both against and in favour of this "development"; I don't foresee a major problem in sourcing these viewpoints.
Lapsed Pacifist ( talk) 20:46, 2 January 2009 (UTC)
The result of the proposal was Merge into History of China, and become a Redirect to Imperial China, which is a disambiguation page. 199.125.109.102 ( talk) 18:22, 24 January 2009 (UTC)
Chinese imperialism → Territorial expansions in the history of China — The current article is an poorly written article on a contentious topic. The content has not changed significantly since May 8, 2005. And this content has no citation whatsoever.
I believe the article should be refocused for it to be improved properly, this is because 1) Imperialism is a word that was coin only in the 1800s, when referring to imperialistic acts by the Romans and Mongols Wikipedia simply use conquests or campaigns. 2) Imperialism is a policy/philosophy, unless the country had colonies or openly acknowledged imperialism, calling it imperialistic would be an interpretation, which could easily be disputed/NPOV in both source and content for both historical and modern regimes.
The proposed title strives to be neutral. I wish to model the name after Territorial acquisitions of the United States or Overseas expansion of the United States, however it is difficult as this topic will cover multiple regimes/dynasties. Open to suggestion however. — Voidvector ( talk) 10:48, 13 January 2009 (UTC)
*'''Support'''
or *'''Oppose'''
, then sign your comment with ~~~~
. Since
polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account
Wikipedia's naming conventions.I removed the requested move template. Don't think its right to move it to Territorial expansions in the history of China (based on Territorial acquisitions of the United States). If anything it should be redirected to Territorial evolution of China modelled on Territorial evolution of the United States. These two as well as Overseas expansion of the United States are subarticles to United States territory. There are no China equivalents e.g. Chinese territory (this is a redirect to a names page) or Territory of China. Now considering that this is English Wikipedia it is entirely natural that its coverage of the USA is far more indepth and specialist than that of China, then all those topics are dealt with more or less in History of China and each of the Chinese dynasty articles.-- Loop 9 ( talk) 18:00, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
Infact Territorial acquisitions of the United States has also been moved to Territorial changes of the United States.-- Loop 9 ( talk) 18:04, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
Tensions aren't an example of imperialism. Disputes aren't imperialism.
For example: If you discuss the South China Sea or Indian Border Disputes, you should open a new page titled "Vietnamese imperialism" or "Filipino Imperialism" or "Indian imperialism". This article looks like it's trying to paint China in a negative light rather than actually try and discuss imperialism. Why do you only call it imperialism if China does it? AmericanPropagandaHunter ( talk) 14:46, 18 June 2020 (UTC)
This article should be deleted. Whatever we think of Chinese foreign policy, the title "Chinese imperialism" is inherently POV. There is no agreed definition of imperialism, and certainly no agreement among historians that China is or ever has been an imperialist power by any definition. Constant Pedant ( talk) 03:32, 4 July 2020 (UTC)
Most of the material in the modern expansions in section is not properly sourced. The citations offered for the material do not even mention the word imperialism. Either new citations should be produced or the section should be removed. 188.141.3.145 ( talk) 16:33, 10 September 2020 (UTC)
The article mentions the publication of several "Maps of National Shame" and lists the territories in said maps--but where is a copy of the map itself? I really want to see that! 147.226.213.152 ( talk) 17:52, 7 September 2021 (UTC)
The PRC dont claim that much territories anymore. Most of them were already settled with neighboring countries. The only lost territories that still claim by China is the South Tibet and Taiwan. The section has so many misinformation. Not even the Qing dynasty claimed they want Outer Manchuria and Sakhalin island back lol. -- Someone97816 ( talk) 16:09, 4 May 2022 (UTC)
Southern Mongolia is a territory that originally belongs to Mongolia. It was annexed by the Chinese and renamed " Inner Mongolia". So it should be mentioned in this article. - Artanisen ( talk) 09:50, 19 January 2023 (UTC)
This article includes expanding territories, redeeming territories, and expanding influence, which are not the same under Expansionism. Vacosea ( talk) 18:16, 5 September 2023 (UTC)
![]() | This article was nominated for deletion on 8 May 2005. The result of the discussion was keep. |
![]() | This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||
|
A few things:
I'm going to start by making a few changes. If anyone wants to help out, please do. -- ran ( talk) 22:27, May 7, 2005 (UTC)
China isn't an empire anymore right? Don't you need an emperor? What is the goal of creating this article?-- Amerinese 17:32, 8 May 2005 (UTC)
The PRC has a policy of encouraging Han migration to Tibet and Xinjiang, which I believe is important in understanding the views of Tibetans and Uighurs. Your edit hides that.
Lapsed Pacifist 18:00, 24 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/Chinese imperialism -- DavidStevenson 21:35, 24 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Macau was a small penninsula with two islands attached which altogether is less than eighty square kilometres... and it was granted to the Portugese in the Sixteenth century, thus it is hardly accurate to call it a territory lost to Portugal in the nineteenth century. In fact, at that point its character was closer to a ghetto than a colony, and the Portugese's behaviour there over the years showed this.
I just reverted this blatant POV. As common knowledge within the boundaries the Russian Federation, ethnic-Russians and the indigenous peoples of Siberia are both considered Russians. - 210.0.204.29 03:18, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
This chunk of text has been deleted, and I can't find a reason here or or in the edit history:
"The Republic of China and the People's Republic of China (established 1949) have since attempted, with varying degrees of success, to re-incorporate some areas that fell outside of Chinese control before and after the collapse of the Qing Dynasty. The PRC's control over Tibet, East Turkestan, and Inner Mongolia, (the first two of which contain majority non-Han populations), is seen by some locals citation needed and outsiders as modern-day imperialism, as are subsequent organized campaigns citation needed of Han immigration into these regions. This is often described by critics as demographic swamping, aimed at destroying the uniqueness of those regions, but defended as the innocuous, routine and benevolent importing of labourers and professionals into sparsely populated and poorly developed regions by supporters. Finally, the PRC's territorial claim over Taiwan, which is still controlled by the Republic of China, is also seen as an example of imperialism by critics. In all these cases supporters consider China's policy to be that of defending the PRC's right to succeed the ROC as well as defend the territorial integrity of China. "
Anyone object to its reinsertion?
Lapsed Pacifist ( talk) 17:16, 2 January 2009 (UTC)
Tibet springs to mind as one country that had pretty much slipped out of Chinese control by the time of the formation of the PRC. The PRC regime often portrays its "development" of countries like East Turkestan and Tibet as benevolent. Many have spoken both against and in favour of this "development"; I don't foresee a major problem in sourcing these viewpoints.
Lapsed Pacifist ( talk) 20:46, 2 January 2009 (UTC)
The result of the proposal was Merge into History of China, and become a Redirect to Imperial China, which is a disambiguation page. 199.125.109.102 ( talk) 18:22, 24 January 2009 (UTC)
Chinese imperialism → Territorial expansions in the history of China — The current article is an poorly written article on a contentious topic. The content has not changed significantly since May 8, 2005. And this content has no citation whatsoever.
I believe the article should be refocused for it to be improved properly, this is because 1) Imperialism is a word that was coin only in the 1800s, when referring to imperialistic acts by the Romans and Mongols Wikipedia simply use conquests or campaigns. 2) Imperialism is a policy/philosophy, unless the country had colonies or openly acknowledged imperialism, calling it imperialistic would be an interpretation, which could easily be disputed/NPOV in both source and content for both historical and modern regimes.
The proposed title strives to be neutral. I wish to model the name after Territorial acquisitions of the United States or Overseas expansion of the United States, however it is difficult as this topic will cover multiple regimes/dynasties. Open to suggestion however. — Voidvector ( talk) 10:48, 13 January 2009 (UTC)
*'''Support'''
or *'''Oppose'''
, then sign your comment with ~~~~
. Since
polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account
Wikipedia's naming conventions.I removed the requested move template. Don't think its right to move it to Territorial expansions in the history of China (based on Territorial acquisitions of the United States). If anything it should be redirected to Territorial evolution of China modelled on Territorial evolution of the United States. These two as well as Overseas expansion of the United States are subarticles to United States territory. There are no China equivalents e.g. Chinese territory (this is a redirect to a names page) or Territory of China. Now considering that this is English Wikipedia it is entirely natural that its coverage of the USA is far more indepth and specialist than that of China, then all those topics are dealt with more or less in History of China and each of the Chinese dynasty articles.-- Loop 9 ( talk) 18:00, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
Infact Territorial acquisitions of the United States has also been moved to Territorial changes of the United States.-- Loop 9 ( talk) 18:04, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
Tensions aren't an example of imperialism. Disputes aren't imperialism.
For example: If you discuss the South China Sea or Indian Border Disputes, you should open a new page titled "Vietnamese imperialism" or "Filipino Imperialism" or "Indian imperialism". This article looks like it's trying to paint China in a negative light rather than actually try and discuss imperialism. Why do you only call it imperialism if China does it? AmericanPropagandaHunter ( talk) 14:46, 18 June 2020 (UTC)
This article should be deleted. Whatever we think of Chinese foreign policy, the title "Chinese imperialism" is inherently POV. There is no agreed definition of imperialism, and certainly no agreement among historians that China is or ever has been an imperialist power by any definition. Constant Pedant ( talk) 03:32, 4 July 2020 (UTC)
Most of the material in the modern expansions in section is not properly sourced. The citations offered for the material do not even mention the word imperialism. Either new citations should be produced or the section should be removed. 188.141.3.145 ( talk) 16:33, 10 September 2020 (UTC)
The article mentions the publication of several "Maps of National Shame" and lists the territories in said maps--but where is a copy of the map itself? I really want to see that! 147.226.213.152 ( talk) 17:52, 7 September 2021 (UTC)
The PRC dont claim that much territories anymore. Most of them were already settled with neighboring countries. The only lost territories that still claim by China is the South Tibet and Taiwan. The section has so many misinformation. Not even the Qing dynasty claimed they want Outer Manchuria and Sakhalin island back lol. -- Someone97816 ( talk) 16:09, 4 May 2022 (UTC)
Southern Mongolia is a territory that originally belongs to Mongolia. It was annexed by the Chinese and renamed " Inner Mongolia". So it should be mentioned in this article. - Artanisen ( talk) 09:50, 19 January 2023 (UTC)
This article includes expanding territories, redeeming territories, and expanding influence, which are not the same under Expansionism. Vacosea ( talk) 18:16, 5 September 2023 (UTC)