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For your information, there recently was a bit of a disagreement on what is considered fair use. An administrator speedily deleted the infobox image for this article following a previous discussion to keep it. After a discussion on the administrator's talk page who deleted the article, a discussion at ANI, and a deletion review, the file was restored. It seems to be the consensus of editors and admins that copyrighted images of unbuilt buildings are fair use, especially if permission was obtained from the copyright holder. It should be noted, however, that permission alone will get an image deleted. It must be labeled with an appropriate copyright tag and have a sufficient fair use rationale. Also, once measurable progress has been made on the building a free replacement can be made and this image should be deleted immediately. In other words, if/when this structure starts rising and we can take a photo of it, we need to replace and delete this image. DR04 ( talk) 03:44, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
I'll be performing a decent amount of edits to this article over the next 24 hours. One of my primary concerns was that the current financial problems did not a get a new section. Instead an editor simply moved the initial financial problem section down and added to it. That works fine for now, but the prose is not in chronological order as you would expect from such a section. I'll be adding additional information on the current financial problems as well as the construction delays and restoring chronological flow for this section. I'll also include the new developments of Kelleher trying to obtain union financing. I'll try to expand the construction sections a bit as well. Feel free to include other updates during this and any other time as well! DR04 ( talk) 05:14, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
Just a note, one source [1] is currently saying they got the $170m - but considering the coverage by local media on this project and their lack of articles confirming this, I think the Artinfo reporter might have jumped the gun. Let's wait until we get another confirmation before updating the article. DR04 ( talk) 17:37, 17 December 2009 (UTC)
Moved out of 111 South Wacker Drive, unpaid rent. Daniel Christensen ( talk) 06:36, 25 November 2010 (UTC)
A lot of good stuff here that should be worked in: http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20101112-714149.html
Searching it through google shows the whole story and not the log in thing: http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20101112-714149.html
The infobox says this building was never built; is that true? Apple & TWC Fan ( talk) 01:23, 17 December 2010 (UTC)
This is true. MelbourneStar1 ( talk) 00:40, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
The circular foundation was prepared in 2008, but no above-ground work was done and there has been no work on the site since late that year. Sepreece ( talk) 01:24, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
a few references:
Wow the Chicago Spire really does have a 'fantastic' future ahead of it. MelbourneStar1 ( talk) 00:39, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
lol I wouldnt say the whole city -- just this cancelled / dead project :) MelbourneStar1 ( talk) 00:46, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
What's the basis for saying specifically that it was canceled in early 2010? The foreclosure didn't start until late-2010. What event are you taking as signaling canceling it was canceled? Sepreece ( talk) 01:48, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
take a read of the articles look at their dates :) MelbourneStar1 ( talk) 02:27, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
Project cancelled - does this mean that there is no hope of ever restarting it? If so, what next? Can the existing work be salvaged and used in another project, or will it need to be demolished? What are the plans for that piece of property? 74.100.60.53 ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 20:21, 28 March 2011 (UTC).
"Canceled" is really the wrong word, because it suggests that someone made a decision to kill it. The most you can say accurately is that work has stopped, control of the property has been taken away from the developer, and for some time, nobody from the developer's company has said they're still trying. It's fair to say it's functionally dead and the odds of it being resurrected in the time before they lose the ability to buy back the property taxes is negligible. In the current Chicago real estate market, nobody is likely to move to build on the site anytime soon - a nearby project that had been on hold for two+ years was recently reannounced, but with the project scale cut in half and many other projects are still dead in the water. However, the foreclosure action and tax sale make it much harder to review the Spire than most of those other projects. The most complete review of the project I know of is the recent Chicago TimeOut feature - [13]. Sepreece ( talk) 01:50, 30 March 2011 (UTC)
We'll have to just disagree about the semantics of "cancel", which by my dictionary pretty clearly requires an action. "Dead" just describes the result, without saying anything about how it got that way, which is fine in this case. February 2 is pretty recent in encyclopedic terms; a quick Google search didn't come up with anything more recent about the Spire. The TimeOut Chicago piece is by a respected journalism professor and seems well-researched. In any case, I think we're all in agreement that the project is dead. Sepreece ( talk) 02:28, 31 March 2011 (UTC)
Since the project is n longer alive, the description of the view etc. should be canged from indicative to subjunctive.!!!!
I have reverted Wikidemon's edit, for now. I think it is a little early to be calling this project revived enough to turn the wording back present tense. These three reliable sources, all say it is still cancelled: CTBUH, Emporis, Skyscraperpage. The project 'knight in shining armour' riding to the rescue, might yet disappear along with their $135m if they don't get their act together by the end of march. Astronaut ( talk) 18:12, 18 February 2014 (UTC)
Cyberbot II has detected that page contains external links that have either been globally or locally blacklisted. Links tend to be blacklisted because they have a history of being spammed, or are highly innappropriate for Wikipedia. This, however, doesn't necessarily mean it's spam, or not a good link. If the link is a good link, you may wish to request whitelisting by going to the request page for whitelisting. If you feel the link being caught by the blacklist is a false positive, or no longer needed on the blacklist, you may request the regex be removed or altered at the blacklist request page. If the link is blacklisted globally and you feel the above applies you may request to whitelist it using the before mentioned request page, or request its removal, or alteration, at the request page on meta. When requesting whitelisting, be sure to supply the link to be whitelisted and wrap the link in nowiki tags. The whitelisting process can take its time so once a request has been filled out, you may set the invisible parameter on the tag to true. Please be aware that the bot will replace removed tags, and will remove misplaced tags regularly.
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I don't have the details on me but I know that this project hit a major setback, and may even be cancelled as a result of a failed payment. -- Dekema2 ( talk) 00:49, 2 November 2014 (UTC) They were supposed to make a payment by the end of yesterday (Friday 10/31). As of yesterday morning their attorney said it was unlikely they would make it. However, I haven't seen anything today about the outcome, so it may be Monday before the Business reporters write it up. Unless, of course, there's some kind of negotiation still ongoing... Sepreece ( talk) 03:01, 2 November 2014 (UTC)
This should be inserted into the main article - by someone a little more experienced than me. 96.247.7.59 ( talk) — Preceding undated comment added 01:12, 20 January 2015 (UTC)
IvoShandor ( talk) 06:29, 21 January 2015 (UTC)
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This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Chicago Spire article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: 1, 2, 3 |
![]() | Chicago Spire has been listed as one of the Art and architecture good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it. | |||||||||||||||
| ||||||||||||||||
Current status: Good article |
![]() | This article is rated GA-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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|
For your information, there recently was a bit of a disagreement on what is considered fair use. An administrator speedily deleted the infobox image for this article following a previous discussion to keep it. After a discussion on the administrator's talk page who deleted the article, a discussion at ANI, and a deletion review, the file was restored. It seems to be the consensus of editors and admins that copyrighted images of unbuilt buildings are fair use, especially if permission was obtained from the copyright holder. It should be noted, however, that permission alone will get an image deleted. It must be labeled with an appropriate copyright tag and have a sufficient fair use rationale. Also, once measurable progress has been made on the building a free replacement can be made and this image should be deleted immediately. In other words, if/when this structure starts rising and we can take a photo of it, we need to replace and delete this image. DR04 ( talk) 03:44, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
I'll be performing a decent amount of edits to this article over the next 24 hours. One of my primary concerns was that the current financial problems did not a get a new section. Instead an editor simply moved the initial financial problem section down and added to it. That works fine for now, but the prose is not in chronological order as you would expect from such a section. I'll be adding additional information on the current financial problems as well as the construction delays and restoring chronological flow for this section. I'll also include the new developments of Kelleher trying to obtain union financing. I'll try to expand the construction sections a bit as well. Feel free to include other updates during this and any other time as well! DR04 ( talk) 05:14, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
Just a note, one source [1] is currently saying they got the $170m - but considering the coverage by local media on this project and their lack of articles confirming this, I think the Artinfo reporter might have jumped the gun. Let's wait until we get another confirmation before updating the article. DR04 ( talk) 17:37, 17 December 2009 (UTC)
Moved out of 111 South Wacker Drive, unpaid rent. Daniel Christensen ( talk) 06:36, 25 November 2010 (UTC)
A lot of good stuff here that should be worked in: http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20101112-714149.html
Searching it through google shows the whole story and not the log in thing: http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20101112-714149.html
The infobox says this building was never built; is that true? Apple & TWC Fan ( talk) 01:23, 17 December 2010 (UTC)
This is true. MelbourneStar1 ( talk) 00:40, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
The circular foundation was prepared in 2008, but no above-ground work was done and there has been no work on the site since late that year. Sepreece ( talk) 01:24, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
a few references:
Wow the Chicago Spire really does have a 'fantastic' future ahead of it. MelbourneStar1 ( talk) 00:39, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
lol I wouldnt say the whole city -- just this cancelled / dead project :) MelbourneStar1 ( talk) 00:46, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
What's the basis for saying specifically that it was canceled in early 2010? The foreclosure didn't start until late-2010. What event are you taking as signaling canceling it was canceled? Sepreece ( talk) 01:48, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
take a read of the articles look at their dates :) MelbourneStar1 ( talk) 02:27, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
Project cancelled - does this mean that there is no hope of ever restarting it? If so, what next? Can the existing work be salvaged and used in another project, or will it need to be demolished? What are the plans for that piece of property? 74.100.60.53 ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 20:21, 28 March 2011 (UTC).
"Canceled" is really the wrong word, because it suggests that someone made a decision to kill it. The most you can say accurately is that work has stopped, control of the property has been taken away from the developer, and for some time, nobody from the developer's company has said they're still trying. It's fair to say it's functionally dead and the odds of it being resurrected in the time before they lose the ability to buy back the property taxes is negligible. In the current Chicago real estate market, nobody is likely to move to build on the site anytime soon - a nearby project that had been on hold for two+ years was recently reannounced, but with the project scale cut in half and many other projects are still dead in the water. However, the foreclosure action and tax sale make it much harder to review the Spire than most of those other projects. The most complete review of the project I know of is the recent Chicago TimeOut feature - [13]. Sepreece ( talk) 01:50, 30 March 2011 (UTC)
We'll have to just disagree about the semantics of "cancel", which by my dictionary pretty clearly requires an action. "Dead" just describes the result, without saying anything about how it got that way, which is fine in this case. February 2 is pretty recent in encyclopedic terms; a quick Google search didn't come up with anything more recent about the Spire. The TimeOut Chicago piece is by a respected journalism professor and seems well-researched. In any case, I think we're all in agreement that the project is dead. Sepreece ( talk) 02:28, 31 March 2011 (UTC)
Since the project is n longer alive, the description of the view etc. should be canged from indicative to subjunctive.!!!!
I have reverted Wikidemon's edit, for now. I think it is a little early to be calling this project revived enough to turn the wording back present tense. These three reliable sources, all say it is still cancelled: CTBUH, Emporis, Skyscraperpage. The project 'knight in shining armour' riding to the rescue, might yet disappear along with their $135m if they don't get their act together by the end of march. Astronaut ( talk) 18:12, 18 February 2014 (UTC)
Cyberbot II has detected that page contains external links that have either been globally or locally blacklisted. Links tend to be blacklisted because they have a history of being spammed, or are highly innappropriate for Wikipedia. This, however, doesn't necessarily mean it's spam, or not a good link. If the link is a good link, you may wish to request whitelisting by going to the request page for whitelisting. If you feel the link being caught by the blacklist is a false positive, or no longer needed on the blacklist, you may request the regex be removed or altered at the blacklist request page. If the link is blacklisted globally and you feel the above applies you may request to whitelist it using the before mentioned request page, or request its removal, or alteration, at the request page on meta. When requesting whitelisting, be sure to supply the link to be whitelisted and wrap the link in nowiki tags. The whitelisting process can take its time so once a request has been filled out, you may set the invisible parameter on the tag to true. Please be aware that the bot will replace removed tags, and will remove misplaced tags regularly.
Below is a list of links that were found on the main page:
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From your friendly hard working bot.— cyberbot II NotifyOnline 11:24, 3 April 2014 (UTC)
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I don't have the details on me but I know that this project hit a major setback, and may even be cancelled as a result of a failed payment. -- Dekema2 ( talk) 00:49, 2 November 2014 (UTC) They were supposed to make a payment by the end of yesterday (Friday 10/31). As of yesterday morning their attorney said it was unlikely they would make it. However, I haven't seen anything today about the outcome, so it may be Monday before the Business reporters write it up. Unless, of course, there's some kind of negotiation still ongoing... Sepreece ( talk) 03:01, 2 November 2014 (UTC)
This should be inserted into the main article - by someone a little more experienced than me. 96.247.7.59 ( talk) — Preceding undated comment added 01:12, 20 January 2015 (UTC)
IvoShandor ( talk) 06:29, 21 January 2015 (UTC)
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