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Why does chanteuse redirect here?
Shouldn't there be some explanation of the relationship of the word "chanteuse" to "chanson" in the body of the article? -- Robotech_Master 04:42, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
In modern French, "une chanson" normally means "a song". As described in "Chanson today" (I corrected the inadequate plural there was), one would say "la chanson française", or maybe "la chanson" by ellypsis (e.g. "J'aime beaucoup la chanson" means liking chanson française when no song is specifically mentionned). "Chanteur" means "singer", there is no specialization to be involved: Pavarotti, Britney Spears and Jacques Brel are all "chanteurs". It's like saying: "Singers specialized in songs are called singers." Just pure obviousness. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 196.41.254.172 ( talk) 08:48, 23 April 2011 (UTC)
This article would greatly benefit from an audio example. — C M B J 04:24, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
There is a discordance. The "Nouvelle chanson" section claims to be about what in France is called "chanson" or "chanson française" (meaning Édith Piaff, Trenet, Jacques Brel, Brassens or more modern artists like Dominique A, Alain Bashung or Miossec) but the main article of "Nouvelle chanson" (check the link which is proposed in the article) is about the "nouvelle scène française" so only artists from the 90s onwards.
So if "Nouvelle chanson" is the equivalent in English for what in France is called "chanson" or "chanson française" the link should redirect to an article that actually talks about that and not only about "nouvelle scène française". I think there are two possible solutions, or another article is made talking about the "chanson française" or the "Nouvelle chanson" article is expanded.
In the other hand if "Nouvelle chanson" refers to the "nouvelle scène française" then this article ("Chanson") must be changed. There must be another section between "Modern chanson" and "Nouvelle chanson" that talks about the "chanson française" from the beginnings of the XXth century until the 90s and the contents of the "Nouvelle chanson" section must be changed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.123.62.16 ( talk) 09:32, 5 November 2017 (UTC)
This whole prissy & artsy-fartsy nonsense should be deleted, lest we begin to have hundreds of thousands of articles on English Wikipedia named with a word in a foreign language but describing only a subject that goes in completely under the English word for it. -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 17:58, 23 September 2020 (UTC)
French native here, guys chanson just mean song... I was going to argue for deletion, but we do have an idiom for specifically french lyrical singing. Medias and the general public would use the term " Chanson francaise". I think it'd be better suited.
https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chanson_fran%C3%A7aise
-- Ostream ( talk) 19:32, 4 December 2020 (UTC)
Done - but that was instantaneously reversed without any discussion. --
SergeWoodzing (
talk)
08:52, 19 June 2021 (UTC)
For 10 years now, this article as per template has been missing inline citations to substantiate a large number of highfalutin (not to say hotsy-totsy) allegations and conjecture, and to motivate the existence of the article per se. It reads more like a personal essay giving the educational opinions of a talented music and/or French teacher, but not like a well-sourced Wikipedia article. Unless the requested inline citations are added soon, I will be removing all that stuff. Fair notice. -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 09:30, 19 June 2021 (UTC)
A source is also needed to clearly substantiate that chanson is the predominant (and title-worthy) denomination to use for an article on the topic of French songs on English Wikipedia (English) Wikipedia. Also see the previous 2 sections on this page immediately preceding this one. There is no clarity (none whatsoever) on that issue. -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 16:38, 19 June 2021 (UTC)
Would be interesting with more reliable & verifiable sources, less personal opinions without such. Wikipedians adding stuff like this is how this is, and that is so, and I'm telling you all this or that is really of no value to an article without reliable sources. Takes up space and makes discussion much more tedious & difficult. -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 20:08, 20 June 2021 (UTC)
![]() | This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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Why does chanteuse redirect here?
Shouldn't there be some explanation of the relationship of the word "chanteuse" to "chanson" in the body of the article? -- Robotech_Master 04:42, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
In modern French, "une chanson" normally means "a song". As described in "Chanson today" (I corrected the inadequate plural there was), one would say "la chanson française", or maybe "la chanson" by ellypsis (e.g. "J'aime beaucoup la chanson" means liking chanson française when no song is specifically mentionned). "Chanteur" means "singer", there is no specialization to be involved: Pavarotti, Britney Spears and Jacques Brel are all "chanteurs". It's like saying: "Singers specialized in songs are called singers." Just pure obviousness. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 196.41.254.172 ( talk) 08:48, 23 April 2011 (UTC)
This article would greatly benefit from an audio example. — C M B J 04:24, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
There is a discordance. The "Nouvelle chanson" section claims to be about what in France is called "chanson" or "chanson française" (meaning Édith Piaff, Trenet, Jacques Brel, Brassens or more modern artists like Dominique A, Alain Bashung or Miossec) but the main article of "Nouvelle chanson" (check the link which is proposed in the article) is about the "nouvelle scène française" so only artists from the 90s onwards.
So if "Nouvelle chanson" is the equivalent in English for what in France is called "chanson" or "chanson française" the link should redirect to an article that actually talks about that and not only about "nouvelle scène française". I think there are two possible solutions, or another article is made talking about the "chanson française" or the "Nouvelle chanson" article is expanded.
In the other hand if "Nouvelle chanson" refers to the "nouvelle scène française" then this article ("Chanson") must be changed. There must be another section between "Modern chanson" and "Nouvelle chanson" that talks about the "chanson française" from the beginnings of the XXth century until the 90s and the contents of the "Nouvelle chanson" section must be changed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.123.62.16 ( talk) 09:32, 5 November 2017 (UTC)
This whole prissy & artsy-fartsy nonsense should be deleted, lest we begin to have hundreds of thousands of articles on English Wikipedia named with a word in a foreign language but describing only a subject that goes in completely under the English word for it. -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 17:58, 23 September 2020 (UTC)
French native here, guys chanson just mean song... I was going to argue for deletion, but we do have an idiom for specifically french lyrical singing. Medias and the general public would use the term " Chanson francaise". I think it'd be better suited.
https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chanson_fran%C3%A7aise
-- Ostream ( talk) 19:32, 4 December 2020 (UTC)
Done - but that was instantaneously reversed without any discussion. --
SergeWoodzing (
talk)
08:52, 19 June 2021 (UTC)
For 10 years now, this article as per template has been missing inline citations to substantiate a large number of highfalutin (not to say hotsy-totsy) allegations and conjecture, and to motivate the existence of the article per se. It reads more like a personal essay giving the educational opinions of a talented music and/or French teacher, but not like a well-sourced Wikipedia article. Unless the requested inline citations are added soon, I will be removing all that stuff. Fair notice. -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 09:30, 19 June 2021 (UTC)
A source is also needed to clearly substantiate that chanson is the predominant (and title-worthy) denomination to use for an article on the topic of French songs on English Wikipedia (English) Wikipedia. Also see the previous 2 sections on this page immediately preceding this one. There is no clarity (none whatsoever) on that issue. -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 16:38, 19 June 2021 (UTC)
Would be interesting with more reliable & verifiable sources, less personal opinions without such. Wikipedians adding stuff like this is how this is, and that is so, and I'm telling you all this or that is really of no value to an article without reliable sources. Takes up space and makes discussion much more tedious & difficult. -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 20:08, 20 June 2021 (UTC)