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Obviously a lot of work has gone into this article by some intelligent people. But I believe the current version has some major problems in terms of completeness and neutral point of view.
Approximately three quarters of the words in this article are about the appearance, size, and shape of breasts. Plastic surgery is given around 600 words, which is more than the number of words on puberty, female sexual pleasure, cancer, and breastfeeding combined. From my perspective as a female reader, these ratios are plainly ludicrous. To make a more conventional Wikipedia argument, the article’s emphasis on breast size and shape, and on cosmetic surgery, is way out of line with how high-quality secondary and tertiary sources on breast health and sex education discuss the subject.
Consider, for example, the WebMD article on breast changes in menopause. It lists three types of changes: 1. Tenderness or pain, 2. Changes in breast size and shape, and 3. Lumps in the breast. The Wikipedia article mentions menopause four times. Every single one of those four mentions relates menopause to changes in breast size and/or shape, and to nothing else. And this example is not an isolated problem.
I would expect a general article on this subject to talk a lot more about breast physiology, about sensations in the breast that are experienced by women and girls, about the health concerns that owners of breasts have (girls and women worry about their breasts a lot), and about the significance of the subject to infants. Some particulars I’d like to see are:
(In case this needs needs to be said - editors of all genders can write well about this stuff.)
The long sections on asymmetry and ptosis could be condensed to a few sentences each - these aspects are covered in far more detail than is necessary for a general article.
This article has an emphasis on plastic surgery that fills up most of four sections. The section on body image gives no alternatives to "a woman [who] considers her breasts deficient in some respect" except surgery and hormonal treatments. The idea of coming to accept one's body as it is is not mentioned. Given the limited extent to which the topic of plastic surgery is brought up in secondary and tertiary sources that discuss breast health for general readers, I think it warrants one section. In this, we should:
Currently our table of contents for the biomedical aspects of the breast is:
with a section of "Body image" further down
A more balanced and less-repetitious article could be arranged something like this:
# Endocrinology
Cheers, Clayoquot ( talk | contribs) 06:41, 4 September 2017 (UTC)
{{u|
Checkingfax}} {
Talk}
12:37, 5 September 2017 (UTC)Extended content
|
---|
Shape and supportSome breasts are mounted high upon the chest wall, are of rounded shape, and project almost horizontally from the chest. These features are common to girls and women in the early stages of thelarchic development (the sprouting of the breasts). In the high-breast configuration, the dome-shaped and the cone-shaped breast is affixed to the chest at the base, and weight is evenly distributed over the base area. In the low-breast configuration, a proportion of the breast weight is supported by the chest, against which rests the lower surface of the breast, thus is formed the inframammary fold (IMF). Because the base is deeply affixed to the chest, the weight of the breast is distributed over a greater area. This reduces the weight-bearing strain upon the chest, shoulder, and back muscles that bear the weight of the bust. citation needed In the course of thelarche, some girls develop breasts the lower skin-envelope of which touches the chest below the IMF, and some girls do not; both breast anatomies are statistically normal morphologic variations of the size and shape of women's breasts. [1] Aging![]() Breast ptosis, or sagging of the breasts, is a normal consequence of aging [2] where the breast tissue droops lower on the chest and the nipple points downward. [3] Researchers have found that ptosis is influenced by several key factors: greater age, higher body mass index, larger bra cup size, history of significant weight loss (>50 lbs or 25 kg), number of pregnancies, and history of cigarette smoking. [4] [5] [6] It is not caused, as commonly believed by many women and medical practitioners, by breastfeeding. [7] Plastic surgeons categorize ptosis by evaluating the position of the nipple relative to the inframammary crease (where the underside of the breast meets the chest wall). This is determined by measuring from the center of the nipple to the sternal notch (at the top of the breast bone) to gauge how far the nipple has fallen. The standard anthropometric measurement for young women is 21 centimetres (8.3 in). This measurement is used to assess both breast ptosis and breast symmetry. The surgeon will assess the breast's angle of projection. The apex of the breast, which includes the nipple, can have a flat angle of projection (180 degrees) or acute angle of projection (greater than 180 degrees). The apex rarely has an angle greater than 60 degrees. The angle of the breast apex is partly determined by the tautness of the suspensory Cooper's ligaments. For example, when a woman lies on her back, the angle of the breast apex becomes a flat, obtuse angle (less than 180 degrees) while the base-to-length ratio of the breast ranges from 0.5 to 1.0. [2] Plastic surgeryAfter mastectomy, the reconstruction of the breast or breasts is done with breast implants or autologous tissue transfer, using fat and tissues from the abdomen, which is performed with a TRAM flap or with a back (latissiumus muscle flap). Breast reduction surgery is a procedure that involves removing excess breast tissue, fat, and skin, and the repositioning of the nipple-areola complex. , breast augmentation with implants, and combination procedures; the two types of available breast implants are models filled with silicone gel, and models filled with saline solution. These types of breast surgery can also repair inverted nipples by releasing milk duct tissues that have become tethered. Furthermore, in the case of the obese woman, a breast lift (mastopexy) procedure, with or without a breast volume reduction, can be part of an upper-body lift and contouring for the woman who has undergone massive body weight loss. citation needed Other potential means of breast enlargement also exist, such as hormonal breast enhancement. [8] [9] References
|
Clayoquot, personally, regarding the asymmetry material, I would not have split the content off to create the Breast asymmetry article. When it comes to WP:Med and WP:Anatomy, we merge a lot of content and this is something I would have considered merging if seeing it separated from this article. I often consider WP:HASTE and WP:No split, and am only open to splitting when I think it's necessary. If it's content composed of a few or several paragraphs, I usually don't consider that worth splitting. Either way, for now, breast asymmetry should be covered in this article and we should point readers to the Breast asymmetry article for further detail. Flyer22 Reborn ( talk) 17:29, 8 September 2017 (UTC)
And I see that you did that with this and this edit, although it's currently a brief mention. Flyer22 Reborn ( talk) 17:33, 8 September 2017 (UTC)
Hi everyone. I'm planning to remove this set of pictures, for the following reasons:
{{editprotected}}
I am currently sorting redirects by adding redirect templates and I wish to add the following two templates to this redirect:
which also place it in Category:Redirects from alternative names and Category:Redirects from plurals. -- OlEnglish ( Talk) 22:55, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
The article says: "In some cultures, like the Himba in northern Namibia, bare-breasted women are normal, while a thigh is highly sexualised and not exposed in public". But the girl showed as exemplar is exposing both breasts and thighs... -- ExperiencedArticleFixer ( talk) 05:56, 7 January 2018 (UTC)
I suggest these edits for the lead:
Along with their major function in providing nutrition for infants, female breasts have social and sexual characteristics. Human B breasts have been featured in notable ancient and modern sculpture, art, and photography. Female breasts can figure prominently in a woman's perception of her the perception women and girls have of their body image and sexual attractiveness. A number of Western cultures associate breasts with sexuality and tend to regard bare breasts in public as immodest or indecent. Breasts, especially the nipples, are an erogenous zone on human females.
AnaSoc (
talk)
00:41, 11 March 2018 (UTC)
I like boo bees — Preceding unsigned comment added by Bigtiddy89 ( talk • contribs) 19:37, 24 March 2018 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request to
Breast has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
The sentence beginning:
In women, the breasts overlay...
is ungrammatical. It should be
In women, the breasts overlie 222.152.167.153 ( talk) 20:30, 8 April 2018 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request to
Boobs has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
The redirect page Boobs should redirect to the disambiguation page Boob, not Breast. Boob contains entries related to the plural form as well.
Also, {{ R cat shell}} should be added along with {{ R from non-neutral name}} and {{ R from ambiguous name}}. {{ R from alternative name}} should be removed since it is not a name.
Also, Boobs was fully protected a decade go. Maybe it’s time that it’s unprotected? It could be semi-protected instead. Interqwark talk contribs 22:41, 1 June 2018 (UTC)
I have a good photo which shows variation of size (whole breast and areola) and shape between women and between the individual breasts of one woman. For the size and shape section.
— Preceding unsigned comment added by Nelson21101805 ( talk • contribs) 18:21, 31 January 2019 (UTC)
breast are the one good thing in this world — Preceding unsigned comment added by Thomas21445645 ( talk • contribs) 02:33, 10 September 2019 (UTC)
breast are the one good thing in this world — Preceding unsigned comment added by Thomas21445645 ( talk • contribs) 02:33, 10 September 2019 (UTC)
An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Bustrioles. Please participate in the redirect discussion if you wish to do so. SpicyMilkBoy ( talk) 21:52, 23 February 2020 (UTC)
An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Tits (boobs). Please participate in the redirect discussion if you wish to do so. SpicyMilkBoy ( talk) 14:49, 25 February 2020 (UTC)
A discussion is taking place to address the redirect
Milker. The discussion will occur at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2020 July 10#Milker until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion.
Hog Farm
Bacon
03:58, 10 July 2020 (UTC)
I'd like to add a needed citation to this section https://citationhunt.toolforge.org/en?id=7d00e5f1 [1]
References
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | ← | Archive 5 | Archive 6 | Archive 7 |
Obviously a lot of work has gone into this article by some intelligent people. But I believe the current version has some major problems in terms of completeness and neutral point of view.
Approximately three quarters of the words in this article are about the appearance, size, and shape of breasts. Plastic surgery is given around 600 words, which is more than the number of words on puberty, female sexual pleasure, cancer, and breastfeeding combined. From my perspective as a female reader, these ratios are plainly ludicrous. To make a more conventional Wikipedia argument, the article’s emphasis on breast size and shape, and on cosmetic surgery, is way out of line with how high-quality secondary and tertiary sources on breast health and sex education discuss the subject.
Consider, for example, the WebMD article on breast changes in menopause. It lists three types of changes: 1. Tenderness or pain, 2. Changes in breast size and shape, and 3. Lumps in the breast. The Wikipedia article mentions menopause four times. Every single one of those four mentions relates menopause to changes in breast size and/or shape, and to nothing else. And this example is not an isolated problem.
I would expect a general article on this subject to talk a lot more about breast physiology, about sensations in the breast that are experienced by women and girls, about the health concerns that owners of breasts have (girls and women worry about their breasts a lot), and about the significance of the subject to infants. Some particulars I’d like to see are:
(In case this needs needs to be said - editors of all genders can write well about this stuff.)
The long sections on asymmetry and ptosis could be condensed to a few sentences each - these aspects are covered in far more detail than is necessary for a general article.
This article has an emphasis on plastic surgery that fills up most of four sections. The section on body image gives no alternatives to "a woman [who] considers her breasts deficient in some respect" except surgery and hormonal treatments. The idea of coming to accept one's body as it is is not mentioned. Given the limited extent to which the topic of plastic surgery is brought up in secondary and tertiary sources that discuss breast health for general readers, I think it warrants one section. In this, we should:
Currently our table of contents for the biomedical aspects of the breast is:
with a section of "Body image" further down
A more balanced and less-repetitious article could be arranged something like this:
# Endocrinology
Cheers, Clayoquot ( talk | contribs) 06:41, 4 September 2017 (UTC)
{{u|
Checkingfax}} {
Talk}
12:37, 5 September 2017 (UTC)Extended content
|
---|
Shape and supportSome breasts are mounted high upon the chest wall, are of rounded shape, and project almost horizontally from the chest. These features are common to girls and women in the early stages of thelarchic development (the sprouting of the breasts). In the high-breast configuration, the dome-shaped and the cone-shaped breast is affixed to the chest at the base, and weight is evenly distributed over the base area. In the low-breast configuration, a proportion of the breast weight is supported by the chest, against which rests the lower surface of the breast, thus is formed the inframammary fold (IMF). Because the base is deeply affixed to the chest, the weight of the breast is distributed over a greater area. This reduces the weight-bearing strain upon the chest, shoulder, and back muscles that bear the weight of the bust. citation needed In the course of thelarche, some girls develop breasts the lower skin-envelope of which touches the chest below the IMF, and some girls do not; both breast anatomies are statistically normal morphologic variations of the size and shape of women's breasts. [1] Aging![]() Breast ptosis, or sagging of the breasts, is a normal consequence of aging [2] where the breast tissue droops lower on the chest and the nipple points downward. [3] Researchers have found that ptosis is influenced by several key factors: greater age, higher body mass index, larger bra cup size, history of significant weight loss (>50 lbs or 25 kg), number of pregnancies, and history of cigarette smoking. [4] [5] [6] It is not caused, as commonly believed by many women and medical practitioners, by breastfeeding. [7] Plastic surgeons categorize ptosis by evaluating the position of the nipple relative to the inframammary crease (where the underside of the breast meets the chest wall). This is determined by measuring from the center of the nipple to the sternal notch (at the top of the breast bone) to gauge how far the nipple has fallen. The standard anthropometric measurement for young women is 21 centimetres (8.3 in). This measurement is used to assess both breast ptosis and breast symmetry. The surgeon will assess the breast's angle of projection. The apex of the breast, which includes the nipple, can have a flat angle of projection (180 degrees) or acute angle of projection (greater than 180 degrees). The apex rarely has an angle greater than 60 degrees. The angle of the breast apex is partly determined by the tautness of the suspensory Cooper's ligaments. For example, when a woman lies on her back, the angle of the breast apex becomes a flat, obtuse angle (less than 180 degrees) while the base-to-length ratio of the breast ranges from 0.5 to 1.0. [2] Plastic surgeryAfter mastectomy, the reconstruction of the breast or breasts is done with breast implants or autologous tissue transfer, using fat and tissues from the abdomen, which is performed with a TRAM flap or with a back (latissiumus muscle flap). Breast reduction surgery is a procedure that involves removing excess breast tissue, fat, and skin, and the repositioning of the nipple-areola complex. , breast augmentation with implants, and combination procedures; the two types of available breast implants are models filled with silicone gel, and models filled with saline solution. These types of breast surgery can also repair inverted nipples by releasing milk duct tissues that have become tethered. Furthermore, in the case of the obese woman, a breast lift (mastopexy) procedure, with or without a breast volume reduction, can be part of an upper-body lift and contouring for the woman who has undergone massive body weight loss. citation needed Other potential means of breast enlargement also exist, such as hormonal breast enhancement. [8] [9] References
|
Clayoquot, personally, regarding the asymmetry material, I would not have split the content off to create the Breast asymmetry article. When it comes to WP:Med and WP:Anatomy, we merge a lot of content and this is something I would have considered merging if seeing it separated from this article. I often consider WP:HASTE and WP:No split, and am only open to splitting when I think it's necessary. If it's content composed of a few or several paragraphs, I usually don't consider that worth splitting. Either way, for now, breast asymmetry should be covered in this article and we should point readers to the Breast asymmetry article for further detail. Flyer22 Reborn ( talk) 17:29, 8 September 2017 (UTC)
And I see that you did that with this and this edit, although it's currently a brief mention. Flyer22 Reborn ( talk) 17:33, 8 September 2017 (UTC)
Hi everyone. I'm planning to remove this set of pictures, for the following reasons:
{{editprotected}}
I am currently sorting redirects by adding redirect templates and I wish to add the following two templates to this redirect:
which also place it in Category:Redirects from alternative names and Category:Redirects from plurals. -- OlEnglish ( Talk) 22:55, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
The article says: "In some cultures, like the Himba in northern Namibia, bare-breasted women are normal, while a thigh is highly sexualised and not exposed in public". But the girl showed as exemplar is exposing both breasts and thighs... -- ExperiencedArticleFixer ( talk) 05:56, 7 January 2018 (UTC)
I suggest these edits for the lead:
Along with their major function in providing nutrition for infants, female breasts have social and sexual characteristics. Human B breasts have been featured in notable ancient and modern sculpture, art, and photography. Female breasts can figure prominently in a woman's perception of her the perception women and girls have of their body image and sexual attractiveness. A number of Western cultures associate breasts with sexuality and tend to regard bare breasts in public as immodest or indecent. Breasts, especially the nipples, are an erogenous zone on human females.
AnaSoc (
talk)
00:41, 11 March 2018 (UTC)
I like boo bees — Preceding unsigned comment added by Bigtiddy89 ( talk • contribs) 19:37, 24 March 2018 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request to
Breast has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
The sentence beginning:
In women, the breasts overlay...
is ungrammatical. It should be
In women, the breasts overlie 222.152.167.153 ( talk) 20:30, 8 April 2018 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request to
Boobs has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
The redirect page Boobs should redirect to the disambiguation page Boob, not Breast. Boob contains entries related to the plural form as well.
Also, {{ R cat shell}} should be added along with {{ R from non-neutral name}} and {{ R from ambiguous name}}. {{ R from alternative name}} should be removed since it is not a name.
Also, Boobs was fully protected a decade go. Maybe it’s time that it’s unprotected? It could be semi-protected instead. Interqwark talk contribs 22:41, 1 June 2018 (UTC)
I have a good photo which shows variation of size (whole breast and areola) and shape between women and between the individual breasts of one woman. For the size and shape section.
— Preceding unsigned comment added by Nelson21101805 ( talk • contribs) 18:21, 31 January 2019 (UTC)
breast are the one good thing in this world — Preceding unsigned comment added by Thomas21445645 ( talk • contribs) 02:33, 10 September 2019 (UTC)
breast are the one good thing in this world — Preceding unsigned comment added by Thomas21445645 ( talk • contribs) 02:33, 10 September 2019 (UTC)
An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Bustrioles. Please participate in the redirect discussion if you wish to do so. SpicyMilkBoy ( talk) 21:52, 23 February 2020 (UTC)
An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Tits (boobs). Please participate in the redirect discussion if you wish to do so. SpicyMilkBoy ( talk) 14:49, 25 February 2020 (UTC)
A discussion is taking place to address the redirect
Milker. The discussion will occur at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2020 July 10#Milker until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion.
Hog Farm
Bacon
03:58, 10 July 2020 (UTC)
I'd like to add a needed citation to this section https://citationhunt.toolforge.org/en?id=7d00e5f1 [1]
References