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At the very top right of the page, the location coordinates on Google maps point here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=42.35,-71.05&spn=0.1,0.1&q=42.35,-71.05 to the South Station location, while in the info box the coordinates point right to the center of Boston, MA on Google map: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=42.358261,-71.060181&spn=0.3,0.3&q=42.358261,-71.060181. I don't understand how the coordinates are generated at the top right of the page. Especially when the correct coordinates are in the info box. Can someone with Wikispeak-techy knowledge help with this? Or explain? Is it somehow automatically generated by a bot or what when the subject is a city and a certain template is used? Also, I cannot find a way to change the coordinates displayed on the top right of the page to the coordinates that are in the info box under location. (Even though both coordinates are in Boston) Is this even possible? Necessary? Am I making a big deal over a difference of a few miles? Jeeny 16:32, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
Hey guys, the 2005 population estimate , listed as 559,034, is wrong. The Census admitted that it made a mistake and corrected it to 596,638. Here's is the link: [1]. I had fixed it before, but somebody didn't believe me, so I decided to bring the issue up here. Lexicon506 03:21, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
The image under the "education" is of a building located in Newton, Massachusetts, not Boston. Can anyone find anything suitable that's actually in Boston? BigKennyK 21:07, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
The image is of Boston College and is right on the Brighton line. It is clearly appropriate and, as one of the nices buildings in Boston, a nice touch. 24 March 2007 (UTC)
It is a great picture, not in Newton fyi. The picture quality of all posted has improved greatly with the one exception of the longwood scape. 5-2-07
Boston, Mass. is not the only significant settlement called Boston inhabited by English speakers, so why does a search for "Boston" not go to the disambiguation page ? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 62.25.106.209 ( talk • contribs).
The very first sentence in the article is confusing.
"Boston is the capital and the most populous city of the Commonwealth of Massachusetts, a state of the United States of America, and the largest city in New England."
This makes it sound like Boston is a state in the US.
The result of the debate was No move. It should be noted that Serge's notices to users who would specifically favor one side of this proposal do qualify as canvass, and not as friendly notices.-- Hús ö nd 03:33, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
Boston, Massachusetts →
Boston — This city is the primary meaning of the term, so no disambiguation is needed, and it can be simply placed at its actual name.
Yath
19:11, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
# '''Support'''
or # '''Oppose'''
on a new line in the appropriate section followed by a brief explanation, then sign your opinion using ~~~~. Please remember that this survey is
not a vote, and please provide an explanation for your recommendation.by Serge? Agne 22:58, 5 February 2007 (UTC)
From
WP:CANVASS under the section Votestacking
"Votestacking is sending mass talk messages out to editors who are on the record with a specific opinion (such as via a userbox or other user categorization) and informing them of a current or upcoming vote.".
Your message to your fellow supporters was "
In the past, you've noted support on my talk page for naming U.S. cities consistently with other countries (only disambiguate when necessary)" and then encouraging them to come here. That is pretty clear cut.
Agne
23:06, 5 February 2007 (UTC)
I notice that a lot of vandalism has occurred due to what has tentatively been labled on Wikipedia the "Boston advertising security scare" (by moi), in addition to Aquagate and other rather silly names. They're doing it because Boston was pwned and the hackers (including the folks at 4Chan) know it, so they want to celebrate the fact by running riot all over Wikipedia. — Rickyrab | Talk 17:28, 2 February 2007 (UTC)
This event seems reasonably important to recent history to me, it can be mentioned, but should be done in a NPOV way (naturally). Perhaps a link to a separate page talking about the event? 24.27.93.253 23:03, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
{{editprotected}}
I am requesting that an edit be made to the first lines in the history/intro section of this award winning article. The Puritans of Massachusetts Bay who founded Boston in 1630 were not "known as the Pilgrim fathers." This should be deleted.
The Pilgrims founded Plymouth Colony and had a separate history and religious platform from the Puritans of the Massachusetts Bay Colony. The Pilgrims departed by sea for the New World from Leiden, Holland not England. Leiden was their temporary home for 12 years (1608-1620) after having fled persecution in England. The Pilgrims landed in Plymouth, Massachusetts in 1620 on the Mayflower, ten years before the Puritans. The Puritans came direct from England to Boston.
The two colonies were separate and did not merge until 1691, 71 years after the founding of the Plymouth Colony. When the Massachusetts Bay Colony was reorganized and issued a new charter as the Province of Massachusetts Bay in 1691, Plymouth ended its history as a separate colony and merged into the new province. The most obvious difference between the Pilgrims and the Puritans is that the Puritans had no intention of breaking with the Church of England - only to "purify" it. The Pilgrims were separatists who considered the established church in England to be corrupt and non-reformable. The two groups did eventually unite into one faith community but by then they were no longer Pilgrims and Puritans but had evolved into New England Congregationalists. For a detailed treatment of this issue, see http://www.rootsweb.com/~mosmd/ Jm3106jr 06:27, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
I have posted comments in /Comments regarding some issues with this article. Please address these concerns in this section. Failing resolution or discussion I will be putting the article up for a WP:FAR. Alan.ca 11:32, 18 February 2007 (UTC)
The demographics section has been edited heavily lately, I have a couple issues with recent changes:
-- Loodog 03:55, 24 February 2007 (UTC)
This article states that Boston was founded on November 17, 1630. The correct date is September 7, 1630. The only references I see to the November 17, 1630 are websites that copy Wikipedia data. If you need a reference, "A Municipal History of the Town and City of Boston During Two Centuries: From September 17, 1630,..." by Josiah Quincy, is available by Google, http://books.google.com/books?vid=OCLC57248669 -- petertdavis 11:53, 25 February 2007
Just a note, there is apparently another edit war in process as to whether Boston should redirect to this article or to the disambiguation page. It is currently pointing at the disambiguation page. I've created an RFD. Enjoy.-- Bobblehead 18:35, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
Aside from the clear cut BS and Bostonians delusions of grandeur, please tell me what part of CT is in the Boston metro area? I would like to know. You guys in Philly, as well as Boston (I feel that you two have something in common, historically) need your own Identities. Philly needs to stop trying to put itself in with NYC just because it (Philly) is near NJ. NYC already has it's NY/NJ/CT region. Similarly, Boston needs to stop trying to force CT into it's New England region headed (self appointed of course) by itself. CT is not what you would like it to be. All of you stores (with Boston sports propaganda in them) cannot take it away from NYC. You two cities need to get a life and stop trying to leech off of cities that have nothing to do with you.-- 71.235.81.39 03:52, 7 March 2007 (UTC)
Well I am glad that a sound editor is a work here. Boston does not have the reach that New Englanders would like to believe. It is not that large of a city. It is only the last major city in the US before Canada and it is all alone up there. The last time I checked TV markets, no piece of CT is in there TV market and there is no New England TV market. Boston keeps trying to use the New England thing to mean Boston and expand it's market share to make themselves appear more of a major TV market in the US. We in CT are proudly in the NYC area.-- 71.235.81.39 18:45, 7 March 2007 (UTC)
Seems to me that the Connecticut River splits the state into New York and New England spheres of influence. For example, Hartford is closer to Logan than JFK. - Keith D. Tyler ¶ ( AMA) 22:00, 7 March 2007 (UTC)
I am from Rocky Hill and grew up in danbury, and have always considered myself a New Englander, and a part of the Boston area, so I agree, please do not try and speak for the whole state. For some in Fairfield County, you may share this POV, but do not speak on behalf of the entire state. youd have a better argument against boston area if you were to say the hartford/springfield area, as bradley international airport serves. and i am also on the west of the river and have always been, so even that doesn't work.Kmccusker2 06:50, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
Lol! It may be closer to Logan (Hartford has it's own airport), but Logan is still a good way away from Boston. However, Hartford is not in the NYC area. Since they are crazy about Springfield, MA and call themselves the "shining start of New England," that pretty much sums up what they feel that they must be. Down in the NY area parts of the state, the only thing New England are some Boston/MA owned businesses who seem to want to promote Boston sports teams or call themselves "New England" something. They put emphasis on the "New England." It's a dead give away. I have never seen a city so far away try so hard to capture the minds of a state that has nothing at all to do with them. In spite of all of their efforts, they cannot change the culture. Ask anyone in the world, "New York or Boston?" You know Boston is not even in the running. Boston is not even world class. The question is "New York or Los Angeles?" Boston needs to deal with it's own region and forget about trying to brainwash CT citizen's.--71.235.81.39
Well, the south central part is NYC too. You forget that they are on the Metro-North line and Boston is still light years away. They just do not have anything in common with a city that has no influence or proximity to them. For those who do, I may assume it is because they border MA and that must be good enough for them. Southeastern CT is very odd. I used to assume that they were into Boston and NOT NYC. When I was coming back from RI(I keep forgetting that another cultural divide is that these Boston related peoples sound alike and NOT as we do in CT), I was in a town (North Stonington) near the RI border. I went into a gas station and they sold NY newpapers as well as Boston. They also sol Yankees and Red Sox gear. Now I will say that the Red Sox gear would not be too shocking, but I was shocked to see Yankees. So I guess the SE part of the state may deal with both.
FOr the most part, if you live in the parts of the state where you pick up NYC or Long Island TV or radio stations, you know that you are in the NYC area. Even in any part of CT, I have not been able to pick up any Boston media because it is not possible since no part of CT is in the Boston area. We don't even get Boston newspapers down here except in those specialty newsstands. I hope that settles this. I just think that people from Boston and New England spent too much time assuming and thinking that CT felt the same way as they do about Boston/New England that it comes as a shock to you. Well this is the way it is.-- 71.235.81.39 15:12, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
My mistake on that. I meant that Hartford is still a good distance from Boston.-- 71.235.81.39 18:18, 27 March 2007 (UTC)
The demographics section claims to be based on the "census of 2006". What on earth is that? THe footnote that supposedly sources it talks about the census of 2000. This needs to be fixed. john k 21:29, 24 March 2007 (UTC)
I reverted the addition of the prediction by Wilford Woodruff that Boston would be destroyed as being WP:Undue weight for an extremely minority POV. [3] However Alex71va ( talk · contribs) re-added the prediction into the history section of the article [4] and then left a comment on my talk page [5] citing the inclusion of Pat Robertson saying the people of Dover, Pennsylvania shouldn't turn to God in case of a disaster after they voted out their school board [6] as justification for inclusion of the prediction in this article. Rather than get in a revert war with the editor, I figured I'd get the opinion of the regular editors of this article on whether it should be included or not. Cheers. -- Bobblehead 22:07, 15 April 2007 (UTC)
Closing as no consensus to move; given this proposal did not succeed a bare two months ago, no guideline changes have occurred in the interim, and the evident trend of the discussion thus far to endorse the previous result, closing early.-- cjllw ʘ TALK 04:30, 21 April 2007 (UTC)
Boston, Massachusetts → Boston – {Boston, MA is by far the most common usage of the term Boston. The Boston page already redirects to Boston, MA. Though Boston, Lincolnshire may be the namesake of Boston MA, Boston MA is still the most common usage by far. Norwich, Norfolk in England, for example, is a lesser known city who can simply be found under Norwich. Several other North American cities have only the city name as their article name, including Philadelphia, New York City, Montreal, Chicago and San Francisco. I feel Boston among others should fall in this category} —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Black Harry ( talk • contribs).
Add "# Support" or "# Oppose" on a new line in the appropriate section followed by a brief explanation, then sign your opinion using ~~~~. Please remember that this survey is not a vote, and please provide an explanation for your recommendation. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Black Harry ( talk • contribs).
Add any additional comments
Why is this question being asked again? We just had a survey that closed February 7, two months ago. See above. - Will Beback · † · 05:42, 20 April 2007 (UTC)
I have edited the erroneous caption misrepresenting Copley Square as the Christian Science Center.
-matt lavallee
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | Archive 2 | Archive 3 | Archive 4 | Archive 5 | Archive 6 |
At the very top right of the page, the location coordinates on Google maps point here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=42.35,-71.05&spn=0.1,0.1&q=42.35,-71.05 to the South Station location, while in the info box the coordinates point right to the center of Boston, MA on Google map: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=42.358261,-71.060181&spn=0.3,0.3&q=42.358261,-71.060181. I don't understand how the coordinates are generated at the top right of the page. Especially when the correct coordinates are in the info box. Can someone with Wikispeak-techy knowledge help with this? Or explain? Is it somehow automatically generated by a bot or what when the subject is a city and a certain template is used? Also, I cannot find a way to change the coordinates displayed on the top right of the page to the coordinates that are in the info box under location. (Even though both coordinates are in Boston) Is this even possible? Necessary? Am I making a big deal over a difference of a few miles? Jeeny 16:32, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
Hey guys, the 2005 population estimate , listed as 559,034, is wrong. The Census admitted that it made a mistake and corrected it to 596,638. Here's is the link: [1]. I had fixed it before, but somebody didn't believe me, so I decided to bring the issue up here. Lexicon506 03:21, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
The image under the "education" is of a building located in Newton, Massachusetts, not Boston. Can anyone find anything suitable that's actually in Boston? BigKennyK 21:07, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
The image is of Boston College and is right on the Brighton line. It is clearly appropriate and, as one of the nices buildings in Boston, a nice touch. 24 March 2007 (UTC)
It is a great picture, not in Newton fyi. The picture quality of all posted has improved greatly with the one exception of the longwood scape. 5-2-07
Boston, Mass. is not the only significant settlement called Boston inhabited by English speakers, so why does a search for "Boston" not go to the disambiguation page ? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 62.25.106.209 ( talk • contribs).
The very first sentence in the article is confusing.
"Boston is the capital and the most populous city of the Commonwealth of Massachusetts, a state of the United States of America, and the largest city in New England."
This makes it sound like Boston is a state in the US.
The result of the debate was No move. It should be noted that Serge's notices to users who would specifically favor one side of this proposal do qualify as canvass, and not as friendly notices.-- Hús ö nd 03:33, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
Boston, Massachusetts →
Boston — This city is the primary meaning of the term, so no disambiguation is needed, and it can be simply placed at its actual name.
Yath
19:11, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
# '''Support'''
or # '''Oppose'''
on a new line in the appropriate section followed by a brief explanation, then sign your opinion using ~~~~. Please remember that this survey is
not a vote, and please provide an explanation for your recommendation.by Serge? Agne 22:58, 5 February 2007 (UTC)
From
WP:CANVASS under the section Votestacking
"Votestacking is sending mass talk messages out to editors who are on the record with a specific opinion (such as via a userbox or other user categorization) and informing them of a current or upcoming vote.".
Your message to your fellow supporters was "
In the past, you've noted support on my talk page for naming U.S. cities consistently with other countries (only disambiguate when necessary)" and then encouraging them to come here. That is pretty clear cut.
Agne
23:06, 5 February 2007 (UTC)
I notice that a lot of vandalism has occurred due to what has tentatively been labled on Wikipedia the "Boston advertising security scare" (by moi), in addition to Aquagate and other rather silly names. They're doing it because Boston was pwned and the hackers (including the folks at 4Chan) know it, so they want to celebrate the fact by running riot all over Wikipedia. — Rickyrab | Talk 17:28, 2 February 2007 (UTC)
This event seems reasonably important to recent history to me, it can be mentioned, but should be done in a NPOV way (naturally). Perhaps a link to a separate page talking about the event? 24.27.93.253 23:03, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
{{editprotected}}
I am requesting that an edit be made to the first lines in the history/intro section of this award winning article. The Puritans of Massachusetts Bay who founded Boston in 1630 were not "known as the Pilgrim fathers." This should be deleted.
The Pilgrims founded Plymouth Colony and had a separate history and religious platform from the Puritans of the Massachusetts Bay Colony. The Pilgrims departed by sea for the New World from Leiden, Holland not England. Leiden was their temporary home for 12 years (1608-1620) after having fled persecution in England. The Pilgrims landed in Plymouth, Massachusetts in 1620 on the Mayflower, ten years before the Puritans. The Puritans came direct from England to Boston.
The two colonies were separate and did not merge until 1691, 71 years after the founding of the Plymouth Colony. When the Massachusetts Bay Colony was reorganized and issued a new charter as the Province of Massachusetts Bay in 1691, Plymouth ended its history as a separate colony and merged into the new province. The most obvious difference between the Pilgrims and the Puritans is that the Puritans had no intention of breaking with the Church of England - only to "purify" it. The Pilgrims were separatists who considered the established church in England to be corrupt and non-reformable. The two groups did eventually unite into one faith community but by then they were no longer Pilgrims and Puritans but had evolved into New England Congregationalists. For a detailed treatment of this issue, see http://www.rootsweb.com/~mosmd/ Jm3106jr 06:27, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
I have posted comments in /Comments regarding some issues with this article. Please address these concerns in this section. Failing resolution or discussion I will be putting the article up for a WP:FAR. Alan.ca 11:32, 18 February 2007 (UTC)
The demographics section has been edited heavily lately, I have a couple issues with recent changes:
-- Loodog 03:55, 24 February 2007 (UTC)
This article states that Boston was founded on November 17, 1630. The correct date is September 7, 1630. The only references I see to the November 17, 1630 are websites that copy Wikipedia data. If you need a reference, "A Municipal History of the Town and City of Boston During Two Centuries: From September 17, 1630,..." by Josiah Quincy, is available by Google, http://books.google.com/books?vid=OCLC57248669 -- petertdavis 11:53, 25 February 2007
Just a note, there is apparently another edit war in process as to whether Boston should redirect to this article or to the disambiguation page. It is currently pointing at the disambiguation page. I've created an RFD. Enjoy.-- Bobblehead 18:35, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
Aside from the clear cut BS and Bostonians delusions of grandeur, please tell me what part of CT is in the Boston metro area? I would like to know. You guys in Philly, as well as Boston (I feel that you two have something in common, historically) need your own Identities. Philly needs to stop trying to put itself in with NYC just because it (Philly) is near NJ. NYC already has it's NY/NJ/CT region. Similarly, Boston needs to stop trying to force CT into it's New England region headed (self appointed of course) by itself. CT is not what you would like it to be. All of you stores (with Boston sports propaganda in them) cannot take it away from NYC. You two cities need to get a life and stop trying to leech off of cities that have nothing to do with you.-- 71.235.81.39 03:52, 7 March 2007 (UTC)
Well I am glad that a sound editor is a work here. Boston does not have the reach that New Englanders would like to believe. It is not that large of a city. It is only the last major city in the US before Canada and it is all alone up there. The last time I checked TV markets, no piece of CT is in there TV market and there is no New England TV market. Boston keeps trying to use the New England thing to mean Boston and expand it's market share to make themselves appear more of a major TV market in the US. We in CT are proudly in the NYC area.-- 71.235.81.39 18:45, 7 March 2007 (UTC)
Seems to me that the Connecticut River splits the state into New York and New England spheres of influence. For example, Hartford is closer to Logan than JFK. - Keith D. Tyler ¶ ( AMA) 22:00, 7 March 2007 (UTC)
I am from Rocky Hill and grew up in danbury, and have always considered myself a New Englander, and a part of the Boston area, so I agree, please do not try and speak for the whole state. For some in Fairfield County, you may share this POV, but do not speak on behalf of the entire state. youd have a better argument against boston area if you were to say the hartford/springfield area, as bradley international airport serves. and i am also on the west of the river and have always been, so even that doesn't work.Kmccusker2 06:50, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
Lol! It may be closer to Logan (Hartford has it's own airport), but Logan is still a good way away from Boston. However, Hartford is not in the NYC area. Since they are crazy about Springfield, MA and call themselves the "shining start of New England," that pretty much sums up what they feel that they must be. Down in the NY area parts of the state, the only thing New England are some Boston/MA owned businesses who seem to want to promote Boston sports teams or call themselves "New England" something. They put emphasis on the "New England." It's a dead give away. I have never seen a city so far away try so hard to capture the minds of a state that has nothing at all to do with them. In spite of all of their efforts, they cannot change the culture. Ask anyone in the world, "New York or Boston?" You know Boston is not even in the running. Boston is not even world class. The question is "New York or Los Angeles?" Boston needs to deal with it's own region and forget about trying to brainwash CT citizen's.--71.235.81.39
Well, the south central part is NYC too. You forget that they are on the Metro-North line and Boston is still light years away. They just do not have anything in common with a city that has no influence or proximity to them. For those who do, I may assume it is because they border MA and that must be good enough for them. Southeastern CT is very odd. I used to assume that they were into Boston and NOT NYC. When I was coming back from RI(I keep forgetting that another cultural divide is that these Boston related peoples sound alike and NOT as we do in CT), I was in a town (North Stonington) near the RI border. I went into a gas station and they sold NY newpapers as well as Boston. They also sol Yankees and Red Sox gear. Now I will say that the Red Sox gear would not be too shocking, but I was shocked to see Yankees. So I guess the SE part of the state may deal with both.
FOr the most part, if you live in the parts of the state where you pick up NYC or Long Island TV or radio stations, you know that you are in the NYC area. Even in any part of CT, I have not been able to pick up any Boston media because it is not possible since no part of CT is in the Boston area. We don't even get Boston newspapers down here except in those specialty newsstands. I hope that settles this. I just think that people from Boston and New England spent too much time assuming and thinking that CT felt the same way as they do about Boston/New England that it comes as a shock to you. Well this is the way it is.-- 71.235.81.39 15:12, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
My mistake on that. I meant that Hartford is still a good distance from Boston.-- 71.235.81.39 18:18, 27 March 2007 (UTC)
The demographics section claims to be based on the "census of 2006". What on earth is that? THe footnote that supposedly sources it talks about the census of 2000. This needs to be fixed. john k 21:29, 24 March 2007 (UTC)
I reverted the addition of the prediction by Wilford Woodruff that Boston would be destroyed as being WP:Undue weight for an extremely minority POV. [3] However Alex71va ( talk · contribs) re-added the prediction into the history section of the article [4] and then left a comment on my talk page [5] citing the inclusion of Pat Robertson saying the people of Dover, Pennsylvania shouldn't turn to God in case of a disaster after they voted out their school board [6] as justification for inclusion of the prediction in this article. Rather than get in a revert war with the editor, I figured I'd get the opinion of the regular editors of this article on whether it should be included or not. Cheers. -- Bobblehead 22:07, 15 April 2007 (UTC)
Closing as no consensus to move; given this proposal did not succeed a bare two months ago, no guideline changes have occurred in the interim, and the evident trend of the discussion thus far to endorse the previous result, closing early.-- cjllw ʘ TALK 04:30, 21 April 2007 (UTC)
Boston, Massachusetts → Boston – {Boston, MA is by far the most common usage of the term Boston. The Boston page already redirects to Boston, MA. Though Boston, Lincolnshire may be the namesake of Boston MA, Boston MA is still the most common usage by far. Norwich, Norfolk in England, for example, is a lesser known city who can simply be found under Norwich. Several other North American cities have only the city name as their article name, including Philadelphia, New York City, Montreal, Chicago and San Francisco. I feel Boston among others should fall in this category} —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Black Harry ( talk • contribs).
Add "# Support" or "# Oppose" on a new line in the appropriate section followed by a brief explanation, then sign your opinion using ~~~~. Please remember that this survey is not a vote, and please provide an explanation for your recommendation. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Black Harry ( talk • contribs).
Add any additional comments
Why is this question being asked again? We just had a survey that closed February 7, two months ago. See above. - Will Beback · † · 05:42, 20 April 2007 (UTC)
I have edited the erroneous caption misrepresenting Copley Square as the Christian Science Center.
-matt lavallee