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wasn't bob ross in vietnam? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.137.24.32 ( talk) 20:45, 1 September 2003 (UTC)
I've also heard that Bob Ross used to be a drill sergent. Val42 05:15, Feb 1, 2005 (UTC)
Substantiate these claims or dont make them please. We'd rather just deal in facts. Cokehabit 03:08, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC)
Okay, everyone, I will be reuploading the picture with the "Legal" Version. Read the following to understand:
Hello Carson, Thank you for your interest in Bob Ross and the Joy of Painting; it's a pleasure to hear from so many of his friends! I apologize for the amount of time it has taken to respond. Attached you'll find a photo to use with your Bob Ross wikipedia article. Please include the following: "(c) Bob Ross Inc. Reprinted with permission" Also, in reviewing your copy about Bob, I see two small errors to correct. (1) Bob's death was a result of Lymphoma, and (2) instead of saying "PBS" stations you should call them "public television" stations -- PBS is only one subcategory in the entire public television system as a whole. Hope this has been helpful, be sure to contact us if you need more (this time I'll be more punctual!). Happy Painting, Joan Kowalski Bob Ross Co. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carson True" <crtrue@gmail.com> To: <info@bobross.com> Sent: Thursday, January 27, 2005 1:02 AM Subject: Request for Public Domain / Limited Copyright Image of Bob Ross > I am inquering as to if either A) a public domain photograph of Bob > Ross exists or B) a one-site use of an image of Bob Ross can be agreed > upon. I am currently working on the Bob Ross article on Wikipedia, the > largest open-source encyclopedia online, and was curious if either of > these were possible. A limited Wikipedia-only copyright can be granted > to a photo if you're concerned about the image spreading prematurely, > although a public domain image would be prefered. > > Reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Ross > > -- > Carson >
CRTrue —Preceding
undated comment added
20:19, 21 March 2005 (UTC)
Here we go. This page is now just a redirect to the main Bob Ross page. This should suit the purpose much more than having a disamgbig that really didn't do anything, since I just now started the article for the other Bob Ross (a moderate gay rights publisher who just died a few years back). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.159.59.250 ( talk) 05:29, 3 June 2005 (UTC)
I'm pretty sure it was Bob Ross being parodied in the Dilbert episode Art. Dilbert, Dogbert and Ratbert were watching Painting with Rusty Shanks where Rusty, in a calm voice, asked viewers to paint a taupe oval, represented by an orange circle. He was eventually killed by Leonardo da Vinci's henchmen.
I look at the dvd and it did look like him -- 67.180.138.205 19:24, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
The article says, Once, at an art demo at a mall, he was chased down in the mall's parking lot by traditionalist painters carrying buckets of water and shouting at Ross to "Scat!". That sounds dubious. Does anyone have a reference? Wmahan . 15:34, 24 September 2005 (UTC)
This page says the show ran from 1982 to 1993, while The Joy of Painting articlw says it ran from 1983 to 1994. Which is correct? Billy H 09:36, 26 January 2006 (UTC)
Fumblebruschi 18:00, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
Could it be that the Roman numerals refer to the show's season? Because I have tapped a couple of episodes, and there the cpation reads "The Joy of Painting with Bob Ross XV". Including the "the" and the Roman XV. Blur4760 00:29, 21 October 2006 (UTC)
The two are not related. Bob Ross did learn from Bill Alexander, and he even used Bill Alexander's products in the beginning, but Joy of Painting is not a continuation of Bill's show. The Bob Ross company has made a point of excluding Bill's name as much as possible. They'd rather you not know who taught him. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.248.198.172 ( talk) 19:58, 2 September 2007 (UTC)
This was in the trivia section: Occasionally kills from beyond the grave. This is obvious defacement and I've made an anonymous edit to remove the text.
- You got to admit though -that IS funny.
Are these links legit? I'm sure it's a very nice company, but is it an "official" or well known Bob Ross source, or is it link spam? Jake b 20:54, 14 April 2006 (UTC)
AGFRAG has since announced that the game will be appearing only on the Nintendo Wii. -al 13:15, 18 May 2006 (UTC)
According to a page on the Alexander Art website ( http://www.alexanderart.com/bill.asp) Bill Alexander didn't develop wet-on-wet painting, but did develop a product ("Magic White") that made the method easier. Does this merit an edit? -- Edward Wakelin 02:25, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
I removed the assertion that Bob Ross was a lifelong friend of Anthony Cumia. The first mention of Cumia in this article came from an anonymous entry stating Bob "visted Vietnam according to Anthony Cumia." This line was later moved and changed to him being a lifelong friend. As Bob was 21 years his senior, I don't see how he could have been a life-long friend. Perhaps it was just a joke. If I am wrong, please add it back and cite a source if at all possible. Arx Fortis 23:25, 22 July 2006 (UTC)
This article is one of thousands on Wikipedia that have a link to YouTube in it. Based on the External links policy, most of these should probably be removed. I'm putting this message here, on this talk page, to request the regular editors take a look at the link and make sure it doesn't violate policy. In short: 1. 99% of the time YouTube should not be used as a source. 2. We must not link to material that violates someones copyright. If you are not sure if the link on this article should be removed or you would like to help spread this message contact us on this page. Thanks, --- J.S ( t| c) 05:19, 10 November 2006 (UTC)
YouTube link has been removed. It was a copyright violation and YouTube had already yanked it as such. AnmaFinotera 19:59, 8 August 2007 (UTC)
My brother told me that Bob was a murderer and that his shows were actually taped in prison and thats why he would always paint in a completely black set - Magikmm 08:05, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
This got taken off the page, but my cousin, Bobby, is his son. I'm very proud of that. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 151.196.142.105 ( talk) 18:52, 20 February 2007 (UTC).
Does anyone know what his religious beliefs were? He often referenced God in his shows. 66.191.19.42 21:08, 6 April 2007 (UTC)
Where was Bob born? The article text says Daytona Beach, FL but the box on the right says Yonkers, NY. There's no explanation of the Jordanian nationality, either. -- Mincebert 12:03, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
I was wondering what Bob died of, hoping to get the answer here. I'm surprised that it's not mentionned in the article. Is it because nobody knows? -- Lyverbe 17:10, 24 April 2007 (UTC)
The section detailing marriages and family should be private life. The article is full of words like loved, sadly etc that doesn't seem encyclopedic. I would be happy to do it if that's alright with other editors.-- The Stars, Like Dust 22:31, 28 May 2007 (UTC)
There are rumors that Boss Ross was gay, are there any proof to these claims? Tmursch 22:46, 14 June 2007 (UTC)
While I was first reading this article, it seemed to be quite decent, until I got to the enormous pop culture section. It seems like most of the included items are minor and do not provide any substantive information about Bob Ross, who is supposed to be the subject of this article. Why clog up the article with such garbage? Does knowing that "Nickelodeon's Doug once fantasized about being a painter resembling Bob Ross" really increase our understanding of Bob Ross? I would like to request feedback on deleting the whole popular culture section, or moving it over to a separate article (where it will hopefully be forgotten) at a minimum. Ultiam 05:54, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
Bob Ross had a segment on a Bill Nye the Science Guy episode about eyes, where he talks about what rods and cones do, and paints some rods and cones inside an outline of an eyeball. ( TomServo1 22:28, 16 August 2007 (UTC))
I made a contribution to the trivia section stating that Bob Ross was referenced in the British TV series "Peep Show" -- this comment was removed by someone called AnmaFinotera. Why would this be removed -- it is clearly trivia, and it is accurate, and is certainly no less important than some of the extant trivia, such as the MTV reference. Thank you -- Drbauman 04:36, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
I don't know if this is the appropriate place for comments, but you're suggesting that most of my edits were vandalism? Have you taken a look at my contributions? I've only made about 15 or 20 contributions over 18 months, and the only one that I had difficulty with was the Bob Ross trivia one, because I couldn't figure out how to get the link to redirect to the TV series, rather than a disambiguation page. -- Drbauman 13:19, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
In fact, I attended Lawrence University, and there was a "Chocolate-Bunny-Be-Gone-Day in the early-to-mid-90s. As I can see on your page you did not attend Lawrence, so I have no idea why you would remove something that you have no knowledge of. And "several" other edits were not removed; as far as I can tell (although I admit I'm not very fluent in using Wikipedia) the only edit that was removed other than the Bob Ross edit was the "Chocolate-Bunny..." edit, which was removed by you (again, I don't know why -- many college pages list traditions of the college). I don't see any other notes on my talk page except from when I first joined Wikipedia in October 2005. Most of my edits were cleaning up the grammatical errors of other users, so I guess I'm just a bit irritated by your tone. I have no problems with trivia being removed, however, my surprise was at the fact that you initially removed just mine, while leaving a big chunk of trivia.-- Drbauman 14:37, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
Did Bob Ross have any religious affiliation? He mentions God often while painting. 68.116.99.77 ( talk) 00:42, 19 January 2008 (UTC)
The TV Show section says "The public arguably knows Ross best as the host of the public television series The Joy of Painting" [emphasis mine]. Even though there might not be any way to definitively prove this, or any source to cite to, is there any question that Bob is best know from his TV show? I think this is a fact, and I don't think that the word "arguably" is appropriate. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jocohen2 ( talk • contribs) 17:30, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
How are we going to reference Bob's quotes? Should we just remove anything that is not sourced even though we all know it to be true? He always said "beat the devil out of it" Can we insert some sound clips? What are the copyright implications of that? Malachite36 ( talk) 05:34, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
It seems that sound clips may be our answer as illustrated in: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Non-free_content#Policy The commentary text already exists and the clips would be 5 seconds of a 20+ minute show. Malachite36 ( talk) 05:43, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
I would like to start a discussion on the validity of some of the topics - namely, the video game and snowboard sections - that have been removed. (see [2]). In my opinion, these items should be included in the article because they illustrate cultural influence outside of the subject's element. It is a noteworthy aspect of the subject's legacy. ++ Arx Fortis ( talk) 16:11, 27 February 2009 (UTC)
Sure, yes, there was IN THE PAST a discussion that might have reached a "consensous". But things change. A consensus IN THE PAST does not prevent revisiting the question. Clearly there is interest in having the section.
Also, you point to WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS and then in the exact same paragraph talk about something being upheld for some other article being relevant to this one, this is contradictory. Now, as to what is a valid reference, references for a Popular Culture section need not meet any more stringent requirements than any other reference. If a reference is good enough for other sections in the article, than they are good enough for Popular Culture section.
One more thing: consensous does not require 100% agreement. This being so, we will soon reach such consensous for a section called Bob Ross in Popular Culture. This being so, let us now discuss what content will go in that soon to be created section. Proxy User ( talk) 16:37, 3 April 2009 (UTC)
"The fact that Family Guy made fun of Ross is irrelevant to a Bob Ross biography, and does not increase an understanding of the subject."
It's relevant because a writer for Family Guy thought it was relevant to use a Bob Ross reference in that particular episode. Family Guy is part of pop culture & the show influences culture. And the consensus is that Bob Ross, according to Wikipedia rules and regulations isn't? Either Wikipedia's standards are too high or the people who are sticking by that there shouldn't be a trivia or pop culture section aren't being open-minded to consider it.
Rayghost ( talk) 06:39, 16 August 2009 (UTC)
It's not relevent, who cares if he was mentioned on Family Guy? Why do the Family Guy and The Simpsons have to be crammed into EVERY article on Wikipedia? Seems clear this has been agreed upon to be removed so I'm removing it 70.91.35.27 ( talk) 16:00, 14 September 2009 (UTC)Tim
Can someone please post hos Ross died? This article seems very incomplete without it. -- Schmendrick ( talk) 18:04, 21 May 2009 (UTC)
I think it would be great to have either one of both of the sections back. The fact that Bob Ross has been referenced or influenced many areas of popular culture makes him very interesting. I've just watched a episode of the cartoon, The Boondocks. The episode featured an art instructor who by all rights is Bob Ross-incarnate. The character's background is similar as far as having a military background (the character was a Gulf War veteran). And sicne the cartoon is an African-American cartoon, it exposes Bob Ross to a group of people who may have not known about Bob Ross. So, this is significnt and I believe this needs to be reviewed again. maybe the artcile can be protect more to keep vanadlism down. Rayghost ( talk) 04:59, 13 May 2008 (UTC)
I'm really trying to understand why that there shouldn't be the section for Bob Ross. Whether we agree or not, Bob Ross is in popular culture. While some of us may care or not, there are people out there that consider Bob Ross part of popular culture.
Rayghost ( talk) 06:47, 16 August 2009 (UTC)
Not sure if its worthy of inclusion but in its better days, MTV had a bumper featuring Bob Ross. This is noted on IMDB. It was basically several seconds of Bob teaching at the easel and then, having painted an MTV logo with a scenic background, closing with something to the effect of "MTV: it's all happy little trees". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.220.6.139 ( talk) 16:38, 30 June 2010 (UTC)
I added that tag because of the source. I was under the impression that Ross graduated from a high school in Orlando, not Pennsylvania. In addition, the reference listed links to a Facebook page, which in turn contains a complete copy/paste of the article, making it self-referential and utterly unverifiable. elektrik SHOOS 05:26, 29 July 2010 (UTC)
If Ross had been a medical-records officer, would he have really been in a position where he had to yell at people or give them a bad time? It sounds odd, especially for someone who seemed congenitally laid-back. WilliamSommerwerck ( talk) 20:45, 2 September 2010 (UTC)
I have nothing against Bob Ross, but does this paragraph really match Wikipedia's standards on neutrality and objectivity?
88.153.25.98 ( talk) 17:50, 15 January 2011 (UTC)
The article says the show ran from 1983 to 1994. But it also says that Bob Ross died at the conclusion of the 31st season. Is 31st season an error? Or is there some other explanation? 71.241.227.109 ( talk) 19:23, 6 February 2011 (UTC)Stephen Kosciesza
The article says the show ran from 1983 to 1994. But it also says that Bob Ross died at the conclusion of the 31st season. Is 31st season an error? Or is there some other explanation? 71.241.227.109 ( talk) 19:23, 6 February 2011 (UTC)Stephen Kosciesza
In this case, the web pages cited are the "critical response". They are not references to the "critical response". 66.66.76.187 ( talk) 01:16, 24 January 2011 (UTC)
The last paragraph in the painting section doesn't quite appear to match the sources given. I took a look trying to verify the information and for my mind it takes quite a bit of reading between the lines to get "overly simplistic, without artistic merit, and monotonous" out of the sources mentioned. Perhaps I'm just missing something (and if I am please by all means point out what), but from what I saw the sources were criticizing his painting style as stolen/copied (the NY Times one) and inspiring dependence on Bob Ross and a lack of originality (the emptyeasel.com one). For this reason, I am tagging the paragraph with the {{ dubious}} and {{ Failed verification}} templates. Ks0stm ( T• C• G) 17:21, 5 April 2011 (UTC)
Over the past several months, an anonymous IP hopper has been adding (and readding) a "Critical Response" section to this biography, which can be seen here. I have objected to the section due to the quality of the sources and the original research quality to the remainder of the text, but since we're the only two people who've been arguing about it, I feel an outside opinion of some sort of necessary. I can understand a need for some sort of criticism/response section, especially given the positive tone of the bio in general, but in this form I feel it's detrimental. Anywho, this is why I opened the RfC, so please, I want outside feedback on this. elektrik SHOOS 19:30, 20 March 2011 (UTC)
Should we dig it up and post it?— Preceding unsigned comment added by Craigboy ( talk • contribs) 05:20, July 17, 2010
Also, I realize this may seem touchy, but I am certainly old enough to recall all this: Master Bill Alexander pioneered this technique, though lots of artists have used similar ways of painting.
It should be noted that Bob Ross basically stole Alexander's format, technique and TV presentation. Everything from the subject matter to the equipment - Ross even cleaned and dried his brushes exactly as Alexander had taught since BEFORE World War II. I made a sturdy screen bottom for a coffee can for brush cleaning - just as Alexander, not Ross, invented.
Alexander was on TV teaching this stuff, perhaps contemporaneously with Ross - but Ross, as I said, stole everything from Alexander. Yes, STOLE it. The only true difference is Bob Ross had a Plexiglas palette (which shape was specially designed by Alexander) - and he could never paint anywhere near as beautifully as Alexander did.
Can we discuss that instead of having stupid things about Ross in the Air Force? 76.195.85.160 ( talk) 18:12, 22 March 2011 (UTC)
All right, I concede your point on this matter. There is no known source (other than my very clear memory) and I know memory falls into personal research or original research. But this article still needs work .... 76.195.81.212 ( talk) 21:59, 2 April 2011 (UTC)
There is a source -- the New York Times -- and the reference has now been added. Let's see how long before someone takes it down! 198.36.194.3 ( talk) 22:13, 5 April 2011 (UTC)
Did Bob Ross make money off this "coffee can theft"? If not, it's not theft, it's just "inspiration". So you can invent using a Coffee can? Yeah sure and the Beatles stole from Elvis and Jerry Lee. I'm sure someone used a coffee can before. I like Bob Ross and always knew he figured all this stuff out from others. That's how the world works. Ford didn't invent the wheel or the car. What a phony! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.139.97.225 ( talk) 00:19, 22 April 2011 (UTC)
Oh, yes, Bob Ross made money! And I was not only talking about a coffee can! I was referring to the FACT that Bob Ross often said on his show that he invented things that Bill Alexander did first. And Ross was a student of his.
So when Alexander - and Ross around the same time - were on TV, it seemed Ross was somehow anointed to succeed Alexander. That was not the case as far as anyone knows, but my own beef was always the fact that Ross did not mention Alexander.
The Alexander heirs have their own site, products etc. and I see that Alexander is credited as the INVENTOR of not only the can-screen but also the palette knife, the Magic White, the black gesso, the Magic Clear, and the technique itself as a whole.
Alexander encouraged people to use all this as a starting point and to expand their artistic training through work. Ross only taught copying.
I didn't see the "NY Times" article. I hope it clears up some confusion.
Nuujinn, you say: "So long as we make clear that this claim was made by Alexander [...]" YES, of course it has to be made clear, that is why I say put the whole par. in the article. Alexander stated this - who else needs to state it? Even if only as a TV viewer, and as a student of Alexander's, I was there and saw that Ross stole the whole thing, then tried to outrun Alexander on TV. Ross made millions, as you see in the "Times" article. Alexander faded away and everyone has forgotten him.
You keep this article unfair if you do not emphasize that controversy. Ross should be shown in a clear, honest light and not just the light of sainthood. 75.21.149.151 ( talk) 07:14, 24 April 2011 (UTC)
I'm new, this is my first edit, ever. Please be kind. I feel that I have important info to contribute. Maybe somebody can assist me in getting this info out better (Maybe on the Article). Bob Ross personally dedicated his show "The Joy of Painting" to William "Bill" Alexander in his opening words of Season 02 - Episode 01 - "Meadow Lake". I can't find the video or transcription online. However, I have the episode and have transcribed it exactly word-for-word myself. After the opening theme, Bob starts: "Hello, I'm Bob Ross, and for the next 13 weeks, I'll be your Host, as we experience The Joy of Painting. This is a fantastic method of painting, where we're using Wet-On-Wet Technique, and before I go too far into the show, I'd like to take a few minutes and make a dedication: I would like to dedicate this show to my Beloved Friend and Teacher, whom we've all watched and loved for many years on Public Television- Bill Alexander. And years ago Bill taught me this fantastic technique, and I feel as though he gave me a Precious Gift, and I'd like to share that Gift with you." 70.173.129.19 ( talk) 21:46, 28 April 2011 (UTC)
Thank You, LessHeard vanU. What If I uploaded just the dedication part of the episode to youtube? Is a link to the youtube clip no-good as a reference? I noticed one of the references on the article page just gives the episode title so I assumed that worked? 70.173.129.19 ( talk) 23:18, 28 April 2011 (UTC)
Forgive me LessHeard but you're all I've got. I really have no idea what I'm doing. Sounds like a good-source is impossible. It's really a shame. I guess my only option could be, put it on youtube and hope a 3rd party writes about it? 70.173.129.19 ( talk) 23:33, 28 April 2011 (UTC)
All this talk about William Alexander had me searching for his Wikipedia article, out of genuine curiosity - but there is none. This begs the question: why haven't you folks, that are so deeply concerned about him, created an article that gives him his proper due, instead of complaining about what contributors to this article have (or haven't) done for him? PScooter63 ( talk) 02:29, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
"In fact, the rivalry between Mr. Ross and his former mentor, William Alexander, is bitter. Mr. Alexander, 76, a Bavarian-born painter who has his own painting show on a public television station in Orange County, Calif., a paint supply business and a line of books and videos, spoke of his former protégé in the tones Thomas Couture might have used to describe the young pupil who outstripped him, Edouard Manet. "He betrayed me," he said in his strong German accent. "I invented 'wet on wet.' I trained him and he is copying me -- what bothers me is not just that he betrayed me, but that he thinks he can do it better." "
SOURCE: "The New York Times",
TELEVISION section: "Bob Ross, the Frugal Gourmet of Painting", By ALESSANDRA STANLEY, December 22, 1991
and this tells us what is lacking in the article on Bob Ross. Even moreso because it simply ends there, and now both men are deceased. No one ever speaks of Bill Alexander. Yet as I said before, I learned from Alexander and I can tell you: Ross could not hold a candle to Alexander. If you don't believe me, look it up. Alexander's paintings were breathtaking.
I'm so glad there's a citation about this, but it isn't clear enough from the article's ref. - and I think this par. I quoted above should be quoted in the article, the Ross-Alexander controversy. It is real, and Ross made an empire when Alexander basically faded away! Is that like someone reaching similar inspiration, or is it as Alexander himself complained ... THEFT? 75.21.149.151 ( talk) 07:02, 24 April 2011 (UTC)
And I say again here: You keep this article unfair if you do not emphasize that controversy. Ross should be shown in a clear, honest light and not just the light of sainthood. 75.21.149.151 ( talk) 07:16, 24 April 2011 (UTC)
You are contradicting yourself - either that or contradicting the Wikipedia standard. "The New York Times" seems sufficient to make mention of the Alexander-Ross controversy. You seem to want some sort of book or major magazine article citations. One citation is enough, and it makes it notable that Alexander was quoted directly in the Times. 75.21.106.208 ( talk) 01:46, 3 May 2011 (UTC)
Your support for the inclusion of just a sentence on the matter is greatly appreciated. The public is going to read about Bob Ross here, the public needs to know some history, even if it is reduced to a sentence. Thanks for also reducing Less Heard's dumb argument to one nonsensical sentence!
Incidentally, I think I may have, in the past, written something in the article about this Alexander Tiff; it should still be there and I do not think more should be made of it since it is, as you say, a well documented fact.
As an incidental, I'd like you to know that there are those in the Alexander camp, including his heirs, who have not forgotten Bob Ross' treachery toward Alexander. I don't speak for them. I only know what I have read on the Alexander Magic of Oil Painting website that is still functional, and has been selling Alexander's patented painting supplies since the early 1980s. 76.195.83.171 ( talk) 05:01, 5 August 2011 (UTC)
This has to to with improving the article... how? elektrik SHOOS ( talk) 21:59, 8 July 2011 (UTC) |
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The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
Everyone should read it, no, not read, feel it. Enjoy the "no true scotsman" using, condescending, arrogant and vitriol-vomiting "real artists" that hide Bob Ross's products to not "offend the regulars". It is a delicious amount of butt hurt "artists". Only the last few paragraphs are about the controversy, the rest is pure comedy so stereotypical that even the worst Hollywood script writer couldn't come up with it. 217.225.125.176 ( talk) 16:11, 6 June 2011 (UTC) |
Umm, how about you read it and then lend some helpful input here. Or are you another disinformation provider? 75.21.155.189 ( talk) 22:32, 25 July 2011 (UTC)
From the Painting section: "Ross's former mentor, William Alexander, has claimed that he taught Ross the "wet-on-wet" technique and that Ross "betrayed him" by presenting the technique as his own."
This does not sound right. Alexander "claimed he taught" Ross? Ross himself acknowledged twice that Alexander taught him. Is this the final expression of that fact for the article?
I object to that sentence. It should state that Bill Alexander taught Ross the method. Ross acknowledged this, and thanked Alexander (on the air) for being his teacher. The rest of it mentioning Alexander's feelings of betrayal is OK as-is.
But I see that editing is out of the question. Who blocked the article from editing? Or am I missing something as usual? 76.195.83.171 ( talk) 05:15, 5 August 2011 (UTC)
1. I apologize for my confusion about editing - it often happens when I go to an article I do NOT see the "edit" option where it ought to be. That was the case here, but I know as inexperienced as I am I'm probably missing something.
2. I concur with the sentence as phrased and proposed here by Keithbob. An excellent revision. I don't want to try my hand at torturing the grammar any further.
3. Sorry, Elektric Shoos, but I am getting a bit tired of this "it's not truth we want, it's verifiability". I can verify for you the existence of the Loch Ness monster, if I go about it the way you keep proposing ... but guess what ... ?!
So you're using that over and over as an electric fly swatter and it's unscholarly, tiresome, juvenile. What you and Wikipedia want to say is verifiable AND RELIABLE sources are needed, or else if it's a silly claim we still need sources to show that claim has been made ... yes, I get it.
All I ask is you stop throwing that out there when it has Nothing to do with the discussion at hand. There - now, what does all your verifiability talk have to do with Alexander's famous statement about Ross? It's cited, it's real, you can read and many of you here have read it.
In short, get off my back with that crap. 76.195.85.222 ( talk) 06:38, 6 August 2011 (UTC)
Well, I am aware of my blunt frankness with ideas and thoughts. I did not mean to insult anybody directly or begin a fight. I hope the remarks to that effect were not too concentrated on me.
My effort has always been merely to make the article as accurate as possible without arguing OBVIOUS sources for facts. 75.21.159.173 ( talk) 03:29, 26 August 2011 (UTC)
To the "Painting" section I have added: "An interesting aspect of Ross' shows, however, were the moments during which Ross discussed his invention of materials and ideas that were clearly Alexander's inventions."
Can someone please assist me with the connexion of that statement to the NY Times ref.? I know it is corroborated there somewhere - I just don't know how to reference that point.
New objection: I do not think it is enough or verifiable to have the following in the same sec.: 'However, Ross never claimed to be the creator of the technique. In fact, in season 2, episode 1 of "The Joy of Painting with Bob Ross", he dedicates his show to William Alexander, explaining that "years ago, Bill taught me this fantastic [wet-on-wet] technique, and I feel as though he gave me a precious gift, and I'd like to share that gift with you [the viewer]".'
I mean, what, we are just supposed to either take the editor's word for it or go hunting for that episode? Apply the same rule here as you did with me. There is no reference and thus no actual verifiability for this remark by Ross except a mention of the show, and that just seems like a forced opinion and is certainly, as it stands now, in the realm of personal research. Or did one of you others get a recording of that episode and hear it for yourselves? If so, then make that a new reference. It would be cool to have that in there to balance out the sourness of the Alexander controversy.
Remember, you all here are the rule-conscious people! So follow the rules. 75.21.159.173 ( talk) 03:41, 26 August 2011 (UTC)
Perhaps so, Nujinn, I was worried I was in error about that. In fact I find myself in the other editor's same quagmire - I know I've seen and heard Ross claim these inventions as his own, over and over. Inventions that Alexander first invented.
As to your explanation of the verifiability, I'm not sure I follow you. Could you clarify? Or are you just trying to say now no one can write a word unless it is a direct quote or paraphrase? 75.21.159.66 ( talk) 23:14, 26 August 2011 (UTC)
I want to add to this about Ross thanking Alexander: it does not belong until we have an air date and not just his exact quote. That is a double standard with the rules here.
Secondly, about Ross taking credit for Alexander's inventions: I have the main Alexander site which is kept up by his heirs. It speaks of his inventions, his early years and his dreams. 75.21.159.66 ( talk) 23:26, 26 August 2011 (UTC)
No, no, I do not want this getting out of hand.
Ross, who I watch all the time to this day, often blurts out that he invented the knife, he invented the "Magic" paints, he invented the easel - all of which Alexander invented.
I'm still struggling to find evidence that Alexander invented the black gesso, since Ross bragged most often about inventing that. There's no way I can get the same citation strength for all that, but I know Ross said those things and they continue to be televised.
If something appropriate can be found on Alexander's site, it should be quotable and cited without trouble. What I also want to know is why no one pursued a good Bill Alexander page, which I know existed at one time? 75.21.159.66 ( talk) 23:42, 26 August 2011 (UTC)
Note that in the article Wet-on-wet it says:"Wet-on-wet painting goes right back to the origins of oil painting, and was used by several of the best Early Netherlandish painters in parts of their pictures, such as Jan van Eyck in the Arnolfini portrait, and Rogier van der Weyden.[1]" so neither Alexander nor Ross can have invented the technique. As for the rest of this discussion, I have watched around 400 of Bob Ross' painting lessons and I can't remember him saying he invented any of the techniques he used. This controversy is probably a lot smaller than any news journalist or this wikipedia article makes it into. I think we should reduce our mentioning of this controversy to a minimum, if we need to mention it at all. Roger491127 ( talk) 02:01, 10 January 2012 (UTC)
Note how this "controversy" is handled in the article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Alexander_(artist), it says:
"Rivalry with Ross
At the beginning of The Joy of Painting's second season in 1984, Ross dedicated the show to Alexander and Alexander filmed a promo for his former student: "I hand off my mighty brush to a mighty man, and that is Bob Ross."[2][5] In 1987 someone from Alexander Art told Ross that they couldn't keep up with the demand generated by the The Joy of Painting and suggested that Ross start his own line of art supplies.[2] As Bob Ross Incorporated grew into a $15 million a year business Alexander told the New York Times that he felt "betrayed" by his one-time student. [6]"
I think we should copy this section in this article too, because the issue has been handled in a better way in that article. Roger491127 ( talk) 02:13, 10 January 2012 (UTC)
"In early 1994, Ross cancelled The Joy of Painting after its 11th season to continue battling the disease."
The term "season" seems vague here. The show ran for 11 years, but those years encompassed a total of 31 series (as Ross referred to them at the beginning and end of each series). Wikipedia's page on the show references "31 seasons". This is supported by the official Bob Ross site's merchandise page.
Is this a joke?
>At age 17, he was raped by a gang of flamboyant clowns who rode him like a pony over the horizon. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.166.232.180 ( talk) 12:02, 29 October 2012 (UTC)
With Bob Ross being celebrated by Google today, we need to lock this page. How do we accomplish this? --12:11, 29 October 2012 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Yoderj ( talk • contribs)
Since this page is locked for a couple days, need to download the image from google and attach it to the article. https://www.google.com/logos/2012/bob_ross12-hp.jpg -- TRiPgod ( talk) 15:15, 29 October 2012 (UTC)
The introduction implies that PBS has stations in Canada. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.209.169.177 ( talk) 14:44, 29 October 2012 (UTC)
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In Popular Culture
Bob Ross was parodied in " Fifteen Minutes of Shame", a Family Guy Episode, in which he threatens to cut viewers who dare tell anyone where he has painted a secret bush. Radish bliss ( talk) 16:09, 29 October 2012 (UTC)
Perhaps there should be added a mention of Bob Ross having lately become an icon of ASMR (aka brain orgasm) via YouTube. 80.61.230.65 ( talk) 18:37, 29 October 2012 (UTC)
Reference 4 does not contain the quote 'vowing "never to scream again."' This looks to have been inserted to prove an internet hoax that Bob Ross was an abusive Drill Sergeant.
"The correct reference is #5. I'll change the annotation. DoctorJoeE review transgressions/ talk to me! 21:54, 22 July 2014 (UTC)
98.227.11.252 ( talk) 18:57, 24 August 2014 (UTC)My name is James Needham. I was the General Manager of WIPB when we first contracted with Bob Ross to do the Joy of Painting Series #2 in 1983. Series #1 was initially produced at a station outside Washington, DC in Virginia, but later post-produced by WIPB and uplinked to satellite for the Joy of Painting Company, later Bob Ross Inc. Your information on the Joy of Painting is correct, and WIPB-TV, the PBS station licensed to Ball State University and still licensed to Ball State University in Muncie, IN was the originating station for the Joy of Painting for all of its PBS TV on-air series and productions. They were filmed in our studios at 246 Minnetrista Blvd. and later at the Ball Communications Building on the campus of Ball State University, both of which are located in Muncie, Indiana. If you need more information, contact me. bsu.needham@gmail.com 98.227.11.252 ( talk) 18:57, 24 August 2014 (UTC)
I dunno, this article lacks so much detail on how Bob Ross went from a minor US Airforce Sargent and bartender to learning how to paint via a German TV show about painting and then BOOM he gets a gig with PBS and finds national fame?-- 173.60.51.236 ( talk) 04:14, 25 July 2015 (UTC)
I was fixing a factual error in the "Influence and legacy" section because it said that the marathon was to conmemorate what would have been his 73th birthday, I replaced it with "...to celebrate the official launch of Twitch Creative", altrough later I included both sentences. My edit was then reverted by Mlpearc with no summary, so I procedurally reverted back saying "No summary given and not blatant vandalism", and then it was reverted with the summary "Sounded better before the change, no one is mentioning vandalism". Per WP:DISPUTED, I think my edit should be kept. (Pinging Mlpearc) -- TL22 ( talk) 02:12, 2 November 2015 (UTC)
Sparcdr (30/11/2015 21:34 GMT-6) - On the channel: bobross located at: http://www.twitch.tv/bobross today has been a marathan of Bob Ross' work. It should be posthumously noted that there is a following of people and his work.
Proof of this here: https://i.gyazo.com/991817f10bb2cd50e2b461e0323df828.png as he has 8456 viewers as of 9:30pm -6 GMT on the 30th of November, 2015. Thanks!
If you agree as the amount of viewers is quite a few, then maybe we should add a section about Bob Ross' legacy or something like that.
In episode 12 of the first season of the TV comedy series The Boondocks, a Bob Ross-like character makes a prominent appearance in order to instruct Riley on a more effective way to channel his artistic talents. Being that The Boondocks is well known and popular, I move to include this detail in the " In popular culture" section of this article. The episode originally aired on 19 February 2006 on Cartoon Network. –– amanisdude ( talk) 15:38, 29 October 2012 (UTC)
Can't believe no one's mentioned Ross/Picasso Epic Rap Battle Silverstina ( talk) 14:33, 19 February 2016 (UTC)
This article made the Wikipedia:Top 25 Report at number ten with 393,217 views for the week November 1 to 7, 2015. It was number seventeen the week before. Ross gained the attention of Twitch.tv which hosted a marathon of The Joy of Painting. Congratulations to the editors of this article for the exposure of their work. SchreiberBike | ⌨ 19:35, 10 November 2015 (UTC)
[[ Julien111111 ( talk) 05:51, 5 March 2016 (UTC)]]
Bob Ross referred to as God in the first episode of the fifth series of British sitcom Peep Show.
Julien111111 3/5/16
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | Archive 2 |
wasn't bob ross in vietnam? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.137.24.32 ( talk) 20:45, 1 September 2003 (UTC)
I've also heard that Bob Ross used to be a drill sergent. Val42 05:15, Feb 1, 2005 (UTC)
Substantiate these claims or dont make them please. We'd rather just deal in facts. Cokehabit 03:08, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC)
Okay, everyone, I will be reuploading the picture with the "Legal" Version. Read the following to understand:
Hello Carson, Thank you for your interest in Bob Ross and the Joy of Painting; it's a pleasure to hear from so many of his friends! I apologize for the amount of time it has taken to respond. Attached you'll find a photo to use with your Bob Ross wikipedia article. Please include the following: "(c) Bob Ross Inc. Reprinted with permission" Also, in reviewing your copy about Bob, I see two small errors to correct. (1) Bob's death was a result of Lymphoma, and (2) instead of saying "PBS" stations you should call them "public television" stations -- PBS is only one subcategory in the entire public television system as a whole. Hope this has been helpful, be sure to contact us if you need more (this time I'll be more punctual!). Happy Painting, Joan Kowalski Bob Ross Co. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carson True" <crtrue@gmail.com> To: <info@bobross.com> Sent: Thursday, January 27, 2005 1:02 AM Subject: Request for Public Domain / Limited Copyright Image of Bob Ross > I am inquering as to if either A) a public domain photograph of Bob > Ross exists or B) a one-site use of an image of Bob Ross can be agreed > upon. I am currently working on the Bob Ross article on Wikipedia, the > largest open-source encyclopedia online, and was curious if either of > these were possible. A limited Wikipedia-only copyright can be granted > to a photo if you're concerned about the image spreading prematurely, > although a public domain image would be prefered. > > Reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Ross > > -- > Carson >
CRTrue —Preceding
undated comment added
20:19, 21 March 2005 (UTC)
Here we go. This page is now just a redirect to the main Bob Ross page. This should suit the purpose much more than having a disamgbig that really didn't do anything, since I just now started the article for the other Bob Ross (a moderate gay rights publisher who just died a few years back). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.159.59.250 ( talk) 05:29, 3 June 2005 (UTC)
I'm pretty sure it was Bob Ross being parodied in the Dilbert episode Art. Dilbert, Dogbert and Ratbert were watching Painting with Rusty Shanks where Rusty, in a calm voice, asked viewers to paint a taupe oval, represented by an orange circle. He was eventually killed by Leonardo da Vinci's henchmen.
I look at the dvd and it did look like him -- 67.180.138.205 19:24, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
The article says, Once, at an art demo at a mall, he was chased down in the mall's parking lot by traditionalist painters carrying buckets of water and shouting at Ross to "Scat!". That sounds dubious. Does anyone have a reference? Wmahan . 15:34, 24 September 2005 (UTC)
This page says the show ran from 1982 to 1993, while The Joy of Painting articlw says it ran from 1983 to 1994. Which is correct? Billy H 09:36, 26 January 2006 (UTC)
Fumblebruschi 18:00, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
Could it be that the Roman numerals refer to the show's season? Because I have tapped a couple of episodes, and there the cpation reads "The Joy of Painting with Bob Ross XV". Including the "the" and the Roman XV. Blur4760 00:29, 21 October 2006 (UTC)
The two are not related. Bob Ross did learn from Bill Alexander, and he even used Bill Alexander's products in the beginning, but Joy of Painting is not a continuation of Bill's show. The Bob Ross company has made a point of excluding Bill's name as much as possible. They'd rather you not know who taught him. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.248.198.172 ( talk) 19:58, 2 September 2007 (UTC)
This was in the trivia section: Occasionally kills from beyond the grave. This is obvious defacement and I've made an anonymous edit to remove the text.
- You got to admit though -that IS funny.
Are these links legit? I'm sure it's a very nice company, but is it an "official" or well known Bob Ross source, or is it link spam? Jake b 20:54, 14 April 2006 (UTC)
AGFRAG has since announced that the game will be appearing only on the Nintendo Wii. -al 13:15, 18 May 2006 (UTC)
According to a page on the Alexander Art website ( http://www.alexanderart.com/bill.asp) Bill Alexander didn't develop wet-on-wet painting, but did develop a product ("Magic White") that made the method easier. Does this merit an edit? -- Edward Wakelin 02:25, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
I removed the assertion that Bob Ross was a lifelong friend of Anthony Cumia. The first mention of Cumia in this article came from an anonymous entry stating Bob "visted Vietnam according to Anthony Cumia." This line was later moved and changed to him being a lifelong friend. As Bob was 21 years his senior, I don't see how he could have been a life-long friend. Perhaps it was just a joke. If I am wrong, please add it back and cite a source if at all possible. Arx Fortis 23:25, 22 July 2006 (UTC)
This article is one of thousands on Wikipedia that have a link to YouTube in it. Based on the External links policy, most of these should probably be removed. I'm putting this message here, on this talk page, to request the regular editors take a look at the link and make sure it doesn't violate policy. In short: 1. 99% of the time YouTube should not be used as a source. 2. We must not link to material that violates someones copyright. If you are not sure if the link on this article should be removed or you would like to help spread this message contact us on this page. Thanks, --- J.S ( t| c) 05:19, 10 November 2006 (UTC)
YouTube link has been removed. It was a copyright violation and YouTube had already yanked it as such. AnmaFinotera 19:59, 8 August 2007 (UTC)
My brother told me that Bob was a murderer and that his shows were actually taped in prison and thats why he would always paint in a completely black set - Magikmm 08:05, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
This got taken off the page, but my cousin, Bobby, is his son. I'm very proud of that. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 151.196.142.105 ( talk) 18:52, 20 February 2007 (UTC).
Does anyone know what his religious beliefs were? He often referenced God in his shows. 66.191.19.42 21:08, 6 April 2007 (UTC)
Where was Bob born? The article text says Daytona Beach, FL but the box on the right says Yonkers, NY. There's no explanation of the Jordanian nationality, either. -- Mincebert 12:03, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
I was wondering what Bob died of, hoping to get the answer here. I'm surprised that it's not mentionned in the article. Is it because nobody knows? -- Lyverbe 17:10, 24 April 2007 (UTC)
The section detailing marriages and family should be private life. The article is full of words like loved, sadly etc that doesn't seem encyclopedic. I would be happy to do it if that's alright with other editors.-- The Stars, Like Dust 22:31, 28 May 2007 (UTC)
There are rumors that Boss Ross was gay, are there any proof to these claims? Tmursch 22:46, 14 June 2007 (UTC)
While I was first reading this article, it seemed to be quite decent, until I got to the enormous pop culture section. It seems like most of the included items are minor and do not provide any substantive information about Bob Ross, who is supposed to be the subject of this article. Why clog up the article with such garbage? Does knowing that "Nickelodeon's Doug once fantasized about being a painter resembling Bob Ross" really increase our understanding of Bob Ross? I would like to request feedback on deleting the whole popular culture section, or moving it over to a separate article (where it will hopefully be forgotten) at a minimum. Ultiam 05:54, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
Bob Ross had a segment on a Bill Nye the Science Guy episode about eyes, where he talks about what rods and cones do, and paints some rods and cones inside an outline of an eyeball. ( TomServo1 22:28, 16 August 2007 (UTC))
I made a contribution to the trivia section stating that Bob Ross was referenced in the British TV series "Peep Show" -- this comment was removed by someone called AnmaFinotera. Why would this be removed -- it is clearly trivia, and it is accurate, and is certainly no less important than some of the extant trivia, such as the MTV reference. Thank you -- Drbauman 04:36, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
I don't know if this is the appropriate place for comments, but you're suggesting that most of my edits were vandalism? Have you taken a look at my contributions? I've only made about 15 or 20 contributions over 18 months, and the only one that I had difficulty with was the Bob Ross trivia one, because I couldn't figure out how to get the link to redirect to the TV series, rather than a disambiguation page. -- Drbauman 13:19, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
In fact, I attended Lawrence University, and there was a "Chocolate-Bunny-Be-Gone-Day in the early-to-mid-90s. As I can see on your page you did not attend Lawrence, so I have no idea why you would remove something that you have no knowledge of. And "several" other edits were not removed; as far as I can tell (although I admit I'm not very fluent in using Wikipedia) the only edit that was removed other than the Bob Ross edit was the "Chocolate-Bunny..." edit, which was removed by you (again, I don't know why -- many college pages list traditions of the college). I don't see any other notes on my talk page except from when I first joined Wikipedia in October 2005. Most of my edits were cleaning up the grammatical errors of other users, so I guess I'm just a bit irritated by your tone. I have no problems with trivia being removed, however, my surprise was at the fact that you initially removed just mine, while leaving a big chunk of trivia.-- Drbauman 14:37, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
Did Bob Ross have any religious affiliation? He mentions God often while painting. 68.116.99.77 ( talk) 00:42, 19 January 2008 (UTC)
The TV Show section says "The public arguably knows Ross best as the host of the public television series The Joy of Painting" [emphasis mine]. Even though there might not be any way to definitively prove this, or any source to cite to, is there any question that Bob is best know from his TV show? I think this is a fact, and I don't think that the word "arguably" is appropriate. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jocohen2 ( talk • contribs) 17:30, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
How are we going to reference Bob's quotes? Should we just remove anything that is not sourced even though we all know it to be true? He always said "beat the devil out of it" Can we insert some sound clips? What are the copyright implications of that? Malachite36 ( talk) 05:34, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
It seems that sound clips may be our answer as illustrated in: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Non-free_content#Policy The commentary text already exists and the clips would be 5 seconds of a 20+ minute show. Malachite36 ( talk) 05:43, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
I would like to start a discussion on the validity of some of the topics - namely, the video game and snowboard sections - that have been removed. (see [2]). In my opinion, these items should be included in the article because they illustrate cultural influence outside of the subject's element. It is a noteworthy aspect of the subject's legacy. ++ Arx Fortis ( talk) 16:11, 27 February 2009 (UTC)
Sure, yes, there was IN THE PAST a discussion that might have reached a "consensous". But things change. A consensus IN THE PAST does not prevent revisiting the question. Clearly there is interest in having the section.
Also, you point to WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS and then in the exact same paragraph talk about something being upheld for some other article being relevant to this one, this is contradictory. Now, as to what is a valid reference, references for a Popular Culture section need not meet any more stringent requirements than any other reference. If a reference is good enough for other sections in the article, than they are good enough for Popular Culture section.
One more thing: consensous does not require 100% agreement. This being so, we will soon reach such consensous for a section called Bob Ross in Popular Culture. This being so, let us now discuss what content will go in that soon to be created section. Proxy User ( talk) 16:37, 3 April 2009 (UTC)
"The fact that Family Guy made fun of Ross is irrelevant to a Bob Ross biography, and does not increase an understanding of the subject."
It's relevant because a writer for Family Guy thought it was relevant to use a Bob Ross reference in that particular episode. Family Guy is part of pop culture & the show influences culture. And the consensus is that Bob Ross, according to Wikipedia rules and regulations isn't? Either Wikipedia's standards are too high or the people who are sticking by that there shouldn't be a trivia or pop culture section aren't being open-minded to consider it.
Rayghost ( talk) 06:39, 16 August 2009 (UTC)
It's not relevent, who cares if he was mentioned on Family Guy? Why do the Family Guy and The Simpsons have to be crammed into EVERY article on Wikipedia? Seems clear this has been agreed upon to be removed so I'm removing it 70.91.35.27 ( talk) 16:00, 14 September 2009 (UTC)Tim
Can someone please post hos Ross died? This article seems very incomplete without it. -- Schmendrick ( talk) 18:04, 21 May 2009 (UTC)
I think it would be great to have either one of both of the sections back. The fact that Bob Ross has been referenced or influenced many areas of popular culture makes him very interesting. I've just watched a episode of the cartoon, The Boondocks. The episode featured an art instructor who by all rights is Bob Ross-incarnate. The character's background is similar as far as having a military background (the character was a Gulf War veteran). And sicne the cartoon is an African-American cartoon, it exposes Bob Ross to a group of people who may have not known about Bob Ross. So, this is significnt and I believe this needs to be reviewed again. maybe the artcile can be protect more to keep vanadlism down. Rayghost ( talk) 04:59, 13 May 2008 (UTC)
I'm really trying to understand why that there shouldn't be the section for Bob Ross. Whether we agree or not, Bob Ross is in popular culture. While some of us may care or not, there are people out there that consider Bob Ross part of popular culture.
Rayghost ( talk) 06:47, 16 August 2009 (UTC)
Not sure if its worthy of inclusion but in its better days, MTV had a bumper featuring Bob Ross. This is noted on IMDB. It was basically several seconds of Bob teaching at the easel and then, having painted an MTV logo with a scenic background, closing with something to the effect of "MTV: it's all happy little trees". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.220.6.139 ( talk) 16:38, 30 June 2010 (UTC)
I added that tag because of the source. I was under the impression that Ross graduated from a high school in Orlando, not Pennsylvania. In addition, the reference listed links to a Facebook page, which in turn contains a complete copy/paste of the article, making it self-referential and utterly unverifiable. elektrik SHOOS 05:26, 29 July 2010 (UTC)
If Ross had been a medical-records officer, would he have really been in a position where he had to yell at people or give them a bad time? It sounds odd, especially for someone who seemed congenitally laid-back. WilliamSommerwerck ( talk) 20:45, 2 September 2010 (UTC)
I have nothing against Bob Ross, but does this paragraph really match Wikipedia's standards on neutrality and objectivity?
88.153.25.98 ( talk) 17:50, 15 January 2011 (UTC)
The article says the show ran from 1983 to 1994. But it also says that Bob Ross died at the conclusion of the 31st season. Is 31st season an error? Or is there some other explanation? 71.241.227.109 ( talk) 19:23, 6 February 2011 (UTC)Stephen Kosciesza
The article says the show ran from 1983 to 1994. But it also says that Bob Ross died at the conclusion of the 31st season. Is 31st season an error? Or is there some other explanation? 71.241.227.109 ( talk) 19:23, 6 February 2011 (UTC)Stephen Kosciesza
In this case, the web pages cited are the "critical response". They are not references to the "critical response". 66.66.76.187 ( talk) 01:16, 24 January 2011 (UTC)
The last paragraph in the painting section doesn't quite appear to match the sources given. I took a look trying to verify the information and for my mind it takes quite a bit of reading between the lines to get "overly simplistic, without artistic merit, and monotonous" out of the sources mentioned. Perhaps I'm just missing something (and if I am please by all means point out what), but from what I saw the sources were criticizing his painting style as stolen/copied (the NY Times one) and inspiring dependence on Bob Ross and a lack of originality (the emptyeasel.com one). For this reason, I am tagging the paragraph with the {{ dubious}} and {{ Failed verification}} templates. Ks0stm ( T• C• G) 17:21, 5 April 2011 (UTC)
Over the past several months, an anonymous IP hopper has been adding (and readding) a "Critical Response" section to this biography, which can be seen here. I have objected to the section due to the quality of the sources and the original research quality to the remainder of the text, but since we're the only two people who've been arguing about it, I feel an outside opinion of some sort of necessary. I can understand a need for some sort of criticism/response section, especially given the positive tone of the bio in general, but in this form I feel it's detrimental. Anywho, this is why I opened the RfC, so please, I want outside feedback on this. elektrik SHOOS 19:30, 20 March 2011 (UTC)
Should we dig it up and post it?— Preceding unsigned comment added by Craigboy ( talk • contribs) 05:20, July 17, 2010
Also, I realize this may seem touchy, but I am certainly old enough to recall all this: Master Bill Alexander pioneered this technique, though lots of artists have used similar ways of painting.
It should be noted that Bob Ross basically stole Alexander's format, technique and TV presentation. Everything from the subject matter to the equipment - Ross even cleaned and dried his brushes exactly as Alexander had taught since BEFORE World War II. I made a sturdy screen bottom for a coffee can for brush cleaning - just as Alexander, not Ross, invented.
Alexander was on TV teaching this stuff, perhaps contemporaneously with Ross - but Ross, as I said, stole everything from Alexander. Yes, STOLE it. The only true difference is Bob Ross had a Plexiglas palette (which shape was specially designed by Alexander) - and he could never paint anywhere near as beautifully as Alexander did.
Can we discuss that instead of having stupid things about Ross in the Air Force? 76.195.85.160 ( talk) 18:12, 22 March 2011 (UTC)
All right, I concede your point on this matter. There is no known source (other than my very clear memory) and I know memory falls into personal research or original research. But this article still needs work .... 76.195.81.212 ( talk) 21:59, 2 April 2011 (UTC)
There is a source -- the New York Times -- and the reference has now been added. Let's see how long before someone takes it down! 198.36.194.3 ( talk) 22:13, 5 April 2011 (UTC)
Did Bob Ross make money off this "coffee can theft"? If not, it's not theft, it's just "inspiration". So you can invent using a Coffee can? Yeah sure and the Beatles stole from Elvis and Jerry Lee. I'm sure someone used a coffee can before. I like Bob Ross and always knew he figured all this stuff out from others. That's how the world works. Ford didn't invent the wheel or the car. What a phony! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.139.97.225 ( talk) 00:19, 22 April 2011 (UTC)
Oh, yes, Bob Ross made money! And I was not only talking about a coffee can! I was referring to the FACT that Bob Ross often said on his show that he invented things that Bill Alexander did first. And Ross was a student of his.
So when Alexander - and Ross around the same time - were on TV, it seemed Ross was somehow anointed to succeed Alexander. That was not the case as far as anyone knows, but my own beef was always the fact that Ross did not mention Alexander.
The Alexander heirs have their own site, products etc. and I see that Alexander is credited as the INVENTOR of not only the can-screen but also the palette knife, the Magic White, the black gesso, the Magic Clear, and the technique itself as a whole.
Alexander encouraged people to use all this as a starting point and to expand their artistic training through work. Ross only taught copying.
I didn't see the "NY Times" article. I hope it clears up some confusion.
Nuujinn, you say: "So long as we make clear that this claim was made by Alexander [...]" YES, of course it has to be made clear, that is why I say put the whole par. in the article. Alexander stated this - who else needs to state it? Even if only as a TV viewer, and as a student of Alexander's, I was there and saw that Ross stole the whole thing, then tried to outrun Alexander on TV. Ross made millions, as you see in the "Times" article. Alexander faded away and everyone has forgotten him.
You keep this article unfair if you do not emphasize that controversy. Ross should be shown in a clear, honest light and not just the light of sainthood. 75.21.149.151 ( talk) 07:14, 24 April 2011 (UTC)
I'm new, this is my first edit, ever. Please be kind. I feel that I have important info to contribute. Maybe somebody can assist me in getting this info out better (Maybe on the Article). Bob Ross personally dedicated his show "The Joy of Painting" to William "Bill" Alexander in his opening words of Season 02 - Episode 01 - "Meadow Lake". I can't find the video or transcription online. However, I have the episode and have transcribed it exactly word-for-word myself. After the opening theme, Bob starts: "Hello, I'm Bob Ross, and for the next 13 weeks, I'll be your Host, as we experience The Joy of Painting. This is a fantastic method of painting, where we're using Wet-On-Wet Technique, and before I go too far into the show, I'd like to take a few minutes and make a dedication: I would like to dedicate this show to my Beloved Friend and Teacher, whom we've all watched and loved for many years on Public Television- Bill Alexander. And years ago Bill taught me this fantastic technique, and I feel as though he gave me a Precious Gift, and I'd like to share that Gift with you." 70.173.129.19 ( talk) 21:46, 28 April 2011 (UTC)
Thank You, LessHeard vanU. What If I uploaded just the dedication part of the episode to youtube? Is a link to the youtube clip no-good as a reference? I noticed one of the references on the article page just gives the episode title so I assumed that worked? 70.173.129.19 ( talk) 23:18, 28 April 2011 (UTC)
Forgive me LessHeard but you're all I've got. I really have no idea what I'm doing. Sounds like a good-source is impossible. It's really a shame. I guess my only option could be, put it on youtube and hope a 3rd party writes about it? 70.173.129.19 ( talk) 23:33, 28 April 2011 (UTC)
All this talk about William Alexander had me searching for his Wikipedia article, out of genuine curiosity - but there is none. This begs the question: why haven't you folks, that are so deeply concerned about him, created an article that gives him his proper due, instead of complaining about what contributors to this article have (or haven't) done for him? PScooter63 ( talk) 02:29, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
"In fact, the rivalry between Mr. Ross and his former mentor, William Alexander, is bitter. Mr. Alexander, 76, a Bavarian-born painter who has his own painting show on a public television station in Orange County, Calif., a paint supply business and a line of books and videos, spoke of his former protégé in the tones Thomas Couture might have used to describe the young pupil who outstripped him, Edouard Manet. "He betrayed me," he said in his strong German accent. "I invented 'wet on wet.' I trained him and he is copying me -- what bothers me is not just that he betrayed me, but that he thinks he can do it better." "
SOURCE: "The New York Times",
TELEVISION section: "Bob Ross, the Frugal Gourmet of Painting", By ALESSANDRA STANLEY, December 22, 1991
and this tells us what is lacking in the article on Bob Ross. Even moreso because it simply ends there, and now both men are deceased. No one ever speaks of Bill Alexander. Yet as I said before, I learned from Alexander and I can tell you: Ross could not hold a candle to Alexander. If you don't believe me, look it up. Alexander's paintings were breathtaking.
I'm so glad there's a citation about this, but it isn't clear enough from the article's ref. - and I think this par. I quoted above should be quoted in the article, the Ross-Alexander controversy. It is real, and Ross made an empire when Alexander basically faded away! Is that like someone reaching similar inspiration, or is it as Alexander himself complained ... THEFT? 75.21.149.151 ( talk) 07:02, 24 April 2011 (UTC)
And I say again here: You keep this article unfair if you do not emphasize that controversy. Ross should be shown in a clear, honest light and not just the light of sainthood. 75.21.149.151 ( talk) 07:16, 24 April 2011 (UTC)
You are contradicting yourself - either that or contradicting the Wikipedia standard. "The New York Times" seems sufficient to make mention of the Alexander-Ross controversy. You seem to want some sort of book or major magazine article citations. One citation is enough, and it makes it notable that Alexander was quoted directly in the Times. 75.21.106.208 ( talk) 01:46, 3 May 2011 (UTC)
Your support for the inclusion of just a sentence on the matter is greatly appreciated. The public is going to read about Bob Ross here, the public needs to know some history, even if it is reduced to a sentence. Thanks for also reducing Less Heard's dumb argument to one nonsensical sentence!
Incidentally, I think I may have, in the past, written something in the article about this Alexander Tiff; it should still be there and I do not think more should be made of it since it is, as you say, a well documented fact.
As an incidental, I'd like you to know that there are those in the Alexander camp, including his heirs, who have not forgotten Bob Ross' treachery toward Alexander. I don't speak for them. I only know what I have read on the Alexander Magic of Oil Painting website that is still functional, and has been selling Alexander's patented painting supplies since the early 1980s. 76.195.83.171 ( talk) 05:01, 5 August 2011 (UTC)
This has to to with improving the article... how? elektrik SHOOS ( talk) 21:59, 8 July 2011 (UTC) |
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Everyone should read it, no, not read, feel it. Enjoy the "no true scotsman" using, condescending, arrogant and vitriol-vomiting "real artists" that hide Bob Ross's products to not "offend the regulars". It is a delicious amount of butt hurt "artists". Only the last few paragraphs are about the controversy, the rest is pure comedy so stereotypical that even the worst Hollywood script writer couldn't come up with it. 217.225.125.176 ( talk) 16:11, 6 June 2011 (UTC) |
Umm, how about you read it and then lend some helpful input here. Or are you another disinformation provider? 75.21.155.189 ( talk) 22:32, 25 July 2011 (UTC)
From the Painting section: "Ross's former mentor, William Alexander, has claimed that he taught Ross the "wet-on-wet" technique and that Ross "betrayed him" by presenting the technique as his own."
This does not sound right. Alexander "claimed he taught" Ross? Ross himself acknowledged twice that Alexander taught him. Is this the final expression of that fact for the article?
I object to that sentence. It should state that Bill Alexander taught Ross the method. Ross acknowledged this, and thanked Alexander (on the air) for being his teacher. The rest of it mentioning Alexander's feelings of betrayal is OK as-is.
But I see that editing is out of the question. Who blocked the article from editing? Or am I missing something as usual? 76.195.83.171 ( talk) 05:15, 5 August 2011 (UTC)
1. I apologize for my confusion about editing - it often happens when I go to an article I do NOT see the "edit" option where it ought to be. That was the case here, but I know as inexperienced as I am I'm probably missing something.
2. I concur with the sentence as phrased and proposed here by Keithbob. An excellent revision. I don't want to try my hand at torturing the grammar any further.
3. Sorry, Elektric Shoos, but I am getting a bit tired of this "it's not truth we want, it's verifiability". I can verify for you the existence of the Loch Ness monster, if I go about it the way you keep proposing ... but guess what ... ?!
So you're using that over and over as an electric fly swatter and it's unscholarly, tiresome, juvenile. What you and Wikipedia want to say is verifiable AND RELIABLE sources are needed, or else if it's a silly claim we still need sources to show that claim has been made ... yes, I get it.
All I ask is you stop throwing that out there when it has Nothing to do with the discussion at hand. There - now, what does all your verifiability talk have to do with Alexander's famous statement about Ross? It's cited, it's real, you can read and many of you here have read it.
In short, get off my back with that crap. 76.195.85.222 ( talk) 06:38, 6 August 2011 (UTC)
Well, I am aware of my blunt frankness with ideas and thoughts. I did not mean to insult anybody directly or begin a fight. I hope the remarks to that effect were not too concentrated on me.
My effort has always been merely to make the article as accurate as possible without arguing OBVIOUS sources for facts. 75.21.159.173 ( talk) 03:29, 26 August 2011 (UTC)
To the "Painting" section I have added: "An interesting aspect of Ross' shows, however, were the moments during which Ross discussed his invention of materials and ideas that were clearly Alexander's inventions."
Can someone please assist me with the connexion of that statement to the NY Times ref.? I know it is corroborated there somewhere - I just don't know how to reference that point.
New objection: I do not think it is enough or verifiable to have the following in the same sec.: 'However, Ross never claimed to be the creator of the technique. In fact, in season 2, episode 1 of "The Joy of Painting with Bob Ross", he dedicates his show to William Alexander, explaining that "years ago, Bill taught me this fantastic [wet-on-wet] technique, and I feel as though he gave me a precious gift, and I'd like to share that gift with you [the viewer]".'
I mean, what, we are just supposed to either take the editor's word for it or go hunting for that episode? Apply the same rule here as you did with me. There is no reference and thus no actual verifiability for this remark by Ross except a mention of the show, and that just seems like a forced opinion and is certainly, as it stands now, in the realm of personal research. Or did one of you others get a recording of that episode and hear it for yourselves? If so, then make that a new reference. It would be cool to have that in there to balance out the sourness of the Alexander controversy.
Remember, you all here are the rule-conscious people! So follow the rules. 75.21.159.173 ( talk) 03:41, 26 August 2011 (UTC)
Perhaps so, Nujinn, I was worried I was in error about that. In fact I find myself in the other editor's same quagmire - I know I've seen and heard Ross claim these inventions as his own, over and over. Inventions that Alexander first invented.
As to your explanation of the verifiability, I'm not sure I follow you. Could you clarify? Or are you just trying to say now no one can write a word unless it is a direct quote or paraphrase? 75.21.159.66 ( talk) 23:14, 26 August 2011 (UTC)
I want to add to this about Ross thanking Alexander: it does not belong until we have an air date and not just his exact quote. That is a double standard with the rules here.
Secondly, about Ross taking credit for Alexander's inventions: I have the main Alexander site which is kept up by his heirs. It speaks of his inventions, his early years and his dreams. 75.21.159.66 ( talk) 23:26, 26 August 2011 (UTC)
No, no, I do not want this getting out of hand.
Ross, who I watch all the time to this day, often blurts out that he invented the knife, he invented the "Magic" paints, he invented the easel - all of which Alexander invented.
I'm still struggling to find evidence that Alexander invented the black gesso, since Ross bragged most often about inventing that. There's no way I can get the same citation strength for all that, but I know Ross said those things and they continue to be televised.
If something appropriate can be found on Alexander's site, it should be quotable and cited without trouble. What I also want to know is why no one pursued a good Bill Alexander page, which I know existed at one time? 75.21.159.66 ( talk) 23:42, 26 August 2011 (UTC)
Note that in the article Wet-on-wet it says:"Wet-on-wet painting goes right back to the origins of oil painting, and was used by several of the best Early Netherlandish painters in parts of their pictures, such as Jan van Eyck in the Arnolfini portrait, and Rogier van der Weyden.[1]" so neither Alexander nor Ross can have invented the technique. As for the rest of this discussion, I have watched around 400 of Bob Ross' painting lessons and I can't remember him saying he invented any of the techniques he used. This controversy is probably a lot smaller than any news journalist or this wikipedia article makes it into. I think we should reduce our mentioning of this controversy to a minimum, if we need to mention it at all. Roger491127 ( talk) 02:01, 10 January 2012 (UTC)
Note how this "controversy" is handled in the article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Alexander_(artist), it says:
"Rivalry with Ross
At the beginning of The Joy of Painting's second season in 1984, Ross dedicated the show to Alexander and Alexander filmed a promo for his former student: "I hand off my mighty brush to a mighty man, and that is Bob Ross."[2][5] In 1987 someone from Alexander Art told Ross that they couldn't keep up with the demand generated by the The Joy of Painting and suggested that Ross start his own line of art supplies.[2] As Bob Ross Incorporated grew into a $15 million a year business Alexander told the New York Times that he felt "betrayed" by his one-time student. [6]"
I think we should copy this section in this article too, because the issue has been handled in a better way in that article. Roger491127 ( talk) 02:13, 10 January 2012 (UTC)
"In early 1994, Ross cancelled The Joy of Painting after its 11th season to continue battling the disease."
The term "season" seems vague here. The show ran for 11 years, but those years encompassed a total of 31 series (as Ross referred to them at the beginning and end of each series). Wikipedia's page on the show references "31 seasons". This is supported by the official Bob Ross site's merchandise page.
Is this a joke?
>At age 17, he was raped by a gang of flamboyant clowns who rode him like a pony over the horizon. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.166.232.180 ( talk) 12:02, 29 October 2012 (UTC)
With Bob Ross being celebrated by Google today, we need to lock this page. How do we accomplish this? --12:11, 29 October 2012 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Yoderj ( talk • contribs)
Since this page is locked for a couple days, need to download the image from google and attach it to the article. https://www.google.com/logos/2012/bob_ross12-hp.jpg -- TRiPgod ( talk) 15:15, 29 October 2012 (UTC)
The introduction implies that PBS has stations in Canada. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.209.169.177 ( talk) 14:44, 29 October 2012 (UTC)
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In Popular Culture
Bob Ross was parodied in " Fifteen Minutes of Shame", a Family Guy Episode, in which he threatens to cut viewers who dare tell anyone where he has painted a secret bush. Radish bliss ( talk) 16:09, 29 October 2012 (UTC)
Perhaps there should be added a mention of Bob Ross having lately become an icon of ASMR (aka brain orgasm) via YouTube. 80.61.230.65 ( talk) 18:37, 29 October 2012 (UTC)
Reference 4 does not contain the quote 'vowing "never to scream again."' This looks to have been inserted to prove an internet hoax that Bob Ross was an abusive Drill Sergeant.
"The correct reference is #5. I'll change the annotation. DoctorJoeE review transgressions/ talk to me! 21:54, 22 July 2014 (UTC)
98.227.11.252 ( talk) 18:57, 24 August 2014 (UTC)My name is James Needham. I was the General Manager of WIPB when we first contracted with Bob Ross to do the Joy of Painting Series #2 in 1983. Series #1 was initially produced at a station outside Washington, DC in Virginia, but later post-produced by WIPB and uplinked to satellite for the Joy of Painting Company, later Bob Ross Inc. Your information on the Joy of Painting is correct, and WIPB-TV, the PBS station licensed to Ball State University and still licensed to Ball State University in Muncie, IN was the originating station for the Joy of Painting for all of its PBS TV on-air series and productions. They were filmed in our studios at 246 Minnetrista Blvd. and later at the Ball Communications Building on the campus of Ball State University, both of which are located in Muncie, Indiana. If you need more information, contact me. bsu.needham@gmail.com 98.227.11.252 ( talk) 18:57, 24 August 2014 (UTC)
I dunno, this article lacks so much detail on how Bob Ross went from a minor US Airforce Sargent and bartender to learning how to paint via a German TV show about painting and then BOOM he gets a gig with PBS and finds national fame?-- 173.60.51.236 ( talk) 04:14, 25 July 2015 (UTC)
I was fixing a factual error in the "Influence and legacy" section because it said that the marathon was to conmemorate what would have been his 73th birthday, I replaced it with "...to celebrate the official launch of Twitch Creative", altrough later I included both sentences. My edit was then reverted by Mlpearc with no summary, so I procedurally reverted back saying "No summary given and not blatant vandalism", and then it was reverted with the summary "Sounded better before the change, no one is mentioning vandalism". Per WP:DISPUTED, I think my edit should be kept. (Pinging Mlpearc) -- TL22 ( talk) 02:12, 2 November 2015 (UTC)
Sparcdr (30/11/2015 21:34 GMT-6) - On the channel: bobross located at: http://www.twitch.tv/bobross today has been a marathan of Bob Ross' work. It should be posthumously noted that there is a following of people and his work.
Proof of this here: https://i.gyazo.com/991817f10bb2cd50e2b461e0323df828.png as he has 8456 viewers as of 9:30pm -6 GMT on the 30th of November, 2015. Thanks!
If you agree as the amount of viewers is quite a few, then maybe we should add a section about Bob Ross' legacy or something like that.
In episode 12 of the first season of the TV comedy series The Boondocks, a Bob Ross-like character makes a prominent appearance in order to instruct Riley on a more effective way to channel his artistic talents. Being that The Boondocks is well known and popular, I move to include this detail in the " In popular culture" section of this article. The episode originally aired on 19 February 2006 on Cartoon Network. –– amanisdude ( talk) 15:38, 29 October 2012 (UTC)
Can't believe no one's mentioned Ross/Picasso Epic Rap Battle Silverstina ( talk) 14:33, 19 February 2016 (UTC)
This article made the Wikipedia:Top 25 Report at number ten with 393,217 views for the week November 1 to 7, 2015. It was number seventeen the week before. Ross gained the attention of Twitch.tv which hosted a marathon of The Joy of Painting. Congratulations to the editors of this article for the exposure of their work. SchreiberBike | ⌨ 19:35, 10 November 2015 (UTC)
[[ Julien111111 ( talk) 05:51, 5 March 2016 (UTC)]]
Bob Ross referred to as God in the first episode of the fifth series of British sitcom Peep Show.
Julien111111 3/5/16