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Currently, it's written that, "A memorial is held for Superman in Metropolis. Clark is also declared dead, with various friends and family members including Bruce Wayne and Diana Prince attending for him in Smallville." Is it possible to insert "and Arlington National Cemetery" after Metropolis? Bignole and I had a previous discussion on this and suggested I should put it on the talk page. Lo and behold. After some painful lesson, I finally learned how to do it. I just want global readers understand the significance of Superman to the United States. Supermann ( talk) 18:52, 9 June 2017 (UTC)
I'm sorry, I honestly cannot tell if you're trolling or if you actually believe what you're saying. It makes it difficult to have an adult, rational conversation about why things can be placed in certain locations and what restrictions we have. Especially when you fall back on personal attacks and just odd statements. BIGNOLE (Contact me) 18:54, 21 July 2017 (UTC)
A primary source may only be used on Wikipedia to make straightforward, descriptive statements of facts that can be verified by any educated person with access to the primary source but without further, specialized knowledge.(emphasis mine}} DonQuixote ( talk) 19:05, 21 July 2017 (UTC)
Plot summaries cannot engage in interpretation and should only present an obvious recap of the work...Even small details that might be clear on a word-by-word or frame-by-frame analysis – steps well beyond the normal act of reading or watching a work – should be considered original research and excluded from such articles.DonQuixote ( talk) 19:31, 21 July 2017 (UTC)
Plot summaries cannot engage in interpretation and should only present an obvious recap of the workdo you not understand? The key phrase being "obvious recap". DonQuixote ( talk) 20:15, 21 July 2017 (UTC)
Guidelines and policies exist for a reason. They represent norms and practices that have been formed through consensus, usually over the course of many years. While WP:IAR encourages common-sense editing without fear of violating a specific rule, you are still expected to adequately explain your position and gain consensus for your proposed change when challenged. A strong argument and a willingness to work with others is usually all you need. Here, I'm not sure if an exception should or shouldn't be made based on what's been stated so far, but let's not forget to consider alternative solutions. Does the location really need to be stated, including Metropolis? What about just stating:
"A memorial is held for Superman, while Clark is also declared dead. Various friends and family members, including Bruce Wayne and Diana Prince, attended his funeral in Smallville.
If the only solution you'll accept is to insert Arlington National Cemetery, then perhaps improving the article isn't your primary goal. -- GoneIn60 ( talk) 02:15, 23 July 2017 (UTC)
I have a new source saying the scene of Arlington is filmed in Michigan now! Hope you guys approve! Supermann ( talk) 02:50, 29 July 2017 (UTC)
I just watched this awful movie. Criticism aside, the actual movie and this plot summary have only a faint resemblance. It would have been a much better movie if it was the one described in this summary, but it was not made that way. It was practically incoherent. Please note that Lex Luthor has a LOT of screen time which this supposed plot summary neglects. Batman (I'd have to check; was he being called that in the movie?) developed what amounted to an insane and juvenile hatred of Superman - supposedly because Superman was involved in fights with large innocent civilian "collateral damage". In the penultimate scene with Batman standing over Superman ready to finish him off, Lois didn't "reason with him". Watch it again, he just didn't have the guts or perhaps the insanity to follow through (inexplicably, imho), especially with her as a witness. I'll also question whether the appearance of the Flash, Cyborg or Aquaman is notable, but I'll leave that for another day. 174.130.48.221 ( talk) 18:37, 30 August 2017 (UTC)
Despite a warning against this in the infobox it should absolutely include each of at least the title characters creators as it is not only a requirement in the credits of the film itself but also an important piece of information about the work itself and its writing. It is in no way different than including Bram Stoker's credit in an adaption of Dracula or Arthur Conan Doyle in a derivative work of Sherlock Holmes, these characters and their stories were created by these people and as such any work that is based on their efforts should be credited to them. Shallowgravy ( talk)
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Sorry but you fanboys/girls really need to get a life. This movie is simply not historically or culturally significant enough (or at all) to have an article this ridiculously long. I'm recommending that this article be pared down and tidied up substantially. Start with the introduction -- way too long, and it gets worse from there. Alialiac ( talk) 15:12, 29 March 2018 (UTC)
The neutral standpoint is being battled by fans and critics. Statistics do show what the general public think about the movie in general however, is this what the movie should be rated on? We know fans loved the movie and others deem it to fall within the lines of what Rotten Tomatoes think. Though what I fail to see is that its not mentioned much on what Snyder's vision even was. Snyder himself has said, “I love the characters, and maybe to a fault sometimes, I dork out on the hardcore aspects of the comic books.” [1] This comes to reflect as to why his vision is so dark. Is this page to criticize his work based on having no knowledge of the comics or is it on having an honest opinion with knowledge on knowing how dark DC comics are? The general public does not get this nor will it ever without completely understanding where Snyder's vision truly comes from. I see this information to be extremely significant when it comes to referencing Batman v Superman as just a failure and flop from the general public. Especially when the film is being praised by those who understand where Snyder is coming from. Sanchez.Rigoberto ( talk) 03:43, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
References
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edit request to
Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
I think it would be great if there could be a scholarly analysis section (or a comparable section from other Wikipedia pages about movies), discussing how film studies scholars have analyzed the film since its release. Perhaps for now, rather than creating a new section, it would be best to include scholarly responses under the Critical Response section. Here is one example:
In 2018, the journal Mise-en-scène published "Applying Suspense to Archetypal Superheroes: Hitchcockian Ambiguity in Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice," which argued that the film "applies a remarkable amount of Hitchcockian thrills to a story pitting two protagonists against one another within a villain’s conspiracy to cre-ate the first live-action Hitchcockian superhero thriller featuring branded, culturally established characters. By displacing its protagonists from their inherently justified positions, it creates a critical moral ambiguity that directly deconstructs the assumptions at the heart of Western society’s two most archetypal superheroes.": https://journals.sfu.ca/msq/index.php/msq/article/view/86/pdf Usagienthusiast ( talk) 02:42, 16 December 2018 (UTC)
Change: Eisenberg responded to the critiques by saying he attempted to "make these people real and relatable and interesting and engaging, not just, you know, a surface bad person."[319]
To: Eisenberg responded to the critiques by saying he attempted to "make these people real and relatable and interesting and engaging, not just, you know, a surface bad person."[319]
(new paragraph below)
In June 2018, Mise-en-scène: The Journal of Film & Visual Narration published the article "Applying Suspense to Archetypal Superheroes: Hitchcockian Ambiguity in Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice," which argued that the film "applies a remarkable amount of Hitchcockian thrills to a story pitting two protagonists against one another within a villain’s conspiracy to create the first live-action Hitchcockian superhero thriller featuring branded, culturally established characters. By displacing its protagonists from their inherently justified positions, it creates a critical moral ambiguity that directly deconstructs the assumptions at the heart of Western society’s two most archetypal superheroes." Source: [1] Usagienthusiast ( talk) 06:18, 29 December 2018 (UTC)
I am not a wikipedia editor, so I am flagging this for someone to do. But the plot summary calls Superman a "retard" and lists the date of the previous movie as 1888. 2601:182:4201:83F0:E9BE:62B3:E0EA:1447 ( talk) 14:12, 20 February 2019 (UTC)
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Remove the quotation marks from "deterrent" in the plot summary.
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Remove the statement "however, Michael Shannon did not film any scenes for the film and the corpse was created using the physique of fitness model Greg Plitt and a head-shot of Shannon.", because it's only sourced to to a youtube video. DCBVS ( talk) 17:47, 19 May 2019 (UTC)
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I am new to wikipedia. I have suggestions for additions to the themes and analysis section.
Several critics have noted the similarities between the destruction of Metropolis and 9/11.
John Beifuss wrote "The idea is that just as 9/11 had a transformative existential impact on the psyche of America (hello, President Donald Trump), the battle of Metropolis -- and the subsequent realization that an all-powerful alien could destroy his adopted planet with ease -- has altered human consciousness, creating new standards of morality and levels of fear -- "the feeling of powerlessness that turns good men cruel," in the words of Wayne's butler, Alfred (Jeremy Irons)."[2] He says that Batman comes out of the Metropolis battle scene as "a changed -- and even more deranged -- man."[2]
Kaleem Aftab wrote the film "is about the confusion that America has been in since 9/11", and "was intended as an unpleasant lambast of the government and the popular reaction to 9/11."[3] In addition, he wrote "As a writer who is Muslim, I find it rare to see a protagonist that represents me in American film, but Batman v Superman positions Kal-El as an unfortunate victim, tarnished because of the actions of others deemed to be his contemporaries." [3] He also wrote the film "is a condemnation of what America is becoming, a place where immigrants, especially those unfairly tainted because of the mass destruction caused by a few, are no longer part of a viable American dream."[3]
Beifuss, John (March 25, 2016). "'Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice' - A Review". The Commercial Appeal. Archived from the original on |archive-url= requires |archive-date= (help). Retrieved May 25, 2020. Aftab, Kaleem (March 28, 2016). "'Batman v Superman' Is Actually a Good Depiction of the American Muslim Experience". Vice.
I think I could have worded the transitions better, and I need help with finding the archive date for The Commercial Appeal review. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Pineapple4321 ( talk • contribs) 14:10, 26 May 2020 (UTC)
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The first line says "featuring the DC Comics characters Batman and Superman. ", normally movies are described as "based on the DC characters", cause the actual DC character is a separate entity. The actual character isn't featured in the movie, but rather, their own take, based on the character. Rtc7788 ( talk) 03:17, 19 June 2020 (UTC)
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i want to edit Kadkemeh ( talk) 18:46, 21 June 2020 (UTC)
Not done: this is not the right page to
request additional
user rights. You may reopen this request with the specific changes to be made and someone will add them for you.
DonQuixote (
talk)
18:49, 21 June 2020 (UTC)
In the themes section, the first source from Richard Brody takes the most space out of any of the sources on the themes section. His view is also not shared by anyone else I can find. I assume the editor put his analysis first because it is from the New Yorker. I think his quote and analysis should be reduced and moved to later in the section, because I can't find another source that agrees with it, and there are several more sources that have the opposite view of the political themes. If you have any recommendations on how to solve this issue, feel free to give them. I also think the themes section could be expanded much more. Pineapple4321 ( talk) 21:41, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
I’d like to add a HUGE +1 to this. I glared at my phone when I opened the themes section only to be greeted by this bizarre lede to a section. Just because someone writes for the New Yorker does not mean that their weird, over-simplified analysis deserves to open the section and have three entire paragraphs dedicated to it. Especially when the analysis equates to, “colors mean republicans and democrats and if he’s saying democrats are bad then I think that is wrong and also bad”. I’ve never seen the film, but it’s really really off-putting to open the Themes section of a film and see this. Length doesn’t equate to notability or weight-of-importance in an article, but there’s three entire paragraphs dedicated to this one guy’s opinion, with everything from one source. It’s not NEARLY notable enough an opinion to warrant that much real estate in the section, and considering that it’s far from a popular theory, it needs to be moved.
As an aside, the formatting is a mess too. The writer’s analysis should NOT be mixed in with the lede to the section as, again, it implies that the opinion has significant weight to the rest of the section. Regardless of what happens here, that needs to be moved to its own individual paragraph. Thatdave ( talk) 17:12, 18 August 2020 (UTC)
The first line of the plot summary isn't good. First off, the scene isn't really a flashback as it is the first scene of the film. Maybe you could argue since it has adult Bruce's narration, it is a flashback, but it is disputable. Also "memorable encounter with bats" isn't a good way of summarizing the scene. Plus, the fact that he sees his parents murdered in front of him, while it may be well known to a general audience, is still important information to include. Pineapple4321 ( talk) 00:02, 11 December 2020 (UTC)
where he is risen alongside bats", just sounds awkward. I did retain the part about seeing his parents getting murdered, as that can arguably be an important distinction to make. Open to suggestions if you think this needs further tweaking, but challenging the use of "flashback" seems unnecessary. -- GoneIn60 ( talk) 07:41, 15 December 2020 (UTC)
In a flashback after witnessing his parents' murder, Bruce Wayne falls into a cave while running from the funeral, where he has a memorable encounter with a legion of bats." The problem is that the flashback is both remembering the night of his parents' murder while running from the funeral. In fact, that sequence switches constantly back and forth between the two events. I'm sure that can be phrased better. Maybe something like:
In a flashback to his childhood, Bruce Wayne runs from his parents' funeral while remembering the night they were murdered. He falls into a cave, where he has a memorable encounter with a legion of bats.
...there is no prior established current point in the story..."
If the scene happened in the middle of the film, I would consider it a flashback."
A device in the narrative of a motion picture, novel, etc., by which an event or scene taking place before the present time in the narrative is inserted into the chronological structure of the work.
He falls into a cave, and a circling vortex of bats elevates him back to the surface." -- GoneIn60 ( talk) 08:47, 23 December 2020 (UTC)
a circling vortex of bats elevates him back to the surface". As for being an issue during a GA review, no one is going to even pause and think there's a problem with the term flashback. The fact that you are doing so is odd to me. In case it does come up during the review, I provided 6 sources that call it a flashback. No reason that shouldn't be enough to quell the concern. -- GoneIn60 ( talk) 18:11, 2 January 2021 (UTC)
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I want to change "though some praised its visuals and acting performances" to "though some praised the visuals and Affleck's performance " 70.29.44.224 ( talk) 18:31, 6 January 2021 (UTC)
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Typo in the following text:
“criminal mastermind Lex Luthor manipulates Batman into a preemptive battle with Superman, whom whom Luthor is obsessed”
“whom whom” should actually be “with whom” 165.120.207.68 ( talk) 00:02, 20 March 2021 (UTC)
The reception of the ultimate edition should be discussed in the opening and reception section. All sources I could find say the reception is improved. https://www.slashfilm.com/batman-v-superman-ultimate-edition-reviews/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Transfo47 ( talk • contribs) 12:09, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
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Archive 1 | ← | Archive 4 | Archive 5 | Archive 6 |
Currently, it's written that, "A memorial is held for Superman in Metropolis. Clark is also declared dead, with various friends and family members including Bruce Wayne and Diana Prince attending for him in Smallville." Is it possible to insert "and Arlington National Cemetery" after Metropolis? Bignole and I had a previous discussion on this and suggested I should put it on the talk page. Lo and behold. After some painful lesson, I finally learned how to do it. I just want global readers understand the significance of Superman to the United States. Supermann ( talk) 18:52, 9 June 2017 (UTC)
I'm sorry, I honestly cannot tell if you're trolling or if you actually believe what you're saying. It makes it difficult to have an adult, rational conversation about why things can be placed in certain locations and what restrictions we have. Especially when you fall back on personal attacks and just odd statements. BIGNOLE (Contact me) 18:54, 21 July 2017 (UTC)
A primary source may only be used on Wikipedia to make straightforward, descriptive statements of facts that can be verified by any educated person with access to the primary source but without further, specialized knowledge.(emphasis mine}} DonQuixote ( talk) 19:05, 21 July 2017 (UTC)
Plot summaries cannot engage in interpretation and should only present an obvious recap of the work...Even small details that might be clear on a word-by-word or frame-by-frame analysis – steps well beyond the normal act of reading or watching a work – should be considered original research and excluded from such articles.DonQuixote ( talk) 19:31, 21 July 2017 (UTC)
Plot summaries cannot engage in interpretation and should only present an obvious recap of the workdo you not understand? The key phrase being "obvious recap". DonQuixote ( talk) 20:15, 21 July 2017 (UTC)
Guidelines and policies exist for a reason. They represent norms and practices that have been formed through consensus, usually over the course of many years. While WP:IAR encourages common-sense editing without fear of violating a specific rule, you are still expected to adequately explain your position and gain consensus for your proposed change when challenged. A strong argument and a willingness to work with others is usually all you need. Here, I'm not sure if an exception should or shouldn't be made based on what's been stated so far, but let's not forget to consider alternative solutions. Does the location really need to be stated, including Metropolis? What about just stating:
"A memorial is held for Superman, while Clark is also declared dead. Various friends and family members, including Bruce Wayne and Diana Prince, attended his funeral in Smallville.
If the only solution you'll accept is to insert Arlington National Cemetery, then perhaps improving the article isn't your primary goal. -- GoneIn60 ( talk) 02:15, 23 July 2017 (UTC)
I have a new source saying the scene of Arlington is filmed in Michigan now! Hope you guys approve! Supermann ( talk) 02:50, 29 July 2017 (UTC)
I just watched this awful movie. Criticism aside, the actual movie and this plot summary have only a faint resemblance. It would have been a much better movie if it was the one described in this summary, but it was not made that way. It was practically incoherent. Please note that Lex Luthor has a LOT of screen time which this supposed plot summary neglects. Batman (I'd have to check; was he being called that in the movie?) developed what amounted to an insane and juvenile hatred of Superman - supposedly because Superman was involved in fights with large innocent civilian "collateral damage". In the penultimate scene with Batman standing over Superman ready to finish him off, Lois didn't "reason with him". Watch it again, he just didn't have the guts or perhaps the insanity to follow through (inexplicably, imho), especially with her as a witness. I'll also question whether the appearance of the Flash, Cyborg or Aquaman is notable, but I'll leave that for another day. 174.130.48.221 ( talk) 18:37, 30 August 2017 (UTC)
Despite a warning against this in the infobox it should absolutely include each of at least the title characters creators as it is not only a requirement in the credits of the film itself but also an important piece of information about the work itself and its writing. It is in no way different than including Bram Stoker's credit in an adaption of Dracula or Arthur Conan Doyle in a derivative work of Sherlock Holmes, these characters and their stories were created by these people and as such any work that is based on their efforts should be credited to them. Shallowgravy ( talk)
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Sorry but you fanboys/girls really need to get a life. This movie is simply not historically or culturally significant enough (or at all) to have an article this ridiculously long. I'm recommending that this article be pared down and tidied up substantially. Start with the introduction -- way too long, and it gets worse from there. Alialiac ( talk) 15:12, 29 March 2018 (UTC)
The neutral standpoint is being battled by fans and critics. Statistics do show what the general public think about the movie in general however, is this what the movie should be rated on? We know fans loved the movie and others deem it to fall within the lines of what Rotten Tomatoes think. Though what I fail to see is that its not mentioned much on what Snyder's vision even was. Snyder himself has said, “I love the characters, and maybe to a fault sometimes, I dork out on the hardcore aspects of the comic books.” [1] This comes to reflect as to why his vision is so dark. Is this page to criticize his work based on having no knowledge of the comics or is it on having an honest opinion with knowledge on knowing how dark DC comics are? The general public does not get this nor will it ever without completely understanding where Snyder's vision truly comes from. I see this information to be extremely significant when it comes to referencing Batman v Superman as just a failure and flop from the general public. Especially when the film is being praised by those who understand where Snyder is coming from. Sanchez.Rigoberto ( talk) 03:43, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
References
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edit request to
Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
I think it would be great if there could be a scholarly analysis section (or a comparable section from other Wikipedia pages about movies), discussing how film studies scholars have analyzed the film since its release. Perhaps for now, rather than creating a new section, it would be best to include scholarly responses under the Critical Response section. Here is one example:
In 2018, the journal Mise-en-scène published "Applying Suspense to Archetypal Superheroes: Hitchcockian Ambiguity in Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice," which argued that the film "applies a remarkable amount of Hitchcockian thrills to a story pitting two protagonists against one another within a villain’s conspiracy to cre-ate the first live-action Hitchcockian superhero thriller featuring branded, culturally established characters. By displacing its protagonists from their inherently justified positions, it creates a critical moral ambiguity that directly deconstructs the assumptions at the heart of Western society’s two most archetypal superheroes.": https://journals.sfu.ca/msq/index.php/msq/article/view/86/pdf Usagienthusiast ( talk) 02:42, 16 December 2018 (UTC)
Change: Eisenberg responded to the critiques by saying he attempted to "make these people real and relatable and interesting and engaging, not just, you know, a surface bad person."[319]
To: Eisenberg responded to the critiques by saying he attempted to "make these people real and relatable and interesting and engaging, not just, you know, a surface bad person."[319]
(new paragraph below)
In June 2018, Mise-en-scène: The Journal of Film & Visual Narration published the article "Applying Suspense to Archetypal Superheroes: Hitchcockian Ambiguity in Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice," which argued that the film "applies a remarkable amount of Hitchcockian thrills to a story pitting two protagonists against one another within a villain’s conspiracy to create the first live-action Hitchcockian superhero thriller featuring branded, culturally established characters. By displacing its protagonists from their inherently justified positions, it creates a critical moral ambiguity that directly deconstructs the assumptions at the heart of Western society’s two most archetypal superheroes." Source: [1] Usagienthusiast ( talk) 06:18, 29 December 2018 (UTC)
I am not a wikipedia editor, so I am flagging this for someone to do. But the plot summary calls Superman a "retard" and lists the date of the previous movie as 1888. 2601:182:4201:83F0:E9BE:62B3:E0EA:1447 ( talk) 14:12, 20 February 2019 (UTC)
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Remove the quotation marks from "deterrent" in the plot summary.
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Remove the statement "however, Michael Shannon did not film any scenes for the film and the corpse was created using the physique of fitness model Greg Plitt and a head-shot of Shannon.", because it's only sourced to to a youtube video. DCBVS ( talk) 17:47, 19 May 2019 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 18:38, 3 April 2020 (UTC)
I am new to wikipedia. I have suggestions for additions to the themes and analysis section.
Several critics have noted the similarities between the destruction of Metropolis and 9/11.
John Beifuss wrote "The idea is that just as 9/11 had a transformative existential impact on the psyche of America (hello, President Donald Trump), the battle of Metropolis -- and the subsequent realization that an all-powerful alien could destroy his adopted planet with ease -- has altered human consciousness, creating new standards of morality and levels of fear -- "the feeling of powerlessness that turns good men cruel," in the words of Wayne's butler, Alfred (Jeremy Irons)."[2] He says that Batman comes out of the Metropolis battle scene as "a changed -- and even more deranged -- man."[2]
Kaleem Aftab wrote the film "is about the confusion that America has been in since 9/11", and "was intended as an unpleasant lambast of the government and the popular reaction to 9/11."[3] In addition, he wrote "As a writer who is Muslim, I find it rare to see a protagonist that represents me in American film, but Batman v Superman positions Kal-El as an unfortunate victim, tarnished because of the actions of others deemed to be his contemporaries." [3] He also wrote the film "is a condemnation of what America is becoming, a place where immigrants, especially those unfairly tainted because of the mass destruction caused by a few, are no longer part of a viable American dream."[3]
Beifuss, John (March 25, 2016). "'Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice' - A Review". The Commercial Appeal. Archived from the original on |archive-url= requires |archive-date= (help). Retrieved May 25, 2020. Aftab, Kaleem (March 28, 2016). "'Batman v Superman' Is Actually a Good Depiction of the American Muslim Experience". Vice.
I think I could have worded the transitions better, and I need help with finding the archive date for The Commercial Appeal review. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Pineapple4321 ( talk • contribs) 14:10, 26 May 2020 (UTC)
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The first line says "featuring the DC Comics characters Batman and Superman. ", normally movies are described as "based on the DC characters", cause the actual DC character is a separate entity. The actual character isn't featured in the movie, but rather, their own take, based on the character. Rtc7788 ( talk) 03:17, 19 June 2020 (UTC)
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i want to edit Kadkemeh ( talk) 18:46, 21 June 2020 (UTC)
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In the themes section, the first source from Richard Brody takes the most space out of any of the sources on the themes section. His view is also not shared by anyone else I can find. I assume the editor put his analysis first because it is from the New Yorker. I think his quote and analysis should be reduced and moved to later in the section, because I can't find another source that agrees with it, and there are several more sources that have the opposite view of the political themes. If you have any recommendations on how to solve this issue, feel free to give them. I also think the themes section could be expanded much more. Pineapple4321 ( talk) 21:41, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
I’d like to add a HUGE +1 to this. I glared at my phone when I opened the themes section only to be greeted by this bizarre lede to a section. Just because someone writes for the New Yorker does not mean that their weird, over-simplified analysis deserves to open the section and have three entire paragraphs dedicated to it. Especially when the analysis equates to, “colors mean republicans and democrats and if he’s saying democrats are bad then I think that is wrong and also bad”. I’ve never seen the film, but it’s really really off-putting to open the Themes section of a film and see this. Length doesn’t equate to notability or weight-of-importance in an article, but there’s three entire paragraphs dedicated to this one guy’s opinion, with everything from one source. It’s not NEARLY notable enough an opinion to warrant that much real estate in the section, and considering that it’s far from a popular theory, it needs to be moved.
As an aside, the formatting is a mess too. The writer’s analysis should NOT be mixed in with the lede to the section as, again, it implies that the opinion has significant weight to the rest of the section. Regardless of what happens here, that needs to be moved to its own individual paragraph. Thatdave ( talk) 17:12, 18 August 2020 (UTC)
The first line of the plot summary isn't good. First off, the scene isn't really a flashback as it is the first scene of the film. Maybe you could argue since it has adult Bruce's narration, it is a flashback, but it is disputable. Also "memorable encounter with bats" isn't a good way of summarizing the scene. Plus, the fact that he sees his parents murdered in front of him, while it may be well known to a general audience, is still important information to include. Pineapple4321 ( talk) 00:02, 11 December 2020 (UTC)
where he is risen alongside bats", just sounds awkward. I did retain the part about seeing his parents getting murdered, as that can arguably be an important distinction to make. Open to suggestions if you think this needs further tweaking, but challenging the use of "flashback" seems unnecessary. -- GoneIn60 ( talk) 07:41, 15 December 2020 (UTC)
In a flashback after witnessing his parents' murder, Bruce Wayne falls into a cave while running from the funeral, where he has a memorable encounter with a legion of bats." The problem is that the flashback is both remembering the night of his parents' murder while running from the funeral. In fact, that sequence switches constantly back and forth between the two events. I'm sure that can be phrased better. Maybe something like:
In a flashback to his childhood, Bruce Wayne runs from his parents' funeral while remembering the night they were murdered. He falls into a cave, where he has a memorable encounter with a legion of bats.
...there is no prior established current point in the story..."
If the scene happened in the middle of the film, I would consider it a flashback."
A device in the narrative of a motion picture, novel, etc., by which an event or scene taking place before the present time in the narrative is inserted into the chronological structure of the work.
He falls into a cave, and a circling vortex of bats elevates him back to the surface." -- GoneIn60 ( talk) 08:47, 23 December 2020 (UTC)
a circling vortex of bats elevates him back to the surface". As for being an issue during a GA review, no one is going to even pause and think there's a problem with the term flashback. The fact that you are doing so is odd to me. In case it does come up during the review, I provided 6 sources that call it a flashback. No reason that shouldn't be enough to quell the concern. -- GoneIn60 ( talk) 18:11, 2 January 2021 (UTC)
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I want to change "though some praised its visuals and acting performances" to "though some praised the visuals and Affleck's performance " 70.29.44.224 ( talk) 18:31, 6 January 2021 (UTC)
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Typo in the following text:
“criminal mastermind Lex Luthor manipulates Batman into a preemptive battle with Superman, whom whom Luthor is obsessed”
“whom whom” should actually be “with whom” 165.120.207.68 ( talk) 00:02, 20 March 2021 (UTC)
The reception of the ultimate edition should be discussed in the opening and reception section. All sources I could find say the reception is improved. https://www.slashfilm.com/batman-v-superman-ultimate-edition-reviews/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Transfo47 ( talk • contribs) 12:09, 1 April 2021 (UTC)