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A posting about a contrroversy keeps getting deleted because a user does not like the source (who works for the Howard 100). The source is not Howard Stern but rather Steve Langford a credible "real" news reporter who works for Sirius (On Stern's Channel). The source is listed, it's a real news source, it's up to the reader to decided if they trust the source.
By telling their audience to vote for Sanjaya Malakar. Somebody post this in the main article. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.142.59.62 ( talk) 15:03, 29 March 2007 (UTC).
This article was nominated for deletion on March 18, 2006. The discussion can be found here. A number of people thought the article should be merged with American Idol, which could perhaps be discussed below. Flower party■ 02:46, 23 March 2006 (UTC)
"Not showing up" for whatever reason is not controversial. Its just "not showing up". All very unsourced and trivial actually. Section needs cleaning up. -- Eqdoktor 09:26, 3 March 2007 (UTC)
Question, can there be a all girl finale, or it is always boy girl?
Section on Ruben Studdard/Clay Aiken vote controversy says that 230 million of 24 million votes were potentially dropped - this cannot be true - does anyone know the correct number? -- Thomasdelbert 03:11, 13 May 2007 (UTC)
I have removed a large chunk of this article. The statements removed included:
I recognize that several of these removals may be controversial, so to speak, so if any of my edits are in dispute let's discuss them here. -- MisterHand 19:58, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
It's ironic that you regard the well-established (and Wikipedia-documented) principles of vote splitting and strategic voting as too controversial for the "American Idol controversies" page. Yet a newspaper article quoting people saying they got lots of busy signals when they tried to vote is regarded as evidence of overloaded phone lines (without even mentioning the important capacity difference between cell-phone connections and land lines).
Yes it is necessary to collect data to prove that vote splitting has occurred. That's what I've done, and what I referenced. Specifically the polls at www.VoteFair.org/americanidol.html (with details accessed via the table-heading links) establish -- with numerical evidence -- that vote splitting has been a contributing factor in the early eliminations of Melinda Doolittle, Elliott Yamin, Chris Daughtry, and Jennifer Hudson. (In the case of Jennifer Hudson, strategic voting was also involved, and this was expressed by Ryan Seacrest as "you have to vote for your favorites.")
In my other areas of expertise (including having written a how-to book on creative problem solving, which has been published in nine languages) my expertise is appreciated. Yet here where I see unsubstantiated opinions backed up with news articles in which the evidence is a few quotations from a few fans, my expertise seems to be unappreciated.
How many more soldiers need to die in Iraq before the unfair voting method used within the Iraqi Parliament (where Shiites easily outvote the Sunnis and Kurds) is recognized as adding fuel to the conflict in Iraq? That's the kind of voting issue that is indeed controversial. Pardon me if I'm anxious to move beyond the primitive "single-mark ballots" we currently use in political elections -- and in American Idol polls -- and start using "order-of-preference" (a.k.a. "preferential" or "ordinal") ballots so that people don't have to die unnecessarily. Only when we've advanced beyond primitive voting methods (that are vulnerable to vote splitting and strategic voting) can we be ready to truly solve bigger problems like terrorism and the Middle East conflict.
If there are any newspaper editors out there, I'll be happy to do interviews about American Idol voting issues so that the resulting articles posted on the Internet can be referenced here by other posters who will then be able to convey the importance of vote splitting for predicting the eliminations that are a surprise to everyone who doesn't understand how American Idol's voting method works (and doesn't work). My phone number is posted at the bottom of www.solutionscreative.com/cpst.html. VoteFair 05:49, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
I might have accidentally skipped over it, but on the Top 11 night of season 4, the voting numbers were put up incorrectly for three of the contestants, causing them to have to reshow the episode the Wednesday night with the correct numbers, and show the new results on the Thursday. I'll try to find a source, but I definately remember this happening.
The section on career control gives no in-line citations for any information given. This should either be tagged in the article or corrected by citing the sources. TennysonXII ( talk) 05:16, 14 January 2009 (UTC)
Alexis Grace wasn't actually voted out in the week which she was assigned the IDOLS-36 number, and was in fact voted out a week later in the Top 11 round. I'm not sure how to clean this up, because although there were concerns were placed around the fact that she was assigned an unusual number for the Top 13 week, it didn't actually affect her in the competition. The source cited was actually written the week before Alexis was voted out of the show. Astharis ( talk) 12:36, 13 April 2009 (UTC)
"signing the contract is optional but a requirement if they want to participate in the competition."
It is part of a sentence in the Career Control section, and is one of the most contradictory statements I think I've ever read. Signing the contract to enter the competition is optional but to enter the competition you have to sign it ???? -__- Dylan ( talk) 16:00, 3 September 2010 (UTC)
This should be mentioned because Ms. Toscano's elimination is very similar to the Season 9 Siobhan Magnus. Many say that they will never watch the show again. There are reliable sources. I've heard reports that a voting glitch (online) may have been discovered. Aeverine Frathleen Nieves ( talk) 08:19, 11 April 2011 (UTC)
As explained at VoteFair.org, here is the reason for Pia's surprise elimination:
American Idol uses runoff voting which makes the mistaken assumption that the person with the fewest votes is least popular. (This unfairness is well known by voting-method experts and "game-theory" mathematicians.) This unfairness arose two weeks earlier when Casey Abrams was unexpectedly eliminated early because voters focused on their first choice and neglected to vote for secondary choices. To compensate for this unfairness, which is a limitation of runoff voting, voters recently used strategic voting to focus on secondary choices to protect the singers who are not the most popular, nor the least popular. Unfortunately voters also reduced their votes for Pia Toscano because she had not been in the bottom three and voters assumed that her popularity in online polls [1] meant that other voters were giving her plenty of votes. This situation is similar to what happened in week 7 of Season 3 when Fantasia Barrino (the eventual winner), LaToya London, and Jennifer Hudson (who was eliminated that night) ended up in the bottom three in spite of commonly being regarded as that season's three best singers.
Quotations from the judges can be used to support the fact that, at the very least, this result was very surprising. As for proof of the reason, that might be difficult because the show does not share results above the bottom three, and Wikipedia's academic-publication-oriented source-requirement criteria may not give credibility to online polls.
I am the person who conducts the VoteFair American Idol polls, so I cannot write this section myself, but someone else can. The elimination chart at VoteFair.org clearly shows how much of a surprise this was. VoteFair ( talk) 06:21, 13 April 2011 (UTC)
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A posting about a contrroversy keeps getting deleted because a user does not like the source (who works for the Howard 100). The source is not Howard Stern but rather Steve Langford a credible "real" news reporter who works for Sirius (On Stern's Channel). The source is listed, it's a real news source, it's up to the reader to decided if they trust the source.
By telling their audience to vote for Sanjaya Malakar. Somebody post this in the main article. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.142.59.62 ( talk) 15:03, 29 March 2007 (UTC).
This article was nominated for deletion on March 18, 2006. The discussion can be found here. A number of people thought the article should be merged with American Idol, which could perhaps be discussed below. Flower party■ 02:46, 23 March 2006 (UTC)
"Not showing up" for whatever reason is not controversial. Its just "not showing up". All very unsourced and trivial actually. Section needs cleaning up. -- Eqdoktor 09:26, 3 March 2007 (UTC)
Question, can there be a all girl finale, or it is always boy girl?
Section on Ruben Studdard/Clay Aiken vote controversy says that 230 million of 24 million votes were potentially dropped - this cannot be true - does anyone know the correct number? -- Thomasdelbert 03:11, 13 May 2007 (UTC)
I have removed a large chunk of this article. The statements removed included:
I recognize that several of these removals may be controversial, so to speak, so if any of my edits are in dispute let's discuss them here. -- MisterHand 19:58, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
It's ironic that you regard the well-established (and Wikipedia-documented) principles of vote splitting and strategic voting as too controversial for the "American Idol controversies" page. Yet a newspaper article quoting people saying they got lots of busy signals when they tried to vote is regarded as evidence of overloaded phone lines (without even mentioning the important capacity difference between cell-phone connections and land lines).
Yes it is necessary to collect data to prove that vote splitting has occurred. That's what I've done, and what I referenced. Specifically the polls at www.VoteFair.org/americanidol.html (with details accessed via the table-heading links) establish -- with numerical evidence -- that vote splitting has been a contributing factor in the early eliminations of Melinda Doolittle, Elliott Yamin, Chris Daughtry, and Jennifer Hudson. (In the case of Jennifer Hudson, strategic voting was also involved, and this was expressed by Ryan Seacrest as "you have to vote for your favorites.")
In my other areas of expertise (including having written a how-to book on creative problem solving, which has been published in nine languages) my expertise is appreciated. Yet here where I see unsubstantiated opinions backed up with news articles in which the evidence is a few quotations from a few fans, my expertise seems to be unappreciated.
How many more soldiers need to die in Iraq before the unfair voting method used within the Iraqi Parliament (where Shiites easily outvote the Sunnis and Kurds) is recognized as adding fuel to the conflict in Iraq? That's the kind of voting issue that is indeed controversial. Pardon me if I'm anxious to move beyond the primitive "single-mark ballots" we currently use in political elections -- and in American Idol polls -- and start using "order-of-preference" (a.k.a. "preferential" or "ordinal") ballots so that people don't have to die unnecessarily. Only when we've advanced beyond primitive voting methods (that are vulnerable to vote splitting and strategic voting) can we be ready to truly solve bigger problems like terrorism and the Middle East conflict.
If there are any newspaper editors out there, I'll be happy to do interviews about American Idol voting issues so that the resulting articles posted on the Internet can be referenced here by other posters who will then be able to convey the importance of vote splitting for predicting the eliminations that are a surprise to everyone who doesn't understand how American Idol's voting method works (and doesn't work). My phone number is posted at the bottom of www.solutionscreative.com/cpst.html. VoteFair 05:49, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
I might have accidentally skipped over it, but on the Top 11 night of season 4, the voting numbers were put up incorrectly for three of the contestants, causing them to have to reshow the episode the Wednesday night with the correct numbers, and show the new results on the Thursday. I'll try to find a source, but I definately remember this happening.
The section on career control gives no in-line citations for any information given. This should either be tagged in the article or corrected by citing the sources. TennysonXII ( talk) 05:16, 14 January 2009 (UTC)
Alexis Grace wasn't actually voted out in the week which she was assigned the IDOLS-36 number, and was in fact voted out a week later in the Top 11 round. I'm not sure how to clean this up, because although there were concerns were placed around the fact that she was assigned an unusual number for the Top 13 week, it didn't actually affect her in the competition. The source cited was actually written the week before Alexis was voted out of the show. Astharis ( talk) 12:36, 13 April 2009 (UTC)
"signing the contract is optional but a requirement if they want to participate in the competition."
It is part of a sentence in the Career Control section, and is one of the most contradictory statements I think I've ever read. Signing the contract to enter the competition is optional but to enter the competition you have to sign it ???? -__- Dylan ( talk) 16:00, 3 September 2010 (UTC)
This should be mentioned because Ms. Toscano's elimination is very similar to the Season 9 Siobhan Magnus. Many say that they will never watch the show again. There are reliable sources. I've heard reports that a voting glitch (online) may have been discovered. Aeverine Frathleen Nieves ( talk) 08:19, 11 April 2011 (UTC)
As explained at VoteFair.org, here is the reason for Pia's surprise elimination:
American Idol uses runoff voting which makes the mistaken assumption that the person with the fewest votes is least popular. (This unfairness is well known by voting-method experts and "game-theory" mathematicians.) This unfairness arose two weeks earlier when Casey Abrams was unexpectedly eliminated early because voters focused on their first choice and neglected to vote for secondary choices. To compensate for this unfairness, which is a limitation of runoff voting, voters recently used strategic voting to focus on secondary choices to protect the singers who are not the most popular, nor the least popular. Unfortunately voters also reduced their votes for Pia Toscano because she had not been in the bottom three and voters assumed that her popularity in online polls [1] meant that other voters were giving her plenty of votes. This situation is similar to what happened in week 7 of Season 3 when Fantasia Barrino (the eventual winner), LaToya London, and Jennifer Hudson (who was eliminated that night) ended up in the bottom three in spite of commonly being regarded as that season's three best singers.
Quotations from the judges can be used to support the fact that, at the very least, this result was very surprising. As for proof of the reason, that might be difficult because the show does not share results above the bottom three, and Wikipedia's academic-publication-oriented source-requirement criteria may not give credibility to online polls.
I am the person who conducts the VoteFair American Idol polls, so I cannot write this section myself, but someone else can. The elimination chart at VoteFair.org clearly shows how much of a surprise this was. VoteFair ( talk) 06:21, 13 April 2011 (UTC)
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