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Can anybody tell me, who controls Al-JAzeera, simply who ist owner? I know, taht this is not R. Murdoch. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.173.85.252 ( talk) 18:54, 16 January 2008 (UTC)
Any chance of an American wikipedian posting or linking to a copy of this memo? Almafeta 05:19, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
I suspect that this really was a joke remark, although I am at a loss to then explain the UK gov's stupidly draconian response. I can't believe even a buffoon like Bush would bomb Qatar, it doesn't make any sense (does the memo explicitly specifiy aerial bombing btw? Or just any bombing, e.g. CIA etc?). As it evolves this article should perhaps explicitly state that the actual text is unavailable (or at least I couldn't find it on a quick google search + scanning the likes of Indymedia etc) and the context of the remarks is thus unclear. (These days however, anything is possible- maybe it's time to get my tin hat out and hide in the cellar just in case).
Changing "King" into "Emir" -- Gerard von Hebel 10:10, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
--
This article is written terribly.
This article is very poorly written and riddled with POV. No-one has even seen the memo and speculations about its content vary widely. The Mirror front page refers to the supposed plan to bomb Al Jazeera yet the most common view of those experts asked of it is that Bush was simply letting off steam and making a joke, if indeed he ever said it. This view is not explained in the article. This article needs a thorough cleanup. David | Talk 19:17, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
If Bush makes such a joke, given the immense damage it could do to the US if reported, then he is unfit to be president. But then he has shown repeatedly that he is unfit for office. FearÉIREANN 21:11, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
As the memo is a multiple page document, it would be minutes of the meeting, not a summary. Frankly, I suspect (though it is OR and POV), it was a joke borne of frustration. The US most certainly would not alienate Qatar, where two major US bases are. Wzrd1 ( talk) 18:49, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
Well, I wonder if Bush is gonna take responsibility about this or would the matter end up as a joke?! Ashs2005 19:42, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
Tabloid BS indeed. Its amazing its gotten this much attention.
This is not something I have any interest in entering a revert war over, but I do object to the line that The paper notably has a very anti-George Bush/America stance 2, in reference to The Daily Mirror. A single cover page is not sufficient evidence that an entire publication has an Anti-American stance. Can't sleep, clown will eat me 21:52, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
The claim that the paper is anti-American is preposterous. It is anti-Bush and his policies, but then so is most of the planet. Does that mean that most of the planet, including according to polls on Bush and his policies even the UK, the late Pope John Paul II and Queen Elizabeth, all are known to have been extremely critical of Bush, is anti-American? Does that mean that the majority of Americans who voted against Bush in 2000 and the near majority who votes against Bush in 2004 are anti-American? FearÉIREANN 02:03, 28 November 2005 (UTC)
In the context of the UK press, the Mirror is probably the most anti-American paper, with the possible exception of the Independent. The Guardian is rather less so.
If we have a scale of 5 (anti) to 1 (pro) American (and by that I mean - against or for US foreign policy, as put into practice under recent presidents)
Mirror - 5 Independent - 5 Guardian - 4 Sun - 1 Times - 1 (note the Murdoch connection) Telegraph - 2 Mail - 2 Express - 2
Let's be clear here - the Mirror's criticisms of US policy apply (though perhaps not quite so much) to the policy of Clinton and Bush Sr as well as Bush jr, which are blamed for the anti-American (what else would you call it) feeling in the Middle East.
Is the Mirror RIGHT to take the stance it has? Perhaps yes - in my own POV. But it's undoubtedly non-POV to describe it as anti-American in the sense usually meant when discussing foreign policy, the Iraq war, etc. It doesn't mean it's against Mickey Mouse, McDonalds, and Rock and Roll.
Someone who wants British troops out of Ireland could as a shorthand description be called "anti-British" even though he may like tea, cricket and British people as individuals.
Of course such a description could be used to dismiss the allegations made here. However a little research shows that the memo appears to exist - the only dispute is over its contents.
Exile 15:44, 28 November 2005 (UTC)
(The following is copied from the talk page for the WikiNews article)
I'm not a Brit, so will ask the question: Is the Daily Mirror a reputable source or a scandal sheet that reports front page stories about princesses having their toes sucked ? If it's as bad as the National Enquirer in the US, I don't think we should be using it directly, or any quotes from it found in other news reports (like the Yahoo source). StuRat 18:33, 23 November 2005 (UTC)
Any chance someone could get hold of the memo and publish it here? That woudl resolve the dispute! :)
The above request could be considered incitement to commit a breach of the official secrets act. Not sure about the extra territorial jurisdiction of the Official secrets act but some british acts allow for crimes to be comitted anywhere in the world. For example the Computer misuse act (1991 I think) Dolive21 10:13, 29 November 2005 (UTC)
I guess it is clear by now that a top-secret document got leaked. In sharing the concerns about the reputation of the Mirror, the authors have gone to great lengths to illuminate the flow of information and the unverified (unverifyable) nature of its contents, wherever appropriate and necessary. After thegag order, it is unlikely to hear further reporting on the document (which has been returned to Blairs office anyway). -- vonbergm 19:42, 23 November 2005 (UTC)
Why is the article now protected? I had just clicked to revert the POV insertion by the anon that "the Daily Mirror is sensationalist" and well, found myself at "view source" - the article does not even say {{protected}} - What's going on?
Really, the assertation "sensationalist tabloid" (or similar) needs to be removed from the article - The last edit by the anon.. -- Chaosfeary 23:00, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
It is protected to stop the edit war. As the notice makes clear WP does not endorse the version protected. It has been so to stop and edit war and will remain so until there is evidence that warriors will not restart. Anymore edits that breach WP:3RR will lead to the immediate banning of those responsible. FearÉIREANN 23:06, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
I have no idea why your user page was blocked. (WP is doing strange things right. It could be a gremlin. I've removed it but it took 4 attempts for the system to allow me do it. It has taken 3 attempts to get the f***** system to save this!) Constant adding in of each other's version over someone else's changes breaches 3RR. Users went well beyond 3. FearÉIREANN 23:15, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
Are they??? Jesus, what is wrong with this goddamned system tonight!!! FearÉIREANN 23:15, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
I guess we can call the Mirror a "sensationalist tabloid" for buying fabricated photos. But then, of course, we'd have to call the Bush administration a "sensationalist regime" for starting a war over fabricated intelligence. Can't have one but not the other... but then 30,000 people didn't die over the Mirror's sensationalism stunt, you would think, so Bush seems rather more sensationalist in that sense. dab (ᛏ) 12:09, 28 November 2005 (UTC)
# Better context to the faked TA photos - this is skirting the edge of being POV as it is. |
accountable for cheating on his income tax. After all, there
are other senators who have done far worse things.”
Another example: “I should not pay a fine for reckless driving.
There are many other people on the street who are dangerous
criminals and rapists, and the police should be chasing them,
not harassing a decent tax-paying citizen like me.”The actual article:
Bush Plot To Bomb His Arab Ally http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/tm_objectid=16397937&method=full&siteid=94762&headline=exclusive--bush-plot-to-bomb-his-arab-ally-name_page.html
On November 13, 2001 a US cruise missile hit Al Jazeera's office in Kabul after it criticised the US attack on Afghanistan. [4] Although no Al-Jazeera staff were hurt in the attack, the building was destroyed and the homes of some employees were damaged. At the time, Mohammed Jasim al-Ali, managing editor, said that the coordinates of the office were well known to everyone including the Americans.
In November 2002, Al-Jazeera's office in Kabul, Afghanistan, was destroyed by a U.S. missile. None of the crew was at the office at the time. U.S. officials said they believed the target was a terrorist site and did not know it was Al-Jazeera's office. [5]
On April 8, 2003 a US missile hit an electricity generator at Al Jazeera's office in Baghdad. The resulting fire killed reporter Tareq Ayyoub and wounded another staff member. On February 24, Mohammed Jasim al-Ali had sent a letter (however, it should be noted that the location had not been requested by the US government) with the coordinates of the offices to Victoria Clarke, the US Assistant Secretary of State of Defence for Public Affairs. The assault on the Baghdad office occurred after the network had screened footage of the US bombing of civilian targets in the city. [6] a State Department spokesman in Doha, said the strike was a mistake. [7] Kgrr 15:06, 28 November 2005 (UTC)
David Keogh, 49, a former communications officer at the Cabinet Office, and Leo O’Connor, 42, a one-time researcher for the former Labour MP, Anthony Clarke, appeared at Bow Street Magistrates Court charged under the Official Secrets Act. [8] 24.18.194.118 14:58, 30 November 2005 (UTC)
The article has a hidden warning to UK editors:
I think this is unnecessary. Wikipedia is governed by Florida state law, not UK law. Seabhcán 14:18, 28 November 2005 (UTC)
This [Al-Jazeera Kabul offices hit in US raid BBC news article on the bombing of the Kabul Al-Jazeera offices] (which is alreadly linked to as a source in the article) specifically quotes al-Jazeera's managing director Mohammed Jasim al-Ali:
"This office has been known by everybody, the American airplanes know the location of the office, they know we are broadcasting from there," he said.
As for the Baghdad attack, in an April 26, 2003 article for the San Francisco Bay Guardian, Robert Fisk says:
"Mr al-Ali has given me a copy of his letter to Victoria Clarke, the US Assistant Secretary of State of Defence for Public Affairs in Washington, sent on 24 February this year. In the letter, he gives the address and the map coordinates of the station's office in Baghdad - Lat: 33.19/29.08, Lon 44.24/03.63 - adding that civilian journalists would be working in the building."
Please be careful to phrase things in an NPOV manner.
I notice that nothing on the page links to the actual memo, is a copy of it available anywhere on the web to use as a reference? --anon
NOTE: the first news article is from Yahoo News, which sadly is notorious for its news links becoming DEAD within weeks or even days. Since it is 404 now, I updated it to a Google search for the title of the original article -- see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al_Jazeera_bombing_memo#endnote_yahoo_news
^ PS: Censored it eh? Well can we at least keep the link to that "censored" site within this discussion? http://www.blairwatch.co.uk/node/603
Our O'Connor - Keogh official secrets trial article isn't in an ideal condition. David Keogh redirects to it, Leo O'Connor has his own stub. I'm inclined to believe that neither is encyclopedic beyond the case, so that both names should redirect to the article about the case.
Also, I've differentiated in this article the sections under which the two are charged: Keogh under section 3 (which carries a 2 year term) because he's alleged to have disclosed info he came upon as part of his duties, but O'Connor under section 5, as he's alleged to have passed it on (presumably to the Mirror). That's the same section journalists could be charged under, and carries a term of 6 months [9]. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 13:48, 29 November 2005 (UTC)
What do you all think of including a line or two on other controvesial 'accidental' or accidental bombings performed by the US such as the bombing of the Chinese embassy in Kosovo? I think it'll be relevant but I'm sure some won't agree. 203.118.184.138 20:37, 29 November 2005 (UTC)
Why do we have the Blairwatch stuff at all? Surely this is a non-notable website added here by its owner with the intention of inflating its profile, listing a non-notable list of non-notable websites and blogs promising to do something that they have no chance whatever of actually doing. That The Spectator and Private Eye say they'd publish the memo if they could is interesting and encyclopedic; that a bunch of nobodies say the same isn't. It's just spam. -- Middenface 11:21, 30 November 2005 (UTC)
I think it's reasonable to include the image because it's a nice comment on the way the memo is seen politically within the UK - that those who are anti-Labour (or at least anti-Labour policy on Iraq) are generally of the belief that its publication would aid them. Oddly the Mirror story implied the direct opposite - that Blair had persuaded Bush not to do something stupid. It also indicates a degree of knowledge about the memo among the blogosphere. I'd keep the image in. David | Talk 14:49, 30 November 2005 (UTC)
I don't see any reason why not include it. The only reason I've heard so far is about the notability of Blairwatch.co.uk. As a reminder, Google-watch.org got an entry in wikipedia. Even Daniel Brandt, its founder, got his own controversial article. Indeed, it's just Mr Brandt who's editing his sites while the last time I visited Blairwatch I found 3 users and 317 guests. I am not trying to imply whether any of the websites is notable but implying that if Google-watch is present here than a banner/pic from blairwatch which is directly related to the story is at least notable to this article. The only thing we should discuss is what to mention in the title of the picture, not the presence of it. -- Cheers -- Svest 18:52, 30 November 2005 (UTC) Wiki me up™
I have changed the end of the otherwise good text to remove the reference to 'Blairs edicts'. I probaly swung it too far the other way, so i am very happy for some one to find a better alternative. I think UK law is a better end then blairs edicts. It at least is plain fact, even if the circumstances show a certain amount of POV. Dolive21 23:04, 30 November 2005 (UTC)
Congratulations in your in spired and well balanced image text User:Dbiv. Just one point, it is clear that publishing classified documents is illegal in the UK. The citation if you want to check it is Official secrets act 1989 Section 5 for the publiaction, and section 3 is the section about international relations. The full memo is beleived to contain details of british troop deployments, which would all under section 2. Section 15 extends the jurisdiction of the offence to anyone with british citizen ship any where in the world. If you want ot look this up it is on pages 280 - 286 of blackstones statutes on criminal law, or on line at HMSO. The above was from Blackstones 14th edition. The entry in blackstones about the official secrets act is identical to the act, which is crown copyright and can be reproduced freely as long as attributed. Please keep these two sentences in if you use this information.
User:Peter McConaughey is a suspected sock puppet of a user permanently blocked form editing wikipedia. Dolive21 11:21, 5 July 2006 (UTC)
This seems reduntant after so much time, but publishing the memeo would be copyvio. It is either copyright of the person who transcribed it, their employer (The british goverment, which would not give permission) or blair and bush themselves. Even if it was a fake, then unless the person faking it said ti was ok and owned up to faking it, it would be wikipedia policy to delete it. Dolive21 11:24, 5 July 2006 (UTC)
There has been no proof of the veracity of this "memo". It should therefore, under the NPOV policy, be deemed "alleged", and this should be included in the title to not show a POV. -- Mrmiscellanious 17:37, 9 August 2006 (UTC)
The link posted for this blog site no longer leads to an Al Jazeera-related page but rather to a series of advertisements. If the blog has been moved elsewhere, please update the link. 23skidoo ( talk) 16:10, 5 April 2008 (UTC)
Would editors please not delete dead links (like what was done here [10]) without first trying to find alternative sources for the same content. On many occasions, archive copies of dead links can be found at archive.org. Tiptoethrutheminefield ( talk) 19:58, 3 February 2017 (UTC)
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This article is rated B-class on Wikipedia's
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Can anybody tell me, who controls Al-JAzeera, simply who ist owner? I know, taht this is not R. Murdoch. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.173.85.252 ( talk) 18:54, 16 January 2008 (UTC)
Any chance of an American wikipedian posting or linking to a copy of this memo? Almafeta 05:19, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
I suspect that this really was a joke remark, although I am at a loss to then explain the UK gov's stupidly draconian response. I can't believe even a buffoon like Bush would bomb Qatar, it doesn't make any sense (does the memo explicitly specifiy aerial bombing btw? Or just any bombing, e.g. CIA etc?). As it evolves this article should perhaps explicitly state that the actual text is unavailable (or at least I couldn't find it on a quick google search + scanning the likes of Indymedia etc) and the context of the remarks is thus unclear. (These days however, anything is possible- maybe it's time to get my tin hat out and hide in the cellar just in case).
Changing "King" into "Emir" -- Gerard von Hebel 10:10, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
--
This article is written terribly.
This article is very poorly written and riddled with POV. No-one has even seen the memo and speculations about its content vary widely. The Mirror front page refers to the supposed plan to bomb Al Jazeera yet the most common view of those experts asked of it is that Bush was simply letting off steam and making a joke, if indeed he ever said it. This view is not explained in the article. This article needs a thorough cleanup. David | Talk 19:17, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
If Bush makes such a joke, given the immense damage it could do to the US if reported, then he is unfit to be president. But then he has shown repeatedly that he is unfit for office. FearÉIREANN 21:11, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
As the memo is a multiple page document, it would be minutes of the meeting, not a summary. Frankly, I suspect (though it is OR and POV), it was a joke borne of frustration. The US most certainly would not alienate Qatar, where two major US bases are. Wzrd1 ( talk) 18:49, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
Well, I wonder if Bush is gonna take responsibility about this or would the matter end up as a joke?! Ashs2005 19:42, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
Tabloid BS indeed. Its amazing its gotten this much attention.
This is not something I have any interest in entering a revert war over, but I do object to the line that The paper notably has a very anti-George Bush/America stance 2, in reference to The Daily Mirror. A single cover page is not sufficient evidence that an entire publication has an Anti-American stance. Can't sleep, clown will eat me 21:52, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
The claim that the paper is anti-American is preposterous. It is anti-Bush and his policies, but then so is most of the planet. Does that mean that most of the planet, including according to polls on Bush and his policies even the UK, the late Pope John Paul II and Queen Elizabeth, all are known to have been extremely critical of Bush, is anti-American? Does that mean that the majority of Americans who voted against Bush in 2000 and the near majority who votes against Bush in 2004 are anti-American? FearÉIREANN 02:03, 28 November 2005 (UTC)
In the context of the UK press, the Mirror is probably the most anti-American paper, with the possible exception of the Independent. The Guardian is rather less so.
If we have a scale of 5 (anti) to 1 (pro) American (and by that I mean - against or for US foreign policy, as put into practice under recent presidents)
Mirror - 5 Independent - 5 Guardian - 4 Sun - 1 Times - 1 (note the Murdoch connection) Telegraph - 2 Mail - 2 Express - 2
Let's be clear here - the Mirror's criticisms of US policy apply (though perhaps not quite so much) to the policy of Clinton and Bush Sr as well as Bush jr, which are blamed for the anti-American (what else would you call it) feeling in the Middle East.
Is the Mirror RIGHT to take the stance it has? Perhaps yes - in my own POV. But it's undoubtedly non-POV to describe it as anti-American in the sense usually meant when discussing foreign policy, the Iraq war, etc. It doesn't mean it's against Mickey Mouse, McDonalds, and Rock and Roll.
Someone who wants British troops out of Ireland could as a shorthand description be called "anti-British" even though he may like tea, cricket and British people as individuals.
Of course such a description could be used to dismiss the allegations made here. However a little research shows that the memo appears to exist - the only dispute is over its contents.
Exile 15:44, 28 November 2005 (UTC)
(The following is copied from the talk page for the WikiNews article)
I'm not a Brit, so will ask the question: Is the Daily Mirror a reputable source or a scandal sheet that reports front page stories about princesses having their toes sucked ? If it's as bad as the National Enquirer in the US, I don't think we should be using it directly, or any quotes from it found in other news reports (like the Yahoo source). StuRat 18:33, 23 November 2005 (UTC)
Any chance someone could get hold of the memo and publish it here? That woudl resolve the dispute! :)
The above request could be considered incitement to commit a breach of the official secrets act. Not sure about the extra territorial jurisdiction of the Official secrets act but some british acts allow for crimes to be comitted anywhere in the world. For example the Computer misuse act (1991 I think) Dolive21 10:13, 29 November 2005 (UTC)
I guess it is clear by now that a top-secret document got leaked. In sharing the concerns about the reputation of the Mirror, the authors have gone to great lengths to illuminate the flow of information and the unverified (unverifyable) nature of its contents, wherever appropriate and necessary. After thegag order, it is unlikely to hear further reporting on the document (which has been returned to Blairs office anyway). -- vonbergm 19:42, 23 November 2005 (UTC)
Why is the article now protected? I had just clicked to revert the POV insertion by the anon that "the Daily Mirror is sensationalist" and well, found myself at "view source" - the article does not even say {{protected}} - What's going on?
Really, the assertation "sensationalist tabloid" (or similar) needs to be removed from the article - The last edit by the anon.. -- Chaosfeary 23:00, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
It is protected to stop the edit war. As the notice makes clear WP does not endorse the version protected. It has been so to stop and edit war and will remain so until there is evidence that warriors will not restart. Anymore edits that breach WP:3RR will lead to the immediate banning of those responsible. FearÉIREANN 23:06, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
I have no idea why your user page was blocked. (WP is doing strange things right. It could be a gremlin. I've removed it but it took 4 attempts for the system to allow me do it. It has taken 3 attempts to get the f***** system to save this!) Constant adding in of each other's version over someone else's changes breaches 3RR. Users went well beyond 3. FearÉIREANN 23:15, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
Are they??? Jesus, what is wrong with this goddamned system tonight!!! FearÉIREANN 23:15, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
I guess we can call the Mirror a "sensationalist tabloid" for buying fabricated photos. But then, of course, we'd have to call the Bush administration a "sensationalist regime" for starting a war over fabricated intelligence. Can't have one but not the other... but then 30,000 people didn't die over the Mirror's sensationalism stunt, you would think, so Bush seems rather more sensationalist in that sense. dab (ᛏ) 12:09, 28 November 2005 (UTC)
# Better context to the faked TA photos - this is skirting the edge of being POV as it is. |
accountable for cheating on his income tax. After all, there
are other senators who have done far worse things.”
Another example: “I should not pay a fine for reckless driving.
There are many other people on the street who are dangerous
criminals and rapists, and the police should be chasing them,
not harassing a decent tax-paying citizen like me.”The actual article:
Bush Plot To Bomb His Arab Ally http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/tm_objectid=16397937&method=full&siteid=94762&headline=exclusive--bush-plot-to-bomb-his-arab-ally-name_page.html
On November 13, 2001 a US cruise missile hit Al Jazeera's office in Kabul after it criticised the US attack on Afghanistan. [4] Although no Al-Jazeera staff were hurt in the attack, the building was destroyed and the homes of some employees were damaged. At the time, Mohammed Jasim al-Ali, managing editor, said that the coordinates of the office were well known to everyone including the Americans.
In November 2002, Al-Jazeera's office in Kabul, Afghanistan, was destroyed by a U.S. missile. None of the crew was at the office at the time. U.S. officials said they believed the target was a terrorist site and did not know it was Al-Jazeera's office. [5]
On April 8, 2003 a US missile hit an electricity generator at Al Jazeera's office in Baghdad. The resulting fire killed reporter Tareq Ayyoub and wounded another staff member. On February 24, Mohammed Jasim al-Ali had sent a letter (however, it should be noted that the location had not been requested by the US government) with the coordinates of the offices to Victoria Clarke, the US Assistant Secretary of State of Defence for Public Affairs. The assault on the Baghdad office occurred after the network had screened footage of the US bombing of civilian targets in the city. [6] a State Department spokesman in Doha, said the strike was a mistake. [7] Kgrr 15:06, 28 November 2005 (UTC)
David Keogh, 49, a former communications officer at the Cabinet Office, and Leo O’Connor, 42, a one-time researcher for the former Labour MP, Anthony Clarke, appeared at Bow Street Magistrates Court charged under the Official Secrets Act. [8] 24.18.194.118 14:58, 30 November 2005 (UTC)
The article has a hidden warning to UK editors:
I think this is unnecessary. Wikipedia is governed by Florida state law, not UK law. Seabhcán 14:18, 28 November 2005 (UTC)
This [Al-Jazeera Kabul offices hit in US raid BBC news article on the bombing of the Kabul Al-Jazeera offices] (which is alreadly linked to as a source in the article) specifically quotes al-Jazeera's managing director Mohammed Jasim al-Ali:
"This office has been known by everybody, the American airplanes know the location of the office, they know we are broadcasting from there," he said.
As for the Baghdad attack, in an April 26, 2003 article for the San Francisco Bay Guardian, Robert Fisk says:
"Mr al-Ali has given me a copy of his letter to Victoria Clarke, the US Assistant Secretary of State of Defence for Public Affairs in Washington, sent on 24 February this year. In the letter, he gives the address and the map coordinates of the station's office in Baghdad - Lat: 33.19/29.08, Lon 44.24/03.63 - adding that civilian journalists would be working in the building."
Please be careful to phrase things in an NPOV manner.
I notice that nothing on the page links to the actual memo, is a copy of it available anywhere on the web to use as a reference? --anon
NOTE: the first news article is from Yahoo News, which sadly is notorious for its news links becoming DEAD within weeks or even days. Since it is 404 now, I updated it to a Google search for the title of the original article -- see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al_Jazeera_bombing_memo#endnote_yahoo_news
^ PS: Censored it eh? Well can we at least keep the link to that "censored" site within this discussion? http://www.blairwatch.co.uk/node/603
Our O'Connor - Keogh official secrets trial article isn't in an ideal condition. David Keogh redirects to it, Leo O'Connor has his own stub. I'm inclined to believe that neither is encyclopedic beyond the case, so that both names should redirect to the article about the case.
Also, I've differentiated in this article the sections under which the two are charged: Keogh under section 3 (which carries a 2 year term) because he's alleged to have disclosed info he came upon as part of his duties, but O'Connor under section 5, as he's alleged to have passed it on (presumably to the Mirror). That's the same section journalists could be charged under, and carries a term of 6 months [9]. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 13:48, 29 November 2005 (UTC)
What do you all think of including a line or two on other controvesial 'accidental' or accidental bombings performed by the US such as the bombing of the Chinese embassy in Kosovo? I think it'll be relevant but I'm sure some won't agree. 203.118.184.138 20:37, 29 November 2005 (UTC)
Why do we have the Blairwatch stuff at all? Surely this is a non-notable website added here by its owner with the intention of inflating its profile, listing a non-notable list of non-notable websites and blogs promising to do something that they have no chance whatever of actually doing. That The Spectator and Private Eye say they'd publish the memo if they could is interesting and encyclopedic; that a bunch of nobodies say the same isn't. It's just spam. -- Middenface 11:21, 30 November 2005 (UTC)
I think it's reasonable to include the image because it's a nice comment on the way the memo is seen politically within the UK - that those who are anti-Labour (or at least anti-Labour policy on Iraq) are generally of the belief that its publication would aid them. Oddly the Mirror story implied the direct opposite - that Blair had persuaded Bush not to do something stupid. It also indicates a degree of knowledge about the memo among the blogosphere. I'd keep the image in. David | Talk 14:49, 30 November 2005 (UTC)
I don't see any reason why not include it. The only reason I've heard so far is about the notability of Blairwatch.co.uk. As a reminder, Google-watch.org got an entry in wikipedia. Even Daniel Brandt, its founder, got his own controversial article. Indeed, it's just Mr Brandt who's editing his sites while the last time I visited Blairwatch I found 3 users and 317 guests. I am not trying to imply whether any of the websites is notable but implying that if Google-watch is present here than a banner/pic from blairwatch which is directly related to the story is at least notable to this article. The only thing we should discuss is what to mention in the title of the picture, not the presence of it. -- Cheers -- Svest 18:52, 30 November 2005 (UTC) Wiki me up™
I have changed the end of the otherwise good text to remove the reference to 'Blairs edicts'. I probaly swung it too far the other way, so i am very happy for some one to find a better alternative. I think UK law is a better end then blairs edicts. It at least is plain fact, even if the circumstances show a certain amount of POV. Dolive21 23:04, 30 November 2005 (UTC)
Congratulations in your in spired and well balanced image text User:Dbiv. Just one point, it is clear that publishing classified documents is illegal in the UK. The citation if you want to check it is Official secrets act 1989 Section 5 for the publiaction, and section 3 is the section about international relations. The full memo is beleived to contain details of british troop deployments, which would all under section 2. Section 15 extends the jurisdiction of the offence to anyone with british citizen ship any where in the world. If you want ot look this up it is on pages 280 - 286 of blackstones statutes on criminal law, or on line at HMSO. The above was from Blackstones 14th edition. The entry in blackstones about the official secrets act is identical to the act, which is crown copyright and can be reproduced freely as long as attributed. Please keep these two sentences in if you use this information.
User:Peter McConaughey is a suspected sock puppet of a user permanently blocked form editing wikipedia. Dolive21 11:21, 5 July 2006 (UTC)
This seems reduntant after so much time, but publishing the memeo would be copyvio. It is either copyright of the person who transcribed it, their employer (The british goverment, which would not give permission) or blair and bush themselves. Even if it was a fake, then unless the person faking it said ti was ok and owned up to faking it, it would be wikipedia policy to delete it. Dolive21 11:24, 5 July 2006 (UTC)
There has been no proof of the veracity of this "memo". It should therefore, under the NPOV policy, be deemed "alleged", and this should be included in the title to not show a POV. -- Mrmiscellanious 17:37, 9 August 2006 (UTC)
The link posted for this blog site no longer leads to an Al Jazeera-related page but rather to a series of advertisements. If the blog has been moved elsewhere, please update the link. 23skidoo ( talk) 16:10, 5 April 2008 (UTC)
Would editors please not delete dead links (like what was done here [10]) without first trying to find alternative sources for the same content. On many occasions, archive copies of dead links can be found at archive.org. Tiptoethrutheminefield ( talk) 19:58, 3 February 2017 (UTC)
-- Elvey( t• c) 18:56, 31 October 2016 (UTC)
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