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Shuneh el-Janubiyeh is mentioned by M. Piccirillo, for instance here, and by others. It would be welcome.
Is it the "Shunet Nimrin" from WWI? See Second Transjordan attack on Shunet Nimrin and Es Salt. If so, then after the creation of the article, Shunet Nimrin, wherever it occurs, must be linked to it. Cheers, Arminden ( talk) 20:57, 18 January 2022 (UTC)
I have brought this up on many pages, with little result. A standard system, not to be applied blindly, but as a source of reference, is needed. There are Jordanian lists of toponyms, I have once seen partial ones prepared by the Department of Antiquities, but they're not online – and I don't know if they've been worked through to a final form. Here a few options.
Ritter also mentions three other widely used standards, but I lack the time to search for those too. They have been established and are used by:
Concrete example for this article: see the US gazetteer entries from p. 237. I have grouped together all variants leading to the same recommended spelling:
It's clear that we have two main places, North and South Shuna. Not clear to me where the gazetteer's Sh. Power Station, Bridge, and Tell are, nor if Shūnat Ibn 'Adwān coincides with one of the two, but this is secondary for now. Anyway, getamap.net states that "Shuneh Power Station is also known as Jisr ash Shunah, ... Shuna Bridge", in Irbid Province (so connected to North Shuna). I guess Shuna Bridge is over the King Abdallah Channel and the power station somewhere nearby - unless they are both actually relating to Rutenberg's power station (there are several bridges there), which would require for Baqura to be in the N Shuna District & Irbid Province, which is perfectly possible.
"The Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan (Archaeological Map) 1:250k, April 1978" (from here on JAM), Sheet 1, has a T[ell] esh-Shunah at what is now South Shuna, which is certain to be identical with our Tell esh-Shuneh. N.B.: there's also a Kh[irbet] esh-Shuneh at what is now North Shuna, certainly the initial nucleus of the current town there.
geographic.org 's page on Jordan (see here) looks mildly useful. Some of the pins are not very accurate, but can help in broad terms. Shuna Refugee Camp is shown at/just outside South Shuna. Shūnat Ibn 'Adwān has a pin in the middle of nowhere, next to some agricultural terraces near Hisban/Husban. Sh. Power Station has its pin in an agricultural field, but it's close to N. Shuna, in Irbid Province. Tall ash Shūnah is totally misplaced, downhill from Pella, but maybe it's not by chance that it's closer to N Shuna than to S Shuna.
EcoPeace Middle East. There is also a New Shuneh near S Shuna (see p. 62, left col.). They call Tell esh-Shuneh "Tell North Shuna", but "they" aren't focused on names, they're into really moving things in the real world ("Regional NGO Master Plan for Sustainable Development in the Jordan Valley. Final Report – June 2015").
The long-standing standard for reproducing long i sounds at the end of place-names is -iyeh or -iyyeh, which looks a bit over the top. The tendency (see OGS) is to now use a for e, so we get -iya(h).
CONCLUSION: I would suggest
both with the equally valid alternative version without an article (ash-) at the beginning, so
I would personally have preferred the old forms, with -iyeh, but that seems to be sooo 1999. We can consider when to use which form for the article's title, and create redirects for those left out. Arminden ( talk) 01:35, 22 January 2022 (UTC)
References
North Shunais in (very) wide use, use that and only transliterate once in the lead and once in the etymology section, strictly:
al-Shūna al-Shamāliyya. If North Shuna is not in wide use, use the basic transcription
al-Shuna al-Shamaliyya, with the strict transliteration at first mention in the lead. ☿ Apaugasma ( talk ☉) 11:05, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
Thanks to Loew now we have an article on South Shuna, too. There the article used is ash, here it's al – shouldn't we decide for one? There is an article (DAB, but with explanation in the lead) for ash-shamaliyah and I have updated the one on al-janubiyah. Arminden ( talk) 11:25, 23 January 2022 (UTC)
I agree that the manual of style should be followed. I even amended it since it was confusing or had multiple styles mixed without labeling.
I've always supported the following practice:
Thanks. ---- Mahmudmasri ( talk) 15:18, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
? Arminden ( talk) 20:16, 26 January 2022 (UTC)
This article has not yet been rated on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||
|
Shuneh el-Janubiyeh is mentioned by M. Piccirillo, for instance here, and by others. It would be welcome.
Is it the "Shunet Nimrin" from WWI? See Second Transjordan attack on Shunet Nimrin and Es Salt. If so, then after the creation of the article, Shunet Nimrin, wherever it occurs, must be linked to it. Cheers, Arminden ( talk) 20:57, 18 January 2022 (UTC)
I have brought this up on many pages, with little result. A standard system, not to be applied blindly, but as a source of reference, is needed. There are Jordanian lists of toponyms, I have once seen partial ones prepared by the Department of Antiquities, but they're not online – and I don't know if they've been worked through to a final form. Here a few options.
Ritter also mentions three other widely used standards, but I lack the time to search for those too. They have been established and are used by:
Concrete example for this article: see the US gazetteer entries from p. 237. I have grouped together all variants leading to the same recommended spelling:
It's clear that we have two main places, North and South Shuna. Not clear to me where the gazetteer's Sh. Power Station, Bridge, and Tell are, nor if Shūnat Ibn 'Adwān coincides with one of the two, but this is secondary for now. Anyway, getamap.net states that "Shuneh Power Station is also known as Jisr ash Shunah, ... Shuna Bridge", in Irbid Province (so connected to North Shuna). I guess Shuna Bridge is over the King Abdallah Channel and the power station somewhere nearby - unless they are both actually relating to Rutenberg's power station (there are several bridges there), which would require for Baqura to be in the N Shuna District & Irbid Province, which is perfectly possible.
"The Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan (Archaeological Map) 1:250k, April 1978" (from here on JAM), Sheet 1, has a T[ell] esh-Shunah at what is now South Shuna, which is certain to be identical with our Tell esh-Shuneh. N.B.: there's also a Kh[irbet] esh-Shuneh at what is now North Shuna, certainly the initial nucleus of the current town there.
geographic.org 's page on Jordan (see here) looks mildly useful. Some of the pins are not very accurate, but can help in broad terms. Shuna Refugee Camp is shown at/just outside South Shuna. Shūnat Ibn 'Adwān has a pin in the middle of nowhere, next to some agricultural terraces near Hisban/Husban. Sh. Power Station has its pin in an agricultural field, but it's close to N. Shuna, in Irbid Province. Tall ash Shūnah is totally misplaced, downhill from Pella, but maybe it's not by chance that it's closer to N Shuna than to S Shuna.
EcoPeace Middle East. There is also a New Shuneh near S Shuna (see p. 62, left col.). They call Tell esh-Shuneh "Tell North Shuna", but "they" aren't focused on names, they're into really moving things in the real world ("Regional NGO Master Plan for Sustainable Development in the Jordan Valley. Final Report – June 2015").
The long-standing standard for reproducing long i sounds at the end of place-names is -iyeh or -iyyeh, which looks a bit over the top. The tendency (see OGS) is to now use a for e, so we get -iya(h).
CONCLUSION: I would suggest
both with the equally valid alternative version without an article (ash-) at the beginning, so
I would personally have preferred the old forms, with -iyeh, but that seems to be sooo 1999. We can consider when to use which form for the article's title, and create redirects for those left out. Arminden ( talk) 01:35, 22 January 2022 (UTC)
References
North Shunais in (very) wide use, use that and only transliterate once in the lead and once in the etymology section, strictly:
al-Shūna al-Shamāliyya. If North Shuna is not in wide use, use the basic transcription
al-Shuna al-Shamaliyya, with the strict transliteration at first mention in the lead. ☿ Apaugasma ( talk ☉) 11:05, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
Thanks to Loew now we have an article on South Shuna, too. There the article used is ash, here it's al – shouldn't we decide for one? There is an article (DAB, but with explanation in the lead) for ash-shamaliyah and I have updated the one on al-janubiyah. Arminden ( talk) 11:25, 23 January 2022 (UTC)
I agree that the manual of style should be followed. I even amended it since it was confusing or had multiple styles mixed without labeling.
I've always supported the following practice:
Thanks. ---- Mahmudmasri ( talk) 15:18, 24 January 2022 (UTC)
? Arminden ( talk) 20:16, 26 January 2022 (UTC)