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Does anyone notice in this section involving Itachi Uchiha that it says Main article: Itachi Uchiha but the the links just directs us to Itachi's Akatsuki page and not his main page with the plot overviw and stuff. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.121.42.181 ( talk) 00:32, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
If it makes you feel any better, Mhart, I think I'm above you. It has something to do with you thinking that Madara cannot possibly be Tobi and that "you're right and we're all wrong". Speak Qwerty 07:16, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
That was a joke, didnt you see the giant star i gave TheUltimate3. I did it too see if admins could revert more then 3 times. since no dam admins would tell me. you sound tough for someone who has only been here for 2 days. dont start with me!-- Mhart54com 10:30, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
I suggest something be put in about how it almost seems that Itachi still likes his brother as seen in chapter 146 and after Kisame thinks Sasuke is dead he describes Itachi as looking like hes crying about it in issue 364. —Preceding unsigned comment added by OOMYK007 ( talk • contribs) 04:56, 5 September 2007 (UTC)
Ok first of all, will everybody stop the personal attacks, I dont think we should add the thing about Itachi crying and we don't know is he was-- Blue-Eyes Gold Dragon 07:44, 5 September 2007 (UTC)
How about adding to his article about how pretty much everything Itachi has done has been the driving force behind almost all of Sauske's actions in the show. Or his encounter with Orochimaru which caused Orochimaru's defection and in turn desire for Sauske's sharingan? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.124.139.205 ( talk) 16:33, 5 September 2007 (UTC)
Nah Orochimaru left Akatsuki because he tried to take over Itachi's body while they were both in Akatsuki and Itachi took his hand for it it's been explained in the manga and even the show. I also don't think someone should have to by happenstance be forced to read about something intimate between 2 separate characters via 1 characters info/page/view —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.124.139.205 ( talk) 17:20, 5 September 2007 (UTC)
Also the relationship between Sauske and Itachi is highly relevant to the manga/show their characters and the characters around sauske in particular. Itachi is a very important character with plenty of information regarding him and his actions thus far to downplay his importance in a manner to insinuate that he doesn't need and is undeserving of his own page is sad. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.124.139.205 ( talk) 17:30, 5 September 2007 (UTC)
If Itachi's personal article still exists in its "History" form, then may I please view it? Kageryushin 19:18, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
In ch. 369, it shows Pein going to sleep, opening six giant canisters, and waking up again. After that, you see six people emerge from the canisters, but you can't see their faces. The pictures were a little blurry, but I think those six people were wearing Akatsuki cloaks! It was a cloak that looked exactly like Akatsuki cloaks (yes, they were black). I'm not positive if it had red clouds on it or not, but it looked like it. Anyway, it's got something covering those cloaks. Even though I couldn't see the faces, I think one of them was Kakuzu. Who knows? Therefore, Pein is either recruiting new Akatsuki members, resurrecting deceased Akatsuki members (Deidara, Sasori, Hidan, Kakuzu, Orochimaru, and an unknown), or he could just be using completely new ninja to do his bidding. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.181.50.107 ( talk) 22:48, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
From what i have seen recently about pein calling jairiya sensei, does anybody think he and Konan might be his other two genin he taught with the fourth. because the other two genin partners are not mentioned and they could have moved to another village. Pein could have went from konoha and started a civil war in the land rain to get control of a village. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.179.163.157 ( talk) 23:30, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
On Pein's section, it says that Pein is switching into six different bodies. Is this true?
no right now alll we know is that akatsuki is doing sumtin with bodies one looked odly like kakuzu and the other big one cold be deidara since he did explode he might be just deflating or sumtin but we have to wait till next week to find out —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
209.159.197.82 (
talk)
03:35, 8 September 2007 (UTC)
Can anyone tell the meaning of the words in front of the bodies? Enoch08 05:07, 8 September 2007 (UTC)
There is still no information about the bodies. You're going to have to wait another week. I think it's worthy to mention though, that the eyes were NOT normal. Pein went to sleep, and presumably woke up in another body, but he still had the spiral eyes. There is nobody left in Akatsuki that matches those bodies, either. Zetsu's body only gets bigger around the neck, not the gut, and Sasori doesn't even look human in puppet form. It's just a collection of bodies (probably of legendary ninja, but maybe not). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 149.152.121.199 ( talk) 04:28, 13 September 2007 (UTC)
No Sasuke DOES NOT have mangekyou sharingan, go read the manga or watch the anime again. I made a post about this on a forum, and after extensive answers, it's been confirmed that he DOES NOT possess it. Period. Note that the section on his three-bladed sharingan has been removed from your linked website; check it out. It was probably a blurred picture or a deluded anime watcher, but it probably stayed on the website because no one monitored that page. Anyway, the bodies seem to just be multiple bodies for Pein to use himself, meaning that they are NOT akatsuki members (until pein enters them i guess. Just because they were wearing the cloaks doesn't mean they were any of the members we knew. Its just so he has his normal clothes on for everyday purposes. We should just give them a mention and wait for further information as to what they really are. 60.52.125.108 07:57, 13 September 2007 (UTC)
Are you certain of this? Because this wasn't the only site where I have seen this image. I'm admittedly bothered by this, but I got to wonder about it. -- Chipmonk32817 September 2007 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.128.107.129 ( talk) 05:08, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
Quite sure. Unless someone can find a non-altered, canonical and non-fan-made picture somewhere to prove this (or find an anime screenshot), then it stands that sasuke DOES NOT have MS. Also, he did mention how he was going to "attain power his own way" and not by following itachi's will( that is, to kill his best friend to get MS). So unless further proof turns up, or future chapters verify this, I say it's not possible. Thousands of manga readers and anime watchers do not remember seeing this. Like i said, its probably a hoax or something. N Dot W 02:47, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
the mangekyou sharingan doesnt matter to me but just because thats what you think those bodies were doesnt mean thats what they are, after all, everyone thought we'd know who the al was...turns out it was some random guy living in the rain village. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Threatening force ( talk • contribs) 02:59, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
Most of you remember that Pein has used the ability to use the bodies of subordinates in order to create "clones" of akatsuki members. Now, it could be fallen akatsuki members that Pein has in those chambers, but I believe that he has used a jutsu on other subordinates to provide himself with vessels. Think about it. Some members of akatsuki appear to have found different ways of extending their lives. Orochimaru, Sasori, Kakazu, Hidan, and Tobi, have all shown that they have indeed lived longer than usual. This could be Pein's method of longer life. —Preceding unsigned comment added by RogueFox ( talk • contribs) 16:38, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
Hmm... About the MS. While I know Sasuke doesn't have it yet, I would like to point out that it's quite impossible for Itachi's specific method to gain the Mangekyo to be the true method. As mentioned elsewhere, Kakashi's Mangekyo was formed some time after everyone he could have called "best friend" had died. 82.34.123.164 07:52, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
Someone ought to change the part on Pein's article that we have never seen him in combat. As of 373 we have.
Can someone add that Pein shares a remarkable resemblence to Naruto?
Maybe he's a ressurected Nawaki or Naruto's long lost brother of some sort. just some suggestions
Me too I think they were the other two genin with the fourth and they left. Pein left to maybe start the civil war and to fight one of the stongest ninja. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.179.163.157 ( talk) 23:34, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Apparently, Pein is the other student of Jiraiya along with Konan. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.236.250.188 ( talk) 00:32, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
Pein, along with Konan, are revealed to have been orphans from Rain taken in by Jiraiya. His name is Nagato. obf213
At this point, we don't know exactly if Pein was Nagato or Yahiko. He bears resemblance to Yahiko, but has the eyes of Nagato. Perhaps his original body is that of Nagato, and that one of his six is Yahiko. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.114.99.15 ( talk) 21:57, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
are we sure that pein is the leader of akatsuki???
Yes, Pein is the Akatsuki "leader," but he takes orders from Tobi/Madara for some reason. In chapter 373, we find out that Pein's eye technique is called Rinnegan, which is supposed to be the most powerful of all three eye jutsu. Someone might wanna add that.
Not Rin'negan, just Rinnegan. They are not the "cause" of an eye technique, they are an eye technique, a Kekkei Genkai, similar to Sharingan and Byakugan. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Muramasa itachi ( talk • contribs) 03:02, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
The Akatsuki page states that Tobi is Madara Uchiha, while Tobi simply states in Chapter 364, page 18 that his power and Madara's are one and the same, i.e. "My power, Madara's power". It is a strong possibility that Tobi may simply be working for Madara or acting as a conduit for him, but regardless there is no conclusive evidence that the two characters are one and the same. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Alwayssummerdays ( talk • contribs) 19:09, 9 September 2007 (UTC) Traditional Japanese speach commonly speaks in the third person in which case, Tobi was referring to himself and Uchiha Madara. that and kishimoto wanted to reveal his identity with crazy climax and that was how he chose to do it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.111.232.107 ( talk) 20:34, 9 September 2007 (UTC)
Where to begin. First of all, he looks nothing like an older-looking Sasuke to me. He looks, if anything, somewhat-similar to Curse-Seal Stage 2 Sasuke. It never said he was defeated by the fourth. It said he was defeated by the FIRST. There was no mention of any discrepancy, and there was no laughing when he was standing on the statue. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.99.127.210 ( talk) 23:05, 14 September 2007 (UTC)
the manga states that madara uchiha was DEFEATED not killed by the first hokage. Also if people dont believe that tobi is madara, 1. itachi wiped out all known uchiha members, 2. kakuzu was able to fight the 1st hokage and lived so why cant someone else. My friend says that it could possibly be obito uchiha, because: 1. obito gave kakashi his left eye, while tobi's mask only reveals his right eye. 2.the pins in tobi's arms could be medical pins to heal his crushed arms. 3. obito and tobi (the names) look similar. 4. obito was like naruto as a kid and still retains his goofiness. -tavaresiroc
Not the Tobi is Obito theory again. Why can't you theory-makers just shut up and wait and see what Kishimoto reveals? Anyway, back to the main issue. Tobi never does say he is Madara. He simply states that he has the power of Uchiha Madara, and then they do a close up on his Sharingan. This leads us to believe the Sharingan in the power of Madara, which makes sense, considering Madara was supposed to have founded the Uchiha Clan. On top of that, Madara would be somewhere between 92-112 in the current arc, and not even Sandaime could move in the ways Tobi does. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.116.185.196 ( talk) 01:28, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
You know, intellect ninja had a good point. this is not a forum, and should not be treated as such. i will also make sure i keep this in mind for the future. we should not discuss such issues as "theory" on this page. the main topics that should be discussed are discrepency in "FACTS", and not matters of opinion. the only facts we have are that tobi said, " my power, uchiha madara's power" which means tobi is madara. also, it is quite possible for madara to be alive still due to the fact that there are several members of akatsuki that have found ways to extend there lives. this has not been shown to be the case with tobi, so, the only thing we can do is wait and see what actually happens, rather than speculate and make theories. —Preceding unsigned comment added by RogueFox ( talk • contribs) 18:58, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
Although this falls under the lines of theory too he might have been talking about Uchiha Madara's power over the nine tails as seen with sasuke in naruto's mind and to which jiraiya adds his own theory in the recents chapter. Anyway the point is it is also a theory that he is uchiha madara since although kazuku survived is encounter with the First he has had quite a longer lifespan than we've heard from any ohter character and I could state another dozen of reason why it is unlikely however since it is a theory it should be stated as such just like it was when people put up the theory that he was obito(which is far more likely than madara but thats my opinion) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.82.97.16 ( talk) 23:11, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
Definitely one of the wierder plot twists here. Tobi's personality completely changes as Madara, but as of now all we know is that he is at the very least a reincarnation(?) of Madara. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Muramasa itachi ( talk • contribs) 23:27, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
it was said that in chapter 369 page 7 that Pein's blood was from the Fuuma clan. I just wanted to let you know that and that Remnants of the former Amegakure were searching for Pein and trying to kill him. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Temari y ( talk • contribs) 22:02, 9 September 2007 (UTC)
The "rumor" that Pein is from the Fuma clan is canon. If it is said in the manga, then that is what should be considered canon. And no, fillers do not count, and should not count. Also, since it is "rumored" and has not been proven yet, I don't feel it should be included in Pein's description. But now we know pein isn't his original name in chapter 372 but a name he took after he spent time with jiraiya since even he didn't know who he was and ask konan"So which of the two is Pein?" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.82.97.16 ( talk) 23:15, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
The Fuma clan appeared in the first filler arc as a clan Orochimaru supposedly wiped out. They seemed to be described in the same manner as Pein, so I'm glad that arc is being taken as canon. Again, the Fuma bloodline limit (Kekkei Genkai) appears to be Rinnegan; check above for that. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Muramasa itachi ( talk • contribs) 23:39, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
You read the headline, so you know what I want done.
All over on Wikipedia it keeps saying that he's Madara Uchiha. HE'S NOT!! They've shown a real picture of madara, and that's not him, obviously.
I know that in the manga he says "He has Uchiha Madara's power... my power..." but what he actually means is that he has the SAME power as Sasuke, he is NOT saying that he is Madara.
So SOMEONE needs to get on there and change that! please —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.149.22.27 ( talk) 01:06, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
Alright, I'll clear this up for the people who are clueless as to Japanese. I am no expert, but I am taking the JLPT and I have studied Japanese and act as an amateur translator. What Tobi says exactly is:「写輪眼の本当の力が・・・このうちはマダラの力が 」Which in roumaji transliterates to "Sharingan no hontou no chikara ga...kono Uchiha Madara no chikara ga." Which in English literally means: "The Sharingan's true power...this/that, Uchiha Madara's power." Now, I and other amateur translators suggested on the forums where this Japanese was discussed that it meant he was referring to the "power of Uchiha Madara" which meant the Sharingan or something like that. However, expert translators and native Japanese have said that the "kono" which is usually used as a demonstrative adjective for "this/that (object)" is used sort of as a pronoun in reference to himself (a supervillain way, some translators said as when Zabuza said "Kono Momochi Zabuza" to refer to say "I am Momochi Zabuza") and his power. And the translation has been looked at over and over again by experts in Japanese and that seems to be the general consensus. So, wisen up and accept the translation! The great kawa 01:47, 28 July 2007 (UTC)
And after my fourth edit conflict with SineBot today, I end up EdConning with Someguy... Thanks... You Can ' t Review Me!!! 01:10, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
Tobi may claim he is Madara but keep in mind it still doesn't confirm the fact that he actually is Madara. Tobi is revealed to be a goofy person so maybe he could be lying and just like to refer himself to someone of great power. Enoch08 08:24, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
What do you mean he's not obito? zetsu refers to him as young. And who's not to say obito's still alive? Unlike madara, obito's only supposed to be in his late 20's. And the stitches in his arms are probably there because of his wounded body. Not to mention that there could still be some hidden underneath his akatsuki cloak. —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
98.192.183.207 (
talk)
04:18, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
in my opinion tobi's identity is still unsure apart from one page they've yet to use the name madara in association with tobi i mean until its known for sure you shouldnt go around claiming its the truth i mean some people (myself excluded) actually use this site to confirm facts so isnt the whole point of wikipedia to make sure that the information is 100% accurate before putting it up - Xeogen
But how could he be Madara? It even says that Tobi is young in the article. Madara's the founder of the Uchiha Clan, isn't he? So he ought to be pretty old. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.199.93.79 ( talk) 17:42, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
I can't believe this poll is here twice but here goes first if you want the whole unlikely madara version read the comments put on the first poll,secondly sorry for you Someguy0830 but the fourth is naruto's father and finaly the tobi being uchiha madara is a theory just like tobi being obito and should be both stated and stated as theories —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.82.97.16 ( talk) 23:22, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
I found a blurry summary of ch. 371. I think it says that Jiraiya encounters Deidara. But I'm not 100% certain. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.181.53.37 ( talk) 10:58, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
No. You saw Jiraiya run into Konan.-DylanUchiha 6:53 EST 21 September 2007
Pein's new look greatly resembles Deidara. Check him out! Plus, Pein and Konan are revealed to be former students of Jiraiya (If what I read was correct. Kanji is difficult). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.204.100.226 ( talk) 16:57, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
I wish I could post a picture of Pein's new look. Unfortunately, I can't. One more thing: Doesn't Pein resemble Naruto or Deidara in any way? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.181.53.37 ( talk) 00:19, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
http://bp1.blogger.com/_VkIbHKDK5Dg/RvFxZGtSuaI/AAAAAAAAA0U/aroAgMQv4vY/s1600-h/Naruto+371.jpg http://bp3.blogger.com/_VkIbHKDK5Dg/RvFxPmtSuZI/AAAAAAAAA0M/r2aaV3fUf04/s1600-h/Naruto+371+Naruto+371.jpg
the second one looks nothing like deidera, and i doubt theyd be his student, i mean we just found out for sure that naruto is minatos son, i dont think theyll throw something else big at us for like another 3 yrs lol. but if they did suddenly start revealing crap, people might stop reading and lose interest. whats next, konan is kushina but with dyed hair..... Threatening force 03:12, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
Tobi and Sasuke survived. Why not Deidara? He might've had more tricks up his sleeve. Or he might've blown up another clone. I'm not saying Deidara IS alive, but I thought it was best to at least look into this. Why would Kishimoto make Pein's second body resemble Deidara so much? Is he running out of character looks? Then again, just a thought. One more thing: I'm still curious about what Pein's other forms look like. Was it four more, or five more? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.181.53.37 ( talk) 22:36, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
I'm thinking Pein cloned himself as Diedra, & that the original Pein isn't really the original Pein, just another clone. Sort of like a Sasori thing. 2:25 Sept. 21
I think that there should be pictures of the members and the pictureof the latest face of pein or all the faces —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.201.23.162 ( talk) 01:47, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
what do you mean?
why not? theres pics in naruto and the others —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.62.206.250 ( talk) 22:21, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
Will somebody please fix the article. The in universe banner is still there and hasn't moved once. This is because you're using tenses, implying that earlier in the series was at an earlier time, which it wasn't it was simply earlier in teh series. Somebody has to clean this up by removing 1) the membership status from each character entry. 2) the categories 'current members' and 'former members' and add 'original members' and 'changes to the Akatsuki roster' or something to that effect. Just because a character dies in chapter 360-something doesn't mean that the character is dead because the character still exists in chapter 340-something. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.142.130.31 ( talk) 15:21, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
What you don't seem to understand is that there is no "original ten" members. There was never a period when there were ten members at once, and there never will be. And just so you know, the in-universe template was added a long time ago, not recently, and back then we listed the member's eye colors, blood type, jutsu, specific traits, and a bunch of other things that were clearly in-universe, and we also refered to the Naruto world in an in-universe way ("world domination" over "domination of the Naruto world", for example), so the template is now questionable. Either way, the way we list members now is better than the one you thought of right now. Don't be discouraged, however, I'm sure you'll think of a different one. Artist Formerly Known As Whocares 19:06, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
Konan is jairyas former student but with dyed hair —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.187.163.8 ( talk) 19:53, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
http://bp0.blogger.com/_VkIbHKDK5Dg/RvPZvWaifDI/AAAAAAAAA0s/w21ySDC6XpA/s1600-h/Naruto+371+Spoiler+Pics+and+Summaries+04.jpg http://bp3.blogger.com/_VkIbHKDK5Dg/RvPZkGaifCI/AAAAAAAAA0k/LhdZwI3sIsQ/s1600-h/Naruto+371+Spoiler+Pics+and+Summaries+05.jpg
once again, this is not a forum, and should not be treated as such. until konan is revealed to be jirya's former student, it should not be discussed on this page. stick to discussing the facts, and the subject matter that should be included in descriptions of characters. —Preceding unsigned comment added by RogueFox ( talk • contribs) 19:06, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
The following page has an english translation of Chapter 371 66.24.226.134 00:46, 22 September 2007 (UTC) http://www.msnusers.com/NarutoMangaReturns/narutochapter371english.msnw
Shouldn't we give any info about his new form? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.181.53.37 ( talk) 01:13, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
What are yu talking about? The new chapter already is out! It came out in Japan on Wednesday! I read and looked at it with my own eyes! Pein's new body, him and Konan being Jiraiya's students, it said it all! This is fact! Not speculation! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.181.53.37 ( talk) 20:16, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
I suppose that makes sense. Very well. I'll wait for a subbed version to come out. Sorry. It's just, I can read Japanese. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.181.53.37 ( talk) 20:28, 21 September 2007 (UTC) ]
Pein:
Tobi:
Itachi:
Konan:
that's a nice speculation about pain and itachi but we do not do speculation and tobi was saying he was madara it is just hard to put it in japanese to english and it is hinted that —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.118.111.74 ( talk) 02:07, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
We know that Pein refers to Jiraiya as "sensei", and we know that Jiraiya has known Konan since she was young. Other things can be assumed, but they are not WP:V. – Gunslinger47 05:02, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Why cant people say what they want on a discussions board. he was just pointing it out to see what other people think it is not on the actual pein page. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.179.163.157 ( talk) 05:06, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
It is an opinion, and sounds a bit unprofessional. -- Vehgah 01:07, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
In chapter 371, pain mentions that he has no love for his old teacher, Jiraiya. Isn't this means that one of the 2 unknown genins in Jiraiya's first team is Pein? Bence560 06:17, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
what? What does that have to do with pein or jiraiya? you, sir, make no sense! nut then again, this wiki is full of lies, as they remove a lot of things or cover up stuff revealed in the chapters. I also noticed a lot of missing info that used to be there. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.95.51.48 ( talk) 12:43, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
Maybe Pein and Konan were Minatos teammates back when he whas a genin —Preceding unsigned comment added by 189.171.83.99 ( talk) 13:58, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
His comment made perfect sense. He was illustrating that Pein and Jiraiya could have had a teacher-student relationship without necessarily being on the same team, using Naruto and Iruka as an example. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Zevin64 ( talk • contribs) 15:01, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
sorry, I misread that. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.95.51.48 ( talk) 00:04, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
Wait, he only said, "I hold no more love for him." He didn't say anything about a student/teacher relaionship. Plus, remember that he's a Rain ninja. Although there's a very good chance now that Konan was Minato's teammate. (Hamstergirl591 21:42, 23 September 2007 (UTC)) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Hamstergirl591 ( talk • contribs)
Aoi from the fillers is a Rain ninja, yet was a Leaf ninja. Same concept here. — Someguy0830 ( T | C) 21:54, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
Fillers don't count. And as to the main point, it was said in chapter 372 that Jiraiya, Konan, a boy named Yahiko, and and another boy named Nagato(who's eyes at the end of the chapter are shown to be Pein's, But it is still speculation that this boy is infact Pein), had a teacher-student-like relationship and refer to him as sensei when Jiraiya and the other Sanin where in the Rain Village. It is not known if Pein and Konan leave the Rain village and go to the Leaf Village at this point. -Zasukesan —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.246.59.17 ( talk) 03:45, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
Just something to take in mind, every time you talk about Pein piercings you refer to them as "face-piercings" or "piercings in his face". You should note that they are not just in his face, at least in the first body he shown he also had piercings in the lower parts of his arms (seen in his first appearance, he enters the room grabbing the frame of the entrance and the sleeve of his cloak lowers a bit, revealing the piercing. Also seen when dispelling the "rain jutsu", the sleeves moves and you can see them in both arms this time). Piercings along his body could be more accurate. 22 September '07 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.224.60.72 ( talk) 10:42, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
Chapter 371, page 12 first vignette. In this aerial perspective of Pain you can see piercings around his collarbone. Is that's enough to remove "face"? 29 September '07 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.224.60.72 ( talk)
The article on Pein is based on a character whose name isn't Pein and who uses clones to move around for what we should care is finding out his identity and write his article based on it, not on a clone body, his piercings and appearance are irrelevant info that make the page longer unnecessarily. 66.50.153.104 16:22, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
does any of the other akutsiki know everything about Pein and his past? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 4.242.126.228 ( talk) 16:13, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
well someone told me pein was a girl? i hope thats not true cuz he's really cute
He's not a girl, and you have awful grammar! I found 6 mistakes. 71.200.36.214 21:47, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
PEIN AND KONAN COULD HAVE BEEN OLD TAEMMATES OF THE FOURTH TURNED TRAITORS.
IT MAKES SENSE SINCE THEY TALK THE WAY THEY DO ABOUT JARAIYA, HAVE INCREDIBLE ABILITIES AS NINJA, AND ARE WELL AWARE OF KONOHA'S TRADITIONS —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.145.229.171 ( talk) 01:59, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
your wrong they were rain village kids Jairiya looked after when their parents were killed in a the war. he watched them and one other for a while. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.179.163.157 ( talk) 05:11, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
I think Konan is the girl on team that the Fourth was on under Jiraya. The girl in the picture looks like Konan. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/91/Jiraiyageninteam.jpg —Preceding unsigned comment added by Icyfire221 ( talk • contribs) 02:47, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
And this is not meant to be a forum question, but a "Did I miss them explaining this?":
Tobi is from Konoha. Being Madara or not, the Sharingan is proof enough. Only Uchiha members have Sharingan. And all Uchiha members hail from Konoha. 71.168.85.188 22:02, 27 September 2007 (UTC)Fantasy Leader
what if tobi took madara's sharingan. kinda how kakashi got his from obitos. This could explain how tobi said "this power, madara's power"- not direct quote. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.179.163.157 ( talk) 05:14, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
This webpage has (appearently legitimate) scans from chapter 372. http://naruto-xx.blogspot.com/2007/09/spoiler-pics-naruto-372.html 66.24.231.57 19:22, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
all the Characters of akatsuki should each have their own main articles like Orochimaru and alot of other Naruto characters because we can read about their personality, history, abiltis and so forth.
From what I've read of 372, this is what is known:
Konan can grow wings from her paper, cannot fold them when wet, can shoot the feathers like bullets in a paper air-plane shape, and is Pein's apparent messegner, earning the nickname "God's Angel", god being Pein.
All three are refugees from Rain, where their parents were killed in a war (apparently the one Obito died in, too). They find the Sannin, and get food. The three ask for training, though Orochimaru suggests killing them instead, since their life will only suffer. Jiraiya instead sends Orochimaru and Tsunade off and lives with them in a hut, where they have dinner and discuss the war. Nagato remembers how this reminds him of his real family and begins to cry. Yahiko also appears defensive of Rain, wanting to stop the "crying rain" (he compares the constant rain to tears) and protect the people. The next day, however, Nagato and Yahiko go missing, and when Jiraiya and Konan find them, and Yahiko explains that a Stone Chunin tried to take their money (or that of other refugees), and Nagato killed him. Jiraiya looks at Nagato, and suddenly Pein's eyes are his. Jiraiya also hints those eyes have a major purpose, asking if he could be...?.
Interestingly, Pein is actually Nagato, rather than Yahiko as first suspected. Yahiko has blond hair and looks alot like Pein. Nagato has black hair that usually covers his eyes. Artist Formerly Known As Whocares 01:16, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
Shouldn't we wait until it's confirmed which one of those two kids really was Pein? Nagato may have Pein's eyes, but Yahiko shares what seems to be the same ideals Pein operates by (changing the way Amegakure is run, etc). I think it would be safer to wait it out rather than to base everything on his eyes. The Splendiferous Gegiford 02:31, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
Ever seen a raw -_- -- Blue-Eyes Gold Dragon 07:58, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
I'll first like to point out a speculative point concerning Pain before I actually get into the factual stuff.
The body we all know Pein from, the one we first saw him in, isn't his real body. I think, from the look of everything we have seen, that Nagato (aka Pain) is merely using Yahiko's body. That would explain both why the "default" body of Pain is identical in hairstyle and facial structure as Yahiko and it would also explain why he would presumably use it when contacting the Akatsuki - what better way of keeping your identity unknown than to use someone-else's body? In addition, I would assume that Nagato is actually fulfilling Yahiko's dream for him - controlling the rain, and making everyone pay for what they did. He did crush Amegakure on his own, remember?
Anyway... The proposed updates.
Konan and Pain were not students under Jiraiya. During his time in Amegakure, he merely taught them how to survive. From what we currently know, the jutsu he taught them was no more than mere survival-enabling jutsu (such as a fishing technique and how to cook food with a single fire jutsu).
Pain's "default" body appears to be a lot like what Yahiko's would have grown up to be. Whether this means that Pain IS Yahiko is debateble, given his tendancy to not stick to a single body. His second body, however, is still unknown and should not be mentioned outside of the aforementioned tendancy.
While Yahiko is the leader of the group, it is evident that Nagato is the strongest. As noted by Jiraiya at the time, he managed to kill a Chuunin on his own without any combat experience AND we know now that Jiraiya showed fear upon seeing those eyes. This heavily points to Nagato being Pain, beyond having the same eyes, as he is well-known for being stronger than the 3 Sannin put together during their prime.
Jiraiya, against the wishes of the other two Sannin during the mission, stayed with the three children. It is quite evident that neither Orichamaru or Tsunade felt this was a good idea - Konan even points out that her and Pain are only alive because of Jiraiya (hence why they both still call him Teacher). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.34.123.164 ( talk) 08:29, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
Another thing is whether Pein is "Pein" or "Pain". I would assume it would be "Pain", as Yahiko's ideal. George Leung 18:06, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
So can somebody get rid of the machine thing because it is not known of yet it is still speculation so please change it —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.118.116.168 ( talk) 22:28, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
On the manga I read, it's "Pain". So I would assume, in keeping with Yahiko's wish to inflict pain to everyone, that such a translation certainly makes sense. I also still think that there should be some mention of Pain's power in relation to Konan's comment about his strength - the fact that he killed a Chuunin as a child with little training IS an important fact in regards to his strength. 82.34.123.164 00:38, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
Maybe Pein Is Nagato and jacked Yahiko's body —Preceding unsigned comment added by Redsand182 ( talk • contribs) 04:30, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
Tobi's attitude isn't goofy anymore anyone who reads his text would imply that he still is. The moment he claimed obtaining Madara's power he gives orders and ponders on top of Madara's statue, this isn't what his article tells you. The text "After Deidara's death, Tobi is shown giving Pein, the leader of Akatsuki, orders, and he refers to himself as Madara Uchiha.[34]" should be placed at the end of his text along with his attitude changes, for the text to appear in a chronological manner. Another thing we don't know if he originates from Konohagakure. His name is not Uchiha, if it was then his article should be Tobi Uchiha and not simply Tobi or Madara Uchiha should be placed in the akatsuki page, and we know you don't have to be Uchiha to have sharingan and this is a fact (Kakashi), stating that he might be Uchiha and doing it the way it is written in the article is sloppy and it is original research. Lets wait patiently for the manga to explain. And that goes for every single character in the series. 66.50.153.104 16:16, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
Tobi Is Mandara Uchiha so he is one of the first uchihas in konahagakure as Jiraiya had mentioned 3-4 chapters ago —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.118.116.168 ( talk) 18:25, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
Then why don't we change his name to Madara Uchiha, you say a few chapters back Jiraiya metioned something (Jiraiya hasn't even seen Tobi)... why didn't you quote? He did mention a theory, his theory about the Nine Tails appearance having to do with Madara. Separate fact from original research. 66.50.153.104 02:10, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
Mysteriousness is part of the personality, what the article should follow is Membership, Personality and Plot or whatever is going on in the present, this is hard to tell with the current text. 66.50.153.104 01:11, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
Can someone take a look at Kabuto's information and restore the Plot info, cause it says nothing about him thats important or anything about whats presently going on and he is Orochimaru's only way to return to the series and that make him an important character, equally important as Orochimaru, maybe someone vandalized it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.50.153.104 ( talk) 16:30, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
There is a Chinese translation of Chapter 373 at http://naruto-xx.blogspot.com/ . Where the original Japanese version of the manga may be more convinent, it would seem that this could still be put to some use. 66.24.227.23 00:41, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
In chapter 373, It is revealed that Pain's bloodline limit is one of the "Three Legendary Doujutsu." His eyes are called Rinnegan. It means metempsychosis eye. The creator of all jutsu. One more thing: Konan originally hailed from Hidden Rain. 71.168.85.188 01:08, 5 October 2007 (UTC) Fantasy Leader
![]() | This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 5 | ← | Archive 9 | Archive 10 | Archive 11 | Archive 12 | Archive 13 | → | Archive 15 |
Does anyone notice in this section involving Itachi Uchiha that it says Main article: Itachi Uchiha but the the links just directs us to Itachi's Akatsuki page and not his main page with the plot overviw and stuff. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.121.42.181 ( talk) 00:32, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
If it makes you feel any better, Mhart, I think I'm above you. It has something to do with you thinking that Madara cannot possibly be Tobi and that "you're right and we're all wrong". Speak Qwerty 07:16, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
That was a joke, didnt you see the giant star i gave TheUltimate3. I did it too see if admins could revert more then 3 times. since no dam admins would tell me. you sound tough for someone who has only been here for 2 days. dont start with me!-- Mhart54com 10:30, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
I suggest something be put in about how it almost seems that Itachi still likes his brother as seen in chapter 146 and after Kisame thinks Sasuke is dead he describes Itachi as looking like hes crying about it in issue 364. —Preceding unsigned comment added by OOMYK007 ( talk • contribs) 04:56, 5 September 2007 (UTC)
Ok first of all, will everybody stop the personal attacks, I dont think we should add the thing about Itachi crying and we don't know is he was-- Blue-Eyes Gold Dragon 07:44, 5 September 2007 (UTC)
How about adding to his article about how pretty much everything Itachi has done has been the driving force behind almost all of Sauske's actions in the show. Or his encounter with Orochimaru which caused Orochimaru's defection and in turn desire for Sauske's sharingan? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.124.139.205 ( talk) 16:33, 5 September 2007 (UTC)
Nah Orochimaru left Akatsuki because he tried to take over Itachi's body while they were both in Akatsuki and Itachi took his hand for it it's been explained in the manga and even the show. I also don't think someone should have to by happenstance be forced to read about something intimate between 2 separate characters via 1 characters info/page/view —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.124.139.205 ( talk) 17:20, 5 September 2007 (UTC)
Also the relationship between Sauske and Itachi is highly relevant to the manga/show their characters and the characters around sauske in particular. Itachi is a very important character with plenty of information regarding him and his actions thus far to downplay his importance in a manner to insinuate that he doesn't need and is undeserving of his own page is sad. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.124.139.205 ( talk) 17:30, 5 September 2007 (UTC)
If Itachi's personal article still exists in its "History" form, then may I please view it? Kageryushin 19:18, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
In ch. 369, it shows Pein going to sleep, opening six giant canisters, and waking up again. After that, you see six people emerge from the canisters, but you can't see their faces. The pictures were a little blurry, but I think those six people were wearing Akatsuki cloaks! It was a cloak that looked exactly like Akatsuki cloaks (yes, they were black). I'm not positive if it had red clouds on it or not, but it looked like it. Anyway, it's got something covering those cloaks. Even though I couldn't see the faces, I think one of them was Kakuzu. Who knows? Therefore, Pein is either recruiting new Akatsuki members, resurrecting deceased Akatsuki members (Deidara, Sasori, Hidan, Kakuzu, Orochimaru, and an unknown), or he could just be using completely new ninja to do his bidding. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.181.50.107 ( talk) 22:48, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
From what i have seen recently about pein calling jairiya sensei, does anybody think he and Konan might be his other two genin he taught with the fourth. because the other two genin partners are not mentioned and they could have moved to another village. Pein could have went from konoha and started a civil war in the land rain to get control of a village. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.179.163.157 ( talk) 23:30, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
On Pein's section, it says that Pein is switching into six different bodies. Is this true?
no right now alll we know is that akatsuki is doing sumtin with bodies one looked odly like kakuzu and the other big one cold be deidara since he did explode he might be just deflating or sumtin but we have to wait till next week to find out —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
209.159.197.82 (
talk)
03:35, 8 September 2007 (UTC)
Can anyone tell the meaning of the words in front of the bodies? Enoch08 05:07, 8 September 2007 (UTC)
There is still no information about the bodies. You're going to have to wait another week. I think it's worthy to mention though, that the eyes were NOT normal. Pein went to sleep, and presumably woke up in another body, but he still had the spiral eyes. There is nobody left in Akatsuki that matches those bodies, either. Zetsu's body only gets bigger around the neck, not the gut, and Sasori doesn't even look human in puppet form. It's just a collection of bodies (probably of legendary ninja, but maybe not). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 149.152.121.199 ( talk) 04:28, 13 September 2007 (UTC)
No Sasuke DOES NOT have mangekyou sharingan, go read the manga or watch the anime again. I made a post about this on a forum, and after extensive answers, it's been confirmed that he DOES NOT possess it. Period. Note that the section on his three-bladed sharingan has been removed from your linked website; check it out. It was probably a blurred picture or a deluded anime watcher, but it probably stayed on the website because no one monitored that page. Anyway, the bodies seem to just be multiple bodies for Pein to use himself, meaning that they are NOT akatsuki members (until pein enters them i guess. Just because they were wearing the cloaks doesn't mean they were any of the members we knew. Its just so he has his normal clothes on for everyday purposes. We should just give them a mention and wait for further information as to what they really are. 60.52.125.108 07:57, 13 September 2007 (UTC)
Are you certain of this? Because this wasn't the only site where I have seen this image. I'm admittedly bothered by this, but I got to wonder about it. -- Chipmonk32817 September 2007 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.128.107.129 ( talk) 05:08, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
Quite sure. Unless someone can find a non-altered, canonical and non-fan-made picture somewhere to prove this (or find an anime screenshot), then it stands that sasuke DOES NOT have MS. Also, he did mention how he was going to "attain power his own way" and not by following itachi's will( that is, to kill his best friend to get MS). So unless further proof turns up, or future chapters verify this, I say it's not possible. Thousands of manga readers and anime watchers do not remember seeing this. Like i said, its probably a hoax or something. N Dot W 02:47, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
the mangekyou sharingan doesnt matter to me but just because thats what you think those bodies were doesnt mean thats what they are, after all, everyone thought we'd know who the al was...turns out it was some random guy living in the rain village. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Threatening force ( talk • contribs) 02:59, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
Most of you remember that Pein has used the ability to use the bodies of subordinates in order to create "clones" of akatsuki members. Now, it could be fallen akatsuki members that Pein has in those chambers, but I believe that he has used a jutsu on other subordinates to provide himself with vessels. Think about it. Some members of akatsuki appear to have found different ways of extending their lives. Orochimaru, Sasori, Kakazu, Hidan, and Tobi, have all shown that they have indeed lived longer than usual. This could be Pein's method of longer life. —Preceding unsigned comment added by RogueFox ( talk • contribs) 16:38, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
Hmm... About the MS. While I know Sasuke doesn't have it yet, I would like to point out that it's quite impossible for Itachi's specific method to gain the Mangekyo to be the true method. As mentioned elsewhere, Kakashi's Mangekyo was formed some time after everyone he could have called "best friend" had died. 82.34.123.164 07:52, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
Someone ought to change the part on Pein's article that we have never seen him in combat. As of 373 we have.
Can someone add that Pein shares a remarkable resemblence to Naruto?
Maybe he's a ressurected Nawaki or Naruto's long lost brother of some sort. just some suggestions
Me too I think they were the other two genin with the fourth and they left. Pein left to maybe start the civil war and to fight one of the stongest ninja. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.179.163.157 ( talk) 23:34, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Apparently, Pein is the other student of Jiraiya along with Konan. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.236.250.188 ( talk) 00:32, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
Pein, along with Konan, are revealed to have been orphans from Rain taken in by Jiraiya. His name is Nagato. obf213
At this point, we don't know exactly if Pein was Nagato or Yahiko. He bears resemblance to Yahiko, but has the eyes of Nagato. Perhaps his original body is that of Nagato, and that one of his six is Yahiko. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.114.99.15 ( talk) 21:57, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
are we sure that pein is the leader of akatsuki???
Yes, Pein is the Akatsuki "leader," but he takes orders from Tobi/Madara for some reason. In chapter 373, we find out that Pein's eye technique is called Rinnegan, which is supposed to be the most powerful of all three eye jutsu. Someone might wanna add that.
Not Rin'negan, just Rinnegan. They are not the "cause" of an eye technique, they are an eye technique, a Kekkei Genkai, similar to Sharingan and Byakugan. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Muramasa itachi ( talk • contribs) 03:02, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
The Akatsuki page states that Tobi is Madara Uchiha, while Tobi simply states in Chapter 364, page 18 that his power and Madara's are one and the same, i.e. "My power, Madara's power". It is a strong possibility that Tobi may simply be working for Madara or acting as a conduit for him, but regardless there is no conclusive evidence that the two characters are one and the same. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Alwayssummerdays ( talk • contribs) 19:09, 9 September 2007 (UTC) Traditional Japanese speach commonly speaks in the third person in which case, Tobi was referring to himself and Uchiha Madara. that and kishimoto wanted to reveal his identity with crazy climax and that was how he chose to do it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.111.232.107 ( talk) 20:34, 9 September 2007 (UTC)
Where to begin. First of all, he looks nothing like an older-looking Sasuke to me. He looks, if anything, somewhat-similar to Curse-Seal Stage 2 Sasuke. It never said he was defeated by the fourth. It said he was defeated by the FIRST. There was no mention of any discrepancy, and there was no laughing when he was standing on the statue. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.99.127.210 ( talk) 23:05, 14 September 2007 (UTC)
the manga states that madara uchiha was DEFEATED not killed by the first hokage. Also if people dont believe that tobi is madara, 1. itachi wiped out all known uchiha members, 2. kakuzu was able to fight the 1st hokage and lived so why cant someone else. My friend says that it could possibly be obito uchiha, because: 1. obito gave kakashi his left eye, while tobi's mask only reveals his right eye. 2.the pins in tobi's arms could be medical pins to heal his crushed arms. 3. obito and tobi (the names) look similar. 4. obito was like naruto as a kid and still retains his goofiness. -tavaresiroc
Not the Tobi is Obito theory again. Why can't you theory-makers just shut up and wait and see what Kishimoto reveals? Anyway, back to the main issue. Tobi never does say he is Madara. He simply states that he has the power of Uchiha Madara, and then they do a close up on his Sharingan. This leads us to believe the Sharingan in the power of Madara, which makes sense, considering Madara was supposed to have founded the Uchiha Clan. On top of that, Madara would be somewhere between 92-112 in the current arc, and not even Sandaime could move in the ways Tobi does. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.116.185.196 ( talk) 01:28, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
You know, intellect ninja had a good point. this is not a forum, and should not be treated as such. i will also make sure i keep this in mind for the future. we should not discuss such issues as "theory" on this page. the main topics that should be discussed are discrepency in "FACTS", and not matters of opinion. the only facts we have are that tobi said, " my power, uchiha madara's power" which means tobi is madara. also, it is quite possible for madara to be alive still due to the fact that there are several members of akatsuki that have found ways to extend there lives. this has not been shown to be the case with tobi, so, the only thing we can do is wait and see what actually happens, rather than speculate and make theories. —Preceding unsigned comment added by RogueFox ( talk • contribs) 18:58, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
Although this falls under the lines of theory too he might have been talking about Uchiha Madara's power over the nine tails as seen with sasuke in naruto's mind and to which jiraiya adds his own theory in the recents chapter. Anyway the point is it is also a theory that he is uchiha madara since although kazuku survived is encounter with the First he has had quite a longer lifespan than we've heard from any ohter character and I could state another dozen of reason why it is unlikely however since it is a theory it should be stated as such just like it was when people put up the theory that he was obito(which is far more likely than madara but thats my opinion) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.82.97.16 ( talk) 23:11, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
Definitely one of the wierder plot twists here. Tobi's personality completely changes as Madara, but as of now all we know is that he is at the very least a reincarnation(?) of Madara. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Muramasa itachi ( talk • contribs) 23:27, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
it was said that in chapter 369 page 7 that Pein's blood was from the Fuuma clan. I just wanted to let you know that and that Remnants of the former Amegakure were searching for Pein and trying to kill him. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Temari y ( talk • contribs) 22:02, 9 September 2007 (UTC)
The "rumor" that Pein is from the Fuma clan is canon. If it is said in the manga, then that is what should be considered canon. And no, fillers do not count, and should not count. Also, since it is "rumored" and has not been proven yet, I don't feel it should be included in Pein's description. But now we know pein isn't his original name in chapter 372 but a name he took after he spent time with jiraiya since even he didn't know who he was and ask konan"So which of the two is Pein?" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.82.97.16 ( talk) 23:15, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
The Fuma clan appeared in the first filler arc as a clan Orochimaru supposedly wiped out. They seemed to be described in the same manner as Pein, so I'm glad that arc is being taken as canon. Again, the Fuma bloodline limit (Kekkei Genkai) appears to be Rinnegan; check above for that. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Muramasa itachi ( talk • contribs) 23:39, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
You read the headline, so you know what I want done.
All over on Wikipedia it keeps saying that he's Madara Uchiha. HE'S NOT!! They've shown a real picture of madara, and that's not him, obviously.
I know that in the manga he says "He has Uchiha Madara's power... my power..." but what he actually means is that he has the SAME power as Sasuke, he is NOT saying that he is Madara.
So SOMEONE needs to get on there and change that! please —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.149.22.27 ( talk) 01:06, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
Alright, I'll clear this up for the people who are clueless as to Japanese. I am no expert, but I am taking the JLPT and I have studied Japanese and act as an amateur translator. What Tobi says exactly is:「写輪眼の本当の力が・・・このうちはマダラの力が 」Which in roumaji transliterates to "Sharingan no hontou no chikara ga...kono Uchiha Madara no chikara ga." Which in English literally means: "The Sharingan's true power...this/that, Uchiha Madara's power." Now, I and other amateur translators suggested on the forums where this Japanese was discussed that it meant he was referring to the "power of Uchiha Madara" which meant the Sharingan or something like that. However, expert translators and native Japanese have said that the "kono" which is usually used as a demonstrative adjective for "this/that (object)" is used sort of as a pronoun in reference to himself (a supervillain way, some translators said as when Zabuza said "Kono Momochi Zabuza" to refer to say "I am Momochi Zabuza") and his power. And the translation has been looked at over and over again by experts in Japanese and that seems to be the general consensus. So, wisen up and accept the translation! The great kawa 01:47, 28 July 2007 (UTC)
And after my fourth edit conflict with SineBot today, I end up EdConning with Someguy... Thanks... You Can ' t Review Me!!! 01:10, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
Tobi may claim he is Madara but keep in mind it still doesn't confirm the fact that he actually is Madara. Tobi is revealed to be a goofy person so maybe he could be lying and just like to refer himself to someone of great power. Enoch08 08:24, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
What do you mean he's not obito? zetsu refers to him as young. And who's not to say obito's still alive? Unlike madara, obito's only supposed to be in his late 20's. And the stitches in his arms are probably there because of his wounded body. Not to mention that there could still be some hidden underneath his akatsuki cloak. —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
98.192.183.207 (
talk)
04:18, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
in my opinion tobi's identity is still unsure apart from one page they've yet to use the name madara in association with tobi i mean until its known for sure you shouldnt go around claiming its the truth i mean some people (myself excluded) actually use this site to confirm facts so isnt the whole point of wikipedia to make sure that the information is 100% accurate before putting it up - Xeogen
But how could he be Madara? It even says that Tobi is young in the article. Madara's the founder of the Uchiha Clan, isn't he? So he ought to be pretty old. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.199.93.79 ( talk) 17:42, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
I can't believe this poll is here twice but here goes first if you want the whole unlikely madara version read the comments put on the first poll,secondly sorry for you Someguy0830 but the fourth is naruto's father and finaly the tobi being uchiha madara is a theory just like tobi being obito and should be both stated and stated as theories —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.82.97.16 ( talk) 23:22, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
I found a blurry summary of ch. 371. I think it says that Jiraiya encounters Deidara. But I'm not 100% certain. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.181.53.37 ( talk) 10:58, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
No. You saw Jiraiya run into Konan.-DylanUchiha 6:53 EST 21 September 2007
Pein's new look greatly resembles Deidara. Check him out! Plus, Pein and Konan are revealed to be former students of Jiraiya (If what I read was correct. Kanji is difficult). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.204.100.226 ( talk) 16:57, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
I wish I could post a picture of Pein's new look. Unfortunately, I can't. One more thing: Doesn't Pein resemble Naruto or Deidara in any way? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.181.53.37 ( talk) 00:19, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
http://bp1.blogger.com/_VkIbHKDK5Dg/RvFxZGtSuaI/AAAAAAAAA0U/aroAgMQv4vY/s1600-h/Naruto+371.jpg http://bp3.blogger.com/_VkIbHKDK5Dg/RvFxPmtSuZI/AAAAAAAAA0M/r2aaV3fUf04/s1600-h/Naruto+371+Naruto+371.jpg
the second one looks nothing like deidera, and i doubt theyd be his student, i mean we just found out for sure that naruto is minatos son, i dont think theyll throw something else big at us for like another 3 yrs lol. but if they did suddenly start revealing crap, people might stop reading and lose interest. whats next, konan is kushina but with dyed hair..... Threatening force 03:12, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
Tobi and Sasuke survived. Why not Deidara? He might've had more tricks up his sleeve. Or he might've blown up another clone. I'm not saying Deidara IS alive, but I thought it was best to at least look into this. Why would Kishimoto make Pein's second body resemble Deidara so much? Is he running out of character looks? Then again, just a thought. One more thing: I'm still curious about what Pein's other forms look like. Was it four more, or five more? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.181.53.37 ( talk) 22:36, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
I'm thinking Pein cloned himself as Diedra, & that the original Pein isn't really the original Pein, just another clone. Sort of like a Sasori thing. 2:25 Sept. 21
I think that there should be pictures of the members and the pictureof the latest face of pein or all the faces —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.201.23.162 ( talk) 01:47, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
what do you mean?
why not? theres pics in naruto and the others —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.62.206.250 ( talk) 22:21, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
Will somebody please fix the article. The in universe banner is still there and hasn't moved once. This is because you're using tenses, implying that earlier in the series was at an earlier time, which it wasn't it was simply earlier in teh series. Somebody has to clean this up by removing 1) the membership status from each character entry. 2) the categories 'current members' and 'former members' and add 'original members' and 'changes to the Akatsuki roster' or something to that effect. Just because a character dies in chapter 360-something doesn't mean that the character is dead because the character still exists in chapter 340-something. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.142.130.31 ( talk) 15:21, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
What you don't seem to understand is that there is no "original ten" members. There was never a period when there were ten members at once, and there never will be. And just so you know, the in-universe template was added a long time ago, not recently, and back then we listed the member's eye colors, blood type, jutsu, specific traits, and a bunch of other things that were clearly in-universe, and we also refered to the Naruto world in an in-universe way ("world domination" over "domination of the Naruto world", for example), so the template is now questionable. Either way, the way we list members now is better than the one you thought of right now. Don't be discouraged, however, I'm sure you'll think of a different one. Artist Formerly Known As Whocares 19:06, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
Konan is jairyas former student but with dyed hair —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.187.163.8 ( talk) 19:53, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
http://bp0.blogger.com/_VkIbHKDK5Dg/RvPZvWaifDI/AAAAAAAAA0s/w21ySDC6XpA/s1600-h/Naruto+371+Spoiler+Pics+and+Summaries+04.jpg http://bp3.blogger.com/_VkIbHKDK5Dg/RvPZkGaifCI/AAAAAAAAA0k/LhdZwI3sIsQ/s1600-h/Naruto+371+Spoiler+Pics+and+Summaries+05.jpg
once again, this is not a forum, and should not be treated as such. until konan is revealed to be jirya's former student, it should not be discussed on this page. stick to discussing the facts, and the subject matter that should be included in descriptions of characters. —Preceding unsigned comment added by RogueFox ( talk • contribs) 19:06, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
The following page has an english translation of Chapter 371 66.24.226.134 00:46, 22 September 2007 (UTC) http://www.msnusers.com/NarutoMangaReturns/narutochapter371english.msnw
Shouldn't we give any info about his new form? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.181.53.37 ( talk) 01:13, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
What are yu talking about? The new chapter already is out! It came out in Japan on Wednesday! I read and looked at it with my own eyes! Pein's new body, him and Konan being Jiraiya's students, it said it all! This is fact! Not speculation! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.181.53.37 ( talk) 20:16, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
I suppose that makes sense. Very well. I'll wait for a subbed version to come out. Sorry. It's just, I can read Japanese. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.181.53.37 ( talk) 20:28, 21 September 2007 (UTC) ]
Pein:
Tobi:
Itachi:
Konan:
that's a nice speculation about pain and itachi but we do not do speculation and tobi was saying he was madara it is just hard to put it in japanese to english and it is hinted that —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.118.111.74 ( talk) 02:07, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
We know that Pein refers to Jiraiya as "sensei", and we know that Jiraiya has known Konan since she was young. Other things can be assumed, but they are not WP:V. – Gunslinger47 05:02, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Why cant people say what they want on a discussions board. he was just pointing it out to see what other people think it is not on the actual pein page. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.179.163.157 ( talk) 05:06, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
It is an opinion, and sounds a bit unprofessional. -- Vehgah 01:07, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
In chapter 371, pain mentions that he has no love for his old teacher, Jiraiya. Isn't this means that one of the 2 unknown genins in Jiraiya's first team is Pein? Bence560 06:17, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
what? What does that have to do with pein or jiraiya? you, sir, make no sense! nut then again, this wiki is full of lies, as they remove a lot of things or cover up stuff revealed in the chapters. I also noticed a lot of missing info that used to be there. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.95.51.48 ( talk) 12:43, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
Maybe Pein and Konan were Minatos teammates back when he whas a genin —Preceding unsigned comment added by 189.171.83.99 ( talk) 13:58, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
His comment made perfect sense. He was illustrating that Pein and Jiraiya could have had a teacher-student relationship without necessarily being on the same team, using Naruto and Iruka as an example. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Zevin64 ( talk • contribs) 15:01, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
sorry, I misread that. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.95.51.48 ( talk) 00:04, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
Wait, he only said, "I hold no more love for him." He didn't say anything about a student/teacher relaionship. Plus, remember that he's a Rain ninja. Although there's a very good chance now that Konan was Minato's teammate. (Hamstergirl591 21:42, 23 September 2007 (UTC)) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Hamstergirl591 ( talk • contribs)
Aoi from the fillers is a Rain ninja, yet was a Leaf ninja. Same concept here. — Someguy0830 ( T | C) 21:54, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
Fillers don't count. And as to the main point, it was said in chapter 372 that Jiraiya, Konan, a boy named Yahiko, and and another boy named Nagato(who's eyes at the end of the chapter are shown to be Pein's, But it is still speculation that this boy is infact Pein), had a teacher-student-like relationship and refer to him as sensei when Jiraiya and the other Sanin where in the Rain Village. It is not known if Pein and Konan leave the Rain village and go to the Leaf Village at this point. -Zasukesan —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.246.59.17 ( talk) 03:45, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
Just something to take in mind, every time you talk about Pein piercings you refer to them as "face-piercings" or "piercings in his face". You should note that they are not just in his face, at least in the first body he shown he also had piercings in the lower parts of his arms (seen in his first appearance, he enters the room grabbing the frame of the entrance and the sleeve of his cloak lowers a bit, revealing the piercing. Also seen when dispelling the "rain jutsu", the sleeves moves and you can see them in both arms this time). Piercings along his body could be more accurate. 22 September '07 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.224.60.72 ( talk) 10:42, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
Chapter 371, page 12 first vignette. In this aerial perspective of Pain you can see piercings around his collarbone. Is that's enough to remove "face"? 29 September '07 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.224.60.72 ( talk)
The article on Pein is based on a character whose name isn't Pein and who uses clones to move around for what we should care is finding out his identity and write his article based on it, not on a clone body, his piercings and appearance are irrelevant info that make the page longer unnecessarily. 66.50.153.104 16:22, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
does any of the other akutsiki know everything about Pein and his past? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 4.242.126.228 ( talk) 16:13, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
well someone told me pein was a girl? i hope thats not true cuz he's really cute
He's not a girl, and you have awful grammar! I found 6 mistakes. 71.200.36.214 21:47, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
PEIN AND KONAN COULD HAVE BEEN OLD TAEMMATES OF THE FOURTH TURNED TRAITORS.
IT MAKES SENSE SINCE THEY TALK THE WAY THEY DO ABOUT JARAIYA, HAVE INCREDIBLE ABILITIES AS NINJA, AND ARE WELL AWARE OF KONOHA'S TRADITIONS —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.145.229.171 ( talk) 01:59, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
your wrong they were rain village kids Jairiya looked after when their parents were killed in a the war. he watched them and one other for a while. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.179.163.157 ( talk) 05:11, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
I think Konan is the girl on team that the Fourth was on under Jiraya. The girl in the picture looks like Konan. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/91/Jiraiyageninteam.jpg —Preceding unsigned comment added by Icyfire221 ( talk • contribs) 02:47, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
And this is not meant to be a forum question, but a "Did I miss them explaining this?":
Tobi is from Konoha. Being Madara or not, the Sharingan is proof enough. Only Uchiha members have Sharingan. And all Uchiha members hail from Konoha. 71.168.85.188 22:02, 27 September 2007 (UTC)Fantasy Leader
what if tobi took madara's sharingan. kinda how kakashi got his from obitos. This could explain how tobi said "this power, madara's power"- not direct quote. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.179.163.157 ( talk) 05:14, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
This webpage has (appearently legitimate) scans from chapter 372. http://naruto-xx.blogspot.com/2007/09/spoiler-pics-naruto-372.html 66.24.231.57 19:22, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
all the Characters of akatsuki should each have their own main articles like Orochimaru and alot of other Naruto characters because we can read about their personality, history, abiltis and so forth.
From what I've read of 372, this is what is known:
Konan can grow wings from her paper, cannot fold them when wet, can shoot the feathers like bullets in a paper air-plane shape, and is Pein's apparent messegner, earning the nickname "God's Angel", god being Pein.
All three are refugees from Rain, where their parents were killed in a war (apparently the one Obito died in, too). They find the Sannin, and get food. The three ask for training, though Orochimaru suggests killing them instead, since their life will only suffer. Jiraiya instead sends Orochimaru and Tsunade off and lives with them in a hut, where they have dinner and discuss the war. Nagato remembers how this reminds him of his real family and begins to cry. Yahiko also appears defensive of Rain, wanting to stop the "crying rain" (he compares the constant rain to tears) and protect the people. The next day, however, Nagato and Yahiko go missing, and when Jiraiya and Konan find them, and Yahiko explains that a Stone Chunin tried to take their money (or that of other refugees), and Nagato killed him. Jiraiya looks at Nagato, and suddenly Pein's eyes are his. Jiraiya also hints those eyes have a major purpose, asking if he could be...?.
Interestingly, Pein is actually Nagato, rather than Yahiko as first suspected. Yahiko has blond hair and looks alot like Pein. Nagato has black hair that usually covers his eyes. Artist Formerly Known As Whocares 01:16, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
Shouldn't we wait until it's confirmed which one of those two kids really was Pein? Nagato may have Pein's eyes, but Yahiko shares what seems to be the same ideals Pein operates by (changing the way Amegakure is run, etc). I think it would be safer to wait it out rather than to base everything on his eyes. The Splendiferous Gegiford 02:31, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
Ever seen a raw -_- -- Blue-Eyes Gold Dragon 07:58, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
I'll first like to point out a speculative point concerning Pain before I actually get into the factual stuff.
The body we all know Pein from, the one we first saw him in, isn't his real body. I think, from the look of everything we have seen, that Nagato (aka Pain) is merely using Yahiko's body. That would explain both why the "default" body of Pain is identical in hairstyle and facial structure as Yahiko and it would also explain why he would presumably use it when contacting the Akatsuki - what better way of keeping your identity unknown than to use someone-else's body? In addition, I would assume that Nagato is actually fulfilling Yahiko's dream for him - controlling the rain, and making everyone pay for what they did. He did crush Amegakure on his own, remember?
Anyway... The proposed updates.
Konan and Pain were not students under Jiraiya. During his time in Amegakure, he merely taught them how to survive. From what we currently know, the jutsu he taught them was no more than mere survival-enabling jutsu (such as a fishing technique and how to cook food with a single fire jutsu).
Pain's "default" body appears to be a lot like what Yahiko's would have grown up to be. Whether this means that Pain IS Yahiko is debateble, given his tendancy to not stick to a single body. His second body, however, is still unknown and should not be mentioned outside of the aforementioned tendancy.
While Yahiko is the leader of the group, it is evident that Nagato is the strongest. As noted by Jiraiya at the time, he managed to kill a Chuunin on his own without any combat experience AND we know now that Jiraiya showed fear upon seeing those eyes. This heavily points to Nagato being Pain, beyond having the same eyes, as he is well-known for being stronger than the 3 Sannin put together during their prime.
Jiraiya, against the wishes of the other two Sannin during the mission, stayed with the three children. It is quite evident that neither Orichamaru or Tsunade felt this was a good idea - Konan even points out that her and Pain are only alive because of Jiraiya (hence why they both still call him Teacher). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.34.123.164 ( talk) 08:29, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
Another thing is whether Pein is "Pein" or "Pain". I would assume it would be "Pain", as Yahiko's ideal. George Leung 18:06, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
So can somebody get rid of the machine thing because it is not known of yet it is still speculation so please change it —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.118.116.168 ( talk) 22:28, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
On the manga I read, it's "Pain". So I would assume, in keeping with Yahiko's wish to inflict pain to everyone, that such a translation certainly makes sense. I also still think that there should be some mention of Pain's power in relation to Konan's comment about his strength - the fact that he killed a Chuunin as a child with little training IS an important fact in regards to his strength. 82.34.123.164 00:38, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
Maybe Pein Is Nagato and jacked Yahiko's body —Preceding unsigned comment added by Redsand182 ( talk • contribs) 04:30, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
Tobi's attitude isn't goofy anymore anyone who reads his text would imply that he still is. The moment he claimed obtaining Madara's power he gives orders and ponders on top of Madara's statue, this isn't what his article tells you. The text "After Deidara's death, Tobi is shown giving Pein, the leader of Akatsuki, orders, and he refers to himself as Madara Uchiha.[34]" should be placed at the end of his text along with his attitude changes, for the text to appear in a chronological manner. Another thing we don't know if he originates from Konohagakure. His name is not Uchiha, if it was then his article should be Tobi Uchiha and not simply Tobi or Madara Uchiha should be placed in the akatsuki page, and we know you don't have to be Uchiha to have sharingan and this is a fact (Kakashi), stating that he might be Uchiha and doing it the way it is written in the article is sloppy and it is original research. Lets wait patiently for the manga to explain. And that goes for every single character in the series. 66.50.153.104 16:16, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
Tobi Is Mandara Uchiha so he is one of the first uchihas in konahagakure as Jiraiya had mentioned 3-4 chapters ago —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.118.116.168 ( talk) 18:25, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
Then why don't we change his name to Madara Uchiha, you say a few chapters back Jiraiya metioned something (Jiraiya hasn't even seen Tobi)... why didn't you quote? He did mention a theory, his theory about the Nine Tails appearance having to do with Madara. Separate fact from original research. 66.50.153.104 02:10, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
Mysteriousness is part of the personality, what the article should follow is Membership, Personality and Plot or whatever is going on in the present, this is hard to tell with the current text. 66.50.153.104 01:11, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
Can someone take a look at Kabuto's information and restore the Plot info, cause it says nothing about him thats important or anything about whats presently going on and he is Orochimaru's only way to return to the series and that make him an important character, equally important as Orochimaru, maybe someone vandalized it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.50.153.104 ( talk) 16:30, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
There is a Chinese translation of Chapter 373 at http://naruto-xx.blogspot.com/ . Where the original Japanese version of the manga may be more convinent, it would seem that this could still be put to some use. 66.24.227.23 00:41, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
In chapter 373, It is revealed that Pain's bloodline limit is one of the "Three Legendary Doujutsu." His eyes are called Rinnegan. It means metempsychosis eye. The creator of all jutsu. One more thing: Konan originally hailed from Hidden Rain. 71.168.85.188 01:08, 5 October 2007 (UTC) Fantasy Leader
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