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Is the title "Afro/Cosmic music" OK? I didn't think it was fair to choose a name that favors only Loda or Baldelli, and there didn't seem to be a better term. If anyone has a better suggestion, though, be my guest. — mjb 21:04, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
Greetings, Afro/Cosmic enthusiasts. I've started this article based on a handful of interviews on Web sites, as found in some quick Google searches. We need more journalistic references, though, in order to ensure the article's longevity.
Please help improve the article any way you can. You don't have to try to make it be the most comprehensive collection of information about the scene ever assembled; it just needs to paraphrase, summarize, and point to all of that information as documented elsewhere, as per Wikipedia policies. So be sure to provide references for any info that can possibly be debated. The more places where we can point to for confirmation, the better.
If you're new to Wikipedia, create an account before you edit and make sure you're logged in, then take a look at the verifiability policy and the 'no original research' policy, which basically means you can't provide firsthand information or anything that can't be read about elsewhere. For your writing style, avoid hyperbole and "peacock terms", which means words like "legendary" and "influential" are taboo; just write like a skeptical journalist, as if you're writing for a respectable publication that librarians will want to archive.
Ask any questions here. Thanks! — mjb 21:04, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
You need to pull this together more or get rid of the article. It's a hard thing to write about, we need around 20 more years before we can accurately place this in a historical context.
Musically, I know what you're talking about but that's probably because I am an enthusiast as well. Someone needs to go into far greater depth with regards to this. Above all, REMOVE the reference to "non-mainstream" dance music which is total BS (Baldelli played Bob Marley, Phil Collins, Simple Minds, etc.. there was no line between mainstream and non-mainstream for him.) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.131.207.20 ( talk) 05:11, 23 January 2008 (UTC)
P4K, I disagree with your edit today: the Leone article opens with Space disco!...or cosmic house, or the way out, eclectic sounds of DJs who don't mind throwing in the odd Can track or jazz-funk remix in the middle of their set. That seems to be a pretty clear attempt to label the DJs' overall sound as "space disco" and "cosmic house". Your edit summary says you think it means they just incorporated those genres into their sets. Can you explain? — mjb ( talk) 03:10, 24 January 2008 (UTC)
It was just pointed out to me today that someone already created a Cosmic Disco article 4 months before I created this one. The articles are about the same topic, so obviously a merge is in order, and I've just tagged both articles with merge templates.
The content shouldn't be too hard to merge. My main question is where should the article live? That is, what should its title be?
Because the topic is referred to in print as both "Afro" and "Cosmic" and combinations thereof, I feel my article's title ("Afro/Cosmic music") is the better option. I don't want to favor Baldelli's term ("Cosmic" or "Cosmic Disco") when music journalists are using Loda's ("Afro") as well; and in general I want to present the myriad of terms as neutrally as possible. The article has to be called something, though, and "The Scene With Many Names" doesn't seem like a good candidate. I couldn't think of anything better than "Afro/Cosmic". — mjb ( talk) 03:10, 24 January 2008 (UTC)
Or is all this mergin-direction-stuff just a 'wikitionary' kind of concern only? Djbrokenwindow ( talk) 02:51, 25 May 2008 (UTC)
Recently there has been a spate of anti-Baldelli, anti-'Cosmic', pro-Loda, pro-'Afro' edits by a Telecom Italia user (or group of users) at these IPs:
The edits do contain some plausible information, but they are written as if they are angry rebuttals on a message board, so they can't be allowed to stand. Also, a significant amount of sourced material was deleted, including specific references to published sources of info about the topics. As per Wikipedia policies, any information must be backed up by published, reliable sources sooner or later, and removing existing sources is not allowable.
If there are inaccuracies or misleading information or other problems in the Wikipedia articles, but you don't have magazine, magazine, or academic journal articles you can point to in order to support your point of view, then don't make your edits directly to the articles on Wikipedia. Instead, please discuss the issues on the articles' talk pages:
Then maybe we can figure out a way to proceed with consensus and in a way that is fair to all.
The theme of the edits seems to be that Afro and Cosmic are distinct, and shouldn't be lumped together (even though they sometimes are, in the press). So let's discuss here the ways in which they are distinct and the ways in which they are similar, and how we can write about them neutrally. Also the anonymous editor(s) seems to mistrust all of Baldelli's claims. So let's discuss here exactly which statements are in doubt and what we can do to reconcile them, keeping in mind we have to acknowledge what has been said publicly by everyone about both "Afro" and "Cosmic" and their personal styles of mixing, even if it is false or misleading. To address issues of neutrality, we must carefully choose our words to say "this has been said, and this other conflicting thing has been said" (by these certain people in these certain publications), which is not the same thing as simply saying "this is true" or "this is false" without external support. This manner of writing is a higher standard that Wikipedia articles must be held to. Anything less will undermine the stability and credibility of the articles.
Lastly, although you are free to do what you want, I personally ask that you please don't edit anonymously. Create an account and edit your own user page to tell us who you are. You should have nothing to hide if you are a serious disciple of this music, and it can increase your credibility as an editor. You can read about me on my page, User:Mjb, for example, and send me a private message if you want more info. — mjb ( talk) 21:41, 18 February 2009 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Afro/cosmic music article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
It is requested that an image or photograph of Afro be
included in this article to
improve its quality. Please replace this template with a more specific
media request template where possible.
Wikipedians in Italy may be able to help! The Free Image Search Tool or Openverse Creative Commons Search may be able to locate suitable images on Flickr and other web sites. |
Is the title "Afro/Cosmic music" OK? I didn't think it was fair to choose a name that favors only Loda or Baldelli, and there didn't seem to be a better term. If anyone has a better suggestion, though, be my guest. — mjb 21:04, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
Greetings, Afro/Cosmic enthusiasts. I've started this article based on a handful of interviews on Web sites, as found in some quick Google searches. We need more journalistic references, though, in order to ensure the article's longevity.
Please help improve the article any way you can. You don't have to try to make it be the most comprehensive collection of information about the scene ever assembled; it just needs to paraphrase, summarize, and point to all of that information as documented elsewhere, as per Wikipedia policies. So be sure to provide references for any info that can possibly be debated. The more places where we can point to for confirmation, the better.
If you're new to Wikipedia, create an account before you edit and make sure you're logged in, then take a look at the verifiability policy and the 'no original research' policy, which basically means you can't provide firsthand information or anything that can't be read about elsewhere. For your writing style, avoid hyperbole and "peacock terms", which means words like "legendary" and "influential" are taboo; just write like a skeptical journalist, as if you're writing for a respectable publication that librarians will want to archive.
Ask any questions here. Thanks! — mjb 21:04, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
You need to pull this together more or get rid of the article. It's a hard thing to write about, we need around 20 more years before we can accurately place this in a historical context.
Musically, I know what you're talking about but that's probably because I am an enthusiast as well. Someone needs to go into far greater depth with regards to this. Above all, REMOVE the reference to "non-mainstream" dance music which is total BS (Baldelli played Bob Marley, Phil Collins, Simple Minds, etc.. there was no line between mainstream and non-mainstream for him.) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.131.207.20 ( talk) 05:11, 23 January 2008 (UTC)
P4K, I disagree with your edit today: the Leone article opens with Space disco!...or cosmic house, or the way out, eclectic sounds of DJs who don't mind throwing in the odd Can track or jazz-funk remix in the middle of their set. That seems to be a pretty clear attempt to label the DJs' overall sound as "space disco" and "cosmic house". Your edit summary says you think it means they just incorporated those genres into their sets. Can you explain? — mjb ( talk) 03:10, 24 January 2008 (UTC)
It was just pointed out to me today that someone already created a Cosmic Disco article 4 months before I created this one. The articles are about the same topic, so obviously a merge is in order, and I've just tagged both articles with merge templates.
The content shouldn't be too hard to merge. My main question is where should the article live? That is, what should its title be?
Because the topic is referred to in print as both "Afro" and "Cosmic" and combinations thereof, I feel my article's title ("Afro/Cosmic music") is the better option. I don't want to favor Baldelli's term ("Cosmic" or "Cosmic Disco") when music journalists are using Loda's ("Afro") as well; and in general I want to present the myriad of terms as neutrally as possible. The article has to be called something, though, and "The Scene With Many Names" doesn't seem like a good candidate. I couldn't think of anything better than "Afro/Cosmic". — mjb ( talk) 03:10, 24 January 2008 (UTC)
Or is all this mergin-direction-stuff just a 'wikitionary' kind of concern only? Djbrokenwindow ( talk) 02:51, 25 May 2008 (UTC)
Recently there has been a spate of anti-Baldelli, anti-'Cosmic', pro-Loda, pro-'Afro' edits by a Telecom Italia user (or group of users) at these IPs:
The edits do contain some plausible information, but they are written as if they are angry rebuttals on a message board, so they can't be allowed to stand. Also, a significant amount of sourced material was deleted, including specific references to published sources of info about the topics. As per Wikipedia policies, any information must be backed up by published, reliable sources sooner or later, and removing existing sources is not allowable.
If there are inaccuracies or misleading information or other problems in the Wikipedia articles, but you don't have magazine, magazine, or academic journal articles you can point to in order to support your point of view, then don't make your edits directly to the articles on Wikipedia. Instead, please discuss the issues on the articles' talk pages:
Then maybe we can figure out a way to proceed with consensus and in a way that is fair to all.
The theme of the edits seems to be that Afro and Cosmic are distinct, and shouldn't be lumped together (even though they sometimes are, in the press). So let's discuss here the ways in which they are distinct and the ways in which they are similar, and how we can write about them neutrally. Also the anonymous editor(s) seems to mistrust all of Baldelli's claims. So let's discuss here exactly which statements are in doubt and what we can do to reconcile them, keeping in mind we have to acknowledge what has been said publicly by everyone about both "Afro" and "Cosmic" and their personal styles of mixing, even if it is false or misleading. To address issues of neutrality, we must carefully choose our words to say "this has been said, and this other conflicting thing has been said" (by these certain people in these certain publications), which is not the same thing as simply saying "this is true" or "this is false" without external support. This manner of writing is a higher standard that Wikipedia articles must be held to. Anything less will undermine the stability and credibility of the articles.
Lastly, although you are free to do what you want, I personally ask that you please don't edit anonymously. Create an account and edit your own user page to tell us who you are. You should have nothing to hide if you are a serious disciple of this music, and it can increase your credibility as an editor. You can read about me on my page, User:Mjb, for example, and send me a private message if you want more info. — mjb ( talk) 21:41, 18 February 2009 (UTC)