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![]() | The contents of the AVE page were merged into High-speed rail in Spain on 7 May 2023. For the contribution history and old versions of the merged article please see its history. |
"7000 km of high-speed rail operational by the end of the decade" that really a lot since it's a mountagnous country so with tunnels and bridges. Marc Venot 00:05, 19 August 2004 (UTC)
It would be nice to get some citations/more information on:
-- Blorg 08:08, 9 June 2005 (UTC)
Maybe the lengthy political rant at the introduction of the article should be integrated (and NPOVed a little) with the history section. I think that the introduction should be mostly about technical features of the train. -- xDCDx 09:26, 12 July 2005 (UTC)
"The Army has protected AVE lines recently."
At the moment, there is a direct train service from Madrid to Barcelona which uses the high speed line from Madrid to its current temporary terminus at Lleida, the train continues on existing track to Barcelona. The train uses gauge changing Talgo stock with RENFE's 'Altaria' brand name. These trains can switch from the high speed standard gauge to spanish broad gauge at Lleida. Currently, there are six daily Altaria trains between Madrid to Barcelona taking 5 hours.
From next year, as the Wikepida article suggests, it's quite likely the high speed line will be extended to a new temporary terminus just east of Tarragona. The guage changing Altaria trains will then run on the high speed line all the way from Madrid via Llieda to just beyond Tarragona, and then switch to the existing line for the remaining 50km or so Barcelona. The high speed line will not serve Tarragona, but instead there will be a park and ride station north of city and also within proximity of Reus. This will reduce the journey time from Madrid to Barcelona by possible 30 mins to 4.5 hrs.
Once the standard guage line is complete all the way from Madrid to Barcelona, the purpose built high speed trains can the link the two cities. This will probably be in 2008.
Meanwhile, a high speed line linking Perpignan in France with Figueras in Spain is currently under construction and should be opened in 2009. In turn, there is a high speed line being developed between Figueras and Barcelona. If all these plans come to fruition, by 2009 there will be continous standard guage mostly high speed line from Paris all the way to Madrid opening up all sorts of possibilities for various TGV and AVE services between the two. With a journey time between the French and Spanish capitals of around eight hours, it's unlikely there will a regular through high speed service between the two. However, there may be variations on services connecting closer pairs of cities, for instance Barcelona to Paris in 5 hrs and Barcelona to Merseilles in under 3 hours. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.206.149.194 ( talk) 15:44, 22 August 2005 (UTC)
A Spanish Railway map I picked up ( http://www.alleuroperail.com/eurorailway-maps/spain-portugal-railway-map.htm) seems to show a high-speed Barcelona-Tarragona-Castellon-Valencia-Alicante line. Is this not an AVE line? The map doesn't show the partially completed Madrid-Barcelona or the Madrid-Malaga lines referenced in the map, though. - Binand — Preceding undated comment added 11:06, 16 October 2005 (UTC)
You are totally right, it is not an AVE, but un upgraded broad line, called the Euromed, because it links all the important Mediterranean cities in Spain located in Catalonia and Valencia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.37.253.152 ( talk) 16:42, 18 January 2006 (UTC)
>> Currently, five lines make up the AVE system:
>> AVE Larga Distancia (long distance) Madrid-Sevilla (Madrid, Ciudad Real, Puertollano, Córdoba, Sevilla) AVE Larga Distancia Madrid-Zaragoza-Lleida (Madrid, Guadalajara, Calatayud, Zaragoza, Lleida) AVE Lanzadera (shuttle) Madrid-Puertollano (Madrid, Ciudad Real, Puertollano) Talgo 200 Madrid-Málaga (Madrid, Ciudad Real, Puertollano, Córdoba, Málaga AV Media Distancia (Mid distance) Madrid - Toledo. <<
To me, the above is incorrect in several respects.
Would anyone like to confirm / correct this information before I attempt to incorporate it in the article? -- Picapica 11:36, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
There's written: >However, it has to be said that both Siemens and Talgo/Bombardier train sets have consistently failed to meet scheduled speed >targets. El Periódico newspaper carried an article in October 2005 reporting that the Talgo/Bombardier train set (nicknamed "El >Pato" or "The Duck" because of the locomotive's bill-like snout) would not be tested at 250 km in the near future.
The Bombardier Train works perfectly up to speeds of 300 km/h. At higher speeds there are troubles with ballast stones hitting the underframe. (The Spanisch AVE does not have a truck substructure without ballast like it is recomended for speeds above 300 km/h)
The Siemens train is not yet delivered. It is years late since the German compnay seems to have trouble to produce the train in Spain and delivers now all trains from their Krefeld factory.
The reasons for the trains not going faster on the AVE line is because they have stil to relay on the old Spanish standard train protection ASFA, since the new ETCS level 1 quipment is not working, neither the fixinstallation nor the onboard installation. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.254.100.106 ( talk) 08:41, 26 February 2006 (UTC)
I find this frangment of Future developpement section:
"When completed, the Madrid-Barcelona line should be the world's fastest long-distance train in commercial operation, with trains billed to reach a top speed of 350 km/h and covering the 600 km between the two cities in just 2.5 hours."
quite untrue.
TGV trains already (and this won't rather change) link Paris to Marseilles in 3 hours, which gives both faster journey and longer distance:
-- Madcap pl 08:05, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
I think is not very accurate to define the Basque "Y" as a linkage of the "three" Basques provices. It will link three basques provinces (the ones the "Basque Country" administrative autonomy in Spain) but leaving apart those basque provinces in the sud ouest of France and the Navarra autonomy which has a strong basque heritage and is traditionally considered origin of the Basque identity. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.53.47.104 ( talk) 15:58, 23 September 2006 (UTC)
Given that the subject is spanish high speed trains, I think that the main physical units should be km/h as they are in common use in all continental Europe. Franjesus 11:59, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
Should the place names be the standard English ones or local varieties? For example Sevilla is used here rather than Seville, and there is a mixture between the usage of Lérida and Lleida. The Encyclopaedia Britannica lists Lérida as its article title - therefore is that taken to be the name to be used in English? Jonny1047 15:25, 26 May 2007 (UTC)
There are these other names to change, too: Valencia-->València Alicante-->Alacant Figueras-->Figueres Castellón de la Plana-->Castelló de la Plana —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.170.21.148 ( talk • contribs) 15:42, 23 November 2007
There has been some debate over whether the comments attributed to the minister that the line will be limitted to 300km/h are a journalist's misrepresentation, when they actually meant that it was only raised to 300km/h temporarily and there will be another speed up when ETCS level 2 is available. If this is going to be the final limit, no one has told Siemens, for example. Discussion on Usenet would indicate that 350km/h is still intended. Dpeilow 19:00, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
just wondered why someone felt it necessary to go through and change the dates from eg. the 12th October 2007 to October 12 2007. I thought that kind of editing was against policy - as in if its a European article leave dates written the 'European' way, and as long as its consistent its ok! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jonny1047 ( talk • contribs) 10:50, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
Hi all, I've just read that someone has written that the map is "inaccurate". As I created the map myself, I have something to say. My source is a public document of the Spanish Ministry of Development ("Ministerio de Fomento"), in which there are detailed maps about the current and future high speed lines. You can read a complete English translation here.
About the lines in service, please bear in mind that the map states clearly that it is for December 2007. I uploaded the map last October, before the problems in Barcelona line were known, and that's why this line appeared in green. Now that we all know that the AVE trains will only reach Valladolid and Malaga by end December 2007 if there are no more technical problems, I've made a new version of the map updating the situation in Barcelona (now it appears yellow).
As soon as the Barcelona line is opened, probably during the first semester of 2008, I'll update the map again.
-- Assdl ( talk) 12:36, 7 December 2007 (UTC)
The spanish wikipedia has two separate articles on the subject, es:Alta Velocidad Española, which describes the rolling stock and services, and es:Alta velocidad ferroviaria en España, which describes the network and construction.
I support splitting the english AVE article along similar lines. Spain is currently undergoing a massive renovation of its train network, including (but not limited to) the construction of several new AVE lines. That project needs greater coverage. Alcuin ( talk) 16:50, 9 December 2007 (UTC)
I don't really see the point, as this is just an article about the AVE services and their lines etc. why not just create a separate article for 'High Speed Rail' in spain? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jonny1047 ( talk • contribs) 21:55, 18 January 2008 (UTC)
Two articles would indeed be best, I believe. And I think Jonny agrees to that; I don't think Alcuin really ment literally splitting the current text of this article, but rather disentangling the two articles. The two maps show the difference between high-speed lines and AVE services, and along those lines (ahem) a split could well be made. Classical geographer ( talk) 09:51, 19 January 2008 (UTC)
Turkey bought some high-speed train sets from Spain. Are they AVE?-- 78.180.50.60 ( talk) 13:33, 18 January 2008 (UTC)
The trains are not called AVE! They have names like Siemens S-103. AVE is just the brand name applied by RENFE, so unless RENFE is running the trains in Turkey I assume the Turkish rail operator will brand them something else. Jonny1047 ( talk) 21:52, 18 January 2008 (UTC)
In the section on other projects: "Another connection to the LGV is also planned, at either La Jonquera in Catalonia or Irun in the Basque Country." La Jonquera is the last town in Spain on the Barcelona-France motorway before the frontier, and lies more or less over the tunnel under construction for the Figueras-Perpignan line. The reference should be deleted. I assume the Irun connection would be an extension from the new line to Valladolid. -- JamesWim ( talk) 15:47, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
Someone has put down that other lines that are high speed but not AVE are run under the Alvia brand, but what about the EuroMed? is that not considered high speed by the same standards? or the Altaria (does that still exist) - they all run around 200kmh don't they? does anyone know? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jonny1047 ( talk • contribs) 19:27, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
Alvia run partly on the Highspeed network (250km/h) and partly on the old network (up to 200km/h). Euromed run entirely on the old network. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.54.207.161 ( talk) 15:16, 18 April 2008 (UTC)
Its not difficult as the Alvia trains can change gauge without stopping! The previous Altaria trains which ran the Madrid-Barcelona route could also change but had to stop in order to do so! Jonny1047 ( talk) 18:48, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
Until 7 February 2010 High-speed rail in Spain was a redirect to this page and I suggest it is kept that way. And the information should be merged into this page. (Similar discussion on about the TGV at Talk:TGV#Suggested_re-name). Any opinions on the subject? Prillen ( talk) 09:24, 11 February 2010 (UTC)
In favour: maintain a relationship with AVE, acronym for "Alta Velocidad Española" which is the almost exact translation of High Speed (Rail) of Spain, do not think that it is an excessive advertising of a company. While not relate these two articles simply supposed to hide information to the general public and that the navigation for a non Spanish-speaking person is more complicated. I do not think that this is a good policy for an encyclopedia like Wikipedia — Preceding unsigned comment added by Antonov3691 ( talk • contribs) 12:06, 25 March 2011 (UTC)
AVE services only account for the fastest trains in Spain. There are also the AVANT and Alvia services that have in-service speeds that fit accepted definitions of high-speed rail (i.e. over 200km/h). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.60.98.134 ( talk) 16:16, 16 April 2010 (UTC)
AVE is one of the services that offers Renfe. High-speed railway lines in Spain are also used by other Renfe services such as Avant (regional high-speed train), Alvia (adapted for both Iberian and Standard high-speed gauges) and other services that use the high-speed lines together with the classical lines built in Iberian gauge. Anyway, this article must be improved. Mllturro ( talk) 14:05, 12 January 2012 (UTC)
High-speed roads may be under a concession to some private operator. On that high-speed roads may pass a lot of buses from different private companies. There is similitude when we look at railroads and trains: railroads may be public or may be under a concession to some private operator http://www.networkrail.co.uk/ . And trains that use it may be public or manage by private companies http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/tocs_maps/tocs/ . Mixing those things (walkway and shoes) those not seems a good idea. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Rail Esoj Sevla ( talk) 18:42, 21 April 2010 (UTC)
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File:AVE.svg, has been nominated for speedy deletion at
Wikimedia Commons for the following reason: Other speedy deletions
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Speedy deletions at commons tend to take longer than they do on Wikipedia, so there is no rush to respond. If you feel the deletion can be contested then please do so (
commons:COM:SPEEDY has further information). Otherwise consider finding a replacement image before deletion occurs.
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Cf
http://www.elperiodico.com/es/noticias/sociedad/ave-sufre-otro-reves-retrasa-hasta-2013-1531221
(includes map at
http://estaticos.elperiodico.com/resources/pdf/4/3/1331504775634.pdf )
for the present (12/3/2012) state of affairs.
The bottom line is that in Barcelona, 15 km remain to be completed, plus 9 km in Girona, in both cases track-laying, electrification and the rest, and that a delayed contract awarding procedure means that the line will not open this year, but rather in 2013 - probably around mid-year.
Vamos a ver... .) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 187.45.181.179 ( talk) 04:20, 21 March 2012 (UTC)
It seems there is a conflict on the provided information from Wikipedia regarding the top speed in which AVE operates during commercial service in Spain. In the beginning of this article it is stated:
"Alta Velocidad Española (AVE) is a service of high-speed rail in Spain operated by RENFE, the Spanish national railway company, at speeds of up to 310 km/h (193 mph)."
Later on Madrid–Valladolid line it is written:
"Trainsets used on this line include S-120 (max speed 250 km/h (155 mph)), S-130 (Patito, max speed 250 km/h (155 mph)) and the S102 (Pato, max speed 320 km/h/199 mph)".
In the article
AVE Class 103 under "In Service" section it is written:
"While the trains and the tracks were commissioned for a regular top speed of 350 km/h (220 mph), the train control and signalling system necessary for such operation, ETCS Level 2, was not ready for service. Thus commercial top speed is limited to the maximum Spanish authorities approve for the line with ETCS Level 1 since 7 May 2007, 300 km/h (186 mph)."
And again in the article
AVE Class 102 you can read:
"After the commissioning of the train control system ETCS Level 1, the top speed was increased in steps.[8] Since 7 May 2007,[9] the trains travel with the top speed targeted for the time being[7] 300 km/h (190 mph)."
Which is the correct one after all? 300 km/h? 310 km/h? 320 km/h? something else? Does anybody have a clue?
Clicklander (
talk)
10:06, 7 March 2013 (UTC)
Searched for the words "usage", "ridership" and "popularity" in the article and none turned up. If anyone has sources, I propose adding a section like TGV#Ridership to this article. AadaamS ( talk) 10:27, 24 October 2013 (UTC)
The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:AVE/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.
Article is well developed but needs more references, wikilinking seems erratic. Jezhotwells ( talk) 23:36, 23 May 2009 (UTC) |
Last edited at 23:36, 23 May 2009 (UTC). Substituted at 06:27, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
A discussion is taking place to address the redirect
High-speed rail in Spain. The discussion will occur at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2021 May 25#High-speed rail in Spain until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion.
King of ♥
♦
♣
♠
01:03, 25 May 2021 (UTC)
Two sources mention that the section valladolid - Burgos as active.
The commercial services are all Avia or MD (media distance). It could be that there are no AVE services terminating at Burgos and Avia services run on the high speed line change gauge at Burgos and continue. This seems unlikely as all trains take at least 1 hour 7 minutes, also the MD services. I suspect an opening this year. Smiley.toerist ( talk) 14:36, 18 February 2022 (UTC)
This article requires a complete rewrite. AVE is a high-speed rail service of Renfe, the State-owned train operator. The ADIF-owned high-speed network (the infrastructure) is used by services (Ouigo, Iryo) belonging to non-RENFE operators ( SNCF, ILSA ) as well as other RENFE services ( Alvia, Renfe Avant ...). Most of content of this article currently pertains the infrastructure, not the AVE services. That content should be located elsewhere, for example (preferably) in High-speed rail in Spain (currently a redirect to High-speed rail in Europe) or perhaps in Administrador de Infraestructuras Ferroviarias. Asqueladd ( talk) 17:30, 6 November 2022 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
AVE article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
![]() | This ![]() It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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![]() | The contents of the AVE page were merged into High-speed rail in Spain on 7 May 2023. For the contribution history and old versions of the merged article please see its history. |
"7000 km of high-speed rail operational by the end of the decade" that really a lot since it's a mountagnous country so with tunnels and bridges. Marc Venot 00:05, 19 August 2004 (UTC)
It would be nice to get some citations/more information on:
-- Blorg 08:08, 9 June 2005 (UTC)
Maybe the lengthy political rant at the introduction of the article should be integrated (and NPOVed a little) with the history section. I think that the introduction should be mostly about technical features of the train. -- xDCDx 09:26, 12 July 2005 (UTC)
"The Army has protected AVE lines recently."
At the moment, there is a direct train service from Madrid to Barcelona which uses the high speed line from Madrid to its current temporary terminus at Lleida, the train continues on existing track to Barcelona. The train uses gauge changing Talgo stock with RENFE's 'Altaria' brand name. These trains can switch from the high speed standard gauge to spanish broad gauge at Lleida. Currently, there are six daily Altaria trains between Madrid to Barcelona taking 5 hours.
From next year, as the Wikepida article suggests, it's quite likely the high speed line will be extended to a new temporary terminus just east of Tarragona. The guage changing Altaria trains will then run on the high speed line all the way from Madrid via Llieda to just beyond Tarragona, and then switch to the existing line for the remaining 50km or so Barcelona. The high speed line will not serve Tarragona, but instead there will be a park and ride station north of city and also within proximity of Reus. This will reduce the journey time from Madrid to Barcelona by possible 30 mins to 4.5 hrs.
Once the standard guage line is complete all the way from Madrid to Barcelona, the purpose built high speed trains can the link the two cities. This will probably be in 2008.
Meanwhile, a high speed line linking Perpignan in France with Figueras in Spain is currently under construction and should be opened in 2009. In turn, there is a high speed line being developed between Figueras and Barcelona. If all these plans come to fruition, by 2009 there will be continous standard guage mostly high speed line from Paris all the way to Madrid opening up all sorts of possibilities for various TGV and AVE services between the two. With a journey time between the French and Spanish capitals of around eight hours, it's unlikely there will a regular through high speed service between the two. However, there may be variations on services connecting closer pairs of cities, for instance Barcelona to Paris in 5 hrs and Barcelona to Merseilles in under 3 hours. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.206.149.194 ( talk) 15:44, 22 August 2005 (UTC)
A Spanish Railway map I picked up ( http://www.alleuroperail.com/eurorailway-maps/spain-portugal-railway-map.htm) seems to show a high-speed Barcelona-Tarragona-Castellon-Valencia-Alicante line. Is this not an AVE line? The map doesn't show the partially completed Madrid-Barcelona or the Madrid-Malaga lines referenced in the map, though. - Binand — Preceding undated comment added 11:06, 16 October 2005 (UTC)
You are totally right, it is not an AVE, but un upgraded broad line, called the Euromed, because it links all the important Mediterranean cities in Spain located in Catalonia and Valencia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.37.253.152 ( talk) 16:42, 18 January 2006 (UTC)
>> Currently, five lines make up the AVE system:
>> AVE Larga Distancia (long distance) Madrid-Sevilla (Madrid, Ciudad Real, Puertollano, Córdoba, Sevilla) AVE Larga Distancia Madrid-Zaragoza-Lleida (Madrid, Guadalajara, Calatayud, Zaragoza, Lleida) AVE Lanzadera (shuttle) Madrid-Puertollano (Madrid, Ciudad Real, Puertollano) Talgo 200 Madrid-Málaga (Madrid, Ciudad Real, Puertollano, Córdoba, Málaga AV Media Distancia (Mid distance) Madrid - Toledo. <<
To me, the above is incorrect in several respects.
Would anyone like to confirm / correct this information before I attempt to incorporate it in the article? -- Picapica 11:36, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
There's written: >However, it has to be said that both Siemens and Talgo/Bombardier train sets have consistently failed to meet scheduled speed >targets. El Periódico newspaper carried an article in October 2005 reporting that the Talgo/Bombardier train set (nicknamed "El >Pato" or "The Duck" because of the locomotive's bill-like snout) would not be tested at 250 km in the near future.
The Bombardier Train works perfectly up to speeds of 300 km/h. At higher speeds there are troubles with ballast stones hitting the underframe. (The Spanisch AVE does not have a truck substructure without ballast like it is recomended for speeds above 300 km/h)
The Siemens train is not yet delivered. It is years late since the German compnay seems to have trouble to produce the train in Spain and delivers now all trains from their Krefeld factory.
The reasons for the trains not going faster on the AVE line is because they have stil to relay on the old Spanish standard train protection ASFA, since the new ETCS level 1 quipment is not working, neither the fixinstallation nor the onboard installation. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.254.100.106 ( talk) 08:41, 26 February 2006 (UTC)
I find this frangment of Future developpement section:
"When completed, the Madrid-Barcelona line should be the world's fastest long-distance train in commercial operation, with trains billed to reach a top speed of 350 km/h and covering the 600 km between the two cities in just 2.5 hours."
quite untrue.
TGV trains already (and this won't rather change) link Paris to Marseilles in 3 hours, which gives both faster journey and longer distance:
-- Madcap pl 08:05, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
I think is not very accurate to define the Basque "Y" as a linkage of the "three" Basques provices. It will link three basques provinces (the ones the "Basque Country" administrative autonomy in Spain) but leaving apart those basque provinces in the sud ouest of France and the Navarra autonomy which has a strong basque heritage and is traditionally considered origin of the Basque identity. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.53.47.104 ( talk) 15:58, 23 September 2006 (UTC)
Given that the subject is spanish high speed trains, I think that the main physical units should be km/h as they are in common use in all continental Europe. Franjesus 11:59, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
Should the place names be the standard English ones or local varieties? For example Sevilla is used here rather than Seville, and there is a mixture between the usage of Lérida and Lleida. The Encyclopaedia Britannica lists Lérida as its article title - therefore is that taken to be the name to be used in English? Jonny1047 15:25, 26 May 2007 (UTC)
There are these other names to change, too: Valencia-->València Alicante-->Alacant Figueras-->Figueres Castellón de la Plana-->Castelló de la Plana —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.170.21.148 ( talk • contribs) 15:42, 23 November 2007
There has been some debate over whether the comments attributed to the minister that the line will be limitted to 300km/h are a journalist's misrepresentation, when they actually meant that it was only raised to 300km/h temporarily and there will be another speed up when ETCS level 2 is available. If this is going to be the final limit, no one has told Siemens, for example. Discussion on Usenet would indicate that 350km/h is still intended. Dpeilow 19:00, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
just wondered why someone felt it necessary to go through and change the dates from eg. the 12th October 2007 to October 12 2007. I thought that kind of editing was against policy - as in if its a European article leave dates written the 'European' way, and as long as its consistent its ok! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jonny1047 ( talk • contribs) 10:50, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
Hi all, I've just read that someone has written that the map is "inaccurate". As I created the map myself, I have something to say. My source is a public document of the Spanish Ministry of Development ("Ministerio de Fomento"), in which there are detailed maps about the current and future high speed lines. You can read a complete English translation here.
About the lines in service, please bear in mind that the map states clearly that it is for December 2007. I uploaded the map last October, before the problems in Barcelona line were known, and that's why this line appeared in green. Now that we all know that the AVE trains will only reach Valladolid and Malaga by end December 2007 if there are no more technical problems, I've made a new version of the map updating the situation in Barcelona (now it appears yellow).
As soon as the Barcelona line is opened, probably during the first semester of 2008, I'll update the map again.
-- Assdl ( talk) 12:36, 7 December 2007 (UTC)
The spanish wikipedia has two separate articles on the subject, es:Alta Velocidad Española, which describes the rolling stock and services, and es:Alta velocidad ferroviaria en España, which describes the network and construction.
I support splitting the english AVE article along similar lines. Spain is currently undergoing a massive renovation of its train network, including (but not limited to) the construction of several new AVE lines. That project needs greater coverage. Alcuin ( talk) 16:50, 9 December 2007 (UTC)
I don't really see the point, as this is just an article about the AVE services and their lines etc. why not just create a separate article for 'High Speed Rail' in spain? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jonny1047 ( talk • contribs) 21:55, 18 January 2008 (UTC)
Two articles would indeed be best, I believe. And I think Jonny agrees to that; I don't think Alcuin really ment literally splitting the current text of this article, but rather disentangling the two articles. The two maps show the difference between high-speed lines and AVE services, and along those lines (ahem) a split could well be made. Classical geographer ( talk) 09:51, 19 January 2008 (UTC)
Turkey bought some high-speed train sets from Spain. Are they AVE?-- 78.180.50.60 ( talk) 13:33, 18 January 2008 (UTC)
The trains are not called AVE! They have names like Siemens S-103. AVE is just the brand name applied by RENFE, so unless RENFE is running the trains in Turkey I assume the Turkish rail operator will brand them something else. Jonny1047 ( talk) 21:52, 18 January 2008 (UTC)
In the section on other projects: "Another connection to the LGV is also planned, at either La Jonquera in Catalonia or Irun in the Basque Country." La Jonquera is the last town in Spain on the Barcelona-France motorway before the frontier, and lies more or less over the tunnel under construction for the Figueras-Perpignan line. The reference should be deleted. I assume the Irun connection would be an extension from the new line to Valladolid. -- JamesWim ( talk) 15:47, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
Someone has put down that other lines that are high speed but not AVE are run under the Alvia brand, but what about the EuroMed? is that not considered high speed by the same standards? or the Altaria (does that still exist) - they all run around 200kmh don't they? does anyone know? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jonny1047 ( talk • contribs) 19:27, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
Alvia run partly on the Highspeed network (250km/h) and partly on the old network (up to 200km/h). Euromed run entirely on the old network. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.54.207.161 ( talk) 15:16, 18 April 2008 (UTC)
Its not difficult as the Alvia trains can change gauge without stopping! The previous Altaria trains which ran the Madrid-Barcelona route could also change but had to stop in order to do so! Jonny1047 ( talk) 18:48, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
Until 7 February 2010 High-speed rail in Spain was a redirect to this page and I suggest it is kept that way. And the information should be merged into this page. (Similar discussion on about the TGV at Talk:TGV#Suggested_re-name). Any opinions on the subject? Prillen ( talk) 09:24, 11 February 2010 (UTC)
In favour: maintain a relationship with AVE, acronym for "Alta Velocidad Española" which is the almost exact translation of High Speed (Rail) of Spain, do not think that it is an excessive advertising of a company. While not relate these two articles simply supposed to hide information to the general public and that the navigation for a non Spanish-speaking person is more complicated. I do not think that this is a good policy for an encyclopedia like Wikipedia — Preceding unsigned comment added by Antonov3691 ( talk • contribs) 12:06, 25 March 2011 (UTC)
AVE services only account for the fastest trains in Spain. There are also the AVANT and Alvia services that have in-service speeds that fit accepted definitions of high-speed rail (i.e. over 200km/h). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.60.98.134 ( talk) 16:16, 16 April 2010 (UTC)
AVE is one of the services that offers Renfe. High-speed railway lines in Spain are also used by other Renfe services such as Avant (regional high-speed train), Alvia (adapted for both Iberian and Standard high-speed gauges) and other services that use the high-speed lines together with the classical lines built in Iberian gauge. Anyway, this article must be improved. Mllturro ( talk) 14:05, 12 January 2012 (UTC)
High-speed roads may be under a concession to some private operator. On that high-speed roads may pass a lot of buses from different private companies. There is similitude when we look at railroads and trains: railroads may be public or may be under a concession to some private operator http://www.networkrail.co.uk/ . And trains that use it may be public or manage by private companies http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/tocs_maps/tocs/ . Mixing those things (walkway and shoes) those not seems a good idea. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Rail Esoj Sevla ( talk) 18:42, 21 April 2010 (UTC)
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Speedy deletions at commons tend to take longer than they do on Wikipedia, so there is no rush to respond. If you feel the deletion can be contested then please do so (
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Cf
http://www.elperiodico.com/es/noticias/sociedad/ave-sufre-otro-reves-retrasa-hasta-2013-1531221
(includes map at
http://estaticos.elperiodico.com/resources/pdf/4/3/1331504775634.pdf )
for the present (12/3/2012) state of affairs.
The bottom line is that in Barcelona, 15 km remain to be completed, plus 9 km in Girona, in both cases track-laying, electrification and the rest, and that a delayed contract awarding procedure means that the line will not open this year, but rather in 2013 - probably around mid-year.
Vamos a ver... .) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 187.45.181.179 ( talk) 04:20, 21 March 2012 (UTC)
It seems there is a conflict on the provided information from Wikipedia regarding the top speed in which AVE operates during commercial service in Spain. In the beginning of this article it is stated:
"Alta Velocidad Española (AVE) is a service of high-speed rail in Spain operated by RENFE, the Spanish national railway company, at speeds of up to 310 km/h (193 mph)."
Later on Madrid–Valladolid line it is written:
"Trainsets used on this line include S-120 (max speed 250 km/h (155 mph)), S-130 (Patito, max speed 250 km/h (155 mph)) and the S102 (Pato, max speed 320 km/h/199 mph)".
In the article
AVE Class 103 under "In Service" section it is written:
"While the trains and the tracks were commissioned for a regular top speed of 350 km/h (220 mph), the train control and signalling system necessary for such operation, ETCS Level 2, was not ready for service. Thus commercial top speed is limited to the maximum Spanish authorities approve for the line with ETCS Level 1 since 7 May 2007, 300 km/h (186 mph)."
And again in the article
AVE Class 102 you can read:
"After the commissioning of the train control system ETCS Level 1, the top speed was increased in steps.[8] Since 7 May 2007,[9] the trains travel with the top speed targeted for the time being[7] 300 km/h (190 mph)."
Which is the correct one after all? 300 km/h? 310 km/h? 320 km/h? something else? Does anybody have a clue?
Clicklander (
talk)
10:06, 7 March 2013 (UTC)
Searched for the words "usage", "ridership" and "popularity" in the article and none turned up. If anyone has sources, I propose adding a section like TGV#Ridership to this article. AadaamS ( talk) 10:27, 24 October 2013 (UTC)
The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:AVE/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.
Article is well developed but needs more references, wikilinking seems erratic. Jezhotwells ( talk) 23:36, 23 May 2009 (UTC) |
Last edited at 23:36, 23 May 2009 (UTC). Substituted at 06:27, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
A discussion is taking place to address the redirect
High-speed rail in Spain. The discussion will occur at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2021 May 25#High-speed rail in Spain until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion.
King of ♥
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♣
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01:03, 25 May 2021 (UTC)
Two sources mention that the section valladolid - Burgos as active.
The commercial services are all Avia or MD (media distance). It could be that there are no AVE services terminating at Burgos and Avia services run on the high speed line change gauge at Burgos and continue. This seems unlikely as all trains take at least 1 hour 7 minutes, also the MD services. I suspect an opening this year. Smiley.toerist ( talk) 14:36, 18 February 2022 (UTC)
This article requires a complete rewrite. AVE is a high-speed rail service of Renfe, the State-owned train operator. The ADIF-owned high-speed network (the infrastructure) is used by services (Ouigo, Iryo) belonging to non-RENFE operators ( SNCF, ILSA ) as well as other RENFE services ( Alvia, Renfe Avant ...). Most of content of this article currently pertains the infrastructure, not the AVE services. That content should be located elsewhere, for example (preferably) in High-speed rail in Spain (currently a redirect to High-speed rail in Europe) or perhaps in Administrador de Infraestructuras Ferroviarias. Asqueladd ( talk) 17:30, 6 November 2022 (UTC)