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Isn't it a bit precious to use "É" all the way through? Accents are usually omitted from capital letters in French; one can use them, but why do it here? -- Mel Etitis ( Μελ Ετητης) 21:36, 29 September 2005 (UTC)
The accent issue is a false problem. It is true that for quite a long time, it has been thought to be unnecessary to keep the accent on capital letters. But this comes a technical inability of the old printing machines. In handwriting, we still have to write the accents. Nowadays, with the apparition of the computer, this issue is irrelevent and we yet again have to put the accents on capital letters.
Sseb22 05:28, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
Where should technical errors like the date of Edith Piaf's death being reported as the 10th at the top of the page and the 11th further down in the text be reported? I have similar errors on many pages and would like to let someone know about them. User Alan S12:10, 10 October 2005 (UTC)
The use of her "official" date of death troubles me greatly. Where is the evidence that she actually died on the 10th? Why is she "officially" said to have died on the 11th, if she actually died on the 10th? Where else in Wikipedia do we provide a date of death that we know is not the correct date? If there is indeed a discrepancy between her actual, proven, date of death and some "official" date, we should use the actual date in the article and give the official date in the footnote, not the other way around. JackofOz 01:14, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
Wendy McNeill does a fabulous song ( http://zed.cbc.ca/go?c=contentPage&CONTENT_ID=121650) about Edith Piaf. Kind of summarizes a lot of her life. FireWorks 20:31, 3 December 2005 (UTC)
I would appreciate your sending me information about where you obtained the biographical information for Edith Piaf on the Wikipedia website.
It is my understanding that Edith Piaf's real name is actually: Edith Annette Gisson Holliday. I do not believe that the name Gassion as listed on your website and a fake website with her grave marker is accurate. Also,I do not believe that Edith Piaf was Italian as some of the surnames you have listed would imply. Further, I do not believe that Edith Piaf is related to a circus performer or a madame of a bordello.
act" from 1935 until not long before her death, I don't see how anybody could credit the idea of her having been killed during WW II. If Warner did write such a book and if he did connect her to a relative with a brothel, that statement was not original with him. Terry J. Carter ( talk) 02:08, 22 July 2013 (UTC)
I heard a rumor recently that Senator John Warner wrote a Fake biography about Edith Piaf since he is making money selling her recordings. I am still investigating how Senator Warner is related to Edith Piaf and how he accessed Edith Piaf's recordings to sell after 1945 when there are people that have said Edith Piaf was actually killed during WWII by the Nazis because of her Jewish heritage the fact that she was related to French and Belgian royalty. One would wonder how Senator Warner left WWII in 1945 with Edith Piaf recordings in tow if Edith Piaf lived beyond WWII.
This does show why the article needs citations desperately.-- 76.182.88.254 04:48, 19 July 2007 (UTC)
I post alleged 'original research' and it gets vaporized in a nano second. rem486 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.255.86.240 ( talk) 21:27, 10 May 2008 (UTC)
I recently created an article for La Vie en Rose, so any contributions from people with knowledge about Edith's signature song would be appreciated - AKeen 16:01, 3 February 2006 (UTC)
It's pretty messy and unprofessional at the moment. Let's clean it up already.
Mark 23:40, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
The entirety of this article was deleted, without comment, due to alleged copyright violation a few days ago. It seems absurd to have nothing more than "a French singer" for possibly the most famous French chanteuse. I have supplied a translation, more or less bad, of the Piaf article at the French Wikipedia. But I think that some discussion would be warranted before yanking an entire article. RandomCritic 21:03, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
I don't mind if the article is reverted to the last pre-copyvio form, but I should note that there is a little information in the French article which could be incorporated; for instance, it clears up the October 10/October 11 death date question.
RandomCritic 05:13, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
There's a section with films without any explanation. Did she act in them or are they about her? AxelBoldt 07:24, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
Piaf appeared in all of them except "Edith et Marcel" which is about her. It seems that "Al diavolo la celebritá" was included erroneously, so I've deleted it. RandomCritic 20:05, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
someone obviously vandalized the article: From the age of three to seven she was blind, and from eight to fourteen she was deaf and suffered from severe Androgenetic alopecia.
Wathiik 07:38, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
The blindness / deafness issue seemed to me highly unlikely, so I took a look at the versions in other Wikipedias. Her blindness seems to be well-acknowledged, although w:de reports it as having occurred from the ago of 4 through 6 only. But deafness is mentioned only in the English version, with articles in other languages specifically mentioning that she is believed to have begun singing at age of ten. I think someone with access to a reputable biographical work should further investigate the issue. 62.57.0.221 10:34, 23 December 2006 (UTC)
2.9.07
I added the premiere of the film, "la mome", at the Berlin Film Festival February, 2007 in the legacy section.
"Today she is still remembered and revered as one of the greatest singers France has ever produced. [citation needed]"
Citation needed??? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 87.6.130.121 ( talk) 23:29, 28 April 2007 (UTC).
"Elvis Presley is still remembered and revered as one of the greatest rock'n'roll singer" [citation needed] pole25 20:25, 24 january 2008 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.32.75.131 ( talk)
I could say that I thought she was a singer whose reputation was enhanced by her premature death. That might not be true, but it is no more true to say that she is one of the greatest singers ever in France. However, a comment by a respected music critic saying that she was one of the greatest singers would make the statement more encyclopedic and not violate NPOV, which it seems to do now. 66.234.220.195 ( talk) 06:47, 2 March 2008 (UTC)
In the section "Death and Legacy", it's written "Today she is still remembered and revered as one of the greatest singers France has ever produced.[citation needed]".
Do we really need citation for that statement? It's like saying we need citation for Shakespeare being one of the greatest playwrights. I don't think to say she is "one of the greatest" is an exaggeration (much less a statement requiring citation), though saying she is the "greatest" would certainly be. Mmm...perhaps a better concession would be to rephrase the statement? Something enough to convey that she was recognised a being big in France in her day (almost equivalent so say Madonna or Celine Dion) and is certainly a cultural icon? Pristine 12:55, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
Whoops, I just noticed someone discussed this above. Anyhow, thoughts are still welcome.
Pristine 12:55, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
If it's so obvious, it shouldn't be hard to find a citation for the sentence. Citations are needed on Wikipedia no matter how obvious a statement may seem. That's how it works :) Just find a quick citation and add it. That is the least of this article's problems because most of the article lacks citation of any form.-- 76.182.88.254 04:44, 19 July 2007 (UTC)
"Edith Bunker, the mother on the TV series All in the Family, was named after her." - when I read this in the article's intro paragraph it was a true WTF moment! -- Salimfadhley 08:16, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
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An Image is needed for this article!!!-- Burgas00 16:56, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
Dear editors I just got a message that my addition of ckuik.com link to videos inspired by Edith Piaf is not allowed. Since I did not do it as to promote my website - it is a service since so many video clips there are great examples of her masterpieces - please put it back and let the visitors get the full picture.
Dr. Dafni —Preceding unsigned comment added by Nadav.dafni ( talk • contribs) 23:37, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
The place of death in this article is not the same as the French Wikipedia of Edith Piaf.
Is it normal ?
And in the movie (La Môme, 2007, Olivier Dahan), it is also showed that she died in Grasse. Sseb22 05:35, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
Is there any particular reason why we have no image of Piaf? I thought we were permitted to use fair use ones for people, if the person is dead. - EstoyAquí( t • c • e) 14:27, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
i don't know how to edit picture boxes etc... but the picture of edith's bust needs to be altered or shrunk or something because currently it is obscuring information about her songs —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
77.101.56.216 (
talk) 14:09, 26 April 2009 (UTC)
"The great love of Piaf's life,[3] the married boxer Marcel Cerdan, died in a plane crash in October 1949, while flying from New York City to Paris to meet her"
According to the PlaneCrashInfo database ( http://planecrashinfo.com/1949/1949-46.htm), the plane carrying Cerdan was en route *from Paris* *to NY*. There must be a factual error somewhere: either Piaf was in NY at the time, or Cerdan was not flying *to* her (but perhaps from her?), or the plane was indeed flying to Paris. Does anyone know, which is the case? Kostikrus ( talk) 23:16, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
This article: http://ngm.typepad.com/pop_omnivore/2008/02/and-the-omnie-1.html seems to corroborate the idea that Piaf did work for (even if indirectly) the French resistance during the war. The information comes from her sister-in-law, Christie Laume, who I would accept as an authoritative (if perhaps biased) source. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.91.171.198 ( talk) 07:47, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
Edith's song L'accordéoniste is referenced and used in the interpretation of Alan Bennetts History . —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.6.32.115 ( talk) 20:40, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
Has anyone any evidence that Piaf by Simone Berteaut, (Penguin 1973, ISBN 0 14 00 3669 5) is merely a fabrication? That Piaf and the author were NOT half sisters, and that Berteaut was merely one of Piaf's many hangers-on? If so, Berteaut still seems to know an awful lot of the 'legend' from the inside. Bluedawe 23:19, 2 June 2012 (UTC)
Some of the edits in this diff do not seem to be true. The statements are not necessarily found in the sources. Would someone please look into this? Thanks Jim1138 ( talk) 09:21, 7 July 2012 (UTC)
Why does the discography consist only of "compilations of Édith Piaf's songs, and not reissues of the titles released while Édith Piaf was active"? Is it not possible for someone to list the titles of the albums she actually made? 86.42.33.161 ( talk) 17:30, 29 October 2012 (UTC)
I am just a bit confused. The article says this:
She was named Édith after the World War I British nurse Edith Cavell, who was executed for helping French soldiers escape from German captivity.
The reference it provides is a dead link, so I can't verify. But since Piaf was born in 1908, before Cavell was executed for helping the French soldiers, I highly doubt this fact is true. From the Edith Cavell article, it seems that starting in 1907 and before 1910, Cavell was matron of a nursing school "L'École Belge d’Infirmières Diplômées on the Rue de la Culture in Brussels." Cavell only began assisting Allied soldiers in 1914.
The facts of the matter are this:
Given the above, I find it highly doubtful that Piaf would have been named after Cavell, since Cavell's wartime heroism had not yet occurred at that time.
I have tagged the reference in the article as a dead link, so that someone might try to dig up an archived version or another reference. Mûĸĸâĸûĸâĸû ( blah?) 03:49, 19 November 2012 (UTC)
At one point the article refers to [Theo Sarapo] as Edith's third husband, but only two marriages are ever mentioned. His wikipedia article makes the same assumption. Aebcoreno ( talk) 21:47, 13 March 2013 (UTC)
Janet Flanner, in the source I have cited two/three times already and am too rushed for time to repeat, but see above, says that Edith Piaf was born on a sidewalk and that two policemen assisted in the birth. Could it not have been possible that her mother and she were then taken to a hospital for further attention, and that a birth certificate was filled out there? That's beyond original no-no research, it's original speculation !!! but the answer to the birth dilemma might be "all of the above." Terry J. Carter ( talk) 02:18, 22 July 2013 (UTC)
German wikipedia explains the circumstances of her death rather well. Like other wikipedias, I think we should go for the 10th as her real date of death. Today it is 50 years ago.
Both French and English wikipedia mention the claim that she did not get a Roman Catholic funeral, because the Archbishop of Paris forbade it. However, I am old enough to remember the TV news item about her funeral and the general standstill in Paris as her body was taken to Pere Lachaise. I distinctly remember the broadcaster saying a funeral service had taken place at an Orthodox church. As I could not find that on any wikipedia, I thought my memory was faulty. A bit of googling, however, proved it was not. Photo of an Orthodox Priest Performing the Funeral Rites of Edith Piaf
Since Theo Sarapo was of Greek origin, one may wonder whether he ever envisaged an RC funeral. After all, the couple married at an Orthodox church as well. Can we be sure there really was a veto by the Archbishop? Of course, Edith may have asked for an RC funeral, and after the veto, Theo may have opted for the next best thing. Or Edith may have checked with RC priests before her death (she may have known that she would not live much longer), and have got the answer that there was a veto from the Archbishop. In any case, the fact that she did get a Christian burial anyway should be mentioned if we keep the story about the veto. -- Paul Pieniezny ( talk) 21:56, 10 October 2013 (UTC)
I'm making an edit to the section about the funeral being denied today, having seen this article quoted on a Reddit thread. The article before the edit states that she was denied a funeral Mass "because of her lifestyle", relying on a Guardian article from 2003. However the Guardian's own archives give a more complete reason, quoted at https://www.theguardian.com/theguardian/2008/oct/14/2 : that she had remarried after a divorce in a Greek Orthodox Church. "Remarriage" is impossible in Catholic theology while a valid marriage still exists, and resorting to a Orthodox Church to 'remarry' implies a choice to move from Catholic to Orthodox theology and jurisdiction - and a Catholic funeral Mass is not appropriate for someone who has made the choice to become Orthodox instead. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Daldred ( talk • contribs) 13:33, 4 February 2021 (UTC)
If the listed source claims her birth date is December 15, why is December 19 listed in introduction and the side bar box? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.35.161.105 ( talk) 03:35, 5 January 2014 (UTC)
Hi All, Just wanted to mention that I reworded the sentence "Probably the most famous use of one of her songs was in the film "Inception"." Édith Piaf was a superstar for decades, and according to this article some of her live recordings have "never been out of print." It doesn't seem fair to say that the most famous use of one of her songs is a novelty appearence in an American movie. 71.11.110.90 ( talk) 00:46, 20 March 2015 (UTC)
Were all Nazi collaborators it seems ... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.18.230.179 ( talk) 05:57, 26 June 2015 (UTC)
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Comment: this article is a shame for english Wikipedia. How it is possible that an article about Edith Piaf has in the first line that she was a "Cabaret Singer" ? It's enough to say that 70% of French artists (and of other nationalities on Paris) started singing on Cabarets, so why there's not a "Cabaret Singer" as the definition of Jacques Brel work, to use only one example? Ridiculous. Besides that, mentioning abhorred "rumors" about her life. It's sourced, but what really does matter a "rumor" having a source? So, there's a rumor about Edith Piaf's life, a very offensive rumor, but there's a source for the rumor, so it's ok. Ridiculous... Edith Piaf is too way important artist for having a biography of that level. Shame on Wikipedia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.6.227.188 ( talk) 06:20, 25 March 2017 (UTC)
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The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 09:40, 20 January 2019 (UTC)
@ NKM1974: let me explain. /i/ already includes the pronunciation [piːˈɑːf], in free variation with [pɪˈɑːf], so it is absolutely redundant to transcribe the former pronunciation separately. That’s how we should deal with these cases in Wikipedia transcriptions. American sources normally just use the same symbol that is used for phonemic /iː/, whence probably your confusion originates. 〜 イヴァンスクルージ九十八[IvanScrooge98]( 会話) 07:59, 16 September 2019 (UTC)
/ˈiːdɪθ/ does seem the most common way English speakers pronounce her first name at least based on Youglish, but Edith is also an English given name so we can't use a dictionary as a source for it unless it specifically gives /ˈiːdɪθ/ for Édith, with the acute; it also means /eɪˈdiːt/ given in M-W is most likely prescriptive (see this discussion [ perma]). /ˈpiːæf/, /pi(ː)ˈæf/, /ˈpiːɑːf/, and /pi(ː)ˈɑːf/ all do seem plausible and attested variants, but if we included them and cluttered the lead, it would be giving too much information to the point of giving no information. As for /iː/ vs. /i/, taken at face value, LPD is saying that the first syllable is not reduced—which is not readily discernible because all varieties of modern GA have the same quality in FLEECE and happY, but which could nonetheless be substantiated if a stress shift occurred in e.g. "a ˌPiaf ˈsong"—again, if taken at face value; it could be just a typo. Nardog ( talk) 19:02, 17 September 2019 (UTC)
According to Stephen Bach in his Dietrich bio, and Dietrich's daughter Maria Riva in her book Marlene Dietrich, Piaf and Dietrich were lovers. Margaret Crosland mentions that Ginette and Simone Berteaut lived with her, but says there was 'no lesbian relationship' with them. I have not yet checked this with other sources. Piaf is listed in the Wikipedia list of bisexual people, so shouldn't she have bisexual women, bisexual musicians/entertainers, bisexual actresses categories? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.197.12.104 ( talk) 16:56, 18 June 2022 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
GA toolbox |
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Reviewing |
Reviewer: TompaDompa ( talk · contribs) 00:28, 17 July 2023 (UTC)
This is a
WP:QUICKFAIL based on criterion 1 (It is a long way from meeting any one of the six good article criteria
) and 3 (It has, or needs, cleanup banners that are unquestionably still valid. These include {{
cleanup}}, {{
POV}}, {{
unreferenced}} or large numbers of {{
citation needed}}, {{
clarify}}, or similar tags (See also {{
QF}})
). Specifically, it fails
WP:GACR 1a (the prose is clear, concise, and
understandable to an appropriately broad audience; spelling and grammar are correct
), 1b (it complies with the
Manual of Style guidelines for
lead sections,
layout,
words to watch [...]
), and 2b (
reliable sources are
cited inline. All content that could
reasonably be challenged, except for plot summaries and that which summarizes cited content elsewhere in the article, must be cited no later than the end of the paragraph (or line if the content is not in prose)
), and needs the corresponding maintenance tags. I'll list some of the specific issues I noted while reading through the article:
As a general rule of thumb, a lead section should contain no more than four well-composed paragraphs. This could likely be fixed by judiciously merging paragraphs. I see no reason the first two paragraphs couldn't be a single paragraph, for instance.
Édith Piaf (born Édith Gassion; 19 December 1915 – 10 October 1963) was a French singer [...]and
She was born Édith Giovanna Gassion in Paris in 1915 to Annetta Giovanna Maillard.repeat the birth name (somewhat self-contradictorily) and year of birth needlessly.
Her most widely known songs include " La Vie en rose" (1946)and
Piaf's signature song, La Vie en rose ("life in pink") was published in 1945repeat information about the song and introduce a contradiction about the year.
Her stage name Édith Piaf was created at the age of twenty, when she started her singing career.and
Piaf was acquited and changed her stage name to Édith Piaf.both introduce the stage name. "Acquited" should also be "acquitted".
Piaf's father was Louis Alphonse Gassion, an acrobatic street performer.and
she accompanied her father on tours around France performing street acrobaticscould be combined to avoid mention street acrobatics twice.
Piaf was partly raised by her paternal grandmother in Bethandy, Normandy.– that should be Bernay, right? That's what the body says.
From 1940-1944– see MOS:ENFROM. The hyphen should be an en dash, but there shouldn't be a dash at all when preceded by "from".
Piaf met actor/singer Yves Montand– see MOS:SLASH.
the two conducted an affair– this phrasing seems a bit odd.
Her last song, L'Homme de Berlin was recorded with her husband in April 1963.– the husband in question has not yet been mentioned at this point, which means the reader does not have the necessary context here.
Despite numerous biographies, much of Piaf's life is unknown.– the source only says
If even half of Olivier Dahan's robust film about Piaf's life is true -- and let's face it, much remains shrouded in myth and mystery, making no point about biographies. "Despite X, Y" is textbook WP:Synthesis.
sparrow (a small bird)– I doubt we need to gloss "sparrow", especially if it's linked.
Piaf took a room at the Grand Hôtel de Clermont in Paris and worked with Berteaut as a street singer around Paris and its suburbs.– unsourced.
Leplée persuaded Piaf (then known by her birth name of Édith Gassion)– this is just a very clumsy way of writing it. I would suggest writing that he persuaded "her".
A barrage of negative media attention now threatened Piaf's career.–this is the kind of WP:EMPHATIC language WP:Writing better articles advises against.
This song was entered into the Grammy Hall of Fame in 1998.– unsourced.
In April 1963, Piaf recorded her last song before her death, titled L'Homme de Berlin.– unsourced.
In October 1949, Cerdan flew from Paris to New York City to meet Piaf, however his flight was Air France Flight 009 which crashed while attempting to land at a stopover in Portugal.– rather clumsy way of including the link to Air France Flight 009.
Piaf's drug dependencies are attributed– by whom?
the two remained married until Piaf's death.– unsourced.
before passing away– MOS:EUPHEMISM.
In 1973, the Association of the Friends of Édith Piaf was formed, followed by the inauguration of the Place Édith Piaf in Belleville in 1981. Soviet astronomer Lyudmila Georgievna Karachkina named a small planet, 3772 Piaf, in her honor.– unsourced.
I wish you the best of luck with this article in the future, and hope to see it renominated once the issues listed above have been addressed. In the meantime, I'll add some maintenance tags to the article. TompaDompa ( talk) 00:28, 17 July 2023 (UTC)
Many other biographies on the Internet mention the birth of a daughter. https://uofa.ru/en/biografiya-golosa-parizha-edit-piaf-sudba-malyshki-s-golosom/ Grandma Roses ( talk) 12:12, 10 October 2023 (UTC)
Édith Piaf was nominated as a Music good article, but it did not meet the good article criteria at the time (July 17, 2023, reviewed version). There are suggestions on the review page for improving the article. If you can improve it, please do; it may then be renominated. |
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Isn't it a bit precious to use "É" all the way through? Accents are usually omitted from capital letters in French; one can use them, but why do it here? -- Mel Etitis ( Μελ Ετητης) 21:36, 29 September 2005 (UTC)
The accent issue is a false problem. It is true that for quite a long time, it has been thought to be unnecessary to keep the accent on capital letters. But this comes a technical inability of the old printing machines. In handwriting, we still have to write the accents. Nowadays, with the apparition of the computer, this issue is irrelevent and we yet again have to put the accents on capital letters.
Sseb22 05:28, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
Where should technical errors like the date of Edith Piaf's death being reported as the 10th at the top of the page and the 11th further down in the text be reported? I have similar errors on many pages and would like to let someone know about them. User Alan S12:10, 10 October 2005 (UTC)
The use of her "official" date of death troubles me greatly. Where is the evidence that she actually died on the 10th? Why is she "officially" said to have died on the 11th, if she actually died on the 10th? Where else in Wikipedia do we provide a date of death that we know is not the correct date? If there is indeed a discrepancy between her actual, proven, date of death and some "official" date, we should use the actual date in the article and give the official date in the footnote, not the other way around. JackofOz 01:14, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
Wendy McNeill does a fabulous song ( http://zed.cbc.ca/go?c=contentPage&CONTENT_ID=121650) about Edith Piaf. Kind of summarizes a lot of her life. FireWorks 20:31, 3 December 2005 (UTC)
I would appreciate your sending me information about where you obtained the biographical information for Edith Piaf on the Wikipedia website.
It is my understanding that Edith Piaf's real name is actually: Edith Annette Gisson Holliday. I do not believe that the name Gassion as listed on your website and a fake website with her grave marker is accurate. Also,I do not believe that Edith Piaf was Italian as some of the surnames you have listed would imply. Further, I do not believe that Edith Piaf is related to a circus performer or a madame of a bordello.
act" from 1935 until not long before her death, I don't see how anybody could credit the idea of her having been killed during WW II. If Warner did write such a book and if he did connect her to a relative with a brothel, that statement was not original with him. Terry J. Carter ( talk) 02:08, 22 July 2013 (UTC)
I heard a rumor recently that Senator John Warner wrote a Fake biography about Edith Piaf since he is making money selling her recordings. I am still investigating how Senator Warner is related to Edith Piaf and how he accessed Edith Piaf's recordings to sell after 1945 when there are people that have said Edith Piaf was actually killed during WWII by the Nazis because of her Jewish heritage the fact that she was related to French and Belgian royalty. One would wonder how Senator Warner left WWII in 1945 with Edith Piaf recordings in tow if Edith Piaf lived beyond WWII.
This does show why the article needs citations desperately.-- 76.182.88.254 04:48, 19 July 2007 (UTC)
I post alleged 'original research' and it gets vaporized in a nano second. rem486 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.255.86.240 ( talk) 21:27, 10 May 2008 (UTC)
I recently created an article for La Vie en Rose, so any contributions from people with knowledge about Edith's signature song would be appreciated - AKeen 16:01, 3 February 2006 (UTC)
It's pretty messy and unprofessional at the moment. Let's clean it up already.
Mark 23:40, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
The entirety of this article was deleted, without comment, due to alleged copyright violation a few days ago. It seems absurd to have nothing more than "a French singer" for possibly the most famous French chanteuse. I have supplied a translation, more or less bad, of the Piaf article at the French Wikipedia. But I think that some discussion would be warranted before yanking an entire article. RandomCritic 21:03, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
I don't mind if the article is reverted to the last pre-copyvio form, but I should note that there is a little information in the French article which could be incorporated; for instance, it clears up the October 10/October 11 death date question.
RandomCritic 05:13, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
There's a section with films without any explanation. Did she act in them or are they about her? AxelBoldt 07:24, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
Piaf appeared in all of them except "Edith et Marcel" which is about her. It seems that "Al diavolo la celebritá" was included erroneously, so I've deleted it. RandomCritic 20:05, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
someone obviously vandalized the article: From the age of three to seven she was blind, and from eight to fourteen she was deaf and suffered from severe Androgenetic alopecia.
Wathiik 07:38, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
The blindness / deafness issue seemed to me highly unlikely, so I took a look at the versions in other Wikipedias. Her blindness seems to be well-acknowledged, although w:de reports it as having occurred from the ago of 4 through 6 only. But deafness is mentioned only in the English version, with articles in other languages specifically mentioning that she is believed to have begun singing at age of ten. I think someone with access to a reputable biographical work should further investigate the issue. 62.57.0.221 10:34, 23 December 2006 (UTC)
2.9.07
I added the premiere of the film, "la mome", at the Berlin Film Festival February, 2007 in the legacy section.
"Today she is still remembered and revered as one of the greatest singers France has ever produced. [citation needed]"
Citation needed??? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 87.6.130.121 ( talk) 23:29, 28 April 2007 (UTC).
"Elvis Presley is still remembered and revered as one of the greatest rock'n'roll singer" [citation needed] pole25 20:25, 24 january 2008 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.32.75.131 ( talk)
I could say that I thought she was a singer whose reputation was enhanced by her premature death. That might not be true, but it is no more true to say that she is one of the greatest singers ever in France. However, a comment by a respected music critic saying that she was one of the greatest singers would make the statement more encyclopedic and not violate NPOV, which it seems to do now. 66.234.220.195 ( talk) 06:47, 2 March 2008 (UTC)
In the section "Death and Legacy", it's written "Today she is still remembered and revered as one of the greatest singers France has ever produced.[citation needed]".
Do we really need citation for that statement? It's like saying we need citation for Shakespeare being one of the greatest playwrights. I don't think to say she is "one of the greatest" is an exaggeration (much less a statement requiring citation), though saying she is the "greatest" would certainly be. Mmm...perhaps a better concession would be to rephrase the statement? Something enough to convey that she was recognised a being big in France in her day (almost equivalent so say Madonna or Celine Dion) and is certainly a cultural icon? Pristine 12:55, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
Whoops, I just noticed someone discussed this above. Anyhow, thoughts are still welcome.
Pristine 12:55, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
If it's so obvious, it shouldn't be hard to find a citation for the sentence. Citations are needed on Wikipedia no matter how obvious a statement may seem. That's how it works :) Just find a quick citation and add it. That is the least of this article's problems because most of the article lacks citation of any form.-- 76.182.88.254 04:44, 19 July 2007 (UTC)
"Edith Bunker, the mother on the TV series All in the Family, was named after her." - when I read this in the article's intro paragraph it was a true WTF moment! -- Salimfadhley 08:16, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
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BetacommandBot 01:59, 2 August 2007 (UTC)
An Image is needed for this article!!!-- Burgas00 16:56, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
Dear editors I just got a message that my addition of ckuik.com link to videos inspired by Edith Piaf is not allowed. Since I did not do it as to promote my website - it is a service since so many video clips there are great examples of her masterpieces - please put it back and let the visitors get the full picture.
Dr. Dafni —Preceding unsigned comment added by Nadav.dafni ( talk • contribs) 23:37, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
The place of death in this article is not the same as the French Wikipedia of Edith Piaf.
Is it normal ?
And in the movie (La Môme, 2007, Olivier Dahan), it is also showed that she died in Grasse. Sseb22 05:35, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
Is there any particular reason why we have no image of Piaf? I thought we were permitted to use fair use ones for people, if the person is dead. - EstoyAquí( t • c • e) 14:27, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
i don't know how to edit picture boxes etc... but the picture of edith's bust needs to be altered or shrunk or something because currently it is obscuring information about her songs —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
77.101.56.216 (
talk) 14:09, 26 April 2009 (UTC)
"The great love of Piaf's life,[3] the married boxer Marcel Cerdan, died in a plane crash in October 1949, while flying from New York City to Paris to meet her"
According to the PlaneCrashInfo database ( http://planecrashinfo.com/1949/1949-46.htm), the plane carrying Cerdan was en route *from Paris* *to NY*. There must be a factual error somewhere: either Piaf was in NY at the time, or Cerdan was not flying *to* her (but perhaps from her?), or the plane was indeed flying to Paris. Does anyone know, which is the case? Kostikrus ( talk) 23:16, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
This article: http://ngm.typepad.com/pop_omnivore/2008/02/and-the-omnie-1.html seems to corroborate the idea that Piaf did work for (even if indirectly) the French resistance during the war. The information comes from her sister-in-law, Christie Laume, who I would accept as an authoritative (if perhaps biased) source. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.91.171.198 ( talk) 07:47, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
Edith's song L'accordéoniste is referenced and used in the interpretation of Alan Bennetts History . —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.6.32.115 ( talk) 20:40, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
Has anyone any evidence that Piaf by Simone Berteaut, (Penguin 1973, ISBN 0 14 00 3669 5) is merely a fabrication? That Piaf and the author were NOT half sisters, and that Berteaut was merely one of Piaf's many hangers-on? If so, Berteaut still seems to know an awful lot of the 'legend' from the inside. Bluedawe 23:19, 2 June 2012 (UTC)
Some of the edits in this diff do not seem to be true. The statements are not necessarily found in the sources. Would someone please look into this? Thanks Jim1138 ( talk) 09:21, 7 July 2012 (UTC)
Why does the discography consist only of "compilations of Édith Piaf's songs, and not reissues of the titles released while Édith Piaf was active"? Is it not possible for someone to list the titles of the albums she actually made? 86.42.33.161 ( talk) 17:30, 29 October 2012 (UTC)
I am just a bit confused. The article says this:
She was named Édith after the World War I British nurse Edith Cavell, who was executed for helping French soldiers escape from German captivity.
The reference it provides is a dead link, so I can't verify. But since Piaf was born in 1908, before Cavell was executed for helping the French soldiers, I highly doubt this fact is true. From the Edith Cavell article, it seems that starting in 1907 and before 1910, Cavell was matron of a nursing school "L'École Belge d’Infirmières Diplômées on the Rue de la Culture in Brussels." Cavell only began assisting Allied soldiers in 1914.
The facts of the matter are this:
Given the above, I find it highly doubtful that Piaf would have been named after Cavell, since Cavell's wartime heroism had not yet occurred at that time.
I have tagged the reference in the article as a dead link, so that someone might try to dig up an archived version or another reference. Mûĸĸâĸûĸâĸû ( blah?) 03:49, 19 November 2012 (UTC)
At one point the article refers to [Theo Sarapo] as Edith's third husband, but only two marriages are ever mentioned. His wikipedia article makes the same assumption. Aebcoreno ( talk) 21:47, 13 March 2013 (UTC)
Janet Flanner, in the source I have cited two/three times already and am too rushed for time to repeat, but see above, says that Edith Piaf was born on a sidewalk and that two policemen assisted in the birth. Could it not have been possible that her mother and she were then taken to a hospital for further attention, and that a birth certificate was filled out there? That's beyond original no-no research, it's original speculation !!! but the answer to the birth dilemma might be "all of the above." Terry J. Carter ( talk) 02:18, 22 July 2013 (UTC)
German wikipedia explains the circumstances of her death rather well. Like other wikipedias, I think we should go for the 10th as her real date of death. Today it is 50 years ago.
Both French and English wikipedia mention the claim that she did not get a Roman Catholic funeral, because the Archbishop of Paris forbade it. However, I am old enough to remember the TV news item about her funeral and the general standstill in Paris as her body was taken to Pere Lachaise. I distinctly remember the broadcaster saying a funeral service had taken place at an Orthodox church. As I could not find that on any wikipedia, I thought my memory was faulty. A bit of googling, however, proved it was not. Photo of an Orthodox Priest Performing the Funeral Rites of Edith Piaf
Since Theo Sarapo was of Greek origin, one may wonder whether he ever envisaged an RC funeral. After all, the couple married at an Orthodox church as well. Can we be sure there really was a veto by the Archbishop? Of course, Edith may have asked for an RC funeral, and after the veto, Theo may have opted for the next best thing. Or Edith may have checked with RC priests before her death (she may have known that she would not live much longer), and have got the answer that there was a veto from the Archbishop. In any case, the fact that she did get a Christian burial anyway should be mentioned if we keep the story about the veto. -- Paul Pieniezny ( talk) 21:56, 10 October 2013 (UTC)
I'm making an edit to the section about the funeral being denied today, having seen this article quoted on a Reddit thread. The article before the edit states that she was denied a funeral Mass "because of her lifestyle", relying on a Guardian article from 2003. However the Guardian's own archives give a more complete reason, quoted at https://www.theguardian.com/theguardian/2008/oct/14/2 : that she had remarried after a divorce in a Greek Orthodox Church. "Remarriage" is impossible in Catholic theology while a valid marriage still exists, and resorting to a Orthodox Church to 'remarry' implies a choice to move from Catholic to Orthodox theology and jurisdiction - and a Catholic funeral Mass is not appropriate for someone who has made the choice to become Orthodox instead. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Daldred ( talk • contribs) 13:33, 4 February 2021 (UTC)
If the listed source claims her birth date is December 15, why is December 19 listed in introduction and the side bar box? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.35.161.105 ( talk) 03:35, 5 January 2014 (UTC)
Hi All, Just wanted to mention that I reworded the sentence "Probably the most famous use of one of her songs was in the film "Inception"." Édith Piaf was a superstar for decades, and according to this article some of her live recordings have "never been out of print." It doesn't seem fair to say that the most famous use of one of her songs is a novelty appearence in an American movie. 71.11.110.90 ( talk) 00:46, 20 March 2015 (UTC)
Were all Nazi collaborators it seems ... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.18.230.179 ( talk) 05:57, 26 June 2015 (UTC)
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Comment: this article is a shame for english Wikipedia. How it is possible that an article about Edith Piaf has in the first line that she was a "Cabaret Singer" ? It's enough to say that 70% of French artists (and of other nationalities on Paris) started singing on Cabarets, so why there's not a "Cabaret Singer" as the definition of Jacques Brel work, to use only one example? Ridiculous. Besides that, mentioning abhorred "rumors" about her life. It's sourced, but what really does matter a "rumor" having a source? So, there's a rumor about Edith Piaf's life, a very offensive rumor, but there's a source for the rumor, so it's ok. Ridiculous... Edith Piaf is too way important artist for having a biography of that level. Shame on Wikipedia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.6.227.188 ( talk) 06:20, 25 March 2017 (UTC)
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@ NKM1974: let me explain. /i/ already includes the pronunciation [piːˈɑːf], in free variation with [pɪˈɑːf], so it is absolutely redundant to transcribe the former pronunciation separately. That’s how we should deal with these cases in Wikipedia transcriptions. American sources normally just use the same symbol that is used for phonemic /iː/, whence probably your confusion originates. 〜 イヴァンスクルージ九十八[IvanScrooge98]( 会話) 07:59, 16 September 2019 (UTC)
/ˈiːdɪθ/ does seem the most common way English speakers pronounce her first name at least based on Youglish, but Edith is also an English given name so we can't use a dictionary as a source for it unless it specifically gives /ˈiːdɪθ/ for Édith, with the acute; it also means /eɪˈdiːt/ given in M-W is most likely prescriptive (see this discussion [ perma]). /ˈpiːæf/, /pi(ː)ˈæf/, /ˈpiːɑːf/, and /pi(ː)ˈɑːf/ all do seem plausible and attested variants, but if we included them and cluttered the lead, it would be giving too much information to the point of giving no information. As for /iː/ vs. /i/, taken at face value, LPD is saying that the first syllable is not reduced—which is not readily discernible because all varieties of modern GA have the same quality in FLEECE and happY, but which could nonetheless be substantiated if a stress shift occurred in e.g. "a ˌPiaf ˈsong"—again, if taken at face value; it could be just a typo. Nardog ( talk) 19:02, 17 September 2019 (UTC)
According to Stephen Bach in his Dietrich bio, and Dietrich's daughter Maria Riva in her book Marlene Dietrich, Piaf and Dietrich were lovers. Margaret Crosland mentions that Ginette and Simone Berteaut lived with her, but says there was 'no lesbian relationship' with them. I have not yet checked this with other sources. Piaf is listed in the Wikipedia list of bisexual people, so shouldn't she have bisexual women, bisexual musicians/entertainers, bisexual actresses categories? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.197.12.104 ( talk) 16:56, 18 June 2022 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
GA toolbox |
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Reviewing |
Reviewer: TompaDompa ( talk · contribs) 00:28, 17 July 2023 (UTC)
This is a
WP:QUICKFAIL based on criterion 1 (It is a long way from meeting any one of the six good article criteria
) and 3 (It has, or needs, cleanup banners that are unquestionably still valid. These include {{
cleanup}}, {{
POV}}, {{
unreferenced}} or large numbers of {{
citation needed}}, {{
clarify}}, or similar tags (See also {{
QF}})
). Specifically, it fails
WP:GACR 1a (the prose is clear, concise, and
understandable to an appropriately broad audience; spelling and grammar are correct
), 1b (it complies with the
Manual of Style guidelines for
lead sections,
layout,
words to watch [...]
), and 2b (
reliable sources are
cited inline. All content that could
reasonably be challenged, except for plot summaries and that which summarizes cited content elsewhere in the article, must be cited no later than the end of the paragraph (or line if the content is not in prose)
), and needs the corresponding maintenance tags. I'll list some of the specific issues I noted while reading through the article:
As a general rule of thumb, a lead section should contain no more than four well-composed paragraphs. This could likely be fixed by judiciously merging paragraphs. I see no reason the first two paragraphs couldn't be a single paragraph, for instance.
Édith Piaf (born Édith Gassion; 19 December 1915 – 10 October 1963) was a French singer [...]and
She was born Édith Giovanna Gassion in Paris in 1915 to Annetta Giovanna Maillard.repeat the birth name (somewhat self-contradictorily) and year of birth needlessly.
Her most widely known songs include " La Vie en rose" (1946)and
Piaf's signature song, La Vie en rose ("life in pink") was published in 1945repeat information about the song and introduce a contradiction about the year.
Her stage name Édith Piaf was created at the age of twenty, when she started her singing career.and
Piaf was acquited and changed her stage name to Édith Piaf.both introduce the stage name. "Acquited" should also be "acquitted".
Piaf's father was Louis Alphonse Gassion, an acrobatic street performer.and
she accompanied her father on tours around France performing street acrobaticscould be combined to avoid mention street acrobatics twice.
Piaf was partly raised by her paternal grandmother in Bethandy, Normandy.– that should be Bernay, right? That's what the body says.
From 1940-1944– see MOS:ENFROM. The hyphen should be an en dash, but there shouldn't be a dash at all when preceded by "from".
Piaf met actor/singer Yves Montand– see MOS:SLASH.
the two conducted an affair– this phrasing seems a bit odd.
Her last song, L'Homme de Berlin was recorded with her husband in April 1963.– the husband in question has not yet been mentioned at this point, which means the reader does not have the necessary context here.
Despite numerous biographies, much of Piaf's life is unknown.– the source only says
If even half of Olivier Dahan's robust film about Piaf's life is true -- and let's face it, much remains shrouded in myth and mystery, making no point about biographies. "Despite X, Y" is textbook WP:Synthesis.
sparrow (a small bird)– I doubt we need to gloss "sparrow", especially if it's linked.
Piaf took a room at the Grand Hôtel de Clermont in Paris and worked with Berteaut as a street singer around Paris and its suburbs.– unsourced.
Leplée persuaded Piaf (then known by her birth name of Édith Gassion)– this is just a very clumsy way of writing it. I would suggest writing that he persuaded "her".
A barrage of negative media attention now threatened Piaf's career.–this is the kind of WP:EMPHATIC language WP:Writing better articles advises against.
This song was entered into the Grammy Hall of Fame in 1998.– unsourced.
In April 1963, Piaf recorded her last song before her death, titled L'Homme de Berlin.– unsourced.
In October 1949, Cerdan flew from Paris to New York City to meet Piaf, however his flight was Air France Flight 009 which crashed while attempting to land at a stopover in Portugal.– rather clumsy way of including the link to Air France Flight 009.
Piaf's drug dependencies are attributed– by whom?
the two remained married until Piaf's death.– unsourced.
before passing away– MOS:EUPHEMISM.
In 1973, the Association of the Friends of Édith Piaf was formed, followed by the inauguration of the Place Édith Piaf in Belleville in 1981. Soviet astronomer Lyudmila Georgievna Karachkina named a small planet, 3772 Piaf, in her honor.– unsourced.
I wish you the best of luck with this article in the future, and hope to see it renominated once the issues listed above have been addressed. In the meantime, I'll add some maintenance tags to the article. TompaDompa ( talk) 00:28, 17 July 2023 (UTC)
Many other biographies on the Internet mention the birth of a daughter. https://uofa.ru/en/biografiya-golosa-parizha-edit-piaf-sudba-malyshki-s-golosom/ Grandma Roses ( talk) 12:12, 10 October 2023 (UTC)