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Los Angeles was one of the Geography and places good articles, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.

Article milestones Date Process Result November 24, 2005 Good article nominee Listed August 9, 2008 Good article reassessment Delisted October 5, 2008 Peer review Reviewed January 23, 2015 Good article nominee Not listed Facts from this article were featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the " On this day..." column on April 4, 2004, September 4, 2004, April 4, 2010, September 4, 2011, September 4, 2015, and September 4, 2019. Current status: Delisted good article

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Add the official plant of Los Angeles is Toyon (Heteromeles arbutifolia), to the Los Angeles page. I would like this to be added to the vegetation section. A source can be found here ^[1] Matthewgraham027 ( talk) 03:29, 15 December 2023 (UTC) reply

 Done Jonathan Deamer ( talk) 18:15, 15 December 2023 (UTC) reply

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Spanish, Vietnamese, Hmong, Cantonese, Tagalog, Korean, Armenian, Russian, Farsi, Khmer and Hebrew are the most common non-English languages spoken in L.A. Add this information to the demographics section.

Source: https://www.britannica.com/place/Los-Angeles-California/City-layout#ref10136 91.192.81.61 ( talk) 13:46, 20 December 2023 (UTC) reply

 Not done: I think that's too many languages to write that they "are the most common". Deltaspace⁴² ( talk • contribs) 15:04, 20 December 2023 (UTC) reply

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Los Angeles has the largest Native American population. Add to demographics section.

Source: https://www.visitcalifornia.com/experience/explore-native-american-culture-california/#:~:text=Los%20Angeles%20has%20the%20largest,Kitanemuk%2C%20Serrano%2C%20and%20Tataviam. 91.192.81.61 ( talk) 13:51, 20 December 2023 (UTC) reply

 Not done: I doubt that this website should be considered a reliable source for such claims. Deltaspace⁴² ( talk • contribs) 15:02, 20 December 2023 (UTC) reply

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Change "During Mexican rule, Governor Pío Pico made Los Angeles, Alta California's regional capital." to "During Mexican rule, Governor Pío Pico made Los Angeles the regional capital of Alta California." This is the second sentence of the Mexican Rule section of the History section of the Los Angeles page. The comma between "Los Angeles" and "Alta California" seems grammatically incorrect, and, even if it isn't, the sentence reads better with this change. I know it's picky, I'm sorry! Sgd1441 ( talk) 01:19, 5 January 2024 (UTC) reply

 Done Peterlaxamazing ( talk) 19:32, 5 January 2024 (UTC) reply

Both my edits, on Philly and on LA lede were reverted, first without any explanation, but soon enough next rv had some, I see it, really superficial explanation on both instances. My edit was about following almost universal encyclopedic standard where article on a city, town and/or village starts with "Foo city/town/village is a city/town/village in a Foo-country" and follows it with all necessary and relevant minutiae. (See Britannica; Los Angeles A to Z, etc) These two articles follow a pattern that is turned on its head. The explanation is that readers supposedly already now its a city in the US. Well, readers know many things, but we still write about it in a proper way - this is not a reason to mention the fact that a city is in a certain country only after we buried it in third or fourth row with bunch of detailed info, which is further explanation for these reverts - "go into details" says User:Reywas92. They also claim my edit is repetitive, which is really unwarranted claim, first because I checked next few sentences to avoid obvious repetition, and after all, it is repetitive anyway, even without my edits it repeats statements and info because it is hard to avoid it. Insistence on status quo at any cost, no matter how light edit which follows fairly usual pattern is, appears to be superficial. Point is that articles on any city on the planet should start exactly like an article on the New York City (which I did not edit) - Foo-city is the city in the Foo-country. This fact should not be buried in the third or fourth line of the article with half a dozen of other administrative names, and the reader should not be forced to "go into the details" to find information about the country first. ౪ Santa ౪ ^99° 19:38, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply

The first sentence says that it's in the US state of California. I think that's soon enough to mention what country it's in. The first sentence doesn't have to follow some pure boilerplate form.

That said, I think we can happily lose officially the City of Los Angeles. As far as I know all California cities have a "city of" form (sometimes it sounds kind of silly, like "city of Culver City"), but these are not the name of the city so much as the name of the governmental entity, and I don't think they're informative enough to put in the first sentence.

If we dropped the "city of" part we would get to "US" faster -- Santasa99, would you find that an improvement? -- Trovatore ( talk) 19:55, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply

I would be happy with the link to United States article in the first sentence; not US state or some other complicated way of describing it. I mean, with all of yours and concerns raised by the reverting editor taken into consideration, it would not be some kind of gargantuan work to reconfigure first para in the lede to get a first sentence look more like one on NYC, and still retain all other existing info. It wouldn't change anything to give a reader a clear information about the city and a country first, without forcing them to read through myriad of administrative divisions and detailed info only to learn what is the country. (It shouldn't be of any relevance for us if city is Berlin, LA, or Tuzla in Turkey or Tuzla in Bosnia). All being said, I will accept everything agreed upon here (and I certainly don't wish to make it heavy experience to anyone willing to discuss it). ౪ Santa ౪ ^99° 20:17, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply

Sorry, I have pretty much zero sympathy for any wish to link specifically to United States in preference to US state. I don't think we really need to tell readers that US states are in the United States, and there is no immediate need to go to the article on the United States. -- Trovatore ( talk) 21:01, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply

Just by the way, expect pushback whenever you refer to US states as "administrative divisions". -- Trovatore ( talk) 21:02, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply

Having in mind that English language is "lingua franca" of our time, and thus English Wikipedia project practically international project, I would prefer standard encyclopedic description of the United States' cities and settlements, where a settlement is immediately linked to a country, regardless of what anyone can think readers should or should not know in advance. If we can have New York article properly opened with a statement "New York is the largest city in the United States. It is located...." there is no reason not to have similar opening statement on every other article about settlements in any country.

I can't speak about "pushback" on administrative division when considering US states, although it sounds terribly strange (read terrifying) to hear that and think about its implications; I always thought Americans are terribly patriotic (read frighteningly) about US but never nationalistic or tribal regarding their feelings of belonging to particular "state" - that's truly frighting to outsider like myself who lived through nationalism and ethnic lunacy of " blut und boden" ideology.

But now, after your initial post, I do feel your reverts have lot more in common with "pushback" for the sake of a pushback than with possibility that my edit was potentially harmful for lede's integrity and readability. ౪ Santa ౪ ^99° 22:07, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply

Point of history — I did not revert you. And I too am anti-nationalist. US states are not nations, but they are not "administrative divisions" either; they share sovereignty with the national government

My judgment is that, when you think of LA, you think of California before you think of the United States, and I think this is likely true worldwide. But even for cities in much less known states, the "U.S. state" formulation seems to be pretty standard — check out Albuquerque for example. If you really want to shift to a standard of mentioning the United States first after the city name, in all US city articles, you've got a much bigger job than this article. The NYC article looks like the outlier (from the small sample I've checked), and that one might be just because it's the biggest city in the US. -- Trovatore ( talk) 02:55, 22 January 2024 (UTC) reply

I know that you did not rv my edits, that was Raywas92. If I am correct, you did some mild corrections taking my concern into consideration, and that was cool, I appreciate it. ౪ Santa ౪ ^99° 17:07, 22 January 2024 (UTC) reply

What I mean by repetitive is that you edit began with "is the city in the United States." which was followed by "L.A. is the most populous city in the U.S. state of California". So now "city" is repeated and the U.S. is repeated. This is not an efficient way to write. Even for smaller places, there's no need to start with a short, choppy sentence that doen't really inform the reader. Reywas92 ^Talk 22:34, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply

That's easily fixable, without putting much or any effort. Actually, even though not being nowhere near native speaker of English, I still have reasonably high sensibility for a proper semantics:

• current is a two sentences para including cumbersome break with a semicolon in the second - "Los Angeles, often referred to by its initials L.A., is the most populous city in the U.S. state of California. With roughly 3.9 million residents within the city limits as of 2020, Los Angeles is the second-most populous city in the United States, behind only New York City; it is the commercial, financial and cultural center of the Southern California region."
• and here's mine - Los Angeles, often referred to by its initials L.A., officially the City of Los Angeles, is the city in the United States. L.A. is the most populous city in the U.S. state of California, and with roughly 3.9 million residents within the city limits as of 2020, Los Angeles is the second-most populous city in the United States, behind only New York City. It is the commercial, financial and cultural center of the Southern California region.

Any awkwardness could be easily fixed, like repetitive mention of its name or second mention of "in the United States" that could be replaced with a "in the country". ౪ Santa ౪ ^99° 22:57, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply

Ultimately, this is a long discussion about one user's preference, and it has not built any consensus for changing Wikipedia's standard way of writing the lede in these articles about U.S. cities. Also, to User:Santasa99's edit summary reverting my revert on Philadelphia, I assumed it was a test edit or perhaps a "drive-by" edit, and User:Reywas92's edit summary was exactly what I ought to have said. BCorr| Брайен 21:14, 22 January 2024 (UTC) reply

Concur with BCorr, Trovatore, Reywas92, etc. User:Santasa99's version of the lead sentence was terrible. The longstanding WP style of writing the lead sentence in terms of what actually makes the city significant (i.e., most populous city in the state, most important city in the region, county seat of its county, etc.) is much more readable than leading with the fact that the city happens to be in a particular country. -- Coolcaesar ( talk) 03:30, 23 January 2024 (UTC) reply

I am not particularly against most of the above arguments per se, except maybe Bcorr claim that it's "one user's preference" - it's maybe here and now, but I could point to myriads of articles, besides NYC, which open with immediate mention of a country in as many combinations in terms of formulation - but your reply really left me perplexed.. ౪ Santa ౪ ^99° 08:38, 23 January 2024 (UTC) reply

But I have noticed that US settlement articles in most cases don't mention United States at all in lede. I find that unencyclopedic, I know that it is unencyclopedic. ౪ Santa ౪ ^99° 08:46, 23 January 2024 (UTC) reply

"Encyclopedic" and "unencylopedic" are overly general terms, and difficult to define. One might find it "unencyclopedic" to focus on a overly descriptive technical descriptions in the lede instead of focusing on the most significant facts relevant to the topic. Cristiano Tomás ( talk) 15:36, 23 January 2024 (UTC) reply

@ Uness232: I don’t think it’s correct to say that the city is a few degrees close to a tropical climate because the average temperature isn’t the sole criterion according to the Köppen climate classification. A true tropical climate has humid summers with plenty of precipitation against dry and virtually rainless winters, which is the exact opposite compared to Los Angeles’s Mediterranean climate. You may say that places like Orlando, Hong Kong, São Paulo or Brisbane are short of having a true tropical climate because they all have humid subtropical climates with a tropical precipitation pattern as well as a lot of tropical vegetation and fail to qualify only on average temperature in the coldest month(s), but definitely not for a place like Los Angeles which is at least a desert far from the tropics.-- Kiril Simeonovski ( talk) 22:31, 6 February 2024 (UTC) reply

@ Kiril Simeonovski The sole definition of a tropical climate according to Köppen is all months being above 18C, and the climate not being B type. There is no requirement for tropical climates to have humid summers or dry winters (which is why the As dry-summer tropical savanna type exists, for example near somewhere like Lanai City), and these climates can also border arid ones, like São Tomé. Indeed, LA is only a few degrees away from being classified the same way as Lanai City or São Tomé, and would feel a lot like those places if it wasn't for its slight nighttime chill.

Of course, from a genetic climate class perspective, these climates have nothing to do with each other, but from an effective perspective (which is what Köppen is based on), exceptional situations in different airmass environments can cancel-out, causing similar results.

Also, LA is sub-humid to semi-arid, not really close to being a desert in any climate classification sense. Uness232 ( talk) 22:47, 6 February 2024 (UTC) reply

@ Uness232: That’s outright incorrect. According to Köppen, the definitions for the three tropical climates are as follows:

• Tropical rainforest climate (Af): precipitation in all months greater than 60 mm;
• Tropical monsoon climate (Am): precipitation in driest month less than 60 mm but greater than ${\textstyle 100-\left({\frac {\text{Total Annual Precipitation (mm)}}{25}}\right)}$; and
• Tropical savanna climate (Aw/As): precipitation in driest month less than 60 mm and less than ${\textstyle 100-\left({\frac {\text{Total Annual Precipitation (mm)}}{25}}\right)}$, and total annual precipitation between 700 mm and 1,000 mm.

With 362 mm, Los Angeles fails all three by a long shot. Note that Culiacán qualifies temperature-wise for a tropical climate, but it’s considered a B type even though it has total annual precipitation greater by 300 mm than Los Angeles, which means that Los Angeles would have most definitely been a B type had it qualified based on temperature. All this is based merely on climate definition, not even considering the fact that there’s absolutely no tropical vegetation native to Los Angeles (those palm trees were artificially introduced and require irrigation efforts to survive, with the only native palm species being the desert fan palm).-- Kiril Simeonovski ( talk) 23:41, 6 February 2024 (UTC) reply

It seems like you're both skipping the fact that this statement is WP:OR, since there's no source actually making the claim. Speculation about whether it might be true or not is irrelevant. It should be removed. -- Fyrael ( talk) 03:47, 7 February 2024 (UTC) reply

@ Kiril Simeonovski The Aw/As boundary makes no mention of annual precipitation, which essentially makes all non-B and non-f/m tropical climates Aw/As. I don't know where you're getting those rules from, but WP:RS on this issue are clear. However, I do see your point about how changing the temperature would cause the climate type to change, making these hypotheticals problematic in general if not for LA only. The vegetation point is irrelevant though; Istanbul has no natural subtropical flora, but it is humid subtropical (or Mediterranean if 40mm is used for the f/s boundary, but that's still a subtropical climate). Köppen types are only approximations, they have their problems.

@ Fyrael Technically it is not OR, the source is just at the wrong place and should be the rules of the Köppen classification. However, looking at the claim again, I can see how it is more or less meaningless; after that reconsideration, I am okay with it being removed. Uness232 ( talk) 04:23, 7 February 2024 (UTC) reply

Where is the good map showing all the neighborhoods of Los Angeles? It's very, very, very ridiculous and unencyclopedic that there isn't one in the current version of this article. 98.123.38.211 ( talk) 02:01, 18 March 2024 (UTC) reply

An example of such a map: https://imgcap.capturetheatlas.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/neighborhood-map-los-angeles.jpg 98.123.38.211 ( talk) 02:03, 18 March 2024 (UTC) reply

What is the copyright status of that image? Please read WP:COPYOTHERS, which explains how copyright law affects what we can use in Wikipedia. Donald Albury 12:39, 18 March 2024 (UTC) reply

In the last paragraph of the lede, the statement "a post-COVID-19 pandemic exodus of entertainment production and talent" does not seem to me to be supported by the cited article, which lists only a handful of actors/musicians who have recently moved their primary residence to other states, many citing personal reasons rather than business or financial concerns. An "exodus of entertainment production and talent" sounds more like a significant upheaval, with hundreds of entertainment professionals and businesses pulling up stakes. Unless there are other news sources that credibly report such a major change in the Hollywood industry, I don't see any reason for this edit (from Feb. 21, 2024) to stand. 2600:100A:B1E3:F356:0:1E:34F8:3101 ( talk) 09:46, 25 March 2024 (UTC) reply

I concur. The source is insufficient for the scope claimed by the sentence. It comes off as dishonest POV-pushing. I'm going to remove it outright. oknazevad ( talk) 09:58, 25 March 2024 (UTC) reply