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The recent reworking of the page to be a copy of the DSM-IV-TR criteria seems a little unnecessary. I don't think the page needs to list the DSM criteria verbatim, largely because there is more than one diagnostic system in the world and many conceptions of the disorder (some of which are included in the referenced listed). A link to the full criteria should be enough. Also, the criteria is not meant to be encyclopedic and reads poorly as an encyclopedia article.
I propose to return the page to something a little simpler and easier to read, keep the references (although with referenced properly, it is not clear where the prevalence information etc is from) and link to the full criteria (e.g. here).
- Vaughan 20:41, 28 Dec 2004 (UTC)
- It isn't until item seven that we get the idea that the idea is "unlikely" -- Until then, you're describing someone who is merely passionate about an idea. Scott Adler ( talk) 02:19, 11 March 2008 (UTC)
Yikes, isn't it scary how closely that parallels with religious conviction? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 138.251.31.49 ( talk) 11:51, 6 December 2007 (UTC)
very glad to see I am not the only one who thought that.... is there any sholarly research around the delusion vs spiritual faith definition... one quality seems to further reinforce this striking parallel? how do mental health specialist practically make a difference between a faith and a delusion? is it a simple question of frequency or number of follower or is there something else? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 38.98.7.26 ( talk) 03:02, 9 September 2010 (UTC)
- it all depends on the scale of the problems resulting from someone's belief and whether they present a danger to themself or others 213.208.145.170 ( talk) 14:23, 14 March 2019 (UTC)
when belief without any base is called delusion than our world is full of insane people.
Most of the population of the world is religious,some believe in horoscopes,4 leaf clowers anyone,Jihad heck even maths is delusional.Infinitry? I really think that his article if not this entire disorder should be classified. I suggest putting it a into a low class article.
There should be a limit here or else all of us should go to the psychiatry. The entire human mind was,has always been delusional."Lets kill some ppl cuz that will give us rain"Mayans or Aztecs anyone?
Imho,this is too biased.
I don't understand how Psychiatry can be taken seriously if they label something like this as a disorder. May as well say the entire world population suffers from this so called disorder because everybody believes in some sort of superstition. It has been even demonstrated recently that even atheists believe in immortality of a soul at least deep down below. You cant describe a natural common feature of human mind as a disorder. This is rediculous!
"It's mass madness you manics!" Or a page of hypocrisy? There needs to be section that offers the explanation that atheist materialism is a delusion perpetuated by deluded sanctimonious materialists who want all of humanity defined and encapsulated in a materialist statist state cult. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.27.7.218 ( talk) 10:50, 19 March 2020 (UTC)
This behavior coincides remarkably with conspiracism! I'll look for some RS. Does anyone have any? Johnnyt471 ( talk) 00:57, 22 April 2008 (UTC)
In the article on Delusional Disorder, there is some language that follows a "medical model," e.g. referring to the person with the disorder as "patient" and using a tone that implies a certain derogatory attitude toward the individual with the disorder. It would be more current, and some would say more respectful, to say "individual" rather than "patient."
As for the other issue of overall tone, perhaps one thing that might be helpful is to provide more context for what causes someone with a bizarre idea to become diagnosed with Delusional Disorder. The article hints at the basic premise that a person only develops a disorder when their "symptoms" begin to cause a serious problem for them, interrupting their lives and/or relationships to a degree that is painful for the individual or dangerous to themselves or others. Stating that principle outright could be useful here.
Lastly, a section on treatment would be great. The central issues involved in Delusional Disorder are varied, but can include a severe trauma history, a threatened sense of self (the delusions are, in any case, deeply tied to the individual's sense of self), and possible physiological causes (severe nutritional deficits, specifically those caused by untreated celiac disease, can lead in some cases to psychosis - the Johns Hopkins Gazette, 2.23.04 ran an article entitled "SPH Scientists Find Link Between Digestive Disorder and Schizophrenia"). Given these underlying issues, a referral to a primary care doctor would be advisable, as well as perhaps Dialectical Behavioral Therapy (DBT) to help the individual develop increased skills to manage emotions as well as increased mindfulness skills to assist with insight.
ClinicalSocialWork ( talk) 18:50, 23 April 2008 (UTC) ClinicalSocialWork
you need more relible sources before entering into a discussion about whether common religious belief are considered delusions...hence the tag added today Earlypsychosis ( talk) 07:53, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
- So glad someone else has already brought this up ... I was reading this article with a bit of a smirk on my face, because the pattern of religious expression which so many people exhibit exactly fits the symptoms described. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.225.91.186 ( talk) 05:22, 12 June 2009 (UTC)
- hang on a minute. Many people do experience delusions with strong religious themes. my objection to the previous edits was the implication that mainstream religion was a delusion. Earlypsychosis ( talk) 11:35, 14 June 2009 (UTC)
- Added a clarifying section to the delusions section - firmly held unshakeable beliefs in the face of apparent evidence to the contrary are not classified as delusions if they are in keeping with the patient's social, cultural or religious background - e.g. belief in witchcraft, voodoo or the evil eye amongst certain african and carribean populations, or belief in Jesus/Mohammed/Shiva for mainstream religions. Little Professor ( talk) 13:56, 17 July 2009 (UTC)
- is that all? your clarifying fact seems awfully slim and subjective. Is that the SOLE difference between a religious faith and a Delusion lies in whether the patient holds the same belief as people around him? so a person who would have espoused on its own a religion different from the one of his "background" is classified as suffering from delusion disorder? how about the first christian surrounded by pagan romans? or the first protestant in a strongly catholic surrounding? and the same goes on and on for anyone who innovate or change in the domain of belief....
seems to me that this "clarification" just reinforce the fact that all religions do qualify as delusion under this definition —Preceding unsigned comment added by 38.98.7.26 ( talk) 03:13, 9 September 2010 (UTC)
== disorder, as opposed to the concept of delusion.
Earlypsychosis (
talk) 22:20, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
Support
- I have looked up this section after finding this in lead:
Apart from their delusions, people with delusional disorder may continue to socialize and function in a normal manner and their behavior does not necessarily generally seem odd.[4] However, the preoccupation with delusional ideas can be disruptive to their overall lives.
Indeed, many religionists would then be classified as such sufferers. -》 We need to rephrase it or else further explain the religion vs. delusion disorder difference.
Oppose
- I tend to disagree. Delusions occur in many psychiatric disorders - schizophrenia, psychotic depression, many manic episodes, schizoaffective disorder, and dementia. Also, many of these conditions are more commonly seen than Delusional Disorder. Delusional disorder is a specific DSM diagnosis to describe a longitudinal condition which is much less episodic than schizophrenia. It is not just mild schizophrenia. Still it is good to discuss these things. Casliber ( talk · contribs) 00:14, 25 June 2009 (UTC)
- Per Casliber. Somebody with paranoid schizophrenia would have delusions, but that doesn't imply they have a delusional disorder, which is a different condition. PhilKnight ( talk) 12:08, 17 July 2009 (UTC)
- Oppose. Delusional disorder should not be merged with delusions any more than schoziphrenia or bipolar disorder should. Delusions can occur in many different illnesses, not just delusional disorder. Little Professor ( talk) 13:51, 17 July 2009 (UTC)
- Oppose. Little Professor said it perfectly. Delusional disorder is a specific psychiatric diagnosis (both ICD and DSM-IV). A delusion is a symptom that is common to a wide range of psychiatric disorders. As the proposed merger clearly isn't viable, I'm going to remove the merger tags. Dgf32 ( talk) 17:36, 26 July 2009 (UTC)
A merger may not be worthwhile but there is tons of info in the Delusion article which is a duplicate of
Delusional disorder and can be removed. --
Penbat (
talk) 08:39, 20 November 2009 (UTC)
This is only a small point, but I'm pretty sure that a diagnosis of erotomania is not dependent on the delusion being centred around someone famous, although it can be. Could this be appropriately changed? 92RedRevolver ( talk) 23:54, 5 July 2011 (UTC)
"Delusional disorder is an uncommon psychiatric condition in which patients present with circumscribed symptoms of non-bizarre delusions, but with the absence of prominent hallucinations and no thought disorder, mood disorder, or significant flattening of affect"
Whilst it is referenced surely it should either be quoted or reworded? 85.210.142.183 ( talk) 20:20, 27 September 2012 (UTC)
Bertrand Russell supposed, that there were teapots, which orbited in the solar system (possibly, between Jupiter and Saturn, but anyone with an ounce of common sense will see, that the location does not matter). Anyhow, if someone remains, "coherent, sensible and reasonable" and if there is no hard evidence which indicates, that they are delusional, how, in fact, are we to determine that they are delusional? Of course, we are to rely upon the psychiatrist's political, social and other prejudices, under the rubric of, 'expert opinion' or 'expertise'. However, those with common sense should realize, that the upshot of this is that there are many thousands of, perfectly, sane people detained under psychiatric legislation, who should not be there, due to the complete lack of any objective evidence. Significant consideration might yield someone to conclude, that psychiatry is NOT a science or an objective basis, for detaining people. Psychiatry (given its politicisation) has become somewhat of a tool, for the rich and the powerful, for maintaining social control. Of course, law based social control is accepted by many, but subjective social control at a whim is called Totalitarianism. Even, if you disagree with this, you will have difficulty disagreeing with Bertrand Russell's teapot analogy - how, exactly, in the absence of EVIDENCE are you going to prove Joe Blogs, sectioned off in a psychiatric prison, is delusional? We are not talking about obvious, 'delusions', such as little green men, but, ahem, "coherent, sensible and reasonable", delusions (of course!). Psychiatry and Orwellian speak do go, well together.
ASavantDude ( talk) 17:37, 1 April 2016 (UTC)
Please rephrase it, getting rid of OR, if you want to help us here.
Hi Everyone,
Here's an article about someone's life influenced by another person with delusional disorder: The Story of a Weird World I Was Warned Never to Tell. The story is told by a woman named Pauline Dakin whose mother was influenced by someone with the disorder. Pauline's mother believed organized crime or mafia was hunting them or spying on them because a church minister called Stan Sears convinced her mother it was happening. Years later Pauline Dakin came to believe Sears suffered from the disorder after speaking to psychiatrists about what happened in her life.
Jeffrey Walton ( talk) 07:32, 6 May 2020 (UTC)
|
| This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||
| ||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
| Ideal sources for Wikipedia's health content are defined in the guideline
Wikipedia:Identifying reliable sources (medicine) and are typically
review articles. Here are links to possibly useful sources of information about Delusional disorder.
|
The recent reworking of the page to be a copy of the DSM-IV-TR criteria seems a little unnecessary. I don't think the page needs to list the DSM criteria verbatim, largely because there is more than one diagnostic system in the world and many conceptions of the disorder (some of which are included in the referenced listed). A link to the full criteria should be enough. Also, the criteria is not meant to be encyclopedic and reads poorly as an encyclopedia article.
I propose to return the page to something a little simpler and easier to read, keep the references (although with referenced properly, it is not clear where the prevalence information etc is from) and link to the full criteria (e.g. here).
- Vaughan 20:41, 28 Dec 2004 (UTC)
- It isn't until item seven that we get the idea that the idea is "unlikely" -- Until then, you're describing someone who is merely passionate about an idea. Scott Adler ( talk) 02:19, 11 March 2008 (UTC)
Yikes, isn't it scary how closely that parallels with religious conviction? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 138.251.31.49 ( talk) 11:51, 6 December 2007 (UTC)
very glad to see I am not the only one who thought that.... is there any sholarly research around the delusion vs spiritual faith definition... one quality seems to further reinforce this striking parallel? how do mental health specialist practically make a difference between a faith and a delusion? is it a simple question of frequency or number of follower or is there something else? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 38.98.7.26 ( talk) 03:02, 9 September 2010 (UTC)
- it all depends on the scale of the problems resulting from someone's belief and whether they present a danger to themself or others 213.208.145.170 ( talk) 14:23, 14 March 2019 (UTC)
when belief without any base is called delusion than our world is full of insane people.
Most of the population of the world is religious,some believe in horoscopes,4 leaf clowers anyone,Jihad heck even maths is delusional.Infinitry? I really think that his article if not this entire disorder should be classified. I suggest putting it a into a low class article.
There should be a limit here or else all of us should go to the psychiatry. The entire human mind was,has always been delusional."Lets kill some ppl cuz that will give us rain"Mayans or Aztecs anyone?
Imho,this is too biased.
I don't understand how Psychiatry can be taken seriously if they label something like this as a disorder. May as well say the entire world population suffers from this so called disorder because everybody believes in some sort of superstition. It has been even demonstrated recently that even atheists believe in immortality of a soul at least deep down below. You cant describe a natural common feature of human mind as a disorder. This is rediculous!
"It's mass madness you manics!" Or a page of hypocrisy? There needs to be section that offers the explanation that atheist materialism is a delusion perpetuated by deluded sanctimonious materialists who want all of humanity defined and encapsulated in a materialist statist state cult. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.27.7.218 ( talk) 10:50, 19 March 2020 (UTC)
This behavior coincides remarkably with conspiracism! I'll look for some RS. Does anyone have any? Johnnyt471 ( talk) 00:57, 22 April 2008 (UTC)
In the article on Delusional Disorder, there is some language that follows a "medical model," e.g. referring to the person with the disorder as "patient" and using a tone that implies a certain derogatory attitude toward the individual with the disorder. It would be more current, and some would say more respectful, to say "individual" rather than "patient."
As for the other issue of overall tone, perhaps one thing that might be helpful is to provide more context for what causes someone with a bizarre idea to become diagnosed with Delusional Disorder. The article hints at the basic premise that a person only develops a disorder when their "symptoms" begin to cause a serious problem for them, interrupting their lives and/or relationships to a degree that is painful for the individual or dangerous to themselves or others. Stating that principle outright could be useful here.
Lastly, a section on treatment would be great. The central issues involved in Delusional Disorder are varied, but can include a severe trauma history, a threatened sense of self (the delusions are, in any case, deeply tied to the individual's sense of self), and possible physiological causes (severe nutritional deficits, specifically those caused by untreated celiac disease, can lead in some cases to psychosis - the Johns Hopkins Gazette, 2.23.04 ran an article entitled "SPH Scientists Find Link Between Digestive Disorder and Schizophrenia"). Given these underlying issues, a referral to a primary care doctor would be advisable, as well as perhaps Dialectical Behavioral Therapy (DBT) to help the individual develop increased skills to manage emotions as well as increased mindfulness skills to assist with insight.
ClinicalSocialWork ( talk) 18:50, 23 April 2008 (UTC) ClinicalSocialWork
you need more relible sources before entering into a discussion about whether common religious belief are considered delusions...hence the tag added today Earlypsychosis ( talk) 07:53, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
- So glad someone else has already brought this up ... I was reading this article with a bit of a smirk on my face, because the pattern of religious expression which so many people exhibit exactly fits the symptoms described. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.225.91.186 ( talk) 05:22, 12 June 2009 (UTC)
- hang on a minute. Many people do experience delusions with strong religious themes. my objection to the previous edits was the implication that mainstream religion was a delusion. Earlypsychosis ( talk) 11:35, 14 June 2009 (UTC)
- Added a clarifying section to the delusions section - firmly held unshakeable beliefs in the face of apparent evidence to the contrary are not classified as delusions if they are in keeping with the patient's social, cultural or religious background - e.g. belief in witchcraft, voodoo or the evil eye amongst certain african and carribean populations, or belief in Jesus/Mohammed/Shiva for mainstream religions. Little Professor ( talk) 13:56, 17 July 2009 (UTC)
- is that all? your clarifying fact seems awfully slim and subjective. Is that the SOLE difference between a religious faith and a Delusion lies in whether the patient holds the same belief as people around him? so a person who would have espoused on its own a religion different from the one of his "background" is classified as suffering from delusion disorder? how about the first christian surrounded by pagan romans? or the first protestant in a strongly catholic surrounding? and the same goes on and on for anyone who innovate or change in the domain of belief....
seems to me that this "clarification" just reinforce the fact that all religions do qualify as delusion under this definition —Preceding unsigned comment added by 38.98.7.26 ( talk) 03:13, 9 September 2010 (UTC)
== disorder, as opposed to the concept of delusion.
Earlypsychosis (
talk) 22:20, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
Support
- I have looked up this section after finding this in lead:
Apart from their delusions, people with delusional disorder may continue to socialize and function in a normal manner and their behavior does not necessarily generally seem odd.[4] However, the preoccupation with delusional ideas can be disruptive to their overall lives.
Indeed, many religionists would then be classified as such sufferers. -》 We need to rephrase it or else further explain the religion vs. delusion disorder difference.
Oppose
- I tend to disagree. Delusions occur in many psychiatric disorders - schizophrenia, psychotic depression, many manic episodes, schizoaffective disorder, and dementia. Also, many of these conditions are more commonly seen than Delusional Disorder. Delusional disorder is a specific DSM diagnosis to describe a longitudinal condition which is much less episodic than schizophrenia. It is not just mild schizophrenia. Still it is good to discuss these things. Casliber ( talk · contribs) 00:14, 25 June 2009 (UTC)
- Per Casliber. Somebody with paranoid schizophrenia would have delusions, but that doesn't imply they have a delusional disorder, which is a different condition. PhilKnight ( talk) 12:08, 17 July 2009 (UTC)
- Oppose. Delusional disorder should not be merged with delusions any more than schoziphrenia or bipolar disorder should. Delusions can occur in many different illnesses, not just delusional disorder. Little Professor ( talk) 13:51, 17 July 2009 (UTC)
- Oppose. Little Professor said it perfectly. Delusional disorder is a specific psychiatric diagnosis (both ICD and DSM-IV). A delusion is a symptom that is common to a wide range of psychiatric disorders. As the proposed merger clearly isn't viable, I'm going to remove the merger tags. Dgf32 ( talk) 17:36, 26 July 2009 (UTC)
A merger may not be worthwhile but there is tons of info in the Delusion article which is a duplicate of
Delusional disorder and can be removed. --
Penbat (
talk) 08:39, 20 November 2009 (UTC)
This is only a small point, but I'm pretty sure that a diagnosis of erotomania is not dependent on the delusion being centred around someone famous, although it can be. Could this be appropriately changed? 92RedRevolver ( talk) 23:54, 5 July 2011 (UTC)
"Delusional disorder is an uncommon psychiatric condition in which patients present with circumscribed symptoms of non-bizarre delusions, but with the absence of prominent hallucinations and no thought disorder, mood disorder, or significant flattening of affect"
Whilst it is referenced surely it should either be quoted or reworded? 85.210.142.183 ( talk) 20:20, 27 September 2012 (UTC)
Bertrand Russell supposed, that there were teapots, which orbited in the solar system (possibly, between Jupiter and Saturn, but anyone with an ounce of common sense will see, that the location does not matter). Anyhow, if someone remains, "coherent, sensible and reasonable" and if there is no hard evidence which indicates, that they are delusional, how, in fact, are we to determine that they are delusional? Of course, we are to rely upon the psychiatrist's political, social and other prejudices, under the rubric of, 'expert opinion' or 'expertise'. However, those with common sense should realize, that the upshot of this is that there are many thousands of, perfectly, sane people detained under psychiatric legislation, who should not be there, due to the complete lack of any objective evidence. Significant consideration might yield someone to conclude, that psychiatry is NOT a science or an objective basis, for detaining people. Psychiatry (given its politicisation) has become somewhat of a tool, for the rich and the powerful, for maintaining social control. Of course, law based social control is accepted by many, but subjective social control at a whim is called Totalitarianism. Even, if you disagree with this, you will have difficulty disagreeing with Bertrand Russell's teapot analogy - how, exactly, in the absence of EVIDENCE are you going to prove Joe Blogs, sectioned off in a psychiatric prison, is delusional? We are not talking about obvious, 'delusions', such as little green men, but, ahem, "coherent, sensible and reasonable", delusions (of course!). Psychiatry and Orwellian speak do go, well together.
ASavantDude ( talk) 17:37, 1 April 2016 (UTC)
Please rephrase it, getting rid of OR, if you want to help us here.
Hi Everyone,
Here's an article about someone's life influenced by another person with delusional disorder: The Story of a Weird World I Was Warned Never to Tell. The story is told by a woman named Pauline Dakin whose mother was influenced by someone with the disorder. Pauline's mother believed organized crime or mafia was hunting them or spying on them because a church minister called Stan Sears convinced her mother it was happening. Years later Pauline Dakin came to believe Sears suffered from the disorder after speaking to psychiatrists about what happened in her life.
Jeffrey Walton ( talk) 07:32, 6 May 2020 (UTC)