From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
(Redirected from Talk:9-1-1)
Former good article nominee911 (emergency telephone number) was a good articles nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There may be suggestions below for improving the article. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.
Article milestones
DateProcessResult
December 3, 2008 Good article nomineeNot listed
May 16, 2009 Good article nomineeNot listed
March 21, 2013 Good article nomineeNot listed
Current status: Former good article nominee

Kitty Genovese

This paragraph is inconsistent with the sources cited "In 1964, an attack on a woman in New York City, Kitty Genovese, helped to greatly increase the urgency of the effort to create a central emergency number. Genovese had called for help; but no one had called the police. Some experts theorized that one source of reluctance to call police was due to the complexity of doing so; any calls to the police would go to a local precinct, and any response might depend on which individual sergeant or other ranking personnel might handle the call.[12][13][14][15][16]" A brief reading of the sources indicates that the police were called and that none of them say anything about experts theorizing about the complexity of calling the police. They all confirm that the Kitty Genovese case was a impetus for the adoption of 911, however, so im going to change the text to reflect this. I cant get to it today, but this note should act as a reminder and a call for comments, if anyone is interested. Bonewah ( talk) 17:30, 21 September 2021 (UTC) reply

Egypt also uses 911

I live in Egypt, and calling 911 would do the emergency call as well as 112 Soviera0 ( talk) 12:55, 1 April 2022 (UTC) reply

Is this on a mobile phone? GSM and successor (UMTS, LTE, etc.) mobile networks are set up to accept 112 or 911 anywhere in the world. See section 7.1 of ITU recommendation E.161.1. Justinbb ( talk) 17:38, 9 January 2023 (UTC) reply

911

This is not a close run thing. The use of 911 is so prominent that we really should just move the page to 911, WP:NATURALDAB be damned because this is not at all the WP:COMMON WP:ENGLISH name and we're giving it WP:UNDUE importance pretending it is. Similarly, it is by far the most common meaning of "911" among most native English speakers and most Wikipedians. The disambig page shouldn't be parked at the main real estate.

If we keep it here at 9-1-1 only for the natural dab, we should make that clear within the article and still use 911 consistently in the running text outside of the intro sentence and Name section. —  LlywelynII 20:28, 20 April 2022 (UTC) reply

Others have repeatedly made the same point in the archives above, apparently. —  LlywelynII 22:01, 20 April 2022 (UTC) reply

UK emergency number

In the UK the emergency number map is 999, not 112. The map needs to be corrected. 163.120.111.178 ( talk) 22:38, 19 June 2023 (UTC) reply

112 works quite well in the UK. — kashmīrī  TALK 12:09, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply
It might work, but it's not the number that is popularly used. That has been 999 since 1937, and the fact that 112 has be added "on top" doesn't change that. Nick Cooper ( talk) 21:10, 31 January 2024 (UTC) reply

Requested move 21 January 2024

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved. By numbers this is 5-3 4-4 in support of the move. Most opposers cite WP:NATURAL; however, I note that NATURAL says Using an alternative name that the subject is also commonly called in English reliable sources, albeit not as commonly as the preferred-but-ambiguous title, is sometimes preferred. (emphasis mine) Why exactly natural disambiguation should be preferred for this article is not discussed, which weakens the "oppose" opinions. ( closed by non-admin page mover) feminist🇭🇰🇺🇦 ( talk) 15:05, 30 January 2024 (UTC) reply

Edit: Awesome Aasim should be "oppose" regarding the proposed new title, so numerically this should be 4-4. However, the difference in the strength of arguments still stands; the "oppose" arguments are generally weaker than the "support" arguments. I therefore still find consensus to move based on reasons based in policy, sources, and common sense. feminist🇭🇰🇺🇦 ( talk) 02:54, 31 January 2024 (UTC) reply



9-1-1911 (emergency telephone number) – The current spelling "9-1-1" is hardly ever used [1] and is therefore a suboptimal search term / page title for Wikipedia. I'm proposing to rename the article to 911 (emergency telephone number) that would also bring about consistency with nearly all other articles about emergency numbers:

kashmīrī  TALK 12:19, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply

  • Note that there is also 9-1-1 (Philippines) so the proposed title would be incomplete disambiguation. Crouch, Swale ( talk) 17:51, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    Right, that would make the title 911 (North American emergency telephone number), and is that really an improvement? See WP:BROKE. 162 etc. ( talk) 17:55, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    911 (North American emergency telephone number) and 911 (Philippines) makes sense. Crouch, Swale ( talk) 17:57, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    That's not what is being proposed.
    Please note that the present article is not about the US number alone – vide its lead section. Even though much information focuses on the US, ultimately the article should include the entire NANP zone and other countries where 911 is used, similar to 112 (emergency telephone number). In such a case, the Philippine article might be proposed to be merged here.
    But for now, let's try to get the name correct. — kashmīrī  TALK 18:02, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    The Philippine merger proposal already happened, and the consensus was not to merge. [2]
    As far as this requested move, oppose. 162 etc. ( talk) 18:32, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    Any reasons for opposing? — kashmīrī  TALK 19:36, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    This seems like a textbook case of WP:NATURAL, where an alternative, even if not as common, serves as the better title. I'll note that "9-1-1" is hardly ever used", as claimed in the nomination, is an exaggeration; a look at the article's sources shows a mix of "911" and "9-1-1", with Canadian sources almost always using the latter. 162 etc. ( talk) 19:47, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply
  • Support "911" or "9-1-1". Oppose having the disambiguation in the title. 911 is so prominent and associated with emergencies in the United States and the world that I think this would be the primary title for this number. The second title that "911" is probably associated with would be 9/11 (maybe). But 911 the year is not the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC. Awesome Aasim 20:23, 22 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    and the world? To me, 911 (number), a universally recognised subject, would be the primary topic in the world. Most of the world has never heard of nor will possibly ever hear of that number's use in NANP countries. — kashmīrī  TALK 20:09, 23 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    I can say a few of the other numbers listed (999, 112, 000, maybe 119) are just as much of a primary topic as 911. Especially 000 because it is unlikely someone is typing that looking for information on (0, 0, 0) or even chess castling (castling is denoted as o-o or o-o-o, not 0-0 or 0-0-0). 999 was popularized by British television, 112 because 112 is used as a GSM standard. Awesome Aasim 14:34, 24 January 2024 (UTC) reply
  • Support per nom. -- Necrothesp ( talk) 14:21, 23 January 2024 (UTC) reply
  • Oppose We prefer natural disambiguation to parenthetical disambiguation, especially partial parenthetical disambiguation. * Pppery * it has begun... 19:02, 23 January 2024 (UTC) reply
  • Oppose as WP:NATURALDIS is preferred. cookie monster 755 03:06, 24 January 2024 (UTC) reply
  • Comment. How on earth is putting hyphens between the digits any form of natural disambiguation? How does anyone look at that and think, oh right, that's an emergency number, as opposed to 911? -- Necrothesp ( talk) 14:40, 24 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    A N.A. telephone number could be formatted as XXX-XXX-XXXX so it wouldn't be all that strange to see 9-1-1 written in the same format. cookie monster 755 01:16, 26 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    And in particular AD 911 and 911 (number) are not normally written with punctuation and September 11 attacks is usually abbreviated 9/11 instead and this is the primary topic over all of the other disambiguation items. * Pppery * it has begun... 01:43, 26 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    Maybe, but dashes between individual digits are not normal. It's no disambiguation at all. -- Necrothesp ( talk) 09:48, 26 January 2024 (UTC) reply
  • Weak support. Could be made more concise, e.g. "911 (emergency)" would probably be sufficient. Walrasiad ( talk) 12:51, 25 January 2024 (UTC) reply
  • Support, for CONSISTENCY of the set. — SmokeyJoe ( talk) 10:15, 26 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    If consistency is what we're looking for, then this proposed title isn't it. See Category:N11 codes. 162 etc. ( talk) 05:01, 29 January 2024 (UTC) reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

162 etc., I didn't see your reply. On looking, I think that N11 codes are less important than Emergency telephone numbers. By a long way. -- SmokeyJoe ( talk) 10:35, 31 January 2024 (UTC) reply

Besides, all the other articles on N11 codes use a hyphenated spelling that's not attested by nearly any source listed there. That spelling seems like a poor attempt to disambiguate, in violation e.g. of COMMONNAME. In my view, they should all be moved to "XXX (telephone number)". — kashmīrī  TALK 15:48, 31 January 2024 (UTC) reply
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
(Redirected from Talk:9-1-1)
Former good article nominee911 (emergency telephone number) was a good articles nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There may be suggestions below for improving the article. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.
Article milestones
DateProcessResult
December 3, 2008 Good article nomineeNot listed
May 16, 2009 Good article nomineeNot listed
March 21, 2013 Good article nomineeNot listed
Current status: Former good article nominee

Kitty Genovese

This paragraph is inconsistent with the sources cited "In 1964, an attack on a woman in New York City, Kitty Genovese, helped to greatly increase the urgency of the effort to create a central emergency number. Genovese had called for help; but no one had called the police. Some experts theorized that one source of reluctance to call police was due to the complexity of doing so; any calls to the police would go to a local precinct, and any response might depend on which individual sergeant or other ranking personnel might handle the call.[12][13][14][15][16]" A brief reading of the sources indicates that the police were called and that none of them say anything about experts theorizing about the complexity of calling the police. They all confirm that the Kitty Genovese case was a impetus for the adoption of 911, however, so im going to change the text to reflect this. I cant get to it today, but this note should act as a reminder and a call for comments, if anyone is interested. Bonewah ( talk) 17:30, 21 September 2021 (UTC) reply

Egypt also uses 911

I live in Egypt, and calling 911 would do the emergency call as well as 112 Soviera0 ( talk) 12:55, 1 April 2022 (UTC) reply

Is this on a mobile phone? GSM and successor (UMTS, LTE, etc.) mobile networks are set up to accept 112 or 911 anywhere in the world. See section 7.1 of ITU recommendation E.161.1. Justinbb ( talk) 17:38, 9 January 2023 (UTC) reply

911

This is not a close run thing. The use of 911 is so prominent that we really should just move the page to 911, WP:NATURALDAB be damned because this is not at all the WP:COMMON WP:ENGLISH name and we're giving it WP:UNDUE importance pretending it is. Similarly, it is by far the most common meaning of "911" among most native English speakers and most Wikipedians. The disambig page shouldn't be parked at the main real estate.

If we keep it here at 9-1-1 only for the natural dab, we should make that clear within the article and still use 911 consistently in the running text outside of the intro sentence and Name section. —  LlywelynII 20:28, 20 April 2022 (UTC) reply

Others have repeatedly made the same point in the archives above, apparently. —  LlywelynII 22:01, 20 April 2022 (UTC) reply

UK emergency number

In the UK the emergency number map is 999, not 112. The map needs to be corrected. 163.120.111.178 ( talk) 22:38, 19 June 2023 (UTC) reply

112 works quite well in the UK. — kashmīrī  TALK 12:09, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply
It might work, but it's not the number that is popularly used. That has been 999 since 1937, and the fact that 112 has be added "on top" doesn't change that. Nick Cooper ( talk) 21:10, 31 January 2024 (UTC) reply

Requested move 21 January 2024

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved. By numbers this is 5-3 4-4 in support of the move. Most opposers cite WP:NATURAL; however, I note that NATURAL says Using an alternative name that the subject is also commonly called in English reliable sources, albeit not as commonly as the preferred-but-ambiguous title, is sometimes preferred. (emphasis mine) Why exactly natural disambiguation should be preferred for this article is not discussed, which weakens the "oppose" opinions. ( closed by non-admin page mover) feminist🇭🇰🇺🇦 ( talk) 15:05, 30 January 2024 (UTC) reply

Edit: Awesome Aasim should be "oppose" regarding the proposed new title, so numerically this should be 4-4. However, the difference in the strength of arguments still stands; the "oppose" arguments are generally weaker than the "support" arguments. I therefore still find consensus to move based on reasons based in policy, sources, and common sense. feminist🇭🇰🇺🇦 ( talk) 02:54, 31 January 2024 (UTC) reply



9-1-1911 (emergency telephone number) – The current spelling "9-1-1" is hardly ever used [1] and is therefore a suboptimal search term / page title for Wikipedia. I'm proposing to rename the article to 911 (emergency telephone number) that would also bring about consistency with nearly all other articles about emergency numbers:

kashmīrī  TALK 12:19, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply

  • Note that there is also 9-1-1 (Philippines) so the proposed title would be incomplete disambiguation. Crouch, Swale ( talk) 17:51, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    Right, that would make the title 911 (North American emergency telephone number), and is that really an improvement? See WP:BROKE. 162 etc. ( talk) 17:55, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    911 (North American emergency telephone number) and 911 (Philippines) makes sense. Crouch, Swale ( talk) 17:57, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    That's not what is being proposed.
    Please note that the present article is not about the US number alone – vide its lead section. Even though much information focuses on the US, ultimately the article should include the entire NANP zone and other countries where 911 is used, similar to 112 (emergency telephone number). In such a case, the Philippine article might be proposed to be merged here.
    But for now, let's try to get the name correct. — kashmīrī  TALK 18:02, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    The Philippine merger proposal already happened, and the consensus was not to merge. [2]
    As far as this requested move, oppose. 162 etc. ( talk) 18:32, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    Any reasons for opposing? — kashmīrī  TALK 19:36, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    This seems like a textbook case of WP:NATURAL, where an alternative, even if not as common, serves as the better title. I'll note that "9-1-1" is hardly ever used", as claimed in the nomination, is an exaggeration; a look at the article's sources shows a mix of "911" and "9-1-1", with Canadian sources almost always using the latter. 162 etc. ( talk) 19:47, 21 January 2024 (UTC) reply
  • Support "911" or "9-1-1". Oppose having the disambiguation in the title. 911 is so prominent and associated with emergencies in the United States and the world that I think this would be the primary title for this number. The second title that "911" is probably associated with would be 9/11 (maybe). But 911 the year is not the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC. Awesome Aasim 20:23, 22 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    and the world? To me, 911 (number), a universally recognised subject, would be the primary topic in the world. Most of the world has never heard of nor will possibly ever hear of that number's use in NANP countries. — kashmīrī  TALK 20:09, 23 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    I can say a few of the other numbers listed (999, 112, 000, maybe 119) are just as much of a primary topic as 911. Especially 000 because it is unlikely someone is typing that looking for information on (0, 0, 0) or even chess castling (castling is denoted as o-o or o-o-o, not 0-0 or 0-0-0). 999 was popularized by British television, 112 because 112 is used as a GSM standard. Awesome Aasim 14:34, 24 January 2024 (UTC) reply
  • Support per nom. -- Necrothesp ( talk) 14:21, 23 January 2024 (UTC) reply
  • Oppose We prefer natural disambiguation to parenthetical disambiguation, especially partial parenthetical disambiguation. * Pppery * it has begun... 19:02, 23 January 2024 (UTC) reply
  • Oppose as WP:NATURALDIS is preferred. cookie monster 755 03:06, 24 January 2024 (UTC) reply
  • Comment. How on earth is putting hyphens between the digits any form of natural disambiguation? How does anyone look at that and think, oh right, that's an emergency number, as opposed to 911? -- Necrothesp ( talk) 14:40, 24 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    A N.A. telephone number could be formatted as XXX-XXX-XXXX so it wouldn't be all that strange to see 9-1-1 written in the same format. cookie monster 755 01:16, 26 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    And in particular AD 911 and 911 (number) are not normally written with punctuation and September 11 attacks is usually abbreviated 9/11 instead and this is the primary topic over all of the other disambiguation items. * Pppery * it has begun... 01:43, 26 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    Maybe, but dashes between individual digits are not normal. It's no disambiguation at all. -- Necrothesp ( talk) 09:48, 26 January 2024 (UTC) reply
  • Weak support. Could be made more concise, e.g. "911 (emergency)" would probably be sufficient. Walrasiad ( talk) 12:51, 25 January 2024 (UTC) reply
  • Support, for CONSISTENCY of the set. — SmokeyJoe ( talk) 10:15, 26 January 2024 (UTC) reply
    If consistency is what we're looking for, then this proposed title isn't it. See Category:N11 codes. 162 etc. ( talk) 05:01, 29 January 2024 (UTC) reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

162 etc., I didn't see your reply. On looking, I think that N11 codes are less important than Emergency telephone numbers. By a long way. -- SmokeyJoe ( talk) 10:35, 31 January 2024 (UTC) reply

Besides, all the other articles on N11 codes use a hyphenated spelling that's not attested by nearly any source listed there. That spelling seems like a poor attempt to disambiguate, in violation e.g. of COMMONNAME. In my view, they should all be moved to "XXX (telephone number)". — kashmīrī  TALK 15:48, 31 January 2024 (UTC) reply

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